ExChristians: What are your views of Christianity now?

[Beanieboy]

Editted April 11:
PLEASE NOTE: the purpose of this is not to attack Christians or Christianity, but to understand each other better, or just get perspectives from other people. Please don't take what is said to mean all Christians, and please don't take it as an opportunity to take your wrath out. Frustration, sure, and maybe it will build a better understanding between us.


I was watching American Idol. It was hard to watch, with all of the poverty that surrounds us, the children of Africa dying of maleria, the orphans of parents with AIDS, etc.

The final song was a song praising God. It was a strange choice, in my opinion, because not everyone is Christian, I question the true Christian intention of the show, and I also thought that if any of the people singing aren't really Christian, or aren't very spiritual or religious, it's more about drawing praise for their singing ability than praise to God.

It also makes one question. You are showing the famiine and sickness of others, and appealing to others to reach out and donate out of compassion, and to love your neighbor as yourself, to help others, to sacrifice what you have to others. To then simply sing of God, from an atheists point of view, almost asks the question - if there is a God, then why is there so much disease and famine and poverty? How could a loving God allow such things? Why isn't God calling in an donating $10? The shift was just kind of jarring.

But I think what I was struck by the most were the lyrics. As a Christian, I sang, "Our God reigns" and "King of kings and Lord of lords," etc. The song was basically, "God is great, everyone bows at your name" etc.

I thought about how often we sang about our overwhelming love to God, how Great and Holy God was, whether we believed it or not.
And I often wondered then why we spend so much time telling God how great he is. It feels really narcistic. And after we would sit there singing how great he was, silence. No response from God. And I felt like I was always standing on my head to get his attention.

It's like me having cats, and then electing myself their God, and then demanding them to praise me and tell me how great I am. When I was younger, the only time I really needed other people to constantly praise me is when it didn't come internally from my own security.
Now, if someone praises me, I thank them, and let it roll off. If they insult me, I shrug, tell them that I'm sorry they feel that way, and let it roll off. I define who I am, not others.

In the same vein, I question if God needs nor demands our constant showering of attention and praise.
I now believe that God is the one trying to get our attention, and showering us with love, because God is love. I believe that we serve God by simply loving others, and if we don't love others but think we love God, we have completely missed the point.

I'm curious if people who used to be Christians ever look on it now, and see it with new or different eyes.

 

[français]

Yes, I most certainly do.

As a Christian, I loved Christianity, and loved the Bible, and all that. Even when I first became atheist, I did.

But now, to be honest, I can not fathom to even think about it for too long. I find the Bible to be the most confusing book on this planet. I find the stories EXTREMELY laughable and can not believe I once believed them. Lastly, instead of me seeing the Bible as this nice, peaceful book, I see it as a dull, and rather violent book.

I can never understand how I once believed in the Bible!

And now days, I have come to realize that most Christians just blindly follow it. Lol, today I was speaking to a friend of mine, and I was telling her why I was not Christian, and she got sooo mad. I go "Well if you are Christian, why are you getting all mad" and she goes "I am half Catholic, half Christian" LOL! It is as if she thinks religion is an ethnicity, and as if she thinks that Catholics are not Christian and such.

And last week I was talking to a Christian, and and we were talking about if God was merciful or not. My argument was that God can have the ability to seal the hearts of others, and hence it is God's fault for atheists, not humans. She had no clue what she was talking about. In the end, I totally crushed her argument, and she was like "yeah, I was agreeing the whole time with what you said" LOL! To cover up her lack of knowledge, she claims that she had always agreed with what I was telling her LOL! And she had no clue what she was talking about. I asked her if she thought god was perfect.. She said "Well, not at first, but then after Jesus he was" LOL and then I told her how silly, and then 10 seconds later she said "oh wait, God is all perfect" and so I am all like "well why did you change your mind" and she is all like "because my sister told me God is" LOL so she is blindly following what her sister told her!


To be honest, there is no other religion in the world that I find as confusing and as mubly jumbly as Christianity.


