Mom finds teen daughter's vibro, dad asks me for advice

[phydaux]

I teach a home bible study, so that seems to have made me a "church elder." Enough so that a friend of mine from the the bible study came to me for advice for dealing with his wife & daughter.

My friend and his wife both attend my bible study. They have a teen daughter, about 14/15. She doesn't attend the bible study, she goes to the youth group.

As the story goes, the daughter was out with friends on a weekend afternoon and my friend's wife was "cleaning" the daughter's bedroom. In the daughter's nightstand drawer she found a vibrator.

My friends' wife freaked out. She showed the vibrator to my friend, and demanded he tell her him how he thought they should punish their daughter.

He looked at her and said "I think her KNOWING that we saw her vibrator will be punishment enough."

Now my friend's wife is mad at him, too, because she doesn't think he's taking this seriously enough.

My buddy didn't really laugh it off as he told me the story, but he didn't really see it as any kind of big deal, either. His wife, however, seemed all unglued at the idea.

"She kept asking me 'Where do you think she got it?' "

I told him "She probably bought it at Spencer's." At which my buddy vigorously nodded. Spencer's is a shop in nearly every mall in America and is popular with teenagers. They sell t-shirts and posters and gag gifts, and if you go ALL THE WAY IN THE BACK they also sell sex toys. I knew that, and MY wife knows that, and it looks like my friend knows that, too, but it seems his wife didn't know that.

I know the daughter a bit. She's a good kid. Smart, well spoken, good grades, she doesn't get in trouble, either at school or at home. She has gone on dates but I don't think she's ever had a "steady boyfriend." She has long term friendships with several girls & boys her age that are all similar - Good grades, stable homes, not trouble makers.

My friend asked me what I thought he should do, and if I was willing to talk to his daughter. I told him there was no way on God's green Earth that was was going to talk to his daughter about this. I'm reasonably sure that if I tried then she would drop dead on the spot from embarrassment. Or I would.

I also told him that it was probably not a good idea for his wife to take to the daughter about this. At least, not right away.

I said that he should have a talk with the daughter, and use finding the vibrator as a starting point to discuss her level of sexual activity. She's obviously sexually active, even if it's "only" self sex. Is she sexually active with boys, too, and if so then does she understand what that means as a physically mature human, as an emotionally immature human, and as a child of God?

Then I told him that he needs to have a talk with his wife, about the wife's relationship with the daughter. I asked him "Has your daughter ever given you a reason not to trust her? Does she lie, sneak out of the house, stay out late?" He said "No." "Then why doesn't your wife trust her? Why does she snoop around in her room?"

Man, I totally DID NOT mean to type a whole wall of text.

I just wanted to get some feedback. My wife and I don't have any kids, won't be having any, so this isn't a conversation I've ever tried to prepare myself for.

I did tell the story to my wife in the car on the drive home. Her only reply was "That's exactly why most girls use a hairbrush."

 

[Cute Tink]

As a parent of a teenager, I thought I'd throw in my 2 cents on your post:

I said that he should have a talk with the daughter, and use finding the vibrator as a starting point to discuss her level of sexual activity. She's obviously sexually active, even if it's "only" self sex. Is she sexually active with boys, too, and if so then does she understand what that means as a physically mature human, as an emotionally immature human, and as a child of God?

This would be a good thing to find out. It would also be good, IMO, to find out what she even knows about sex and all that and make sure she knows the accurate information about it instead of the terrible information kids tend to spread amongst each other.

Then I told him that he needs to have a talk with his wife, about the wife's relationship with the daughter. I asked him "Has your daughter ever given you a reason not to trust her? Does she lie, sneak out of the house, stay out late?" He said "No." "Then why doesn't your wife trust her? Why does she snoop around in her room?"

I think this is a great point as well. If the daughter, who sounds like a pretty great kid from your description, has given no reason to be distrusted, then she may feel like this is a huge invasion of her privacy (the snooping) on top of finding the situation generally mortifying anyway. Too late, but this is not the way I would recommend opening up this kind of situation if it can be avoided.

I did tell the story to my wife in the car on the drive home. Her only reply was "That's exactly why most girls use a hairbrush."

Exactly.

 

[Johnnz]

Firstly, any notions of punishment are out.

She needs information, open, shame free discussion, and given concepts that actually help her deal with her developing sexuality, not mere negative moralisms.

Why are Christians so uptight and guilt ridden about a very normal and God designed component of our humanity?

John
NZ

 

[Messy]

Very weird mother, how they should punish the daughter.
When I had that as a teen and wondered if God was okay with it my mother gave me a christian book which explained it all very good and friendly for teens.
Better let her dad handle it in this case.

