Idolism

[FanthatSpark]

Blessings forum,

Listened to a sermon on idols and praise God for his sacrifice. Basically what was said is..."Take a moment and consider,what is it that
we are invested in? Don't touch my ...what? Don't borrow my what? If I lost my _____ I would be devastated." Then it was said, "If any of our answers were not God, then self examination of investment of self in, why not God?" Man,, that really convicted me.

How do you deal with a question like that?

 

[tremble]

Sounds like a pretty good sermon, Fan. Thanks for sharing it. And I agree that it's a convicting topic. We all have issues with materialism.

How do you deal with a question like that?

I think what your pastor did, and what you did by starting this thread is a pretty good start; bringing it out into the open for discussion. Too often we find ways to hide our materialism from ourselves. As the proverb says, the heart is deceitful above all things. Exposing the issue to the light of day is a helpful first step in dealing with it.

Another way of dealing with this issue is what the early church did; they forsook personal ownership and shared all things in common. It doesn't eliminate the problem totally, but it's a huge step in that direction when we agree to share with one another as a way of life rather than random favours we do for one another.

 

[Neogaia777]

Blessings forum,

Listened to a sermon on idols and praise God for his sacrifice. Basically what was said is..."Take a moment and consider,what is it that
we are invested in? Don't touch my ...what? Don't borrow my what? If I lost my _____ I would be devastated." Then it was said, "If any of our answers were not God, then self examination of investment of self in, why not God?" Man,, that really convicted me.

How do you deal with a question like that?

I get your point about Idols, but where you say "what is it that
we are invested in? Don't touch my ...what? Don't borrow my what? If I lost my _____ I would be devastated.

What we are invested in should be God, yes, but that means the will of God, and doing the will of God can be/mean many different things, so if we say "I'm invested in helping or working with the homeless, the elderly, disabled, or children or all those who are less fortunate" or "I'm invested in talking to major corporations about charitable giving", or "I'm invested in self-improvement in order to better serve others in some capacity" or "I'm invested in helping others with their mental health by going to school and becoming a Psychologist." or "I'm a musician and wish to help others through my music, so I'm invested in that." or, Well, I think you get my point by now, we should be invested in doing the "will" of God in our lives, and that is going to be different for each person...

Where you say "Don't touch my " " and you think we should say "God", God is not a possession for us to possess and get jealous over, we should want others to touch or share our God, trust me their enough of God go around and we should want him to "go around" and "share" him, and not be Jealous if our God shows another person attention or care... Same goes with "Don't borrow my " ", we should want God to go to others even before ourselves, so as for me, anyone can "borrow" my God, and I do not mind...

As for the last one if I lost my " " I would be devastated, I think it OK to say God, in this case, and we should say "God" in this case, although I don't think it's necessarily a sin to say if I lost my children, or mother or father or someone else you love and care about deeply, I would be devastated. I don't necessarily think it's a sin to say that...

Greetings and God Bless you, FanthatSpark!

 

[tremble]

What we are invested in should be God, yes, but that means the will of God, and doing the will of God can be/mean many different things, so if we say "I'm invested in helping or working with the homeless, the elderly, disabled, or children or all those who are less fortunate" or "I'm invested in talking to major corporations about charitable giving", or "I'm invested in self-improvement in order to better serve others in some capacity" or "I'm invested in helping others with their mental health by going to school and becoming a Psychologist." or "I'm a musician and wish to help others through my music, so I'm invested in that." or, Well, I think you get my point by now, we should be invested in doing the "will" of God in our lives, and that is going to be different for each person...

Hi Neo. I'm pretty sure the context was materialism. How does one say, "don't touch my work with the homeless"? I suppose someone could make an idol out of helping the poor, but that seems like a somewhat rare example to focus on, rather than all the many, many examples of people making idols out of material possessions.

Where you say "Don't touch my " " and you think we should say "God", God is not a possession for us to possess and get jealous over, we should want others to touch or share our God, trust me their enough of God go around and we should want him to "go around" and "share" him, and not be Jealous if our God shows another person attention or care... Same goes with "Don't borrow my " ", we should want God to go to others even before ourselves, so as for me, anyone can "borrow" my God, and I do not mind...

Again, I think you've misunderstood the context of the sermon (though the thoughts you've expressed here sound fine on their own).

