Monergism vs. Synergism

[Ortho_Cat]

I would like to create this thread so that members from both sides can provide scriptural passages that they believe support either monergistic or synergistic views of grace.

Here are some quick definitions of both. If you guys don't agree with these definitions, let me know (give me suggestions!) and I'll try to clarify them.

Monergism describes the position of those who believe that God through the Holy Spirit works to effectually bring about the salvation of individuals through spiritual regeneration without cooperation from the individual.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monergism

Synergism describes the position that individual salvation is achieved through a combination of human will and divine grace.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synergism

Discussion is encouraged. Enjoy, and please be respectful!!!

 

[wayseer]

Yes and Yes.

I mean - how do we know how the Spirit moves?

 

[Ortho_Cat]

I'll start. These verses illustrate very clearly (at least to me) the view of synergistic grace.

From Mw. 14:

25 And in the fourth watch of the night He came to them, walking on the sea. 26 When the disciples saw Him walking on the sea, they were terrified, and said, “It is a ghost!” And they cried out in fear. 27 But immediately Jesus spoke to them, saying, “Take courage, it is I; do not be afraid.”
28 Peter said to Him, “Lord, if it is You, command me to come to You on the water.” 29 And He said, “Come!” And Peter got out of the boat, and walked on the water and came toward Jesus. 30 But seeing the wind, he became frightened, and beginning to sink, he cried out, “Lord, save me!” 31 Immediately Jesus stretched out His hand and took hold of him, and said to him, “You of little faith, why did you doubt?” 32 When they got into the boat, the wind stopped. 33 And those who were in the boat worshiped Him, saying, “You are certainly God’s Son!”

Christ called Peter to come out of the boat. In order to come out of the boat, two things needed to happen. First, Peter had to believe that if he walked out, he would walk on water. Second, he had to actively respond to Christ's call. Of course, if he tried to walk to Christ by his own power, he would certainly sink. But by the grace of God, he was able to walk on water towards Him. Once he took his mind and eyes off of Christ, however, he immediately sank. But Christ in his mercifulness was waiting for Peter to call out to Him in repentance so that he could save him and restore him to his feet. Christ did not go to Peter and take him physically out of the boat and carry him onto the water (perhaps even against his will). He called Peter, and Peter responded in active faith.

 

[RuthD]

I have no idea what you mean.

 

[Jazmyn]

The monergism one seems to imply man was forced against his will.

While the synergism one doesn't clarify whether this means that God had grace because of man's will, or whether man's will was brought into alignment with God's.

I choose: "'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:44)

But then, "One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?'" (Romans 9:19)

I think this quote by Spurgeon explains what I think of it better:

"It would be preposterous to say that man is not a free agent. There are some who, in order to glorify the grace of God, have sought to deny the free agency of man;—I do not mean that they have done it in so many words; but, practically, the effect of their language has been to deny it. But man is perfectly free, and God violates not the human will; yet, I cannot explain to you how it is, he is as much able to rule perfectly free agents as he is to control the atoms of inert matter." (Spurgeon)

So I think He has grace and man's will is in alignment with that grace, but His grace is not subject to man's will, either in the present time or by foreknowledge. So I'm unable to choose either of the options until they're clarified a bit further.

 

[wayseer]

I have no idea what you mean.

I'm not sure OC does either.

I think what he is suggesting is the idea that God's spirit dwells within all of his creation regardless of what we, as individuals, might say or do - waiting in the shadows if you like. On the other hand, there is the idea that the HS only comes to those invited through some mechanism - like faith.

But his choice of scripture is anything but helpful and appears to confuse faith with the HS. I only guessing.

But it is an interesting point. Are we all that individual as we think? Does some part of our brain has a cell which is activated by God - waiting for the HS to throw the switch.

 

[Hammster]

I'll start. These verses illustrate very clearly (at least to me) the view of synergistic grace.



From Mw. 14:



25 And in the fourth watch of the night He came to them, walking on the sea. 26 When the disciples saw Him walking on the sea, they were terrified, and said, “It is a ghost!” And they cried out in fear. 27 But immediately Jesus spoke to them, saying, “Take courage, it is I; do not be afraid.”

28 Peter said to Him, “Lord, if it is You, command me to come to You on the water.” 29 And He said, “Come!” And Peter got out of the boat, and walked on the water and came toward Jesus. 30 But seeing the wind, he became frightened, and beginning to sink, he cried out, “Lord, save me!” 31 Immediately Jesus stretched out His hand and took hold of him, and said to him, “You of little faith, why did you doubt?” 32 When they got into the boat, the wind stopped. 33 And those who were in the boat worshiped Him, saying, “You are certainly God’s Son!”



Christ called Peter to come out of the boat. In order to come out of the boat, two things needed to happen. First, Peter had to believe that if he walked out, he would walk on water. Second, he had to actively respond to Christ's call. Of course, if he tried to walk to Christ by his own power, he would certainly sink. But by the grace of God, he was able to walk on water towards Him. Once he took his mind and eyes off of Christ, however, he immediately sank. But Christ in his mercifulness was waiting for Peter to call out to Him in repentance so that he could save him and restore him to his feet. Christ did not go to Peter and take him physically out of the boat and carry him onto the water (perhaps even against his will). He called Peter, and Peter responded in active faith.

Let's pretend for a moment that this has something to do with salvation. Why did Peter believe?

 

[sungaunga]

Let's pretend for a moment that this has something to do with salvation. Why did Peter believe?

because Jesus said you didn't choose me, I chose you

 

[LiturgyInDMinor]

GOD does it all, and it's proven in Hebrews and Romans and in the entire OT.
I refuse to post specific verses because they've all been posted in threads like this before.
People just love to "fight the power" so to speak.
God's in total control, YOU are not so get over it.


