Outrage after police fatally shoot Jayland Walker in Ohio

[BPPLEE]

Again, it's not just the fact he was at one point armed....

Chasing a guy running from you with a gun on his belt doesn't mean you can shoot him in the back.

If he shoots at you before running or while running....yeah...shoot him anywhere.

His driving the car amounts to the same as his running in the eyes of the law.



I don't know what they're thinking. DAs are bringing charges hoping juries will acquit....juries are convicting hoping judges will throw out minimum sentences. Then you get the judge crying knowing she's engaged in a bad miscarriage of justice.

I arrested someone who kidnapped an old lady and made her go to the bank and withdraw money. There was a car chase that went through 3 counties then a stand off after we got him stopped. They were taking him to court and he wasn't shackled and he broke free and ran. A police officer shot him from behind and hit him in the leg. The police officer was cleared because the prisoner was a danger to the community.

 

[BPPLEE]

That wouldnt help him much, those darts have a very high pressure and empty themselves in a second or so.

The reason it takes so long is that the fluid is injected into muscle tissue and not into the bloodstream and thus takes longer to absorb.

And a person could still kill you before the tranquilizer takes effect. I think that is the point you are making anyway.

 

[Juan777]

I've sided against the police when I thought they were in the wrong.

How many times have you sided with them?

Jan 6 insurrection is one example of many.

 

[Juan777]

Sure he was. He was willing to kill to get away. They're correct to assume that about him until shown otherwise.

Imagine he had managed to outrun them on foot, evade them for a bit, and upon hearing sirens getting close....kills someone for their car.

If he's not ready to die he shouldn't pull a gun.

Until you can demonstrate white people are treated the same way, in a similar circumstance, then one can assume they used the color of law to conduct a lynching.
So far we had recent dangerous mass shooters who were armed who were taken alive. I raised enough points in my other posts so I am not going in further detail here.

Criminals are not allowed to die unless there is a capital punishment that follows due process. What was his crime? Driving with a broken taillight. That was why he was stopped. White mass shooters and insurrectionists get due process and a black man with a broken tailight gets 60 bullets and his corpse is handcuffed. The other black motorist who was unarmed in Michigan was also shot in the back of the head on a traffic stop. These are YOUR example of criminals?

 

[BPPLEE]

Until you can demonstrate white people are treated the same way, in a similar circumstance, then one can assume they used the color of law to conduct a lynching.
So far we had recent dangerous mass shooters who were armed who were taken alive. I raised enough points in my other posts so I am not going in further detail here.

Criminals are not allowed to die unless there is a capital punishment that follows due process. What was his crime? Driving with a broken taillight. That was why he was stopped. White mass shooters and insurrectionists get due process and a black man with a broken tailight gets 60 bullets and his corpse is handcuffed. The other black motorist who was unarmed in Michigan was also shot in the back of the head on a traffic stop. These are YOUR example of criminals?

Black Americans do seem to be killed at a higher rate by police than other races. But they are more likely to be in contact with police because they commit crimes at a disproportionate rate. They only make up about 14% of the population but according to the FBI, African-Americans accounted for 55.9% of all homicide offenders in 2019, with whites 41.1%, and "Other" 3.0% in cases where the race was known.[52] Among homicide victims in 2019 where the race was known, 54.7% were black or African-American, 42.3% were white, and 3.1% were of other races.[53][54] The per-capita offending rate for African-Americans was roughly eight times higher than that of whites, and their victim rate was similar.
So Black Americans have more contact with the police. While it doesn't exonerate the police the majority killed were engaging in resisting arrest or some form of threatening behavior. Not all but most of these situations could be avoided just by cooperating with the police. There are some examples of completely unjust killings by police but they are not the majority and DAs are more likely to prosecute police than they have been in the past.

 

[loveofourlord]

Black Americans do seem to be killed at a higher rate by police than other races. But they are more likely to be in contact with police because they commit crimes at a disproportionate rate. They only make up about 14% of the population but according to the FBI, African-Americans accounted for 55.9% of all homicide offenders in 2019, with whites 41.1%, and "Other" 3.0% in cases where the race was known.[52] Among homicide victims in 2019 where the race was known, 54.7% were black or African-American, 42.3% were white, and 3.1% were of other races.[53][54] The per-capita offending rate for African-Americans was roughly eight times higher than that of whites, and their victim rate was similar.
So Black Americans have more contact with the police. While it doesn't exonerate the police the majority killed were engaging in resisting arrest or some form of threatening behavior. Not all but most of these situations could be avoided just by cooperating with the police. There are some examples of completely unjust killings by police but they are not the majority and DAs are more likely to prosecute police than they have been in the past.