 

[FanthatSpark]

I get your point about Idols, but where you say "what is it that
we are invested in? Don't touch my ...what? Don't borrow my what? If I lost my _____ I would be devastated.

What we are invested in should be God, yes, but that means the will of God, and doing the will of God can be/mean many different things, so if we say "I'm invested in helping or working with the homeless, the elderly, disabled, or children or all those who are less fortunate" or "I'm invested in talking to major corporations about charitable giving", or "I'm invested in self-improvement in order to better serve others in some capacity" or "I'm invested in helping others with their mental health by going to school and becoming a Psychologist." or "I'm a musician and wish to help others through my music, so I'm invested in that." or, Well, I think you get my point by now, we should be invested in doing the "will" of God in our lives, and that is going to be different for each person...

Where you say "Don't touch my " " and you think we should say "God", God is not a possession for us to possess and get jealous over, we should want others to touch or share our God, trust me their enough of God go around and we should want him to "go around" and "share" him, and not be Jealous if our God shows another person attention or care... Same goes with "Don't borrow my " ", we should want God to go to others even before ourselves, so as for me, anyone can "borrow" my God, and I do not mind...

As for the last one if I lost my " " I would be devastated, I think it OK to say God, in this case, and we should say "God" in this case, although I don't think it's necessarily a sin to say if I lost my children, or mother or father or someone else you love and care about deeply, I would be devastated. I don't necessarily think it's a sin to say that...

Greetings and God Bless you, FanthatSpark!

Neo my brother!

How goes the walk? In OP it is what "was" said by another. But, held
conviction ,for me, to examine self in where I place God. Because it had conviction for self on examination of "how" I think, it seemed worthy to post a broad brushed idea of the sermon. In the authoring, a few suggestions on questions to ask self is given. However, not limited to those questions asked of the messenger of the sermon. We all have that
little whisperer of a voice inside our heads and know the question to ask
self. Basically, it falls under Faith vs Realities of the physical. For me, I fall short of the mustard seed and can not move mountains, thus limitations in faith. As posted in OP , Praise God for His sacrifice for my own lack. Some of your suggestions have merit especially in obedience. Thanks for the input brother!!

 

[Neogaia777]

Neo my brother!

How goes the walk? In OP it is what "was" said by another. But, held
conviction ,for me, to examine self in where I place God. Because it had conviction for self on examination of "how" I think, it seemed worthy to post a broad brushed idea of the sermon. In the authoring, a few suggestions on questions to ask self is given. However, not limited to those questions asked of the messenger of the sermon. We all have that
little whisperer of a voice inside our heads and know the question to ask
self. Basically, it falls under Faith vs Realities of the physical. For me, I fall short of the mustard seed and can not move mountains, thus limitations in faith. As posted in OP , Praise God for His sacrifice for my own lack. Some of your suggestions have merit especially in obedience. Thanks for the input brother!!

Hello! sister... The walk is good, thanks for asking...

Just to clarify, I understand the point of the message being about Idols, and I understand and get both yours and the messengers point... Maybe, it's just that I was trying to broaden it a bit, and I sometimes wonder how much God want's us to even Idolize him, putting him up so high and so far away that he becomes out of reach for us and limits our ability to have a personal relationship with him, man to man, or man to woman. I think, (I think, I don't know for certain, it's a theory) but I think one reason among the many reasons that God came down to us in human form, is to show us that there's really not that big a difference between God and Man, so we could develop a personal, intimate real, down to earth, real "relationship" with him...

For example, we know for certain that God does not want us bowing down to carved images, statues, or using trinkets, like jewelry or neclaces of "other gods", but how do you think Jesus would react to us making huge statues of him, and us bowing down to them, or what do you think, he thinks about crosses (as an Idol), I think he would rip/tear his garments apart, and start telling the people, "No, No, do not do that, you're not getting it, are you?" and would rip his garments apart over the affair...

I also wanted to point out that while yes, we should cling to our Lord Jesus Christ, but not like a possession, and when he see him going to another, and we feel he is maybe not with us at the moment, but we see him with another person, we should not become jealous or envious, but we should be happy and glad to see our Lord go to another and help them...

God Bless, sister!

 

[RBPerry]

Thank you for your post. At one point in my life I lost everything I had, I was alone, broke, and miserable. The Lord had to take me there so I would realize he was all I ever needed;it became the absolute best time of me life, hard yes, but a wonderful blessing and time of maturing.

