Just a question about tongues.

[shabbo148]

Hey guys.

First off I'd like to apologize if any of this comes out offensive. Im exploring different areas on Christianity and need a little help.

I was reading articles for and against tongues. This one article listed verses saying how there must be a tongues interpreter in the church if someone is speaking togues. They listed another verse saying woman arnt allowed to speak tongues in a church and they also listed a verse saying no more than 3 people can have their tongues interpreted during the church. They also pointed out multiple verses stating tongues as an earthly language ONLY used for the non believers (to preach to them in their language) and not for the believers.

But then I came across an article for tongues, and came across a verse that says when we don't know what to pray, the spirit talks through us in grunts that words can't express. So if its a grunt then it's obviously not a tongue being used for public speaking , but for private prayer sessions right? So does that mean tongues is only okay for private speaking? Excluding the church interpreting rules etc.

Just after some opinions, a little confused. Also I'd like double points of views on this, of course this section is for tongues, but can anyone be kind enough to point out a good section that's against tongues?

Thanks! -Just another teenager in search of god.

 

[Wayaok]

... but can anyone be kind enough to point out a good section that's against tongues?

Who's been putting these doubts in your mind? From another post it surely sounds like you have the genuine gift.

Also when I was pretty strong with religion I fainted in the holy spirit and spoke in tongues. which felt absolutely amazing. But then I heard of the placebo affect. Which is where if your body is so convinced something will cause it to do something, it will happen even though nothin physically caused it to.

I'm now questioning weather tongues and the feeling of god is just a placebo affect.

For me, i've come to the conclusion that weather god Is real or not he only brings good an positivity. And the feeling he brings is just amazing, and makes me want to be a better person even if it is just my body being crazy.
I've also decided to start going to a youth group again, and once again very strongly felt gods presence. I'm just so confused about it,but I'm hoping I can strengthen my relationship with god and put these questions behind me.

Hi Sharna,

Do you realize how precious is this supernatural gift you’ve received? You need to be ever so thankful to God and not allow the enemy to put doubts in your mind. It grieves the Holy Spirit when His children doubt that this gift is genuine. These supernatural gifts from God are to be treasured and nurtured with humility. Through prayer ask the Lord to teach you how and when to use this gift and always thank Him.

Instead of getting various opinions from man’s denominational doctrines you need to put your trust in the Lord and not garner denominational views that contradict and confuse (Prov 3:5-6). As you pray and seek His guidance the Holy Spirit will teach you from the Living Word, with a still small voice and sometimes even what seems like an audible voice. Always check these against the Word of God and you will learn to hear His pleasant clear voice; whereas the enemies impressions as accusing and unloving thoughts or even misquoting scripture. You are very, very precious to the Lord to have received one of His precious promises, a gift to Glorify God and advance the Kingdom of God on earth as the Spirit leads your utterances.

My favorite music video is “Mighty To Save” Hillsong - Mighty to Save - With Subtitles/Lyrics - YouTube

 

[tturt]

How awesome to be so young and searching out The Scripture – good for you!

Well, according to Scripture, tongues are a sign to unbelievers of believers per I Cor 14:22 “Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.” Mark 16:17 “And these signs shall follow them that believe; In my name shall they cast out devils; they shall speak with new tongues;”
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]The question about tongues being just for private speaking, I believe is addressed in Scripture such as " 27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular. 28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues." (I Cor 12). Many interpret these "diversities" of tongues to include private speaking and church speaking. Some will include the "groanings" in this area, also.

Since I don’t know where you are in this research, let me say this about church speaking - often the process is a believer gives the message in tongues, then there is an interpretation. In regards to the “two” at the most “three,” The Scripture is referring to the message that’s given in tongues portion. If there isn’t an interpretation after two or at the most three attempts, then the believer giving the message in tongues is to stop. Here are the Scriptures about the “two” at the most “three” I Cor. 14: 27 “If any man speak in an unknown tongue, let it be by two, or at the most by three, and that by course; and let one interpret. 28 But if there be no interpreter, let him keep silence in the church; and let him speak to himself, and to God.”
[FONT=&quot]
[/FONT]I don’t know of any churches that restrict the gifts of the Spirit just to male believers but there probably are. There may be other Scriptures but here’s a couple about women believers prophesying. “And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:” (Acts 2:17). Also, “And the next day we that were of Paul's company departed, and came unto Caesarea: and we entered into the house of Philip the evangelist, which was one of the seven; and abode with him. 9 And the same man had four daughters, virgins, which did prophesy.” [FONT=&quot](acts 21).[/FONT]

Since women believers can prophesy then I would say the restriction that women believers can't speak in tongues nor give the interpretation of tongues in church is incorrect. Since we have to speak to prophesy, speaking in tongues or giving the interpretation of that message in tongues seems pretty obvious. hehehe

(Gosh, I didn't know this was so long until I pressed enter).