Blacks are also more likely to be charged or stopped for a crime then a white person doing the same thing especially drug offenses, so that scues the numbers.

Also all things equal it's more poverty wich determines crime rates and chances of being criminals wich blacks are more likely to be. Plus there is well known documented cases of cops being more likely to police a black area then a white area.

 

[Juan777]

. While it doesn't exonerate the police the majority killed were engaging in resisting arrest or some form of threatening behavior.

It sound like you are conceding that a minority were killed were framed to be resisting arrest but were actually cooperating with the police. That could be up to 49%. How high of a minority of innocent people killed would make that wrong if you are really going with that argument? In my books, one innocent person is one too much.

Not all but most of these situations could be avoided just by cooperating with the police. There are some examples of completely unjust killings by police but they are not the majority and DAs are more likely to prosecute police than they have been in the past.

Why do you have laws where people have capital punishment if they commit certain crimes, then allow extra-judicial summary executions to happen over a broken taillight? Can you cite what law in the books says that not cooperating with the police is a Capital Offense? Why have laws where you have a death penalty in the first place then? It seems that there are more extra-judicial summary executions in a given year then there are death-row inmates or actual executions?

 

[BPPLEE]

Blacks are also more likely to be charged or stopped for a crime then a white person doing the same thing especially drug offenses, so that scues the numbers.

Also all things equal it's more poverty wich determines crime rates and chances of being criminals wich blacks are more likely to be. Plus there is well known documented cases of cops being more likely to police a black area then a white area.

Police go were they are called and when I was in law enforcement during my time in patrol we had assigned areas that covered the whole city but we were called to Black areas more often because they were the ones calling the police. There are many factors like poverty and unemployment rates that contribute to the statistics.
The numbers I gave were for the murder rate, not drugs or traffic violations.

 

[Juan777]

Police go were they are called and when I was in law enforcement during my time in patrol we had assigned areas that covered the whole city but we were called to Black areas more often because they were the ones calling the police. There are many factors like poverty and unemployment rates that contribute to the statistics.
The numbers I gave were for the murder rate, not drugs or traffic violations.

I didn't realize you were a police officer in the past and have real-life experience to contribute to this discussion. I respect real-life experience. Therefore, I have edited my previous post.

 

[BPPLEE]

It sound like you are conceding that a minority were killed were framed to be resisting arrest but were actually cooperating with the police. That could be up to 49%. How high of a minority of innocent people killed would make that wrong if you are really going with that argument? In my books, one innocent person is one too much.



Why do you have laws where people have capital punishment if they commit certain crimes, then allow extra-judicial summary executions to happen over a broken taillight? Can you cite what law in the books says that not cooperating with the police is a Capital Offense? Why have laws where you have a death penalty in the first place then? It seems that there are more extra-judicial summary executions in a given year then there are death-row inmates or actual executions?

I agree one innocent person is too many but you get people in law enforcement who should not be police officers. Another problem is that no matter how much training you do you can't teach common sense. Some people just don't have it and just like in any other profession you are going to have some people who do unacceptable things.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Until you can demonstrate white people are treated the same way, in a similar circumstance, then one can assume they used the color of law to conduct a lynching.

You want an example? This took about a minute to find....

No charges for Bismarck officer who shot, killed unarmed man

Fleeing police, previously armed, shot while unarmed. You might be wondering why they don't list his race....but that's because they only do that if you aren't white. This doesn't generate outrage or clicks, so no advertising revenue, no money.

Regardless....what happened to Jayland wasn't a lynching. He appeared to have successfully fled police less than 24hrs earlier. A lynching is carried out by the public....something that stopped around the time the police could be summoned by telephone.

This would be closer to a lynching.

3 arrested for beating death of Akron teenager outside I Promise School, US Marshals say

Hopefully, those 3 men will never see the outside of a jail again.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Blacks are also more likely to be charged or stopped for a crime then a white person doing the same thing

I don't think you can actually provide evidence for this.

Also all things equal it's more poverty wich determines crime rates

Black people represent 13-14% of the population and 20%+ of enrollment in welfare programs.

At 26-28%....they're essentially taking twice their percentage of the population.

What exactly do you want to do regarding poverty? The same neighborhoods are flooded with illegal immigrants taking up service industry and entry level jobs with low educational requirements. They effectively pushed black people out of the bottom floor of the CA economy.

Plus there is well known documented cases of cops being more likely to police a black area then a white area.

This is true....it's called targeted policing. It's the tactic that essentially ended the worst violence of the 70s and 80s created by drug gangs. It's the reason why crime rates consistently fell after the 90s.

Up until some foolish people started glorifying criminals and blaming police.