Judaism is consistent. Islam is especially consistent. But Christianity.. No way lol

 

[Futuwwa]

Judaism is consistent. Islam is especially consistent. But Christianity.. No way lol

I agree, and this is (simply put) what made me convert. When looking deep enough into Christianity, all I found there to be on the bottom was a failure to properly unify two contradictory theologies - the one of the OT and the one of the Apostles.

 

[vajradhara]

Namaste Beanieboy,

thank you for the OP.

i'd venture to say that most beings that were Christians and are no longer have different views than they did when they were Christians.

interestingly enough i've found my appreciation growing for the Catholic vehicle and my appreciation for the Protestant vehicle to be practically non-existent which is quite different than when i considered myself a Christian.



metta,

~v

(p.s. i put that smilie there cause it's funny)

 

[seed757]

My sentiments were similar to the OP.

I found the Christian faith only relevent when tied to human emotionalism and the willingness to give in to the power of persuasion. Without any of these factors, Christianity (for me) became vain and insignificant.

Hence, I found in Islam a wholeness which I found lacking in Christianity. For example, the approach Islam takes on interest (usury). It is considered a grave sin to partake in the exchange and the receiving of interest of any amount in Islam (unless of a dire need). If you were to look at the some of the factors which lead to economic misery, usury may be high on the list. So to try to eliminate the conditions of financial ruin that emanate from the practice of dealing in interest, Islam makes an emphatic stance against such industry.

But, there are many other examples. That happens to be one of the more pragmatic ones.

 

[Beanieboy]

Namaste Beanieboy,

thank you for the OP.

i'd venture to say that most beings that were Christians and are no longer have different views than they did when they were Christians.

interestingly enough i've found my appreciation growing for the Catholic vehicle and my appreciation for the Protestant vehicle to be practically non-existent which is quite different than when i considered myself a Christian.



metta,

~v

(p.s. i put that smilie there cause it's funny)

Appreciate it in what way?
I appreciate the iconography, but having holy water like it is some kind of magic, or a St. Christopher medal seems like a backwater idea of God to me.

 

[Beanieboy]

The Bible states that people should not charge interest when lending money. Are people on the far right protesting banks? No. In fact, Christians will often ask for interest from a person loan.

I have some issues with Muslims (the idea of women being less than, the way some treat women, etc.) but teaching English, very much respected when they got up and left to pray at a specific time. They seem far more serious and dedicated than those of the Christian faith, that pray when they have time. There is something interesting about Muslims praying together in unison that is quite beautiful.

 

[arunma]

The Bible states that people should not charge interest when lending money. Are people on the far right protesting banks? No. In fact, Christians will often ask for interest from a person loan.

You've severely misunderstood the Bible, and failed to consider other pertinent Scriptures (such as Matthew 25:27). However, yes, there are conservative Christians who protest lending at interest. Many Christians believe that it is unhealthy at best and sinful at worst to live in debt. And in medieval times, many Christian monarchies forbade Christians to lend money at interest, which is precisely why this is the only business that the Jews were allowed to practice.

As for Christians asking for interest on a personal loan (by which I assume you mean loans that individual Christians make to other persons), I have no idea where this claim comes from.

 

[StarCannon]

I find the whole thing just really repulsive. It's just gotten to the point where I can't stand to be in a church, I can't stand to be preached at, and I just can't stand to be asked to conform to the erroneous beliefs that have been propogated since AD 70.

I did not come into this life to follow christianity.

In a nutshell: I'm done with christianity. Closed chapter. Not opening it ever again.

 

[TheKingOfImmortality]

I use to really love Christianty. I thought the Bible made sences and did not go against sciences.


Now when I think about my days as a Christian all I can do is think is what was I thinking. I wonder how I could come to the defences of Litreal interptions of the bible. (The christians that I was learning about Christianty from were vary radical. Fire and brinstone types) So when every I think of Christainty the frist thing that pops into my head were the things that they were doing. (Lieing to them selves about Creation, treating gays and people of other religons like dirt and they pretty much cause me to have a dramaniic change in political views as well, chososing to have more liberal views.)

