Jesus :) what do you want us to believe?

[sk8Joyful]

Giving this yet another attempt, (in the thread called "wof vs. Non-wof" now on pg.10, I asked way back on pg. 4 this: #122).

(Sadly over half that thread, is people playing one-ups-manship , discrediting each other, & causing even further DIVISION.)

So let us discuss how wof Evidence ... Jesus' Love with their fellow humans,
for as Jesus told us "on LOVE hang all the laws and the prophets."
With this uppermost in mind, please discuss what the Wof profess to believe:

Word of Faith Statement of Faith
1. We believe that when we repent, confess with our mouths that Jesus is Lord, and believe in our hearts that God raised Him from the dead, that we are now justified by His blood, and shall be saved from wrath through Him. (Romans 5:9, Romans 10:9-10)

2. We believe that we are new creatures made righteous with Christ's righteousness, which is not of ourselves. We are not "unworthy new creatures" nor "sinners saved by grace". We were once sinners, but now we are saved by grace; our spirits born again, created in righteousness and true holiness; Sons of God, and joint heirs with Jesus.(2 Corinthians 5:17, Philippians 3:9, Ephesians 2:5-8, Ephesians 4:24, Galatians 4:6, Romans 8:17)

3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace, commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

4. We believe the Baptism in the Holy Ghost is a gift from God to all believers in this dispensation. It is received separately from the new birth, and is accompanied by the ability to speak in other tongues, as the Holy Spirit Himself gives utterance. (John 15:26, Acts 2:4)

5. We believe that water baptism should be by immersion in the Name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Ghost. It is a symbol of the Christian's identification with Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection. (Matthew 3:16, Romans 6:1-4)

6. We believe prosperity is always God's will for all believers; for the whole person, spirit, soul, and body. The Lord has pleasure in the prosperity of those who serve Him. (3 John 1:2, Psalm 35:27)

7. We believe divine healing is always God's will for all believers; for the whole person, body, soul, and spirit, and is wrought by the power of God. Jesus healed all who were oppressed of the devil. (Acts10:38, 1 Peter 2:24)

8. We believe that all of the Promises of God are always yes and amen, never no; that they are provided for in the atonement of Christ, and are the privilege of every member of the Body of Christ today who will receive them by faith. (2 Corinthians 1:20)

9. We believe that the faith to receive any of the Promises of God comes from hearing God's Word alone; that God's Word is alive and powerful, and every Promise therein contains the faith of God, sufficient to bring itself to pass in the life of any person who believes His Promise in their heart, and confesses it with their mouth. What God has so wonderfully provided by His grace we receive by faith. (Romans 10:17, Hebrews 4:12)

10. We believe that in all things pertaining to life on earth, God is the Author of all that is good; it is only the devil who comes to steal, kill and destroy. God never tempts us, nor uses any element of the curse (Deut. 28) to teach us; He only teaches us by His Holy Spirit revealing to us, the truth of His Holy Word. (John 10:10, James 1:13, Psalm 119:105, John 16:13, Deuteronomy 28)

11. We believe God gave all mankind free will and dominion over the world that we live in; and gave all Christians His kingdom authority and power, to walk as Sons of God, in the steps of Jesus, Who was our example in all things. By way of the leading of the Holy Spirit, we are to take dominion over circumstances and situations, and enforce His Covenant Promises on earth, through the power of His Words spoken out of our mouth. We believe that when we speak in full agreement with His Word, we can have what we ask. (John 1:12, Mark 11:22-24, Luke 9:1, James 4:7, 1 John 3:22)

12. We believe Jesus, in His life and ministry on earth, demonstrated God's perfect will for the earth in all matters for all time. He was made to be sin for us, and was spiritually separated from the presence of the Father on the cross in our place; He descended into hell, was raised up by God the Father, loosed from the pains of death, and was the firstborn from the dead. (John 14:9-12, 2 Corinthians 5:21, Matthew 27:46, Mark 15:34, Acts 2:24, Colossians 1:18)

13. We believe that all scripture, comprised of the 66 Books of the Bible (no apocrypha) from Genesis to Revelation, is the Word of God, and is our final authority over all else for determining faith and practice.

re their 13 Faith statements, these green parts I agree with, thus far:

What is your understanding? - Share...