 

[eatenbylocusts]

I feel so sorry for this girl. It sounds like her mom and dad need some help. She snooped through her daughter's room and then told her husband. Then her dad went and told another man and wanted a man to talk to her daughter???? Your wife seems to be a sane woman, so maybe she could talk to this girl if her parents ended up embarrassing the heck out of her by confronting her.
I also take issue with someone being classified as sexually active because they have engaged in masturbation. When a two year old boy starts pulling on his penis because it feels good, do we then classify him as sexually active? Or if the rule is there has to be a climax, can we say the same of a young boy who has a wet dream?
Something I never heard of until coming onto these boards quite a few years back was the problem that Christians had with masturbation. I was blissfully unaware of the bondage that some people were in over masturbation and porn. I do understand that these are real issues for some people. I also understand it is wrong to lust over someone not your spouse. I cannot speak for males, but I can personally attest to being able to achieve an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] while thinking about the grocery list and I believe it may be possible for others to do the same and in my humble opinion I do not think that God would have a problem with this when I was not depriving a husband of sex and was remaining celibate when single.
Assuming this lady is following God I believe her future husband will benefit from her awareness and sexual need for release. God bless her and I hope she finds a good Christian man who will embrace a godly, sexually fulfilling relationship.

Why do I think that this girl's mother may have some issues of her own that may need healing? The vibrator was in her room, not her purse; so she wasn't taking it somewhere to be used with someone else. And she thinks her daughter needs to be punished for wanting sexual release?

 

[OGM]

First I would not have been snooping around. Second, if a saw it I would not even mention this to anyone including my spouse. It just isn't necessarily.

 

[Dave-W]

Hmmm. Some are really uptight about that subject. On another thread here was a single mom discovering her son had done that and left "evidence" laying around. She totally freaked out.

But on a site now long gone, a guy described what happened to his kid sister when mom discovered her masturbating. (walked in on her) She tore all her clothes off, dragged her to the car and drove to a local brothel. She then threw her out of the car (naked) and started to drive off. The brother jumped out of the car, put his coat on his siter and made mom let her back into the car and then the house.

Some people just really go ballistic over this subject:

"The sin so bad it can't even be mentioned in a HOLY Bible."
"Better to cast your seed in the belly of a harlot than to spill it on the ground."

I can't tell you how many discussions/arguments I have had with various congregational leaders over their rabbid anti-M stance.

If I had found it, I would have put it back where it was but added a tube of KY Intense ....... and not say a word.

 

[Dave-W]

I also take issue with someone being classified as sexually active because they have engaged in masturbation. When a two year old boy starts pulling on his penis because it feels good, do we then classify him as sexually active? Or if the rule is there has to be a climax, can we say the same of a young boy who has a wet dream?

I remember reading a book (which I almost threw in a trash bin) in a christian bookstore that said that anyone who had ever masturbated should not be considered a virgin. It said something to the effect of:

"How can you claim to be a virgin if you have felt arousal or an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]?"


BTW - Eaten by Locusts - the congregation I attended in college sent their "morality police" around to question everyone if they had been masturbating and made them swear to tell the truth. If you had, they got the pastoral staff involved to cast out demons of lust and perversion.

 

[WolfGate]

I remember reading a book (which I almost threw in a trash bin) in a christian bookstore that said that anyone who had ever masturbated should not be considered a virgin. It said something to the effect of:

"How can you claim to be a virgin if you have felt arousal or an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]?"


BTW - Eaten by Locusts - the congregation I attended in college sent their "morality police" around to question everyone if they had been masturbating and made them swear to tell the truth. If you had, they got the pastoral staff involved to cast out demons of lust and perversion.

I would have thrown it in the trash bin...

 

[Inkachu]

FWIW I don't think it's appropriate for the father to be the one to approach his daughter about this. She's a teenage girl, the idea of her DAD knowing anything about her private sex life would be utterly mortifying.

Put the thing away and leave it alone and don't mention it. There's nothing unusual or unnatural about her experimenting right now. If she's doing well in all other areas; school, grades, social relationships, etc, just leave her alone.

One thing he could do - since it seems Mom won't do it - is simply have a sit-down with her about boys/dating/relationships in general, keep it non-graphic and non-specific, and just let her know that the door is open if she has questions or wants to talk about anything. But I don't think a teenage girl is going to benefit from Dad saying "Hey honey, let's talk about what you're doing with your vagina". Uh, NO.