 

[Yahu]

Hey guys.

First off I'd like to apologize if any of this comes out offensive. Im exploring different areas on Christianity and need a little help.

I was reading articles for and against tongues. This one article listed verses saying how there must be a tongues interpreter in the church if someone is speaking togues. They listed another verse saying woman arnt allowed to speak tongues in a church and they also listed a verse saying no more than 3 people can have their tongues interpreted during the church. They also pointed out multiple verses stating tongues as an earthly language ONLY used for the non believers (to preach to them in their language) and not for the believers.

But then I came across an article for tongues, and came across a verse that says when we don't know what to pray, the spirit talks through us in grunts that words can't express. So if its a grunt then it's obviously not a tongue being used for public speaking , but for private prayer sessions right? So does that mean tongues is only okay for private speaking? Excluding the church interpreting rules etc.

Just after some opinions, a little confused. Also I'd like double points of views on this, of course this section is for tongues, but can anyone be kind enough to point out a good section that's against tongues?

Thanks! -Just another teenager in search of god.

You are confusing the different purposes of tongues. The use of tongues in your prayer closet is one of those uses. It allows the Holy Spirit to pray through you and teaches you to recognize the voice of the Holy Spirit within you. This is the form of tongues that is for self edification.

Here is an example. I was in a conflict with a coven of witches. They were sending things against me. I just sensed a spiritual attack but didn't know what it was. I broke out into tongues. I later found out they were astrally projecting into my room and sending tormenting spirits against me. When I broke out into tongues they saw an angel appear in my room that severed their connection back to their bodies. It scared one of the witches so badly, she went to a friend of mine that was back in California (I was across country in Ga) and got saved. I found out what happened later. My tongues had countered their witchcraft and summoned an angle for my protection.

Another use of tongues is within a congregation to be given as a prophetic word with an interpreter. It gives a double witness that the word is from Yah. It is especially effective if a person present knows the language the tongue is given in but the speaker and interpreter don't know the language.

A third form of tongues allows you to speak to an individual in their native language without knowing that language. It is the Holy Spirit speaking through you to another.

You have to separate what usage of tongues is meant in each verse.

Now their are misuses of tongues. The pentacostal churches commonly have everyone speaking in tongues at the same time without interpretation. This is just mass confusion and tends to freak out those that don't understand. It is a misuse of the gift. That is what is warned against. Don't misuse tongues but use them as they are meant to be used. Paul said don't forbid tongues but use them correctly.

 

[Wayaok]

The use of tongues in your prayer closet is one of those uses. It allows the Holy Spirit to pray through you and teaches you to recognize the voice of the Holy Spirit within you. This is the form of tongues that is for self edification.

Intercessory tongue prayer for others is a good place to start and often one of the most beneficial to nurturing your precious gift. Then developing it further in other ways as the Spirit leads. All the praise goes to God as you intercede in prayer for others.

 

[shabbo148]

Oh thanks for that Some of the verses in my bible are written differently and since I'm young I guess I'm easily confusing the meanings.
Also the verse I saw about woman not bein allowed to speak tongues is 1 Corinthians 14:34
Actuslly now that I read it again I'm unsure if its directly talking about tongues. Could someone please tell me what this verse means?

 

[shabbo148]

Thank you! Makes so much sense

I go to a church where a heap of people usually speak tongues to themself out loud. Or while they're prayin for people. That's wrong, right? Since there's no interpreter.
But it's okay if I were to go home and speak it privately?

 

[shabbo148]

Intercessory tongue prayer for others is a good place to start and often one of the most beneficial to nurturing your precious gift. Then developing it further in other ways as the Spirit leads. All the praise goes to God as you intercede in prayer for others.

What do u mean by that? Are you saying Its okay to pray for someone next to you in tongues?