Thank you!

 

[probinson]

I'd say I agree with most of that (since I helped write a lot of it ).

Do you have specific questions about what I believe? I'll do my best to answer them.

Please note that I said I would do my best to answer questions about what I believe. I can't answer for something Copeland or Hagin or someone else may have said. I can only tell you what I believe and why, and I'll be happy to do so.

 

[sk8Joyful]

I'd say I agree with most of that (since I helped write a lot of it ).

Do you have specific questions about what I believe? I'll do my best to answer them.

Please note that I said I would do my best to answer questions about what I believe.
I can't answer for something Copeland or Hagin or someone else may have said.
I can only tell you what I believe and why, and I'll be happy to do so.

Great, since you wrote those 13, you will be in a good position to explain.

And btw, per CF-record, this is now my 6th. attempt,
so let's make sure THIS time we think of each other in the Positive-light AS God does

okay, let's start with #2:
2. We believe that we are new creatures made righteous with Christ's righteousness, which is not of ourselves.

We are not "unworthy new creatures" nor "sinners saved by grace".

We were once sinners, but now we are saved by grace;
our spirits born again, created in righteousness and true holiness; Sons of God, and joint heirs with Jesus.
(2 Corinthians 5:17, Philippians 3:9, Ephesians 2:5-8, Ephesians 4:24, Galatians 4:6, Romans 8:17)

---
If you've followed my repeated related responses to Yahu,
you know that I wholeheartedly embrace... what God/Jesus us taught, re HOW he regards us:

1. When a person is still a sinner, for her/him God made Laws.
yet,
2. AFTER we are saved, as God/Jesus said, HE calls us sinners, NO MORE. -
in fact in John 15:13-15
13 Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.
14 You are my friends if you do what I command.
15 I no longer call you servants, because a servant does not know his master’s business.
Instead, I have called you friends, for
everything that I learned from my Father I have made known to you. God calls us "My friends"

it IS God's intent & words.
---
Now re "joint heirs with Jesus " ??
(sounds suspiciously like what the mormons also preach; but
they's way LOST.)

So, how do wof Interpret joint heirs with Jesus different?

Thank you!

 

[charityagape]

Was there a question?

 

[sk8Joyful]

Was there a question?

Hi there
I thought I did ask it simply, again.

how do wof Interpret 'joint heirs with Jesus' ?

Thank you!

 

[hislegacy]

Originally Posted by sk8Joyful

how do wof Interpret 'joint heirs with Jesus' ?

Thank you!​

Joint heirs is from

Romans 8:17
and if children, then heirs—heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.​

Transliterated: sygklēronomos, meaning one who obtains something assigned to himself with others, a joint participant

Now you have to connect that with the precedent "heirs of God"

The word heir there is transliterated: klēronomos meaning one who receives his allotted possession by right of sonship

The simple and clearest answer from the Greek says we are like Jesus, who obtained His allotted possession by right of Sonship, and if so, we also have obationed that alloted possession by right of sonship.


The real question is what type of suffering did Christ have. Because the second half of the verse says quite clearly.:

if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together​

So what did Christ's sufferings look like?

that is my question to you.

 

[probinson]

Now re "joint heirs with Jesus " ??
(sounds suspiciously like what the mormons also preach; but
they's way LOST.)

So, how do wof Interpret joint heirs with Jesus different?

Thank you!

First of all, I'd like to reiterate that I'm explaining to you what I believe. I can't speak for all WoF people. I can only explain what I believe and why.

With that in mind....

I have no idea what Mormons believe, nor do I care, so I can't speak to that portion of your question. However, the point in question is based off of this verse;

Romans 8:17 (KJV)
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.
​

This is what I believe. What specifically about this verse do you take issue with?

