John says that a sinner is of the devil?

Giver

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What do you say about a sinner?

John also says that Jesus came to destroy the devil’s work.

Did Jesus fail and not accomplish what he came here to do?

(1 John 3:8) “He who does what is sinful is of the devil, because the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the devil's work”
 

Giver

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I use five different, authorized by Christian Churches, bibles. All of these translations give very similar translations to John’s verse. The verse quote comes from a Catholic bible, and that is the largest Christian religious denomination. I would say they have the greatest resources to provide the most knowledgeable people to do the translation of the written Word.

When people have a problem understanding what the bible says, and want to have it read to where they can accept it, they use many different ways to change what is written.

Tools to Twist Bible
I would like to share some of the tools people use to twist the written Word of God.

The tool often used is the Greek Word.
I believe the Holy Spirit was much involved with the people that translated the Greek scripture to the English version. I also believe they understood the Greek as well or better than the people who try to make people believe the English version is not accurate.

What a con and an elitist act it is to use a study of a language to try and convince others he or she is right because they have some special knowledge of a language.

There are any numbers of translations of the bible, and all tend to slant the Word to read such as to verify one theology or another

Hyperbole is also used a lot. Jesus did not mean that it is just an exaggeration. Then people will go on and tell one what he really meant. Tell me how does anyone know unless Jesus told him or her? If Jesus told them he will tell us also right?

Metaphorically Is used much the same way as hyperbole, and the people who use this tool are of course the experts who can tell one just what Jesus meant. Wow they must be really intelligent, like us simple people can’t read, and understand.

Another tool often used is that part of the written Word is not talking to us. People don’t like what a letter is saying, so then if it is not speaking to them it can be ignored. They want us to believe that the bible is like our history books.

Separating our spirit from our bodies, as if one is not part of the other. This tool is used to make our actions not accountable. Our spirit don’t sin so only the body is held accountable. What is so unbelievable is many people buy into that garbage.

When certain people, one’s who can’t stand the truth, have no rebuttals left to block the truth, and after all the false rebuttals have been exposed as such, they revert to the last tool which is to denigrate, defame, malign, and vilify the person who has exposed the truth.
 
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Faulty

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You can call me what you like, but the word used in both verses 8 and 9 is poieo, Strong's #4160 (if anybody cares to look it up for themselves). It says it's a "prolonged form" of the word, which indicates a duration of some sort or another. Among the definitions for this word given are: abide, work, exercise, bring forth, continue, doing, fulfill, journeying, keep, purpose, observe, tarry, etc.

I'm not a Greek expert by any means, but I do have a brain, and I do have resourses available to everyone else on here. Anyone who cares can spend a wee amount of time studying it out for themselves.
 
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Giver

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You can call me what you like, but the word used in both verses 8 and 9 is poieo, Strong's #4160 (if anybody cares to look it up for themselves). It says it's a "prolonged form" of the word, which indicates a duration of some sort or another. Among the definitions for this word given are: abide, work, exercise, bring forth, continue, doing, fulfill, journeying, keep, purpose, observe, tarry, etc.

I'm not a Greek expert by any means, but I do have a brain, and I do have resourses available to everyone else on here. Anyone who cares can spend a wee amount of time studying it out for themselves.
You don’t find it strange that the people who were chosen to translate the official bibles did not know how to read Greek?

Do you think maybe words change meaning over two thousand years? Do you know what those words meant two thousand years ago?

When I was young gay meant fun loving. Calling some one queer meant he or she was homosexual. Language changes what do you know?





 
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Boidae

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You don’t find it strange that the people who were chosen to translate the official bibles did not know how to read Greek?

Do you think maybe words change meaning over two thousand years? Do you know what those words meant two thousand years ago?

When I was young gay meant fun loving. Calling some one queer meant he or she was homosexual. Language changes what do you know?

Sorry Giver, but all Christians sin. The only perfect person to walk the Earth was Jesus.

We all still sin, even you.
 
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Giver

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Sorry Giver, but all Christians sin. The only perfect person to walk the Earth was Jesus.

