Protestants: Are you tempted?

[Montalban]

The above questions are absurd. Try to be less antagonistic.

I wasn't trying to be antagonistic. I was trying to see what was the parallel between you and Jesus - or what was the point in you raising it?

This is a better question. Scripture has the answer. Jesus shares in our humanity, Hebrews 2:14-18 -
14 Since the children have flesh and blood, he [Jesus] too shared in their humanity so that by his death he might destroy him who holds the power of death--that is, the devil--...17 For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people. 18 Because he himself suffered when he was tempted, he is able to help those who are being tempted.

And Hebrews 4:15 -
15 For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are--yet was without sin.

And regarding the devil and believers, 1 Peter 5:8-9 -
8 Be self-controlled and alert. Your enemy the devil prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour.
9 Resist him, standing firm in the faith, because you know that your brothers throughout the world are undergoing the same kind of sufferings.

I still don't get your parallel. What is the point of the devil tempting you for no gain? Does he just do it for the sake of it? Practice?

 

[Hentenza]

What free gift?

Romans 5:18-19
18 Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.

 

[Montalban]

Romans 5:18-19
18 Therefore, as through one man’s offense judgment came to all men, resulting in condemnation, even so through one Man’s righteous act the free gift came to all men, resulting in justification of life. 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.

Can I guess? Is it Jesus?

How's this equate to the Devil tempting people he can't tempt?

I see the Devil tempting Jesus as Jesus showing what we are meant to do - that is, not to give in. I don't see that this has anything to do with us in everyday life actually giving in to sin. The Devil's always tricking us, deceiving us, and we sin. We actually give in. However, for the notion of people being 'saved' already, even if they give in it doesn't matter the Devil's wasting his time apparently because you're already saved. Unless you can be un-saved?

 

[sunlover1]

Can I guess? Is it Jesus?

How's this equate to the Devil tempting people he can't tempt?

I see the Devil tempting Jesus as Jesus showing what we are meant to do - that is, not to give in. I don't see that this has anything to do with us in everyday life actually giving in to sin. The Devil's always tricking us, deceiving us, and we sin. We actually give in. However, for the notion of people being 'saved' already, even if they give in it doesn't matter the Devil's wasting his time apparently because you're already saved. Unless you can be un-saved?

You didnt think that the reasons that I gave were valid?
I have more.

 

[Montalban]

You didnt think that the reasons that I gave were valid?

Frankly I didn't see your reasons so I didn't reply to them. I apologise for not replying.

I have more.

Okay. But let me go over your previous post first.

Which is why he tries to destroy us, and render us impotent.

Aren't you already saved? How does he destroy you when you're already saved?

Depends on how i got 'saved'.

So you don’t just have to say “I believe”?

If God did it all, then I can depend on Him to finish the job.
Since we can't save ourselves, I'll have to say no.

If you can’t be un-saved then you’ve argued against all the reasons you give above – which would be pointless – given the Devil can’t trick/tempt you

 

[Gary51]

What about the 'saved'? Why's Lucifer tempting people that are already escaped from him?

One is not saved until the return of Christ when He will give the gift of eternal life to those found in the book of life. To get in the book one must resist Satan their entire life.

Satan did a good job on Calvin!!!

 

[Montalban]

One is not saved until the return of Christ when He will give the gift of eternal life to those found in the book of life. To get in the book one must resist Satan their entire life.

This certainly makes more sense! Ta

Satan did a good job on Calvin!!!

Calvin was to me a strange one. He had a theocracy with himself as the leader. he didn't like any opposition

 

[heymikey80]

LDG mentioned Jesus because Satan tempted Him, and He meets the other criteria you're saying should make Satan lay off His temptation.

Maybe Satan ought to simply give up, because eventually He's going into a Lake of Fire forever. If Satan's end is known, the rest is really futile.

Isn't it?

Or isn't it?

Look at us. We all know we're gonna die. And yet we cobble together things that stave that off. We go to work. We take some care of our bodies. We acquire food, shelter. Why? We're gonna die anyway. Yet we do these things. We're members of creation: fallen, yes, and we'll die for that. But for now, we still exist and live.

Satan knows a whole lot more about how the Creation works than we do. His actions are based on greater knowledge, more insightful knowledge, and a deeper sense of urgency. Because he's not always going to have the power he has in this creation.

Why not exert the power he has on those he opposes?

Wouldn't you? Honestly, are you sweet and enabling to the people you oppose at work, outside work, in church? Even though you know -- if you ever thought about it -- you know you won't get through to those you oppose through opposition -- how's it you respond to them in this way?

It's because that's your role before them. That's your status in the eyes of your opposition. And you take up that role, because you have that status.

When I look at sections of Scripture like Ep 4:17ff, I see the same. Paul is saying, "Yeah, you could sin. But your role is now different. And that role says you don't want to sin, so how could you sin the more?"

 

[MamaZ]

Men are tempted when they are lured by their own lust.

 

[heymikey80]

Calvin was to me a strange one. He had a theocracy with himself as the leader. he didn't like any opposition

Citations? There was a Calvin-initiated division between human government and church government in Geneva (though the split was not the same as we would make today). Calvin was ousted from Geneva, and was under a great deal of opposition for most of his frail life. His opposition wasn't overcome by himself, but his supporters, after he was so frail he could barely appear at court cases.

The Reformation at Geneva wasn't his alone. It was a group, both theological and governmental, with all the problems of any organized group governing people. But also all the benefits of changing away from the government a thousand miles south.