 

[OGM]

FWIW I don't think it's appropriate for the father to be the one to approach his daughter about this. She's a teenage girl, the idea of her DAD knowing anything about her private sex life would be utterly mortifying.

Put the thing away and leave it alone and don't mention it. There's nothing unusual or unnatural about her experimenting right now. If she's doing well in all other areas; school, grades, social relationships, etc, just leave her alone.

One thing he could do - since it seems Mom won't do it - is simply have a sit-down with her about boys/dating/relationships in general, keep it non-graphic and non-specific, and just let her know that the door is open if she has questions or wants to talk about anything. But I don't think a teenage girl is going to benefit from Dad saying "Hey honey, let's talk about what you're doing with your vagina". Uh, NO.

I agree... It's not as if she was snorting meth!

 

[Dave-W]

I agree... It's not as if she was snorting meth!

I am sure some parents in the vehement anti-M crowd would prefer that.

I remember back in the Jesus Movement days some unbeliever parents saying they would have prefered their kids to be hooked on heroin and living on the street rather than being Jesus freaks.

 

[PennineLady]

I remember reading a book (which I almost threw in a trash bin) in a christian bookstore that said that anyone who had ever masturbated should not be considered a virgin. It said something to the effect of:

"How can you claim to be a virgin if you have felt arousal or an [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]?"


BTW - Eaten by Locusts - the congregation I attended in college sent their "morality police" around to question everyone if they had been masturbating and made them swear to tell the truth. If you had, they got the pastoral staff involved to cast out demons of lust and perversion.

When I was at school we had one RE teacher who was like that. Thankfully she took our class for just one RE lesson but it put me off seeking the Lord for years. Human arousal is a part of human biology. God created the human body. Hmmm!

 

[OGM]

I am sure some parents in the vehement anti-M crowd would prefer that.

Sadly, I know you are right.

I remember back in the Jesus Movement days some unbeliever parents saying they would have prefered their kids to be hooked on heroin and living on the street rather than being Jesus freaks.

Perhaps those parents experienced people that were "over the edge" in certain ways.

 

[Dave-W]

I am sure many would consider me to be pretty far "over the edge" for not being anti maturbation.

Or for being a charismatic
Or for attending a Messianic Synagogue instead of a sunday church.

 

[PennineLady]

I am sure many would consider me to be pretty far "over the edge" for not being anti maturbation.

Or for being a charismatic
Or for attending a Messianic Synagogue instead of a sunday church.

I remember what puberty was like for me, being bewildered by my own body.
My daughter's body is her business and if she wants to talk me me about anything, she can.

 

[Dave-W]

I remember what puberty was like for me, being bewildered by my own body.
My daughter's body is her business and if she wants to talk me me about anything, she can.

She may be just as bewildered. She may not even know what to ask. You can be the parent and start the conversation.

 

[PennineLady]

I'm starting the conversation by buying her a book on adolescence, puberty and all the stuff that goes with growing up. I'll let her know that I'm very willing to talk to her about any of it.
I've "been the parent" for nearly 12 years and I don't need reminding to be that.
My point was that I'm not going to be embarrassed and act as though nothing's happening to her. My dear mother was willing to talk to me about all this, because she remembered having a mother who was brought up at a time when none of this was spoken about at all.
When my mother was getting married, she was just told to "Be careful!" "Be careful about what?" "......".

 

[Dave-W]

I've "been the parent" for nearly 12 years and I don't need reminding to be that.

Sorry if I came off as saying you wern't.

What I meant was that some kids will not ask even when you say you are available and willing to talk. the book is a good idea. But as this is so personal, it still may be difficult for her to ask. In that case, we as parents need to bring up the subject and teach them. This is too important to let slip away.

 

[keith99]

I'm starting the conversation by buying her a book on adolescence, puberty and all the stuff that goes with growing up. I'll let her know that I'm very willing to talk to her about any of it.
I've "been the parent" for nearly 12 years and I don't need reminding to be that.
My point was that I'm not going to be embarrassed and act as though nothing's happening to her. My dear mother was willing to talk to me about all this, because she remembered having a mother who was brought up at a time when none of this was spoken about at all.
When my mother was getting married, she was just told to "Be careful!" "Be careful about what?" "......".

One very strong advantage of a book of pamphlet is it serves as a checklist. Having 'the talk' and always being available does not magically mean you will not miss something, perhaps something important.

Long ago I did a lot of camp work with the YMCA, some summers I was home only long enough to take my clothes out of my duffel bag, wash them and put them back in. I still was glad for the provided checklists and every once in a while I had missed putting something back in the duffel bag.