India verses China and future India-US axis.

[ander_cool]

September 27, 2005: India has been emerging as a major power over the last twenty years. The Indian economy is growing at a rate of roughly 6.8 percent a year, and its GDP is currently at $3.13 trillion. It also has a military that matches up well with any potential adversary. But how powerful is India when compared to other Asian powers? There is one major rival that has to be considered in Asia: China. With a GDP of $7.2 trillion (about twice that of India’s), China also has a population (1.3 billion) about 30 percent larger than India’s. These two countries are not on a collision course yet. The biggest cause of friction is China’s weapons exports to Pakistan, followed by a border dispute that last flared into war way back in 1962.

Both countries have made extensive acquisitions of Russian technology, like Kilo-class submarines and Su-30 fighters. Both sides also have made some extensive modernization efforts, replacing old technology with new equipment. Both nations are rapidly becoming regional powers to be reckoned with.

The Indian Army has 2.1 million men, counting reserves. It also has 2,800 main battle tanks (including 1,700 T-72s, 400 Vijayanta, 310 T-90S, 120 Arjun, and 200 T-55s), and 1,350 infantry fighting vehicles (1,300 of them BMP-2s). The Indian army also has a large amount of artillery (including 1,300 105mm Indian Field Guns, 750 130mm M-46 howitzers, 550 122mm D-30 howitzers, and 410 FH-77B 155mm howitzers).

The Chinese army has 2.3 million men, and over 7,000 tanks, 5,000 of which are the obsolete Type 59 (a copy of the T-55), and another 1,200 are the more modern Type 96.

The Indian Navy is probably one of the best in Asia. It has one carrier (Viraat), with as many as three others coming in the near future (in addition to the air-defense ship under construction, and the INS Vikramaditya, formerly the Admiral Gorshkov). India also has 11 destroyers, six of which (the three Delhi-class and the three Talwar-class) are modern, 11 frigates (six of which are the modern Godavari-class), and 16 submarines (14 of which are either the Type 209 or Kilo-class submarines). India has also recently agreed to lease two Akula-class nuclear submarines from Russia. The Chinese navy has a lot of quantity (74 submarines, 25 destroyers, 45 frigates), but many of these designs are old (16 of the destroyers, 30 of the frigates, and 52 of the submarines are state-of-the-art for 1960).

The Indian Air Force has around 670 aircraft. These aircraft have all been heavily upgraded. They have modern aircraft as well, including 50 Su-30MK (to eventually reach 190), 50 Mirage 2000, and 60 MiG-29. Even India’s MiG-21s have been upgraded to carry missiles like the AA-11/R-73 Archer, making them deadly adversaries. India’s pilots also train like Western pilots do. The Chinese air force has a lot of quantity (1,900 combat aircraft). However, many of these are older planes (350 J-6/MiG-19, 500 J-7/MiG-21, 300 Q-5, and 80 H-6/Tu-16 Badger). The only modern combat aircraft in the Chinese air force are the 180 J-11/Su-27 Flankers, 200 Su-30MKK Flankers, and 200 J-8 Finback fighters.

Both India and China are rising powers in Asia. That said, India has a pair of crucial leads – its Navy and Air Force have advantages in training and equipment that enable India to project power. China is nowhere close to India’s level of experience with carrier aviation, and PLAAF pilots are not as good as India’s. The Chinese have an edge in their army, but that would be easily overcome by India’s naval and air superiority, making India the major power in Asia by a small margin. – Harold C. Hutchison (hchutch@ix.netcom.com)

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htworld/articles/20050927.aspx

 

[CHARLES H]

September 27, 2005: India has been emerging as a major power over the last twenty years. The Indian economy is growing at a rate of roughly 6.8 percent a year, and its GDP is currently at $3.13 trillion. It also has a military that matches up well with any potential adversary. But how powerful is India when compared to other Asian powers? There is one major rival that has to be considered in Asia: China. With a GDP of $7.2 trillion (about twice that of India’s), China also has a population (1.3 billion) about 30 percent larger than India’s. These two countries are not on a collision course yet. The biggest cause of friction is China’s weapons exports to Pakistan, followed by a border dispute that last flared into war way back in 1962.

