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No, I didn't know that. Please inform me.
You did? They must not have been reliable points.
Since we all know that Gentiles have never been under the ritual laws contained in the Sinai covenant and you are the expert on commandment keeping, give us some specifics on the commands we have to keep in order to gain eternal life.
Because my Savior is the Son of God and God loves all His children. God chose to bring our Savior Jesus to be born into a Jewish family.So you don't consider yourself Israel? Why then did you pick an Israeli Jew to be your Savior?
Funny you didn't attempt to answer my question. I would jump at the chance to help someone to know what commands
God would have us keep in order to gain eternal life.
Lulav asked;
I wonder who came up with that phrase ' under the law'?
Rom 2:12 All who sin apart from the law will also perish apart from the law, and all who sin under the law will be judged by the law.
Lulav answered, Kinda;Lulav wrote;
Your sarcasm at me again is unneeded and shows you need to sink to that to continue this debate?
Jesus explains very clearly in the Gospels.
Sarcasm? I thought I was paying you a compliment.
Lulav wrote;Yes, go on I can hardly wait for you to explain what Paul wrote after that initial statement.
Are you speaking of this?
But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious?
I really believe you do understand the meaning of 2Cor3:6-11, but refuse to admit it because it upsets your apple cart. Because of your preconceived beliefs, Paul introduces the real truth about the 10 commandments. They were the ministry of Death because no one could keep them and they had no power to forgive. They were Israel's temporary guide until Calvary when the law ended.
I can't even begin to go into all those obfuscations. He is mixing up so many things it's pathetic really.
First calling what GOD HIMSELF wrote on the tablets, HIS WORDS, a 'ministry of Death'? when they were to give life. These commandments were to raise up a holy nation to bring forth the Messiah, have you ever thought about that?
Bob S wrote;
Jesus was directing His words to the Jews that at the time were under the old covenant. The problem was not one of His listeners had the ability to really keep all of the commandments found in Torah and that fact is no different today.
Lulav answered;
Oh, there's that 'Under the old law' comment. So everything Jesus said was futile right? Why teach on the law of God and then do away with it shortly thereafter? Rather pointless wouldn't you say? Just pointless and besides that what God had handed down to those at the mountain, he being an evil god gave them things to follow, knowing full well they couldn't do it. That's like giving a 3 year old a copy of Greys Anatomy and telling him to go and be a doctor, now.
So, Paul was a liar when he wrote 2Cor3:6-11. God, because Israel broke the Sinai covenant, ended the Sinai covenant with its 613 Laws. That included the 10 commandments
Lulav wrote;I am so glad you found those verses from 1Jn because I also have a few for you to ponder. The verses I have for you to ponder actually explain the verses you asked me to consider. The verses that explain actually what commandments we are to keep. John tells us we are of the TRUTH if we keep His commandments. Please do not gloss over the TRUTH Lulav. It seems like you have in the past because I have pointed to these verses many times and you must have refused to consider them.
Accusations? According to 1Jn3:19-24 you really don't know whati it is. You are trying to live by a covenant that ended around AD 33.Accusations again Bob? but I have to say, even when it disrupts my whole universe I have searched my whole life for Truth, and not like Pilate, I do know what it is.
Lulav wrote;1Jn 3:19-24 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.
Click to expand...
Didn't we already go over this on this thread or perhaps another?
18My little children, let us not love in word or in tongue, but in deed and in truth. 19And by this we know that we are of the truth, and shall [e]assure our hearts before Him. 20For if our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and knows all things. 21Beloved, if our heart does not condemn us, we have confidence toward God.
22And whatever we ask we receive from Him, because we keep His commandmentS and do those thingS that are pleasing in His sight.
23And this is His commandment: that we should believe on the name of His Son Jesus Christ and love one another, as He gave us commandment.
Yes, we have and your answers were lame then and are still lame. Believe and Love equal two (2) commands and within those two commands if we could and would keep them there would be eternal peace on this Earth. There was not one ritual command in the old covenant that could even come close to those two new covenant commands. You cull them because of an S? Oy!
Which means that they were never commanded to observe Shavuot.Now you need to remember that Gentiles were never commanded to observe Torah. However, all mankind is instilled with the knowledge of right and wrong, so couple that fact with believing the Son of God and loving our fellow man creates a new being filled with the Spirit passed out by Jesus to all at Pentecost.
Not to all, no Gentiles were present unless you count the Roman soldiers that might have been around.
What bearing hinges on whether or not Gentiles were in attendance? Are Gentiles restricted from receiving the Holy Spirit because they might not have been participants at Pentecost?
Yes, they were not perfect and neither are any Gentiles but remember it was the Gentiles that led them astray. I think if one had a choice it would be better to be a Gentile and choose to obey the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob than to be a Jew who got lead astray but the workings of Gentiles.The problem was the Israelites and Gentiles that joined with the Israelites never lived up to the expectations of all the Laws found in Torah. You know the rest of the story. Jesus was directing His words to the Jews that at the time were under the old covenant. The problem was, not one of His listeners had the ability to really keep all of the commandments found in Torah, and that fact is no different today.
Hold on there Lulav, Gentiles led the Israelites astray? I am supposed to remember that? Wasn't it the Jews that were leading the foolish Galatians astray? They were teaching them they had to keep the laws of the old covenant.
Maybe that is something you need to investigate, but I can tell you the main reason was not to come down to 'save everybody', but to put things legally to rights from where man fell and what the consequence was to the one who coerced them to. Genesis 3:15, study that and you many then understand.Why did Jesus have to leave Heaven if salvation came by keeping the Law?
Absolutely a bunch of bologna. The law could not save anyone. Salvation comes from believing in Jesus and loving others as Jesus loves us.
Then please explain to me if they cause death why does the LORD GOD have them up in Heaven, why didn't he get rid of them when Jesus came up to heaven after the resurrection?Israelites were failures just as you and I are failures in keeping the commands Jesus has given us in the new covenant. We live because Jesus lives. As is written in 2Cor3 the 10 commandments WERE the ministry of death, but the Spirit gives life. The Spirit is what is glorious now. The Spirit in us is our guide to eternal life replacing the ministry of Death (the 10 commandments). Amen!
Maybe that is something you need to investigate. What we do know is that the Holy 10 commandments were the temporary guide for Israel and now we are guided by the indwelling of the Holy Spirit as per 2Cor3:6-11. I, for one, do not try to second guess Jesus' ambassador, Paul.
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