 

[dkbwarrior]

We are joint heirs with Jesus of the Blessing of Abraham that God gave to Abraham in Gen. 22. This blessing was to be passed down generation to generation of Abrahams descendents.

In effect, this blessing was the Word of God, in written form, the Bible. Specifically, the promises contained therein. Every book of the Bible was written by a descendent of Abraham, in fulfillment of Gods promise to Abraham:

In Blessing I Will Bless You, and in multiplying I will multiply your seed as the sand which is on the seashore, and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies, and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be bless.

And:

I will establish my covenant between me and thee and thy seed after you in their generations.

When we are born again, we become spiritual Jews, we become the seed of Abraham, and therefore become joint heirs with Jesus of this blessing, this covenant, these promises. It is the covenant, specifically the Blessing or Promises of the Covenant, that Jesus inherited as the seed of Abraham, and which we inherit also, as joint heirs with him.

That is why the Bible tells us that we have been blessed with all spiritual blessing in heavenly places in Christ Jesus. And why it say that all things have been given unto us that pertain to life and godliness by way of the exceeding great and precous promises, and that all the promises of God IN HIM are yes and amen.

I have absolutely no idea of what Mormons believe, so cant speak to that part of your question.

Hope that helps.

Peace...

 

[sk8Joyful]

We are joint heirs with Jesus of the Blessing of Abraham that God gave to Abraham in Gen. 22.
This blessing was to be passed down generation to generation of Abraham's descendents.

In effect, this blessing was the Word of God, in written form, the Bible.
Specifically, the promises contained therein.
Every book of the Bible was written by a descendent of Abraham, in fulfillment of Gods promise to Abraham:

In Blessing I Will Bless You, and in multiplying I will multiply your seed as the sand which is on the seashore, and
thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies, and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed.
And:
I will establish my covenant between me and thee
and thy seed after you in their generations.

When we are born again, we become spiritual Jews,
we become the seed of Abraham, and therefore become joint heirs with Jesus of this blessing, this covenant, these promises.
It is the covenant, specifically the Blessing or Promises of the Covenant,
that Jesus inherited as the seed of Abraham, and which we inherit also, as joint heirs with him.

That is why the Bible tells us that we have been blessed
with all spiritual blessing in heavenly places in Christ Jesus.
And why it say that all things have been given unto us
that pertain to life and godliness by way of the exceeding great and precious promises, and
that all the promises of God IN HIM are yes and amen.

Hope that helps.

Peace...

Hi,
You wrote this simply & in a nice way.
The way you expressed it, I can Agree.

(because I left mormonism after 28yrs. in it), I get leary
of things like joint-heirs, as it sounds too much like
'we're equal to God'.
Can you understand my hesitancy regarding that?
I want to avoid getting 'trapped' in another snare.

I want to stay Spiritually-safe. And why I resonate with Andre, because we both identify as God's eternal little-ones.
iow, we will NOT ever be god, big, little or otherwise.

PS: re 'true holiness': what specifically do you mean?

In others of your beliefs that also comes up,
so understand if I ask again, for clarifications. Thank you!

 

[dkbwarrior]

Thank You!

Holiness means to be set apart from sin. It is a synonym for righteousness. We believe that when we are born again, our spirits are rebirthed perfect, created in righteousness and true holiness, and joined with the body of Christ. There is no more sin in our spirit man, as it is one with Christ, and there is no sin in Christ. Though we still live in corruptible flesh, that has yet to be saved, the spirit of the reborn man has been made the righteousness of God in Christ. We do, however, as all christians do, look forward to the redemption of our bodies, in the ressurection. The term true holiness comes from this verse:

22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.
-Ephesians 4:22-24

IOW, the new man, the spirit man, (Jesus said that which is born of the Spirit is spirit), is not trying to become righteous, it was created that way.

Peace...

 

[lismore]

So what did Christ's sufferings look like?