 

[BPPLEE]

I don't think you can actually provide evidence for this.



Black people represent 13-14% of the population and 20%+ of enrollment in welfare programs.

At 26-28%....they're essentially taking twice their percentage of the population.

What exactly do you want to do regarding poverty? The same neighborhoods are flooded with illegal immigrants taking up service industry and entry level jobs with low educational requirements. They effectively pushed black people out of the bottom floor of the CA economy.



This is true....it's called targeted policing. It's the tactic that essentially ended the worst violence of the 70s and 80s created by drug gangs. It's the reason why crime rates consistently fell after the 90s.

Up until some foolish people started glorifying criminals and blaming police.

There were also government grants that paid off duty police to work at housing projects when I was in law enforcement. As far as black areas being policed more it was just that those areas were where the calls were coming from. The people who dislike the police the most are also the ones that call the police the most.

 

[Ana the Ist]

There were also government grants that paid off duty police to work at housing projects when I was in law enforcement. As far as black areas being policed more it was just that those areas were where the calls were coming from. The people who dislike the police the most are also the ones that call the police the most.

Well if you look into the whole strategy, it's based on the idea that targeting violent reoffenders and increasing visibility of police gives the impression to criminals that they will be caught.

As for it being racist....they targeted geographic areas. They targeted street gangs. It worked.

If you want to help people out of poverty....you have to start by reducing crime. Why work a job just to get robbed on your way home from work on payday?

Crime first.

 

[BPPLEE]

Well if you look into the whole strategy, it's based on the idea that targeting violent reoffenders and increasing visibility of police gives the impression to criminals that they will be caught.

As for it being racist....they targeted geographic areas. They targeted street gangs. It worked.

If you want to help people out of poverty....you have to start by reducing crime. Why work a job just to get robbed on your way home from work on payday?

Crime first.

Look at what has been the result of what was called the Ferguson Effect, especially after the George Floyd protests. Crime has skyrocketed.
10 Killed, At Least 62 Wounded in Fourth of July Weekend Shootings in Chicago – NBC Chicago

63 Shot in NYC Over Fourth of July Weekend

New Orleans leads nation in murders mid-way through 2022, city analyst says

 

[Ana the Ist]

Look at what has been the result of what was called the Ferguson Effect, especially after the George Floyd protests. Crime has skyrocketed.
10 Killed, At Least 62 Wounded in Fourth of July Weekend Shootings in Chicago – NBC Chicago

63 Shot in NYC Over Fourth of July Weekend

New Orleans leads nation in murders mid-way through 2022, city analyst says

Oh it's a shame but it's not viral....so it doesn't stay in the news. They've actually had organized train robbery....a classic brought back to 2021-22.

These people who got their votes off the backs of demonizing the police are reaping the reward. They just continue to harm the very communities they claim to be supporting.

 

[Juan777]

You want an example? This took about a minute to find....

No charges for Bismarck officer who shot, killed unarmed man

Fleeing police, previously armed, shot while unarmed. You might be wondering why they don't list his race....but that's because they only do that if you aren't white. This doesn't generate outrage or clicks, so no advertising revenue, no money.

Regardless....what happened to Jayland wasn't a lynching. He appeared to have successfully fled police less than 24hrs earlier. A lynching is carried out by the public....something that stopped around the time the police could be summoned by telephone.

This would be closer to a lynching.

3 arrested for beating death of Akron teenager outside I Promise School, US Marshals say

Hopefully, those 3 men will never see the outside of a jail again.

I mean an example where the officer was black and the suspect was white. Of course to maintain any WS system there are going to be some colleteral damage to the white community too. The logic is if blacks are disproportionately hurt then they are okay sacrificing a few whites to maintain the system. It is spiting the face by cutting the nose. That is why the American system is toi dysfunctional for even white people. When you have a system that does not mind depriving some whites access to health care, ending up killed by the police, getting less welfare because blacks would benefit way more or get hurt way more then its a very poor logic. The tragic part is people with that mindset would rather suffer personally than see blacks get ahead. It is a sickness.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I mean an example where the officer was black and the suspect was white.

Why would that make any difference?

Were all these 8 cops white? Do you not care if a black cop shoots someone black?

I'd like to know because it looks like you're moving through goalposts.

Of course to maintain any WS system

What's a WS system?

there are going to be some colleteral damage to the white community too.

This isn't collateral damage. The cop who shot that guy intended to.

The logic is if blacks are disproportionately hurt then they are okay sacrificing a few whites to maintain the system.

They kill more white men than black men every year.

It is spiting the face by cutting the nose. That is why the American system is toi dysfunctional for even white people.