We all still sin, even you.

So in your opinion John was wrong, and Jesus failed to do what he came here to do?

(1John 2:6) “Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.”
 
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Boidae

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So in your opinion John was wrong, and Jesus failed to do what he came here to do?

Nope, Jesus came and did exactly what He was supposed to do. He died for our sin, both past, present and future.

Thing is, we will continue to sin. I sinned today. I got frustrated when things weren't going my way. Said some few choice words in my anger.

I know that when I confessed my sin, I was forgiven because He is faithful to forgive us our sins. I know that I will continue to sin. I'm not perfect, no human is. There was only one person who walked the Earth who is perfect, that was Jesus Christ.

I know that I will sin tomorrow, and while I don't know what that sin is, I know that I will because I am imperfect. I may yet sin tonight.

Christians will continue to sin.
 
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Sorry Giver, but all Christians sin. The only perfect person to walk the Earth was Jesus.

We all still sin, even you.

Amen.

So in your opinion John was wrong, and Jesus failed to do what he came here to do?

(1John 2:6) “Whoever claims to live in him must walk as Jesus did.”


Jesus came to destroy the work of the evil one. The devil would have us be eternally separated from God after death; spiritually dead, unforgiven, unable to repent and be in God's presence. The devil wants the relationship with God that was broken in the Garden of Eden, to remain broken.

Jesus came to restore us to his Father, give us eternal life, make us God's children and make us clean, pure and holy. We have life through him, :clap: and, as John says, when we confess our sins will be forgiven.
 
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Boidae

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Amen.




Jesus came to destroy the work of the evil one. The devil would have us be eternally separated from God after death; spiritually dead, unforgiven, unable to repent and be in God's presence. The devil wants the relationship with God that was broken in the Garden of Eden, to remain broken.

Jesus came to restore us to his Father, give us eternal life, make us God's children and make us clean, pure and holy. We have life through him, :clap: and, as John says, when we confess our sins will be forgiven.

Amen.
 
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Strong in Him

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what do you know?

Charming - what a rude remark.

You also implied that Faulty doesn't know the truth, or want to. Insulting and judgemental - and yet you claim that you do not sin!
 
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Giver

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Charming - what a rude remark.

You also implied that Faulty doesn't know the truth, or want to. Insulting and judgemental - and yet you claim that you do not sin!

I asked him or her a question. Is that rude? Why is it you assume me to be rude? Are you trying to find fault with me?

It would be nice if you would answer the thread, and not try to find fault with me.

 
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Child of JC

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Ask yourself; did Jesus come to save sinners before or after David?
Sending His one and only Son was God's plan way back in the garden. Salvation goes right back to Adam. Does the fact that King David lived before Jesus appeared on the scene matter to this discussion?

David sinned and yet God still proclaimed that he was a man after His Own Heart. If murder and adultery did not disqualify him from the family of God, then we can assume there are other factors to consider in this discussion.

I agree with Faulty's interpretation of the scripture in question.
 
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gideons300

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Whether we want to admit it or not, our present day Christianity has a real dilemma on its hands.

Jesus Himself told us that if we abided in Him, and His words abided in us, we would not fall. but rather receive those things we ask of Him in prayer. And how did Jesus teach us to pray? Are we not to say "...and lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil"

Our word, which we say we believe, every jot and tittle. tells us that if we simply will hold up our shield of faith, believing we are new creatures in Christ, new wineskins, NOW light in the Lord, we will not fall when tempted. This is a promise from the mouth of God Himself. So if we are not experiencing it, the problem is on our end, not His.

John backs up the assertions of complete victory and in truth, and it really bothers some people, for they are convinced that all these promises of overcoming actually mean something else. Thus they are forced to believe that Jesus must have been "Madison Avenuing" Christianity, over promising and underdelivering on the victory that overcomes the world, even our faith.

If we actually believe all this "nonsense" about being given power over the enemy in our lives, then we are responsible to walk that way, and that scares the heck out of us and gives us nowhere to hide when we do slip.