Rather horrendous.

 

[sk8Joyful]

Thank You!

Holiness means to be set apart from sin. It is a synonym for righteousness.
We believe that when we are born again, our spirits are rebirthed perfect,
created in righteousness and true holiness, and joined with the body of Christ.

There is no more sin in our spirit man, as it is one with Christ, and there is no sin in Christ.

Though we still live in corruptible flesh, that has yet to be saved,
the spirit of the reborn man has been made the righteousness of God in Christ.

We do, however, as all christians do, look forward to the redemption of our bodies, in the ressurection.

The term true holiness comes from Ephesians 4:22-24
22 That ye put off concerning the former conversation the old man,
which is corrupt according to the deceitful lusts;
23 And be renewed in the spirit of your mind;
24 And that ye put on the new man, which after God is created in righteousness and true holiness.

IOW, the new man, the spirit man, (Jesus said that which is born of the Spirit is spirit), is not trying to become righteous, it was created that way.

Peace...

Kewl
Yes, I have always believed that God originally created us perfect.

Yet, you are the 1st. people I've heard say this: "We believe when we are born again, our spirits are rebirthed perfect" - who else teaches this?

(not even the mormons do, & they're ALL about *perfection* and
like everyone else, say we MUST WORK our way there.) - Not to mess with that, what a Relief! eh?

Yet, if I understood you correctly? - in the singular-act
of us Allowing God/Jesus to *save* us, He then regards us perfect again?

And yes we will be Resurrected but this
does not mean that our bodies now need rot. That miserable belief I have
not, do not, & will NOT buy-$-into. - and What about the wofers?

Thank you again

 

[dkbwarrior]

Are you asking if our bodies will die?

If so, then we are going a bit off of the WOF statment of faith. I would have to say, that WOF for the most part hold the same view as every other Christian group and Denomination out there, that it is appointed unto man once to die. So I can't give you a specific WOF belief in this regard that is different than any other Christian group.

However, I can tell you my belief, which I also believe is the natural conclusion to WOF beliefs in this regard, though it hasn't been taken this far by the WOF movement in general.

I personally believe that man is appointed once to die, as the scripture clearly says, until such time as the church comes into the unity of the faith, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
-Ephesians 4:13

I believe that it is this maturity in the faith, that will allow us to be translated from this corruptible into the incorruptible, to be clothed with our ressurected bodies, and be caught up to meet the Lord in the air, as Enoch and Elijah in the Old Testament. This is how I believe the rapture will take place. So I essentially believe that there is a generation who will see the corruption of this mortal flesh take on the incorruption of His glorified body by faith.

This however, is a personal belief of mine, not neccesarily held by the WOF movement in general.

Peace...

 

[sk8Joyful]

Are you asking if our bodies will die?

If so, then ...

Hi again
I think it would help this discussion, when you are not sure what I asked, that you simply wait for my response,
as opposed to (in this case, carrying on about death); which I did not ask about.

Here's what I said: "this (resurrection)
does not mean that our bodies now need rot. < That miserable belief I have not, do not, &
will NOT buy-$-into. - and What about the wofers?"

IOW, it is man's fallen preachings that we must rot, before we are even dead.

So I believe (& what do wofers believe about this?: that
we can live Vibrant Joyful & physically Healthy (until we taste death once); & then get Resurrected...

 

[dkbwarrior]

Hi again
I think it would help this discussion, when you are not sure what I asked, that you simply wait for my response,
as opposed to (in this case, carrying on about death); which I did not ask about.

Here's what I said: "this (resurrection)
does not mean that our bodies now need rot. < That miserable belief I have not, do not, &
will NOT buy-$-into. - and What about the wofers?"

IOW, it is man's fallen preachings that we must rot, before we are even dead.

So I believe (& what do wofers believe about this?: that
we can live Vibrant Joyful & physically Healthy (until we taste death once); & then get Resurrected...

