No More Moses,or His Friends..

[millerrod]

My point is rules don't mean anything. The Spirit reveals to me sin, far much more than some list. Guess what though, the revealing shows me my wretchedness and my absolute inability to stop. He then empowers me to overcome.

PLEASE NEVER teach my children or my grandchildren that.

 

[jeolmstead]

Yes..
Elementals do nothing.
Lol..they are worldly..
Movies and a cold beer is not worldly,the law is,,

20Since you died with Christ to the basic principles of this world, why, as though you still belonged to it, do you submit to its rules: 21"Do not handle! Do not taste! Do not touch!"? 22These are all destined to perish with use, because they are based on human commands and teachings.

Yes,

And the same flesh that drives a man to the movie and the beer will drive a man to study the law. (if you let it)

It will take pride in it’s great knowledge and exercise of it. It will judge others by it and they will be found lacking. (if you let it)

It will use it to justify it’s self (if you let it)

It will say “Grace” as long as it is Grace plus something else, because, it knows “something else” nullifies Grace Leaving only the flesh in all it’s glory.

John O.

 

[BenAdam]

PLEASE NEVER teach my children or my grandchildren that.

If you disagree with it, refute it with scripture.

Eating meat, not eating meat, observing a holy day, not observing a holy day, drinking, not drinking. These all mean nothing.

 

[jeolmstead]

Teaching the kids the “rules” will not bring them into relationship with Christ, nor will it save them from judgment. You might succeed in keeping them from murdering their playmate, but, the first time they look at their brother with hate in their heart they will have already committed murder.

At that point you had better teach them about Grace, because that is where they will find freedom from death and the law that defines it.

John O.

 

[BenAdam]

You know, Cain didn't need to be told not to murder to know it was wrong.

 

[millerrod]

Dude...
Really,you have made your point..

We know what sin is..

But the answer is grace.

WE know what sin is because WE know the law. the answer is then the law and grace. If we teach Grace alone then WE will know sin but OTHERS will not no sin, because they have never been taught the law they will not be able to reconize sin. Ask a lesbian who has never been taught the law if she is sinning. she will tell you no why ?? because she does not reconize sin because she has not been taught what sin is. she has no knowledge of what sin is. she knows not Gods Law.

 

[Optimax]

The law had a glory.

But it was a glory that was to done away with.

What replaced it had a much greater glory.

The result of the replacement is this:

2 Co 3:18
But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
KJV

 

[millerrod]

Teaching the kids the “rules” will not bring them into relationship with Christ, nor will it save them from judgment. You might succeed in keeping them from murdering their playmate, but, the first time they look at their brother with hate in their heart they will have already committed murder.

At that point you had better teach them about Grace, because that is where they will find freedom from death and the law that defines it.

John O.

John the point is it takes both.

 

[pinetree]

The law had a glory.

But it was a glory that was to done away with.

What replaced it had a much greater glory.

The result of the replacement is this:

2 Co 3:18
But we all, with open face beholding as in a glass the glory of the Lord, are changed into the same image from glory to glory, even as by the Spirit of the Lord.
KJV

So so true faithy one..

 

[Cassidy]

Yes the law is to show us what sin is. But not the same way as it did in the OT. In the OT they had to be obedient from the outside in. Remember...with all the observances, feasts, rituals, sacrifices. It had to be that complicated because it was mere humans doing the work. Thankfully we are now obedient from the inside out.

We now do not need a schoolmaster to tell us what is wrong or right. We already know. The law, that is no longer written in stone and that is now written on our hearts, is what tells us...through the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is what leads and guides us to all truth...not the written law.

Christ came to fulfil the law so that it was fulfilled and complete when it was written on our hearts. Therefore it is in us...perfect and 100% fulfilled by our Lord. So now..by grace..we are able to walk it from the inside out (walking in the spirit) NOT from the outside in (walking in the flesh) like they did in the OT.

By grace we fulfill the law because Christ did. If we have to wake up in the morning and read it to make sure we fulfill it then we have fallen from grace and make what Christ did on the cross nothing.

But how is it that we are able to fullfill those two commandments that we are told to obey? From the Holy Ghost WITHIN. If we love from the outside it is works that are likened to filthy rags. But if the Holy Spirit sheds abroad that love through us then the works are God's works and alive (not dead works) through faith.

We are justified by faith...not by works. Faith without works is dead..so we better make sure that our faith is with Christ...or out works will be dead. Dead works...mean nothing! If we believe in our Lord then we believe that he has set us free from the law and if we believe that we are set free from the law then we will walk in the spirit...and THAT is what obedience is!

It's no longer I that lives but Christ that lives in me. Christ is the one who loves...he is the one who doesn't lie, cheat or steal...so I had better put my faith in his works for if I don't then I will fall from grace.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

People that surely wont be taught the old covenant..