Both countries have made extensive acquisitions of Russian technology, like Kilo-class submarines and Su-30 fighters. Both sides also have made some extensive modernization efforts, replacing old technology with new equipment. Both nations are rapidly becoming regional powers to be reckoned with.

The Indian Army has 2.1 million men, counting reserves. It also has 2,800 main battle tanks (including 1,700 T-72s, 400 Vijayanta, 310 T-90S, 120 Arjun, and 200 T-55s), and 1,350 infantry fighting vehicles (1,300 of them BMP-2s). The Indian army also has a large amount of artillery (including 1,300 105mm Indian Field Guns, 750 130mm M-46 howitzers, 550 122mm D-30 howitzers, and 410 FH-77B 155mm howitzers).

The Chinese army has 2.3 million men, and over 7,000 tanks, 5,000 of which are the obsolete Type 59 (a copy of the T-55), and another 1,200 are the more modern Type 96.

The Indian Navy is probably one of the best in Asia. It has one carrier (Viraat), with as many as three others coming in the near future (in addition to the air-defense ship under construction, and the INS Vikramaditya, formerly the Admiral Gorshkov). India also has 11 destroyers, six of which (the three Delhi-class and the three Talwar-class) are modern, 11 frigates (six of which are the modern Godavari-class), and 16 submarines (14 of which are either the Type 209 or Kilo-class submarines). India has also recently agreed to lease two Akula-class nuclear submarines from Russia. The Chinese navy has a lot of quantity (74 submarines, 25 destroyers, 45 frigates), but many of these designs are old (16 of the destroyers, 30 of the frigates, and 52 of the submarines are state-of-the-art for 1960).

The Indian Air Force has around 670 aircraft. These aircraft have all been heavily upgraded. They have modern aircraft as well, including 50 Su-30MK (to eventually reach 190), 50 Mirage 2000, and 60 MiG-29. Even India’s MiG-21s have been upgraded to carry missiles like the AA-11/R-73 Archer, making them deadly adversaries. India’s pilots also train like Western pilots do. The Chinese air force has a lot of quantity (1,900 combat aircraft). However, many of these are older planes (350 J-6/MiG-19, 500 J-7/MiG-21, 300 Q-5, and 80 H-6/Tu-16 Badger). The only modern combat aircraft in the Chinese air force are the 180 J-11/Su-27 Flankers, 200 Su-30MKK Flankers, and 200 J-8 Finback fighters.

Both India and China are rising powers in Asia. That said, India has a pair of crucial leads – its Navy and Air Force have advantages in training and equipment that enable India to project power. China is nowhere close to India’s level of experience with carrier aviation, and PLAAF pilots are not as good as India’s. The Chinese have an edge in their army, but that would be easily overcome by India’s naval and air superiority, making India the major power in Asia by a small margin. – Harold C. Hutchison (hchutch@ix.netcom.com)

http://www.strategypage.com/htmw/htworld/articles/20050927.aspx

we need to make sure that we play nice with india so they will help us counter the chinese threat.

 

[Cjwinnit]

Well, India play Cricket so they should be ok.

 

[rahul_sharma]

India - US strategic relations are getting stronger and stronger with each passing year and mostly Indians support this growing relationship. Infact, in popular poll few weeks back , America got maximum support for it's policies from Indians.

But noone should believe that India can become puppet of US like UK and some other NATO countries. India's history is a proof that India will do whatever she wants. No one can take India for granted.

 

[revolutio]

Where's the Swiss option?

 

[simplicity]

Ah well, it's always a good idea to make friends regardless of the other nations involved. Be friendly with India. Be friendly with Pakistan. Be friendly with China. Offer up handshakes and other symbolic gestures whenever possible. I suspect the US will need all of its tangible resources at home in the future.