I frist read The NT, and felled in love with the gental Jesus, but then I read the OT, met his father, and found out why he died. Any litreal views of the Father scares me, I dont see how a guy who kills so many people (and the Christian I was hainging out with gave Islam a bad rep for bing to violent) send everyone to hell forever and could not evem forgive any one unless he punished his own son. I started to losed that Joy I once felt when I frist enbraced the religon, out of fear of how God felt about every one I love who was not Christian(one freind comes to mind every time) and knowing that many people that would be going to heaven were the ones that I wanted to get away from.

I aslo felt really bad for the Gay/Lesbains. I know, we can debate this, but I dont its choices.

Then I strated to feel bad for the Polythiest religons, mainly the Pagans. I rember how people would laugh at the idea of there being many Gods and Goddess and yet for some reason I belive in a God who was his own father and that was not laughbal?



To me the bible is book that could make a good philosophy (I guss you could say I going by Jefferson Bible now) but the moment I am asked to belive it, I am afraid I cant do that (I cring in pain at the thought). The bible is just onther book claiming to be the holy word of a deity, as many others do. Ultra radical literal Christaity I think can be vary dagerous (allong with ultra radical anything els) It a book that can never make any ture sences, God gose from KILL THE SINNERS !.... to Love all as you love yourself wich leads me to--->



In the end, I felt more like a slave and I had to escape. When I was done with it I felt so much better. However, I feel that God (the real one) got me out of there.

 

[PassionFruit]

As of now, I see Christianity as another organized religion. There were some things I could never resolve with Christianity. Such as believing certain things were sinful. I could never really define what it meant to be a true Christian.

I don't really like the absolutism with Christianity.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

And last week I was talking to a Christian, and and we were talking about if God was merciful or not. My argument was that God can have the ability to seal the hearts of others, and hence it is God's fault for atheists, not humans. She had no clue what she was talking about. In the end, I totally crushed her argument, and she was like "yeah, I was agreeing the whole time with what you said" LOL! To cover up her lack of knowledge, she claims that she had always agreed with what I was telling her LOL! And she had no clue what she was talking about. I asked her if she thought god was perfect.. She said "Well, not at first, but then after Jesus he was" LOL and then I told her how silly, and then 10 seconds later she said "oh wait, God is all perfect" and so I am all like "well why did you change your mind" and she is all like "because my sister told me God is" LOL so she is blindly following what her sister told her!

So you'd find someone who clearly lacked knowledge on her faith and you toyed around with her and this proved you what about Christian faith?

Judaism is consistent. Islam is especially consistent. But Christianity.. No way lol

Yes, they are CONSISTENT, especially with their position on homos.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

It is considered a grave sin to partake in the exchange and the receiving of interest of any amount in Islam (unless of a dire need).

What defines the dire need? Oh wait, it is a "grave sin" but if I can prove it is a dire need, it is not... That makes a lot of sense. Reminds me of the neighborhood imam, "men, if you find yourself about to rape a woman, just touch, it is ok."

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

and I just can't stand to be asked to conform to the erroneous beliefs that have been propogated since AD 70.

It is actually 33 AD, but you didn't know that, it is ok.

 

[Beanieboy]

You've severely misunderstood the Bible, and failed to consider other pertinent Scriptures (such as Matthew 25:27). However, yes, there are conservative Christians who protest lending at interest. Many Christians believe that it is unhealthy at best and sinful at worst to live in debt. And in medieval times, many Christian monarchies forbade Christians to lend money at interest, which is precisely why this is the only business that the Jews were allowed to practice.

As for Christians asking for interest on a personal loan (by which I assume you mean loans that individual Christians make to other persons), I have no idea where this claim comes from.

I believe you are right.
This link discusses it at length
http://your.sydneyanglicans.net/indepth/articles/bible_ban_on_charging_interest/

 

[Beanieboy]

I find the whole thing just really repulsive. It's just gotten to the point where I can't stand to be in a church, I can't stand to be preached at, and I just can't stand to be asked to conform to the erroneous beliefs that have been propogated since AD 70.

