Contradictions in the Bible?

[ttreg]

These are some posts that someone else made and has made me worried :

Quote:
There are a few sites for Biblical criticism. Just a word of warning though, sometimes these websites have "contradictions" that aren't really contradictions, so just make sure you can tell the difference between a real contradiction and a fake one.

I HAVE CHOSEN TO DELETE THE LINKS

Here is my personal qualm: in the Old Testament, God seems pretty violent and grotesque, while in the New Testament he's portrayed as a big softie.

Cruelty in the Bible: I HAVE CHOSEN TO REMOVE LINKS

Quote:
Thomas Paine is one of the most influential Deist writers of all time. He described the concept of revelation based on pure reason. You see, Christian thought teaches that the Bible is revelation for all Mankind to follow. However, "revelation" is only revelation if direct. Anything else is hearsay. As you did not have the experience yourself, it is not a revelation for you, but instead simple hearsay.

But what is worse than expecting people to follow hearsay? Expecting people to follow hearsay of hearsay. What do I mean by that? I'll use Moses for an example. He is claimed to be the author of Genesis, Exodus, Leviticus, Numbers, and Deuteronomy. If he was truly the author of these books, they would be simple hearsay, as the supposed revelation, if true, was only directly experienced ("revealed") to him.

However, it's not simple hearsay. It's hearsay of hearsay. I don't believe Moses wrote these books. Why?

1. "Now the man Moses was very meek above all the men which were on the face of the earth." Numbers 12:3

If it was Moses writing of himself, not someone else writing of Moses, then this statement itself would be clear evidence that Moses was not meek at all, in fact that would make him extremely arrogant.

2. "So Moses the servant of the Lord died there in the land of Moab." Deuteronomy 34:5

Pray tell, how could Moses write of his own death after the fact?

3. In Genesis 14, an account is given of Lot being taken prisoner and that Abraham marched to rescue Lot all the way unto the land of Dan.

Dan was formerly known as Laish before the people there were slaughtered by the Israelites (Judges 18). The tribe of Dan captured the town, changed its name to Dan, and lived there.

Chronologically it wouldn't make sense for Moses to know of Laish as Dan because that place was not called Dan until 331 years after the death of Moses.

These are just a few things, among more. I think if you really look around, you'll find that a lot of mythology shares some common traits and most religions tend to have similar ideas.
Quote:
I want you to remember that even some of the Mayans or Nostradamus' predictions came true, as well as the predictions of many other supposed visionaries, Seers, and prophets.

So instead of looking at fulfilled predictions, let's look at unfulfilled predictions. I've only listed a few, though you can no doubt easily find more on the Internet.

1. "Behold, therefore I am against thee, and against thy rivers, and I will make the land of Egypt utterly waste and desolate, from the tower of Syene even unto the border of Ethiopia. No foot of man shall pass through it, nor foot of beast shall pass through it, neither shall it be inhabited forty years." Ezekiel 29:10-11

Never in its long history has Egypt ever been uninhabited for forty years.

2. "And I will plant them upon their land, and they shall no more be pulled up out of their land which I have given them, saith the LORD thy God." Amos 9:15

The Jews have actually lost their land several times. In fact, it's only recently that it was returned to them.

3. "And I said unto them, If ye think good, give me my price; and if not, forbear. So they weighed for my price thirty pieces of silver." Zechariah 11:12

While it would appear this is fulfilled in Matthew 27, verse 9 incorrectly labels this prophecy as coming from Jeremiah, not Zechariah.

4. "Therefore thus says the Lord concerning Jehoiakim king of Judah, he shall have none to sit on the throne of David." Jeremiah 36:30

This is contradicted by, "So Jehoiakim slept with his fathers and Jehoiachin his son reigned in his stead." 2 Kings 24:6

You just have to stop and wonder... does it make sense that an all-wise Creator would speak to His Creation through revelation, which cannot be proved unless experienced firsthand? I believe it makes more sense that the Creator speaks to us through science and through reason, something every human being is capable of.
Where did Jesus first appear?

Mark 16:14, 15 - Jesus appears to Mary Magdalena but it’s not clear where (in older endings of Mark, he didn’t appear at all)
Matthew 28:8, 9 - Jesus first appears near his tomb
Luke 24:13-15 - Jesus first appears near Emmaus, several miles from Jerusalem
John 20:13, 14 - Jesus first appears at his tomb

Who sees Jesus first?

Mark - Jesus appears first to Mary Magdalena then later to “the eleven”
Matthew - Jesus appears first to Mary Magdalena, then to the other Mary, and finally to ”the eleven”
Luke - Jesus appears first to “two,” then to Simon, then to “the eleven”
John - Jesus appears first to Mary Magdalena, then the disciples without Thomas, then the disciples with Thomas

Women's Reactions to Empty Tomb

Mark 16:8 - The women were amazed and afraid, so they kept quiet
Matthew 28:6-8 - The women ran away “with great joy”
Luke 24:9-12 - The women left the tomb and told the disciples
John 20:1-2 - Mary told the disciples that the body had been stolen

Jesus' Behavior after Resurrection

Mark 16:14, 15 - Jesus commissions “the eleven” to preach the gospel
Matthew 28:9 - Jesus lets Mary Magdalene and another Mary hold his feet
John 20:17 - Jesus forbids Mary to touch him because he hasn’t ascended to heaven yet, but a week later he lets Thomas touch him anyway