You would make a good reporter pinetree...you thoroughly distort what others actually say and add things they do not say.

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

To whom are you speaking?

You are the only one here who fits the description.

 

[pinetree]

but Torah is not worldly but heavenly as it came down from heaven.

it is not human commands, but the very words of God, the commandments of God,
it teachings and precepts are beautiful (just read Psalm 119)

the passage you cite it to do with the earthly tradition, not the heavenly Torah.


Steve

Please Steven..
It is clearly talking all..and Yes,Torah too..
All the laws,touch not,or circumcision etc..
Paul was talking about all the laws..
Notice he says,they were a shadow..

16Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. 17These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ. 18Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you for the prize. Such a person goes into great detail about what he has seen, and his unspiritual mind puffs him up with idle notions. 19He has lost connection with the Head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.

All scripture is inspired (heavenly)by God,that would include the NT..

 

[pinetree]

You are the only one here who fits the description.

Are you in a bad mood?

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

You said so reight here,this is from post 28.

"even Jesus did not keep all 613 commandments.... this was impossible for him."

Jesus aslo said it.

John 7:19
Has not Moses given you the law? Yet not one of you keeps the law. Why are you trying to kill me?"

If you dont keep one,you break them all..

James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it.

Why would scrifices have been made,if no one sinned..IE,breaking the law,not keeping the commands..

Not Moses or pinetree..

Moses or the ministry of grace that was born with Jesus,preached by Paul..

Since when does saying "you are not keeping it" mean "it's impossible for you to keep it?" And, it's not referring to any one person keeping 613 laws. When you tell your kids, "you're not obeying me" does that translate into "it's impossible for you to obey me?" I think not.

 

[pinetree]

Yes the law is to show us what sin is. But not the same way as it did in the OT. In the OT they had to be obedient from the outside in. Remember...with all the observances, feasts, rituals, sacrifices. It had to be that complicated because it was mere humans doing the work. Thankfully we are now obedient from the inside out.

We now do not need a schoolmaster to tell us what is wrong or right. We already know. The law, that is no longer written in stone and that is now written on our hearts, is what tells us...through the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost is what leads and guides us to all truth...not the written law.

Christ came to fulfil the law so that it was fulfilled and complete when it was written on our hearts. Therefore it is in us...perfect and 100% fulfilled by our Lord. So now..by grace..we are able to walk it from the inside out (walking in the spirit) NOT from the outside in (walking in the flesh) like they did in the OT.

By grace we fulfill the law because Christ did. If we have to wake up in the morning and read it to make sure we fulfill it then we have fallen from grace and make what Christ did on the cross nothing.

But how is it that we are able to fullfill those two commandments that we are told to obey? From the Holy Ghost WITHIN. If we love from the outside it is works that are likened to filthy rags. But if the Holy Spirit sheds abroad that love through us then the works are God's works and alive (not dead works) through faith.

We are justified by faith...not by works. Faith without works is dead..so we better make sure that our faith is with Christ...or out works will be dead. Dead works...mean nothing! If we believe in our Lord then we believe that he has set us free from the law and if we believe that we are set free from the law then we will walk in the spirit...and THAT is what obedience is!

It's no longer I that lives but Christ that lives in me. Christ is the one who loves...he is the one who doesn't lie, cheat or steal...so I had better put my faith in his works for if I don't then I will fall from grace.

well written sis..

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

Fine..the law shows sin.I agree.

But it is powerless to overcome sin..

Romans 8:3
For what the law was powerless to do in that it was weakened by the sinful nature, God did by sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful man to be a sin offering. And so he condemned sin in sinful man,


Sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law, but under grace. Rom 6:14

So then, why did Paul say "so let sin no longer reign in your bodies?" If it was ok for them to sin 'cause they do not have to heed the law anymore, why does Paul give theM a law? "LET SIN NO LONGER REIGN!"

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

My brother, they taught form and form never brings a heart change, only the Spirit of God through the Blood of Christ can bring that. My not stealing means nothing if my heart envys continuously. I can be faithful outwardly to my wife all day long, but if my heart looks with lust on other women I am as Jesus said, an adulterer.

Ah! You are correct! For those who are in Christ, their hearts are changed and it is not form to obey....it's a delight. By the Spirit of God, through the blood of Yeshau, we obey 'cause we want to...not 'cause we have to.

 

[pinetree]

So then, why did Paul say "so let sin no longer reign in your bodies?" If it was ok for them to sin 'cause they do not have to heed the law anymore, why does Paul give theM a law? "LET SIN NO LONGER REIGN!"

speaking of being a reporter..
CNN?
Who said it was ok to sin?

 

[SpiritPsalmist]

speaking of being a reporter..
CNN?
Who said it was ok to sin?

No one said it. But they were practicing their freedom of grace and supposedly not having to listen to the law. Paul stepped in and gave them a law...Let Sin No Longer Reign!