 

[tturt]

With almost every Scripture or every Scripture, there are different interpretations. So it is with tongues. Some churches interpret those Scriptures differently and allow speaking in tongues without interpretation during certain portions of a church service, their definition of "decent and in order." In a church setting where this is permissible, you can tell when there is a message in tongues that's to be followed with an interpretation.

There's also singing in the Spirit 1 Corinthians 14:15 "What is the conclusion then? I will pray with the spirit, and I will also pray with the understanding. I will sing with the spirit, and I will also sing with the understanding."

 

[he4rty]

Oh thanks for that Some of the verses in my bible are written differently and since I'm young I guess I'm easily confusing the meanings.
Also the verse I saw about woman not bein allowed to speak tongues is 1 Corinthians 14:34
Actuslly now that I read it again I'm unsure if its directly talking about tongues. Could someone please tell me what this verse means?

Hi don't post here much now, but to answer your question, and this is just my opinion from things read in the past.

The first thing with scripture is to understand the historical content, the letter Paul had just written was in response to a letter from Corinth, from my understanding the women of Corinth had be worshiping a false idol and as such where trying to bring that teaching into the newly formed Christian church, so to protect the truth Paul suggests it would be best not to have women speaking in public, so this relates to there time and situation.

So if we wanted to try and relate this passage to today we'd have to apply it to a situation where new converts from a previous religion where speaking and bring in some old ideas from that religion which are opposed to the Gospel, and maybe prevent them people from speaking in public for a while.

 

[Giver]

Hi don't post here much now, but to answer your question, and this is just my opinion from things read in the past.

The first thing with scripture is to understand the historical content, the letter Paul had just written was in response to a letter from Corinth, from my understanding the women of Corinth had be worshiping a false idol and as such where trying to bring that teaching into the newly formed Christian church, so to protect the truth Paul suggests it would be best not to have women speaking in public, so this relates to there time and situation.

So if we wanted to try and relate this passage to today we'd have to apply it to a situation where new converts from a previous religion where speaking and bring in some old ideas from that religion which are opposed to the Gospel, and maybe prevent them people from speaking in public for a while.

Who told you that is why Paul wrote what he did?

Paul said that women should be silent in church because Satan fooled Eve.

Also the Bible is not a history book. Why would the Holy Spirit have what Paul said in the bible if it was only telling what happened in one of the churches at that time?

The Holy Spirit put into the bible what he wanted us to do and know.

Anyone can change the meaning of the written Word by explaining the Word away, using the method you just posted.

 

[Yitzchak]

The passage in 1 Corinthians that says tongues are a sign to the unbelieving refers to the unbelieving Jews. Verse 21 and verse 22 go together. Verse 21 quotes the book of Isaiah.

1Co 14:21 in the law it hath been written, that, `With other tongues and with other lips I will speak to this people, and not even so will they hear Me, saith the Lord;'
1Co 14:22 so that the tongues are for a sign, not to the believing, but to the unbelieving; and the prophesy is not for the unbelieving, but for the believing,

Isa 28:10 For it is precept by precept, precept by precept, line by line, line by line; here a little, there a little.
Isa 28:11 For with stammering lips and with a strange tongue shall it be spoken to this people;
Isa 28:12 To whom it was said: 'This is the rest, give ye rest to the weary; and this is the refreshing'; yet they would not hear.
Isa 28:13 And so the word of the LORD is unto them precept by precept, precept by precept, line by line, line by line; here a little, there a little; that they may go, and fall backward, and be broken, and snared, and taken.

To make it more plain, one could compare this to religious Church people who hear thousands of sermons , sermon after sermon and yet refuse to listen to God. They go in circles with endless debates about clear instructions from God.

One could apply this principle to modern religious Christians who do similar things as ancient Israel. One obvious example would be the divorce rate is over 50% in Christians who go to church. Threads on that topic have been posted on here and had thousands of posts about the original Greek translation and all kinds of complicated theories. Just like the disobedient in Israel in the Isaiah passage. Line upon line , precept upon precept. Wrestling with Bible passages concerning the subject for hour after hour and day after day and not coming to a place of faith and understanding where they will do what God says but instead stuck in a circle of confusion where they miss the main point of what God is saying. At the end of all this study and debate about what The Bible "really means " , these people still go out and disobey God and instead do what they wanted to do in the first place.

So God gives this irony of supernatural tongues as a sign that God has rejected these religious non believers and has gone to the Gentiles. In other words , the religious people want to complicate things to the point that they pretend they cannot understand God's plain instructions. So God speaks gibberish to them. The irony is the religious people have been spending countless hours for years studying these Bible passages. Then some non religious person comes along and speaks the mysteries of God in a foreign tongue. That is the context of the 1 Corinthians 14 passage.