Thankyou for listening.

 

[simonthezealot]

GOD does it all, and it's proven in Hebrews and Romans and in the entire OT.
I refuse to post specific verses because they've all been posted in threads like this before.
People just love to "fight the power" so to speak.
God's in total control, YOU are not so get over it.


Thankyou for listening.

Amazing GRACE!

 

[sungaunga]

Yes and Yes.

I mean - how do we know how the Spirit moves?

Great question brother and who better to answer then our Lord Himself. "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit"

 

[Zoness]

I said Synergism because it reminds me of Arminianism.

 

[simonthezealot]

Man was born dead in their trespasses not sick in them, a dead man can't help himself.
Eph 2:5 made us alive with Christ even when we were dead in transgressions--it is by grace you have been saved.

Amazing Grace

NOT

Amazing moralism

Go Augustine
NOT Pelagius

 

[wayseer]

Great question brother and who better to answer then our Lord Himself. "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit"

Indeed - that verse was running through my mind as I read the OP.

 

[itisdeliciouscake]

"Are you a Calvinist?"

"Do I believe in the Bible? Why yes I do!"

 

[Sphinx777]

In Calvinism, "synergism" is used pejoratively to describe the Arminian doctrine of salvation, although many Arminians would disagree with the characterisation. According to Calvinists, synergism is the view that God and man work together, each contributing their part to accomplish regeneration in and for the individual. John Hendryx, a leading Calvinist thinker, has stated it this way: synergism is "...the doctrine that there are two efficient agents in regeneration, namely the human will and the divine Spirit, which, in the strict sense of the term, cooperate. This theory accordingly holds that the soul has not lost in the fall all inclination toward holiness, nor all power to seek for it under the influence of ordinary motives." Arminians, especially of the Wesleyan tradition, might respond with the criticism that Hendryx has merely provided a description of semi-Pelagianism, and they recognize that grace precedes any cooperation of the human soul with the saving power of God.

In other words, God has offered salvation, and man must receive it. This is opposed to the monergistic view as held by Reformed or Calvinistic groups in which objects of God's election participate in, but do not contribute to, the salvific or regenerative processes. Classical Arminians and most Wesleyans would consider this a straw man description, as they have historically affirmed the Reformed doctrine of total depravity. To this, Hendryx replies by asking the following question: "If two persons receive prevenient grace and only one believes the gospel, why does one believe in Christ and not the other? What makes the two persons to differ? Jesus Christ or something else? And that 'something else' is why Calvinists believe Arminians and other non-Augustinian groups to be synergists." Regeneration, in this case, would occur only when the unregenerate will cooperates with God's Spirit to effectuate redemption. To the Monergist, faith does not proceed from our unregenerate human nature. If faith precedes regeneration, as it does in Arminianism, then the unregenerate person must exercise faith in order to be regenerated.

However, it ought to be recognized, such a debate concerning whether it is possible for an unregenerate will to cooperate with God's Spirit is a superimposed Calvinian concept to Wesleyans. In order to answer such objections, we need to see what the doctrine of Prevenient Grace actually teaches. For they are in agreement with the Monergist; strictly speaking, at no time is it being argued that faith proceeds from the unregenerate (that is, a totally natural or graceless) human nature. John Wesley expressed this himself, saying, "The will of man is by nature free only to evil. Yet... every man has a measure of free-will restored to him by grace." "Natural free-will in the present state of mankind, I do not understand: I only assert, that there is a measure of free-will supernaturally restored to every man, together with that supernatural light which 'enlightens every man that comes into the world.'" "This is not a statement about natural ability, or about nature as such working of itself, but about grace working through nature."

Synergism is also an important part of the theology of the Eastern Orthodox Church.

 

[Dark_Lite]

The monergism one seems to imply man was forced against his will.

While the synergism one doesn't clarify whether this means that God had grace because of man's will, or whether man's will was brought into alignment with God's.

I choose: "'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:44)

But then, "One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?'" (Romans 9:19)

I think this quote by Spurgeon explains what I think of it better:

"It would be preposterous to say that man is not a free agent. There are some who, in order to glorify the grace of God, have sought to deny the free agency of man;—I do not mean that they have done it in so many words; but, practically, the effect of their language has been to deny it. But man is perfectly free, and God violates not the human will; yet, I cannot explain to you how it is, he is as much able to rule perfectly free agents as he is to control the atoms of inert matter." (Spurgeon)

So I think He has grace and man's will is in alignment with that grace, but His grace is not subject to man's will, either in the present time or by foreknowledge. So I'm unable to choose either of the options until they're clarified a bit further.

A theology that gives Spurgeon a "how" would be Molinism. Of course, I'm sure Spurgeon would reject it on some ground or another.

 

[Hammster]

The monergism one seems to imply man was forced against his will.

While the synergism one doesn't clarify whether this means that God had grace because of man's will, or whether man's will was brought into alignment with God's.

I choose: "'No one can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:44)

But then, "One of you will say to me: "Then why does God still blame us? For who resists his will?'" (Romans 9:19)

I think this quote by Spurgeon explains what I think of it better:

"It would be preposterous to say that man is not a free agent. There are some who, in order to glorify the grace of God, have sought to deny the free agency of man;—I do not mean that they have done it in so many words; but, practically, the effect of their language has been to deny it. But man is perfectly free, and God violates not the human will; yet, I cannot explain to you how it is, he is as much able to rule perfectly free agents as he is to control the atoms of inert matter." (Spurgeon)

So I think He has grace and man's will is in alignment with that grace, but His grace is not subject to man's will, either in the present time or by foreknowledge. So I'm unable to choose either of the options until they're clarified a bit further.

From what I can tell, you're monergistic. It is basically the belief of the Reformers.

 

[Ortho_Cat]

It appears we have a dead heat!