Fantasy : Good or Bad

[Eagle's Wind]

I'd say yes to all the questions for real witchcraft. however, you have yet to prove that fantasy magic=witchcraft that's mentioned in the Bible

Let me look at my dictionary.....



Witchcraft - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.



OK, let me get my bible concordance ......



Fantasy magic - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.

Hummmm.. Just as I thought . THEY'RE THE SAME THING !!!

 

[Amy]

I was a little taken back by the sexual promiscuity in the first book.

Well, what happens there hardly can be called "sexual promiscuity." The man has one sexual encounter with the woman (no graphic descriptions), and he realizes later how wrong it was and regrets taking what should only belong to her husband. I think the book deals with the subject well.

Amy

 

[Nienor]

Let me look at my dictionary.....



Witchcraft - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.



OK, let me get my bible concordance ......



Fantasy magic - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.

Hummmm.. Just as I thought . THEY'RE THE SAME THING !!!

Paladin went through and defined the types of magic condemned in the Bible. please go and disprove what he said instead of looking in a thesarus. (that isn't a definition of magic, its a comparison.)

and why would a bible concordance define fantasy magic

 

[PaladinValer]

So what your saying is this - if it's not real it's OK to pretend?

1. I never said anything about "pretending."
2. If it isn't real, then it isn't real. So yes, go wave all the little sticks and learn the Latin language all you want; it won't produce a darn thing.

Fantasy is fantasy. Reality is reality. Some wise men and women would say our world is "God's Fantasy," but then again, that's something else (not to mention, I digress...).

There is nothing wrong with pretending you have supernatural powers. I've been known to control traffic lights from time to time myself with a flick; I've learned to time my little hand movement by memorizing how long the various traffic lights usually last...harmless fun and good for a gag.

I highly doubt God is so unintelligent that He cannot tell the difference between pretend and real. By your logic, God couldn't tell the difference between a real knight and a little boy or girl wearing a kettle on the head while holding a trash can and wielding a golf club. Rather rediculous, don't you think?

I usually play my character "Valer" when gaming. He's a aasimar paladin, so he's got some "magical" abilities. I tell the DM, "Valer casts heal light wounds on 'X'" or "My character decides to pray and petition his god for the use of a light spell." Am I really doing so? No. Yes, Dungeons and Dragons somewhat loosely models its "magic" and "magic"-using classes on actual things and yes, for those clerical classes, there's a religious element to it. However, 1) those "religions" are totally made up, 2) the "magic" isn't real. I don't see, during any of my games, the actual players' hands glowing or have lightning coming out of their rear ends (sorry; couldn't resist the Braveheart reference). Never have, and never will.

Let me look at my dictionary.....

Witchcraft - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.

OK, let me get my bible concordance ......

Fantasy magic - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.

Hummmm.. Just as I thought . THEY'RE THE SAME THING !!!

Same Fallacy of Equivocation, as stated already before. Repeating the same error doesn't make you right.

And as for your "Bible concordance," get a new one: Jewish prohibitions against magic wasn't so much a universal ban but specific to non-Hebrew religious traditions. You, and obviously your concordance's authors, forget that the cultural belief in magic back then was not drawing from metamath or metaphysical, beyond-logic equasions (like it is in most fantasies, like Harry Potter) but always had a religious basis. The gods would grant the powers to their worshippers through various ceremonies or through their appointed messengers.

Judaism was no different; the very use of prophets and Moses' miracles were no different from that of the Egyptians', the Babylonians', or various Native American tribal rituals. The only difference is that, to Jews, their God, YHVH, was the only True God; if others existed, YHVH Created them. As such, the only acceptable magical or miraculous practice could be that which was sanctioned by God.

So you've yet to prove that your average fantasy book or game is in any way evil, demonic, or "ungodly."

 

[Llauralin]

Allow me to ask, do you believe that witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Do you believe that practicing witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Do you believe that entertaining yourself by watching people practice witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Lastly, Do you believe that entertaining yourself by pretending to practice witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Yes, witchcraft is an abomination
Yes, practicing witchcraft is an abomination
Do you mean watching or reading; if a Christian is actuall watching people practicing real witchcraft, I think they have a duty to try to interfere.... If you mean reading, you should say so.
Pretending? That sounds rather useless and wasteful, but not necessarily abhorrent.... Scripture is silent on this.