I did not come into this life to follow christianity.

In a nutshell: I'm done with christianity. Closed chapter. Not opening it ever again.

Can you expound?
What about it do you find repulsive?

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

very much respected when they got up and left to pray at a specific time. They seem far more serious and dedicated than those of the Christian faith, that pray when they have time. There is something interesting about Muslims praying together in unison that is quite beautiful.

So if I read/recite the same prayers in specific order at certain times of the day, I become more serious about a relationship towards God... Prayer is not a "whenever I find time thing" in Christianity, don't know where you picked up this twisted idea but go ask Orthodox and Catholics about prayers. They have their respective forums.

 

[Beanieboy]

Let me give you an example.

Many people talk about going to church, believe in God, etc., but underneath it, is the fear of being sent to hell if they don't comply.

I can't imagine meditating out of fear of being eternally tortured, or needing to choose between acting in loving kindness, or punished with eternal torment. I don't even know how truthfully I could love my partner if he said, "your choices are to love me (which I already do) or I could lock you in the basement, and torture you but keep you just enough alive, like that scene from Seven."

I would lose my love for him. I would be afraid of him, and I don't think you can love someone of whom you are afraid.

Another example: I have discussed with atheists and christians about good deeds. Christians will usually say that their good deeds will be rewarded in heaven. An atheist will say that their good works are their own reward, because if makes the world a better place to live. Which sounds more loving?

I am often told by Christians, "You can't earn your way into heaven", although they seem to congratulate themselves on how they have accepted Jesus into their heart and repented (actions that they did which made them saved.) While I agree that one can't "earn" you way into heaven, the way you can't simply do X number of acts and then tell someone they have to love you now, if you do acts of loving kindness, it changes you, and if you start to lie or steal, that changes you as well.

But I think of it like this:
Acts only: You shovel your neighbor's walk, and in the spring, say, "you have to be my friend! You owe me that."
Faith only: You are my friend, but I just don't have time for you, and never find time to help you with anything.
Acts + Faith: I shovel your walk simply because I care about you as a neighbor. If you never want to be my friend, that's ok. That's not my purpose. It is simply to be neighborly. And usually, in turn, you will want to be my friend for my selfless acts. When you thank me, I will tell you that it's nothing.

It's not that complicated, but then the "you can't earn your way" folks will then sit on their hands, do nothing, and say, "Come quickly Lord Jesus, and Soon!"

Another example: I often struggle with the bible - not just the crazy stories of the concubine given to the group of men who was raped to death, and then cut into pieces, nor the talking donkey, but trying to figure out the point of the stories. Job was a pawn between Satan and God. For what end? To prove something to Satan? And even if God would give you a new wife and kids, would that take away you loss of your dead wife and kids?

Yet, you ask some believers, and many of them rarely read the Bible, or they have twisted ideas of the scripture (like S&G destroyed because of homosexuality). And I'm a Buddhist and they are Christian.

Everytime I look at it, it seems more and more foreign.

 

[Beanieboy]

So if I read/recite the same prayers in specific order at certain times of the day, I become more serious about a relationship towards God... Prayer is not a "whenever I find time thing" in Christianity, don't know where you picked up this twisted idea but go ask Orthodox and Catholics about prayers. They have their respective forums.

I'm not saying there are no Christians that do this. (There are nuns, for example, that only pray.) There are those that go to Church daily, or go to confession every week.

I just don't have lay Christians saying, "excuse me teacher, but it is 7:00pm, and I have to go to pray." ALL of my Muslim students leave en masse. It has a priority above all things.
From my experience, it seems to be more of a secondary thing, a "business is business", with Christianity, and even Christian behavior exempt during business hours.

It seems that Christians that are committed are the exception, not the rule. If 75% of the US is Christian, then materialism should be a nonissue, and yet, people often judge you one what you own, wear, or drive.

 

[HumbleSiPilot77]

Everytime I look at it, it seems more and more foreign.

This is partly on you. Sorry your understanding of our faith and our Church, like arunma indicated, is very shallow. I can come back later and highlight some points out of your post.