That is a given:

7. We believe divine healing is always God's will for all believers; for the whole person, body, soul, and spirit, and is wrought by the power of God. Jesus healed all who were oppressed of the devil. (Acts10:38, 1 Peter 2:24)

We certainly believe that it is Gods will that we walk in divine health, and wholeness in this life; and that we can achieve this goal, by faith, and by following common sense and biblical adomonitions about how we live.

Peace...

 

[sk8Joyful]

That is a given:

7. We believe divine healing is always God's will for all believers; for the whole person, body, soul, and spirit, and is wrought by the power of God. Jesus healed all who were oppressed of the devil. (Acts10:38, 1 Peter 2:24)

We certainly believe that it is Gods will that we walk in divine health, and wholeness in this life; and
that we can achieve this goal, by faith, and by following common sense and biblical admonitions about how we live.

Peace...

okay, Kewl

There's two things in there I have questions about, but since it's #7 on this list, we can discuss them later...
--- okay
Now to the next one:
3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace, commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

Notice, this time none of the words I made GREEN, as I do those I agree with,
because you had not yet explained, as you did later your #-2 Statement, which I now do Agree with.

So in light of #-2 where you say "We believe when we are born again, our spirits are rebirthed perfect", PERFECT is perfect, right? - How you can improve upon perfect, I don't know.

so

Now we have this statement:
3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace,
commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the Consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

What do you mean by Regeneration?, and Sanctification?, and Consummation? of salvation

 

[HolySpiritWOF2]

okay, Kewl

There's two things in there I have questions about, but since it's #7 on this list, we can discuss them later...
--- okay
Now to the next one:
3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace, commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

Notice, this time none of the words I made GREEN, as I do those I agree with,
because you had not yet explained, as you did later your #-2 Statement, which I now do Agree with.

So in light of #-2 where you say "We believe when we are born again, our spirits are rebirthed perfect", PERFECT is perfect, right? - How you can improve upon perfect, I don't know.

so

Now we have this statement:
3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace,
commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the Consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

What do you mean by Regeneration?, and Sanctification?, and Consummation? of salvation

we are a 3-part being. GOD said let US make man in OUR own image after OUR likeness.

the BIBLE says GOD is a SPIRIT.
JESUS is a life-giving SPIRIT
the HOLY SPIRIT is obviously a spirit.

angels are spirits too but NOT made in the image of GOD. only humans are made in the image of GOD.

sooo we are spirits that live in a body and have a soul (mind will emotions).

when we get born again it is because we surrendered our entire being in irrevocable allegience to GOD.

the HOLY SPIRIT comes inside of us and recreates us from the inside - our inner spirit man is co-joined to the HOLY SPIRIT in such a way that we are told that we become a brand new creation. EVERYTHING is new. ALL the old passed away. this is our spirit man/heart. we are re-created with a brand new spirit/heart that is soft and pliable to the HOLY SPIRIT. this is called re-generated, re-born, born of the SPIRIT, sealed by the SPIRIT, born of GOD, born again, etc.

sanctification is a daily re-newing of our mind with the WORD of GOD and by listening to the HOLY SPIRIT of GOD. our spirit is perfect, but our mind needs to learn about the new us. the more we learn about the new us, the better/easier we walk in the goodness of GOD daily.

ex. if you are a re-created KING'S kid, but don't know what that means or how to behave yourself or what authority and power is available to you - you could walk around walking talking living like a sick oppressed pauper.

new creation believers need DAILY renewing of their mind/heart with the WORD and the HOLY SPIRIT leading to walk in the fullness of who they really are. this is called santification. we grow in this until JESUS comes to get us or we go to live with HIM - which ever comes first.

 

[sk8Joyful]

Thanks!

Let's see if I can summarize: "when we get born again
it is because we surrendered our entire being in irrevocable allegience to GOD. the HOLY SPIRIT comes inside us
and recreates us from the inside, with a brand new spirit/heart that is soft and pliable to the HOLY SPIRIT.
this is called re-generated, re-born, born of the SPIRIT, sealed by the SPIRIT, born of GOD, born again, etc."