I'd like it if we went back to the pre-BLM police.....since BLM was just a scam to rob liberals and black people anyway.

When you have a system that does not mind depriving some whites access to health care, ending up killed by the police, getting less welfare because blacks would benefit way more or get hurt way more then its a very poor logic.

It's as if racism isn't any part of it lol systemically I mean.

The tragic part is people with that mindset would rather suffer personally than see blacks get ahead. It is a sickness.

I have no problem with wealthy and successful black people. From Oprah Winfrey to Barak Obama they've played a significant part in our history and culture.

What I don't understand is why they should be handed out special privileges like a charity case.

 

[Skye1300]

Blacks are also more likely to be charged or stopped for a crime then a white person doing the same thing especially drug offenses, so that scues the numbers.

Also all things equal it's more poverty wich determines crime rates and chances of being criminals wich blacks are more likely to be. Plus there is well known documented cases of cops being more likely to police a black area then a white area.

Plus sometimes I think there's something else going on in poor communities besides poverty that's making them more agitated. Like putting up all of these 5G and soon to be 6G towers and food deserts where there's nothing but junk trash food to eat along with most prescription drugs having depression and suicide as the main side effect. And non prescription drug use. I think there's more going on than what can be seen. I don't know what, but something. Everything has a cause, what is the root cause. It's easy to target all poor neighborhoods with technological things to cause agitation and make then kill each other etc. if someone wanted to. People are focusing on vaccines, but vaccines are not it.
I've been seeing on the news how people in New York have been committing random unprovoked acts of crime for no reason and people are doing it a lot. Walking up to complete strangers and just shoving them down the stairs and things like that. New Yorkers have gone crazy. Something is going on.

 

[Juan777]

Why would that make any difference?

Were all these 8 cops white? Do you not care if a black cop shoots someone black?

For the purpose of argument I'm only concerned between black cop and white suspect and white cop and black suspect. A black cop can not kill a white suspect in the line of duty. A white cop can get away with killing anyone, black or white. So, I have to hit the arguments where the nerve is.
If you see black cops getting a systemic pass for killing white suspects, even when their lives were actually in danger, or they believed it was in danger, then that would discredit the WS system conspiracy theory.

I'd like to know because it looks like you're moving through goalposts.

I didn't intend to move through goal-posts. The discussion is evolving. The argument is if there is a background system that has a set of hidden laws that is shadowing the public system. Anything that illustrates a covert system of operation would be illustrated.

What's a WS system?

It means 'White Supremacy" system. It means the KKK have successfully infiltrated law enforcement and the criminal justice system and have created a shadow system behind the criminal justice system and way police is conducted. The idea is if you are white then you are given the benefit of the doubt, get light sentences or a slap in the wrist if you are prosecuted, specially if it's a hate crime or racist act against a black person, and you could have a mile-long rap sheet. If you are black, then you are a criminal already and there is a program of subtle genocide that include mass shootings from racists that the police deliberately don't go after and allow them to carry out their deeds and then "arrest" them afterwards, or police killings over very encounters that are premised on very minor or trivial issues. Their idea is to eliminate as many black people as they can so the Republicans can win the next election and because of "replacement theory". Whether false arrest, planting drugs, executions under false color of law pretexts.

This isn't collateral damage. The cop who shot that guy intended to.

In terms of the WS system, not individual cop. If there was no WS system, then ALL cops would be prosecuted and jailed for any killings, white, black or otherwise. If they had such a system that automatically fired cops and put them in jail WHO did this, then blacks would disproportionately benefit from such a system more than whites would. So systematically it's collateral damage.

They kill more white men than black men every year.

By the numbers perhaps. However, if you look carefully at the statistics and see how many victims are unarmed and didn't pose a threat to the officers, and the total population (ie to get what the rate of the killings are), then it would appear that blacks have a disproportionally higher rate of police killings for UNARMED cases.

I'd like it if we went back to the pre-BLM police.....since BLM was just a scam to rob liberals and black people anyway.

People are not protesting because of BLM, they are protesting because of footage that comes from smartphones that contradict what the police are saying in their official report. Did BLM cause the riots in 1991 with Rodney King? You didn't even have smartphones then. What caused the riots is that the justice system does not care enough to hold police accountable with egregious acts of violence during arrests.

It's as if racism isn't any part of it lol systemically I mean.

That's exactly the point. I always talk by systems and conspiracy theories, not individuals.

I have no problem with wealthy and successful black people. From Oprah Winfrey to Barak Obama they've played a significant part in our history and culture.

What I don't understand is why they should be handed out special privileges like a charity case.

No matter what special privileges you claim anyone has, that is all meaningless if you can get gunned down by the police because you are not alive to claim it.