Yet, If we are truly noble, like the Bereans were, and search the scriptures whether these things be so, we must conclude they indeed are and it is our take on them that is twisted, not the scriptues themselves.

It is then that the power of God can make itself known because our only hope is to fall down on our faces and tell our God that He is not a man, that he should lie. If He has promised us victory, then by gosh, we want it and will not rest until we find the secret to how to walk in it.

Far better to do this rather than to justify our unbelief by saying "We are only human", thinking this this will excuse us of any need for full obedience, and then looking down our noses on the man in the temple who is truly crushed over His contiunued sin, crying out for a new heart, yerning for full deliverance..

Listen, dear friends, who keeps who from falling? Jesus promised to keep us, amen? So, if we are not finding that to be true in our lives, do we hide behind our "truth" that it is still impossible, keeping our eyes on us, or do we get our eyes off us and onto Him and what He has accomplished and what He has clearly promised.

Of course, in our fleshly efforts, we all know we cannot walk perfect before Him, for part of us is in direct rebellion to our God and this traitor sells us out, justifying our continued sin, when in fact, this is the real purpose of why Christ came to earth. He came to not just forgive, He came to "set the captives free".

And what freedom is He taking about?

"He that commits sin is a Servant to sin, and the servant abides not in the house always."
John 8

So, here we sit, confounded at the word. My take on it is it is always better to err on the side of believing too much rather than too little. Thank you dear brother, for your post, May eyes be opened to the truths of the new wineskins. IIf it is true, as Paul told us, that nothing profits but a new creature, then it behooves all of us to fall on our faces to first, admit that we do NOT possess it and secondly, how we actually can walk in it.

Blessings,

Gideon
 
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gideons300

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Sending His one and only Son was God's plan way back in the garden. Salvation goes right back to Adam. Does the fact that King David lived before Jesus appeared on the scene matter to this discussion?

David sinned and yet God still proclaimed that he was a man after His Own Heart. If murder and adultery did not disqualify him from the family of God, then we can assume there are other factors to consider in this discussion.

I agree with Faulty's interpretation of the scripture in question.
The flaw in your assertion is that Jesus had not yet died to free us, and David was smack dab under the law. The Holy Spirit had not yet been given, so thus, God was with David, not in Him. Giant difference.

Blessings,
Gideon

 
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Faulty

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You don’t find it strange that the people who were chosen to translate the official bibles did not know how to read Greek?

Do you think maybe words change meaning over two thousand years? Do you know what those words meant two thousand years ago?

When I was young gay meant fun loving. Calling some one queer meant he or she was homosexual. Language changes what do you know?

Oddly enough, if I take your argument to it's obvious conclusion, then there is no way to know what any greek word actually meant back then. That actually weakens your argument quite a bit. Maybe the greek word we call 'sin' was actually the word for 'fishing'. Then all who "fish" are of the devil. Then again, maybe the greek word we know for 'devil' was actually the word for 'wood' back then.

Therefore, 'all who fish are made of wood'.

Hmmm, I can't say I support that intrepretation.
 
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Strong in Him

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I asked him or her a question. Is that rude? Why is it you assume me to be rude? Are you trying to find fault with me?

No I'm not trying to find fault, it didn't sound very nice, that's all.

It's possible you could have meant it as an exclamation, or remark of surprise, as in, "well what do you know?" - similar to "well fancy that!" If so, maybe you could have made it clearer.

Earlier you wrote of people who didn't want to know the truth and who tried to justify their position by discrediting others. Which sounded like you were saying, "what I am saying is true; you don't want to accept it so you are coming up with lots of reasons why I might be wrong". Which isn't that nice.
 
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Oddly enough, if I take your argument to it's obvious conclusion, then there is no way to know what any greek word actually meant back then. That actually weakens your argument quite a bit. Maybe the greek word we call 'sin' was actually the word for 'fishing'. Then all who "fish" are of the devil. Then again, maybe the greek word we know for 'devil' was actually the word for 'wood' back then.

Therefore, 'all who fish are made of wood'.

Hmmm, I can't say I support that intrepretation.

:thumbsup: ^_^
 
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