So re me personally: when (in a communist-country), I 1st. Noticed that TINY-baby
(naked on straw: never done, as I was raised rurally).
I thought something's Different about this, and I asked for 3 years,
until finally as a kindergartner someone told me: "Yes, it was a little boy named JESUS;
but it's only another Fairy-tale, just forget it". JESUS?

JESUS, what a beautiful name. And that's all it took.
How else to describe what happened next? - Firstly the voice saying: You can talk with me anytime. I looked,
around the room. Nope, nobody there. (must be my imagination ) Nobody there. - But yet again
Little one you can talk with me anytime.
okay,
but who are you? and why can't I see you? - I am God, and I live in your heart.
okay, wait a minute, Nobody can live inside my heart, it's too little. the voice said: I can live anywhere I am welcomed. will you Welcome me? and
as it was not threatening or scarry, but in fact I felt from it ONLY PURE LOVE, I said yes
and so our conversations went from there for 6 yrs. My heart was/is "soft & pliable", so was I saved then?
likely not.
God never once told me I was sinner, nor therefore
had need to repent, nor that God was my Savior.
All that I had no awareness of, until I came to the USA,
where the next year I accepted JESUS as my Savior.

--- then you said
"new creation believers need DAILY renewing of their mind/heart with the WORD
and the HOLY SPIRIT leading to walk in the fullness of who they really are.
this is called santification.
we grow in this until JESUS comes to get us or we go to live with HIM - which ever comes first. "

Okay, so during those 6 yrs. that God & I shared...
(I still had never heard anyone pray,
had no awareness of a book called the Bible, &
had never been inside no church). So as far as wof is concerned, our LOVING soul-&-mind relationship was all for naught?

What I'm trying to get at, is that God interacts with us Individually ,
so while it seems like there is only ONE way for God to *save, & sanctify*
God is not bound to only one recipe. - God knows His own, &
how best each can respond, so all who will, can be Save at-home in His eternal... Kingdom

How do wof believe this?

 

[dkbwarrior]

Now we have this statement:
3. We believe in the Doctrine of Sanctification as a definite, yet progressive work of grace,
commencing at the time of regeneration, and continuing until the Consummation of salvation at Christ's return. (John 17:17-19)

What do you mean by Regeneration?, and Sanctification?, and Consummation? of salvation

As HolySpiritWOF said above, man is a three part being, (spirit, soul, body); made in the image of a three part God, (Father, Son, Holy Spirit).

Regeneration is what happens in the spirit of man when he is born again. The spirit of man is born-again, created in righteousness and true holiness.

But the soul of man, (the mind, will, and emotions), is not born again, nor is the body born again.

Sanctification refers to the soul of man, the intellect, the mind. We as christians are called to continually renew our minds to the Word of God, on a day by day basis. Casting down imagination, and every high thing that exalts itself against God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ. This is an ongoing process, and is never fully completed in this life.

2 And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.
-Romans 12:2

21 Wherefore lay apart all filthiness and superfluity of naughtiness, and receive with meekness the engrafted word, which is able to save your souls.
-James 1:21

The consummation of our salvation is the resurrection, when we are given our incorrutible bodies, and the final part of man (our body) is brought into the manifestation of the fulness of our redemption.

22 For we know that the whole creation groaneth and travaileth in pain together until now.
23 And not only they, but ourselves also, which have the firstfruits of the Spirit, even we ourselves groan within ourselves, waiting for the adoption, to wit, the redemption of our body.
-Romans 8:22-23

13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
14 Which is the earnest of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, unto the praise of his glory.
-Ephesians 1:13-14

Peace...

 

[HolySpiritWOF2]

Thanks!

Let's see if I can summarize: "when we get born again
it is because we surrendered our entire being in irrevocable allegience to GOD. the HOLY SPIRIT comes inside us
and recreates us from the inside, with a brand new spirit/heart that is soft and pliable to the HOLY SPIRIT.
this is called re-generated, re-born, born of the SPIRIT, sealed by the SPIRIT, born of GOD, born again, etc."