The sign is a sign of judgment upon the religious people who refused to follow the Bible and instead just went in circles debating every little punctuation mark. The blind leading the blind.


Of course this applies to public tongues in the Church. Personal or private tongues is a whole other subject.





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[he4rty]

Who told you that is why Paul wrote what he did?

Paul said that women should be silent in church because Satan fooled Eve.

Also the Bible is not a history book. Why would the Holy Spirit have what Paul said in the bible if it was only telling what happened in one of the churches at that time?

The Holy Spirit put into the bible what he wanted us to do and know.

Anyone can change the meaning of the written Word by explaining the Word away, using the method you just posted.

well i think you'll find its the most common approach.

 

[Giver]

well i think you'll find its the most common approach.

You may be right, and that is truly sad. The approach to reading the bible should be reading what it says, and letting the Holy Spirit/Jesus explain to one what it means.

 

[Yahu]

You may be right, and that is truly sad. The approach to reading the bible should be reading what it says, and letting the Holy Spirit/Jesus explain to one what it means.

So you support taking scriptures totally out of context to twist it to mean something different?

You can't just take any scripture and declare it is TRUTH. For example the words of Job's friends are found to be in error. I have seen teacher try to use one of their statements as TRUTH when we are told by Yah that they are WRONG.

 

[Giver]

So you support taking scriptures totally out of context to twist it to mean something different?

You can't just take any scripture and declare it is TRUTH. For example the words of Job's friends are found to be in error. I have seen teacher try to use one of their statements as TRUTH when we are told by Yah that they are WRONG.

How did you understand what I said to mean that I supported one to take scripture out of context, twist it to mean something different?

Do you believe that Jesus/Holy Spirit would tell someone the wrong meaning of the written Word of God?

 

[Yahu]

How did you understand what I said to mean that I supported one to take scripture out of context, twist it to mean something different?

Do you believe that Jesus/Holy Spirit would tell someone the wrong meaning of the written Word of God?

I have seen man claim the Holy Spirit led them into a meaning that was totally out of context. It happens all the time on this forum.

 

[shabbo148]

Oh gosh.
Not even one denomination can have an agreement. Yet alone the opinions of like 500 others.
Personally I don't see the point of tongues, It's led me almost to the point of losing faith and my church doesnt have interpreters so it's just pointless words that I can't take anything out of. Plus there's no point in private tongues if im in doubt of what I'm doing.
I think I'll just stick to the praise songs and bible readings.

I thought Adam sinned too? Wernt they both kicked from the garden? God would be fair on both sexes.. I doubt he would only allow one gender to speak in a church right? I mean if that were a rule followed today he might as well stop the whole female population if we don't get a chance to learn about him.

Ugh religion is too confusing x_x And even when we have a book of answers we still can't get a standing meaning without 3000 other translations.

 

[Giver]

I have seen man claim the Holy Spirit led them into a meaning that was totally out of context. It happens all the time on this forum.

No matter who tells one anything about God he or she is to ask Jesus if it is right or wrong.

If one can’t trust it is God leading him or her then why would they ever trust a man is telling them the truth?

Jesus said he own would recognize his voice, and follow no other.
Also the fruits that are produced from following anyone about God can be what lets one know if it is God or not. If one continues to commit sin then that is not good fruit.

 

[Giver]

Oh gosh.
Not even one denomination can have an agreement. Yet alone the opinions of like 500 others.
Personally I don't see the point of tongues, It's led me almost to the point of losing faith and my church doesnt have interpreters so it's just pointless words that I can't take anything out of. Plus there's no point in private tongues if im in doubt of what I'm doing.
I think I'll just stick to the praise songs and bible readings.

I thought Adam sinned too? Wernt they both kicked from the garden? God would be fair on both sexes.. I doubt he would only allow one gender to speak in a church right? I mean if that were a rule followed today he might as well stop the whole female population if we don't get a chance to learn about him.

Ugh religion is too confusing x_x And even when we have a book of answers we still can't get a standing meaning without 3000 other translations.

Yes if one listens to man about God, then it can become very confusing.

Pray, and continue to pray until Jesus comes and take you by the hand. When on allows Jesus/Holy Spirit to teach him or her then religion will stop being confusing.