 

[Grey Eminence]

India will have a use for the US as long as it serves their strategic interets. However a more formal arrangement between the two nations is unlikely. The BJP came off very badly in the last election on a platform very much involved tighter Indian-US relations.

India and China have very little in the way of friction that could lead to conflicts. While there may still be some lingering border issues in the mountains both nations know it is inherently in their interest to let the matter rest. The only thing that I could see brining them into conflict is American adventurism with regards to China. And only then if India was stupid enough to get involved.

America might like to enlist India in its paranoid little quest against China but it advances no real goal of India's why should they get involved? They might be better served by actually talking to China to improve regional stability. Why does the US need to be involved?

 

[jlujan69]

Way back in 1980, a fiction book called Systemic Shock was written which told of a Sino-Indian alliance that led to a nuclear attack on America. WW3 was the result. At the end, however, America was a divided nation literally. What was once a united country now consisted of an independent east coast; old Southern Confederacy; the Plains and west coast were divided up between Mexico and Canada; and America proper in the Great Lakes region, led by a Mormon president. As if that weren't enough, Canada became the dominant western power!

 

[jlujan69]

The Chinese army has 2.3 million men,

That may well be their active duty members, but their potential in the event of a call up would exceed the US population easily. If all of them were fully armed with the latest and greatest weaponry, they'd be virtually unstoppable, short of nuking them. Even if they were only armed with spear guns and Swiss army knives, imagine having to face them en masse.

 

[mala]

That may well be their active duty members, but their potential in the event of a call up would exceed the US population easily. If all of them were fully armed with the latest and greatest weaponry, they'd be virtually unstoppable, short of nuking them. Even if they were only armed with spear guns and Swiss army knives, imagine having to face them en masse.

exactly how would you face them en masse?
it would be fairly hard to get that many people from one side of the world to the other
maybe if they form a human body bridge across the ocean =\

 

[Marklet12]

I hope we team up with India...their women are hottt! Although Ziyi Zhang is a looker.

 

[jlujan69]

exactly how would you face them en masse?
it would be fairly hard to get that many people from one side of the world to the other

I wasn't thinking of them invading America, but rather an armed conflict on the Asian continent.

maybe if they form a human body bridge across the ocean

Now, that'd be a sight!

 

[Chosen One]

That may well be their active duty members, but their potential in the event of a call up would exceed the US population easily. If all of them were fully armed with the latest and greatest weaponry, they'd be virtually unstoppable, short of nuking them.

We've done it before- we can do it again.

Your assuming they have the latest gear. They just got to the point where they can finally feed everyone.

I think a democratic outbreak in China is the best hope.

 

[Moros]

I find it interesting that the US has been the main superpower because of its wealth, whereas the new superpowers are because of their populations.. I see this as evidence of the decline the quality of humanity.

 

[ander_cool]

I find it interesting that the US has been the main superpower because of its wealth, whereas the new superpowers are because of their populations.. I see this as evidence of the decline the quality of humanity.

When we can generate this much wealth from 300 million than think how much wealth IT power India and manufacturing power China can generate in near future? Don't think of today , see what can happen tomarrow.

 

[rahul_sharma]

I hope we team up with India...their women are hottt! Although Ziyi Zhang is a looker.

....what a reason!!

 

[CocaCola]

I believe We can't trust India and ofcourse We can't trust China.

But is that mean We can trust Pakistan's mushraff .

 

[ander_cool]

Who voted for Islamic pakistan? Who voted for this country which is hub of international terrorism?

 

[JPPT1974]

I believe We can't trust India and ofcourse We can't trust China.

But is that mean We can trust Pakistan's mushraff .

Sadly it seems we can't trust a lot of countries these days.
Because they don't or won't trust the USA!

 

[Inge87]

India is one the U.S.'s natural allies against Chinese influence in Asia (the other is Japan). Although the border desputes have for the most part been solved, it India and China still do not like each other, nor do they really pretend to get along. It will take a huge mistake by the U.S. to send India over to the other side.