 

[AT7iLA]

That's a deeper meaning to idolatry. Idolatry us pretty much a slap in the face of God and an insult to our intelligence. Why make an idol or an image to God when God already made an image of Himself by creating us. Genesis.

 

[Neogaia777]

The OT was a time of ignorance, about God, the Old Covenant, in it God made certain exceptions like men's vulnerability to fornication and adultery, so, he made the "exception" in the Old Covenant of men having multiple wives, I believe he also made an exception for Idol worship, mainly the Ark of the Covenant, and the tent (temple) of meeting and the altar, and it's inner and outer courtyards, inscence, loaves of presentation, seven candles, holy place and most holy place(s), ect., ect...

I believe God knew at that early age and time he wasn't going to be able to prevent us from having an earthen model (Idol) of him, so he gave them the Ark of the Covenant, and all that went with it, but It was almost like he was saying "Allright, if there going to have to have some kind of earthbound "Idol" of for me, at this early stage of development, I'm going to choose what it is..."

And so, he gave them the Ark, and all that went with it, as an earthly presentation or "model" of the earthly representation (representative of) the Heavenly Jerusalem, and Heaven, so he allowed this for a time, but, in the new Covenant with Christ, we are supposed to have "grown up" and got the point, and are not supposed to have any Idols, even of him, nor are we supposed to "Idolize" anyone or anything else on earth, above him...

The Old Covenant and the OT, were an "age of ignorance" for man, but after Christ, and with the New Covenant, and the NT, we are supposed to have grown out of, this age of ignorance, having only one spouse, and no Idols...

Well, that's my take anyways, in Jesus name,

God Bless!

 

[FanthatSpark]

The OT was a time of ignorance, about God, the Old Covenant, in it God made certain exceptions like men's vulnerability to fornication and adultery, so, he made the "exception" in the Old Covenant of men having multiple wives, I believe he also made an exception for Idol worship, mainly the Ark of the Covenant, and the tent (temple) of meeting and the altar, and it's inner and outer courtyards, inscence, loaves of presentation, seven candles, holy place and most holy place(s), ect., ect...

I believe God knew at that early age and time he wasn't going to be able to prevent us from having an earthen model (Idol) of him, so he gave them the Ark of the Covenant, and all that went with it, but It was almost like he was saying "Allright, if there going to have to have some kind of earthbound "Idol" of for me, at this early stage of development, I'm going to choose what it is..."

And so, he gave them the Ark, and all that went with it, as an earthly presentation or "model" of the earthly representation (representative of) the Heavenly Jerusalem, and Heaven, so he allowed this for a time, but, in the new Covenant with Christ, we are supposed to have "grown up" and got the point, and are not supposed to have any Idols, even of him, nor are we supposed to "Idolize" anyone or anything else on earth, above him...

The Old Covenant and the OT, were an "age of ignorance" for man, but after Christ, and with the New Covenant, and the NT, we are supposed to have grown out of, this age of ignorance, having only one spouse, and no Idols...

Well, that's my take anyways, in Jesus name.




Greetings Sister Neo, ,,

Your view is so literal. Get you some time in the Spirit and revisit that statement above.

Salutations Sister Neo.

 

[RBPerry]

The OT was a time of ignorance, about God, the Old Covenant, in it God made certain exceptions like men's vulnerability to fornication and adultery, so, he made the "exception" in the Old Covenant of men having multiple wives,

The Catholic church changed the rules regarding polygamy, it never was and still isn't a sin. The original definition of fornication is harlot-mongering. Look carefully at Lev 18 regarding acceptable sexual practices. God law hasn't changed, the churches has.

 

[tremble]

LK 16:13 No servant can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

LK 16:14 And the Pharisees also, who were covetous, heard all these things: and they derided him.

"Mammon" is a term used to describe money and the things money can buy. In response to Jesus' teachings about money, the religious leaders insulted Jesus. Why? They were upset because he was attacking their idol. They were covetous which is idolatry and Jesus was speaking against their idol (mammon).

Paul also confirms this.

COL 3:5 Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:

EPH 5:5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

 

[Alithis]

I'v said it before and thus far nothing has changed.
Whenever we elevate any one,thing,idea,to a place of exalted importance over the position and knowledge of the Lord Jesus,-it is in every meaning of the word,a form of idolatry .