This is a perspective which I have heard before, but honestly do not understand. First of all, I am led to believe, judging by this post, that you lump together every expression of supernatural power under "witchcraft," which seems a misrepresentation; some magic is witchcraft, some is not. In much of good Christian fantasy, the powers that we refer to as "magic" could just as well be called "miracles," powers bestowed upon or given to the characters by someone with the authority to do so. Some examples may include traditional fairy tales, wherein all kinds of magic is used, both good and bad; there are spells, curses, and witchcraft; the evil witches are indeed evil, and the good fairy godmothers are both good and fairy. That dark magic is wrong is shown, as it is in passages showing sorcery in the Bible (I Samuel 28:7-25). In what way is this wrong? Because the Tales are not true? That would be an argument against all novels. If the presence of sorcery is wrong, then so is the Bible. If the presence of miraculous powers is wrong, then so are the Prophets. This, then, must not be your meaning. In the more strictly fantasy genre, consider The Song of Albion - The magic of the stories lies in 1.) stumbling from our reality into a different reality. 2.) Some powers held by the Bards. 3.) Sorcery practiced by the evil army of zombe people (I forgot their name) and 4.) Miracles, including the Song, which drives away the enemy army, a silver hand given to a maimed king, and a fire which destroys and remakes the world of Albion. How is this wrong? In The Lord of the Rings, Gandalf, Saruman, and company are wizards, but there is a distinction which you should consider - if they were in the Bible, they would be prophets, not wizards. My reasoning behind this is as follows: what matters, what determines what is of God (good) and what is not (evil), is not what the power it is called, but what it is, and who it comes from. Witchcraft is not an abomination because it is supernatural, it is an abomination because it is stealing powers which are either evil in themselves, or reserved for God, to be given at His discretion only. The powers of "magic" come from somewhere; in fantasy, sometimes it is from God, sometimes not. There is a difference....

I just got lost in my own argument....I hope you kind of got where I was coming from....

Anyway, I would urge you, faced with a specific story, to consider weather is is actually portraying actual witchcraft as acceptable, and if it is, you are perfectly entitled to stop reading it and tell all your friends not to read it.

 

[Llauralin]

Witchcraft - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.



OK, let me get my bible concordance ......



Fantasy magic - divination, levitation, fire making, necromancy, and magic potions.

Hummmm.. Just as I thought . THEY'RE THE SAME THING !!!

Odd concordance, defining for you what fantasy magic is. Especially considering how concordences don't actually define, but rather direct you to related verses....

Anyway, I hope that you realize that there are fantasy books that condone none of the above activities.

 

[The Theory]

There is nothing wrong with pretending you have supernatural powers. I've been known to control traffic lights from time to time myself with a flick; I've learned to time my little hand movement by memorizing how long the various traffic lights usually last...harmless fun and good for a gag.

I like that annalogy a lot. I do the same thing... except I snap to try and predict the light change.

I highly doubt God is so unintelligent that He cannot tell the difference between pretend and real. By your logic, God couldn't tell the difference between a real knight and a little boy or girl wearing a kettle on the head while holding a trash can and wielding a golf club. Rather rediculous, don't you think?

Agreed. I think that God blessed people with an imagination for a reason. Because when we USE our imagination it is actually glorifying to Him. The ability to use the imagination is a GIFT, just like any other he has blessed us with (musical talent, the ability to calculate numbers fast, inventing things)... and using His gifts is a form of worship.

 

[TurtleTape]

I think that if you do not actually believe in it it is ok, I mean, if you think that what you are reading is true, then no, you shouldn't read it, but if you can descern reality from fantasy, I see no problem with it.

 

[Eudaimonist]

I grew up in the 70s and 80s.

So did I.

I was heavily involved with D&D and fantasy novels. Through a series of events I came to the Lord and was delivered out of these games. The grip that they had on my life was astonishing. The fear, dread and oppression is something that is difficult to even put into words.

Strange, those novels and games were nothing but a source of fun, imagination, creativity, and entertainment for me. I look back on that time with nostalgia.

 

[MsSnow]

I think if you know God , then fantasy wont hurt you as long as you know that is all it is is fantasy. I like fantasy myself ( like fairy tales) they are fun to read and they keep me young. I also know God loves me and wants me to be happy and as long as I know that then Im sure he doesnt mind a bit of fantasy that i read. keep God number one and the rest will take care of itself

 

[Fly]

Am a witch!
i do some card pretend magic...

 

[Waiting for the Verdict]

Allow me to ask, do you believe that witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Do you believe that practicing witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Do you believe that entertaining yourself by watching people practice witchcraft is an abomination to God?

Lastly, Do you believe that entertaining yourself by pretending to practice witchcraft is an abomination to God?

NOW PEOPLE WHO ARE READING THIS POST: You will either do one of three things.
1. Ignore these questions.
2. Answer these questions in a way that is consistent with Scripture.
3. Or you will choose to be stupid!

I would agree with you about most fantasy novels, but not neccessarily all. For instance, in Lord of the Rings, magic is really not the term Tolkien really wanted to use. The magical powers people used came either directly from God (Gandalf, the Elves) or from Melkor (a.k.a. Satan). There was no mixing of the two, and Tolkien very clearly pointed out that the magic Melkor used was demonic. The magic that Gandalf and the Elves used would not really be defined as magic, per se, but rather special spirtual dispensations from God to certain individuals.

Lewis was less careful with the theological underpinnings of magic, so I won't try to defend him here, though i do think his books are alright. Also, you seem to forget the Redwall series. Except for Martin the Warrior, I don't think magic is used at all in those books.