So re me personally: when (in a communist-country), I 1st. Noticed that TINY-baby
(naked on straw: never done, as I was raised rurally).
I thought something's Different about this, and I asked for 3 years,
until finally as a kindergartner someone told me: "Yes, it was a little boy named JESUS;
but it's only another Fairy-tale, just forget it". JESUS?

JESUS, what a beautiful name. And that's all it took.
How else to describe what happened next? - Firstly the voice saying: You can talk with me anytime. I looked,
around the room. Nope, nobody there. (must be my imagination ) Nobody there. - But yet again
Little one you can talk with me anytime.
okay,
but who are you? and why can't I see you? - I am God, and I live in your heart.
okay, wait a minute, Nobody can live inside my heart, it's too little. the voice said: I can live anywhere I am welcomed. will you Welcome me? and
as it was not threatening or scarry, but in fact I felt from it ONLY PURE LOVE, I said yes
and so our conversations went from there for 6 yrs. My heart was/is "soft & pliable", so was I saved then?
likely not.
God never once told me I was sinner, nor therefore
had need to repent, nor that God was my Savior.
All that I had no awareness of, until I came to the USA,
where the next year I accepted JESUS as my Savior.

--- then you said
"new creation believers need DAILY renewing of their mind/heart with the WORD
and the HOLY SPIRIT leading to walk in the fullness of who they really are.
this is called santification.
we grow in this until JESUS comes to get us or we go to live with HIM - which ever comes first. "

Okay, so during those 6 yrs. that God & I shared...
(I still had never heard anyone pray,
had no awareness of a book called the Bible, &
had never been inside no church). So as far as wof is concerned, our LOVING soul-&-mind relationship was all for naught?

What I'm trying to get at, is that God interacts with us Individually ,
so while it seems like there is only ONE way for God to *save, & sanctify*
God is not bound to only one recipe. - God knows His own, &
how best each can respond, so all who will, can be Save at-home in His eternal... Kingdom

How do wof believe this?

very good questions.

the WORD of GOD can be spoken to someone who does not have a BIBLE. it is still the WORD of GOD. the HOLY SPIRIT knows every WORD of the BIBLE and can quote it or paraphrase it anytime HE wants.

what you experienced DOES happen ALL the time in countries where people have NO access to a BIBLE or a preacher.

some people even have angels come teach them. or JESUS appear to them. or dreams and visions. etc. etc. etc. GOD is LOVE and will do MIRACULOUS things to get HIS WORD and provision to people.

if GOD came to live in your heart i would say that you were saved. i know of children 4 years old and younger who accept JESUS into their heart and are saved. and some of them receive the baptism of the HOLY SPIRIT too. there is NO age limit with GOD. in fact scripture says that unless we ALL become as a little child we can not in any way enter heaven.

when adults acknowlege that they are sinners, this helps them to become like a little child again to accept JESUS as their savior. you were already a little child. "sinner" and "savior" are things to lead us to JESUS. JESUS came to you.

repent means have a change of mind. again that is usually for adults that have forged their own sof for themselves. adults have to put all the facts together of all the things they have been taught to come up with a belief system that makes sense to them. this is quite often not based on the WORD of GOD but on their own best ideas. so adults NEED to repent of all their own ideas and become TEACHABLE little children with GOD. pliable and soft towards GOD. repenting is sometimes a big thing. especially to someone that has learned by suffering to trust ONLY themselves and no one else.

so bottom line: i believe you were saved when you welcomed JESUS into your heart. you by-passed the "sinner repent savior" stuff because you didn't really need all that to become as a little child before GOD. you WERE a little child. your sanctification started the day you welcomed JESUS in your heart.

just curious:did you at some point receive the baptism of the HOLY SPIRIT for HIS power to work through you for your benefit and the benefit of those around you?