Sure there are modern-level aberrations of government, in a country threatened on all sides with evils of much worse government on all sides. Which heritage would you like to claim, today?

Jewish people could find some refuge there ... certainly in comparison with anywhere else in Europe. The attack of the day was that Protestant regions were filled with heretics and lawlessness. That assessment has been turned a complete 180 in our day. "We played a flute, you didn't dance. We sang a dirge, you didn't mourn."

 

[LamorakDesGalis]

I wasn't trying to be antagonistic. I was trying to see what was the parallel between you and Jesus - or what was the point in you raising it?

In light of what you just said, your question, "are you Jesus?" is definitely both absurd and antagonistic.

I still don't get your parallel. What is the point of the devil tempting you for no gain? Does he just do it for the sake of it? Practice?

The Scriptures I posted should be clear enough for anyone who actually reads it. Jesus shares in our humanity and was tempted - just as believers are tempted. Because Jesus suffered when he was tempted, Jesus is able to help believers who are being tempted. These verses show a clear parallel between Jesus' temptation and the temptation of believers. So these Scriptures answer your initial original question.

1 Peter 5:8-9 shows that the devil is still active, and that believers suffer as a result of his activity. So 1 Peter 5:8-9 answers your other original question.


LDG

 

[Hentenza]

One is not saved until the return of Christ when He will give the gift of eternal life to those found in the book of life. To get in the book one must resist Satan their entire life.

Satan did a good job on Calvin!!!

Was mankind able to resist Satan under the law? Why did Jesus come?

 

[Hentenza]

Can I guess? Is it Jesus?

How's this equate to the Devil tempting people he can't tempt?

I see the Devil tempting Jesus as Jesus showing what we are meant to do - that is, not to give in. I don't see that this has anything to do with us in everyday life actually giving in to sin. The Devil's always tricking us, deceiving us, and we sin. We actually give in. However, for the notion of people being 'saved' already, even if they give in it doesn't matter the Devil's wasting his time apparently because you're already saved. Unless you can be un-saved?

By faith in Jesus Christ we accept the free gift. This gift is justification which is by God's grace and not by anything that we do. If we are made righteous by a free gift, then if it is taken away, then the gift would have been contingent on future free will actions and therefore, not a free gift after all. That would be a contradiction. A free gift is not a free gift if we have to pay for it, however, Christ already paid for it so that we, that couldn't, could have eternal life.

 

[heymikey80]

One is not saved until the return of Christ when He will give the gift of eternal life to those found in the book of life. To get in the book one must resist Satan their entire life.

Then we're all dead.

But I say to you, Do not resist the one who is evil. But if anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. 40And if anyone would sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. 41And if anyone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles. 42 Give to the one who begs from you, and do not refuse the one who would borrow from you. Mt 5:39-42
​

Fact is, while the idea of eternal life is normally assigned to the Last Day, Jesus changes this idea a number of different ways. Note that you have eternal life, present tense, in these verses:

Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him. Jn 3:36

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life. Jn 5:24
​

Satan did a good job on Calvin!!!

God works all things for the good of those who love Him.
​

 

[Stryder06]

Was mankind able to resist Satan under the law?

Had they been obedient to the law then they would have been able to resist him. Just like today, for salvation never came by the law, ever.

Why did Jesus come?

For salvation. I think a better question is why did Jesus have to die?

 

[Stryder06]

To those who believe you're already saved, do you still get tempted by/to sin?

Is the devil still working on you?

Now that I have a good idea of what you're getting at:

Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.

19When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful. 23But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.

Temptation from satan is a way of proving those who claim to be God's from those who actually are. If you are His than temptaion will actually work to refine you just as gold is refined in the fire.

We all at time will fall, but the key is getting back up, repenting, and asking for strength from God to not fall again. The more we are tempted, the more we should realize our own weakness, and our need to desperately cling to the Savior.

 

[PT Calvinist]

27 “My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;
28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.
-John 10:27-28

13 No temptation has overtaken you but such as is common to man; and God is faithful, who will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation will provide the way of escape also, so that you will be able to endure it.
- 1 Cor. 10:13

 

[sunlover1]

Aren't you already saved? How does he destroy you when you're already saved?

I said he 'tries' to destroy us and thus render us impotent.
I am sorry that I didnt elaborate (thought i did), anyhow, I
was speaking of destroying our body, relationships, our witness,
our destiny etc...

Jesus made it clear that NO one can snatch us from His hand.

We are in a battle against the forces of evil, the war is over our
assignment. God has a plan for each of us to walk in, and the
enemy tries to thwart it by distracting us with pain, poverty,
offense, oppression, depression, strife... etc. We need to get
our mind renewed and get our act together so we can begin
to spot the distractions and eradicate them.

But we have armor, we have the Spirit ,and we have a sword to fight with.

If you can’t be un-saved then you’ve argued against all the reasons you give above – which would be pointless – given the Devil can’t trick/tempt you

the devil can trick us and can tempt us.
Jesus (God) was even tempted.
His response was "It is written"

 

[MamaZ]

When one is saved there is nothing that can ever seperate us for Gods love for us in Christ Jesus. Not even the devil himself. The devil attacks Gods people not because of the people of God but to dig at God. Just as Jesus said to Saul as He persecuted the Believers..

 

[MamaZ]

Temptation will be with us until our bodies are glorified. For we are new creations in Christ Jesus born of the Spirit but still at home in our flesh where sin dwells.