Doubting the Resurrection

Mark 16:11, Luke 24:11 - Everyone doubts and/or is scared at first, but eventually they go along with it
Matthew 28:16 - Some doubt, but most believe
John 20:24-28 - Everyone believes but Thomas, whose doubts are eliminated when he gets physical proof

Jesus ascends to Heaven

Mark 16:14-19 - Jesus ascends while he and his disciples are seated at a table in or near Jerusalem
Matthew 28:16-20 - Jesus’ ascension isn’t mentioned at all, but Matthew ends at a mountain in Galilee
Luke 24:50-51 - Jesus ascends outisde, after dinner, and at Bethany and on the same day as the resurrection
John - Nothing about Jesus’ ascension is mentioned
Acts 1:9-12 - Jesus ascends at least 40 days after his resurrection, at Mt. Olivet

 

[arunma]

Here is my personal qualm: in the Old Testament, God seems pretty violent and grotesque, while in the New Testament he's portrayed as a big softie.

I've never seen it the same way. God is portrayed every bit as loving in the Old Testament as he is in the New. As it says,

The LORD passed before him and proclaimed, "The LORD, the LORD, a God merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and abounding in steadfast love and faithfulness, keeping steadfast love for thousands, forgiving iniquity and transgression and sin, but who will by no means clear the guilty, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children and the children's children, to the third and the fourth generation." (Exodus 34:6-7)
​

And see how God describes his love for the church,

It was not because you were more in number than any other people that the LORD set his love on you and chose you, for you were the fewest of all peoples, but it is because the LORD loves you and is keeping the oath that he swore to your fathers, that the LORD has brought you out with a mighty hand and redeemed you from the house of slavery, from the hand of Pharaoh king of Egypt. (Deuteronomy 7:7-8)
​

We should note, also, that God is just as wrathful in the New Testament as in the Old. Here is one New Testament example of God's wrath:

On an appointed day Herod put on his royal robes, took his seat upon the throne, and delivered an oration to them. And the people were shouting, "The voice of a god, and not of a man!" Immediately an angel of the Lord struck him down, because he did not give God the glory, and he was eaten by worms and breathed his last. (Acts 12:21-23)
​

It seems to me that God's love and wrath seem to be consistent between the two Testaments of the Bible.

 

[QuantaCura]

Here's a good site to answer apparent contradictions:

http://www.bringyou.to/apologetics/bible.htm#INDEX

As for the stuff about hearsay, all of history is hearsay. None of us were actually there, yet we have no problem believing various other more "secular" events actually happened. People who hate Christianity and who want to destory Christian society (like Thomas Paine and his boys) use a double standard against Christianity.

In regards to the prophecies, some have yet to be fulfilled, while others are fulfilled in a greater spiritual manner in regards to the Church and the Heavenly kingdom.

As for "pure" reason, show me a man who is sinless, and I will show you a man with pure reason. The fact is, because of our fallen natures, no one has perfect reasoning. That's why two otherwise reasonable people can look at the same facts and come to different conclusions--we often act against the will of God who is Logos. It's why people can rationalize anything (abortion is a great example of this).

It is faith that perfects reason and frees it from error, while reason helps demonstrate the truths of faith. God can be known by just natural reason--this is why the great Greek philosophers reasoned that there was one ominipotent God. There are many rational deductive proofs for God, but most naturalists do not except them because as naturalists, they require physical empirical evidence--but of course many metaphysical truths cannot be shown this way, and yet they are accepted. Again, the double standard.

This God has also given revelation of Himself. All who came with new revelation, like Moses, Jesus, and the Apostles proved themselves with great miracles. This faith has continued to provide scientifically verifiable miracles for 2000 years. I know in the Catholic Church, for something to be declared a miracle, it has to under go very strict scrutiny. There are also a number of major modern miracles covered by secular news sources that were also witnessed by atheists and non-believers at the time. These "hostile witnesses" are the most reliable.

People like Thomas Paine pride themselves on being rational. But since the cult of reason began making progress in the west, rather than lead to pure thinking and unified society, it has led to mass confusion and conflict. The most absurd propositions are accepted as perfectly rational and normal . Likewise, their own biases lead them to apply a double standard to facts and deductions that in other spheres they wouldn't hesitate to accept.

As an aside, if you want to read a great purely rational proof that, given the existence of God, He must have become incarnate and made satisfaction for sins, I highly recommend St. Anselm's Cur Deus Homo

 

[QuantaCura]

I agree with arunma, but any hint that God in the OT may seem less loving than in the NT is because it was before the Incarnation. God was naturally a bit more distant before He became man and gave us the means for the most intimate and profound love and communion with Him. Revelation was not as complete in OT times. The full revelation of justice and mercy is fullfilled in Christian love

 

[Ave Maria]

There are no contradictions in the King James Bible.

 

[Razorbuck]

There are no contradictions in the King James Bible.

Plant a big ol' AMEN right there.

Shout it twice, even!

 

[No Swansong]

Thread closed for staff review

 

[No Swansong]

We are reopening this thread. We would like to remind our members and visitors of CF rule 2.1


2.1 No Flaming

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We can find ways to disagree without flaming.

 

[cubanito]

It is difficult to respond to many different questions.

If you are truly interested, perhaps you can select objections one at a time in separate threads, and keep the number of them manageable.

I grew up when there were things know as "books" around. Curious cumbersome real objects (not virtual, if you can conceive of that!), I retain a fondness for them that is probably unwholesome. One such is Archer's "Bible Difficulties." It answers many of your points clearly and simply.

JR