Bigotry

[Meissner]

yes, very good, bye now

 

[FundiMentalist]

Can't speak for Meiessner, but I'm personally not a Poe.

What's interesting about Poe's Law is that it's as if it's the beginning of empathy.

If one can construct all of the arguments, ideas, points of view of a different position, one is well on the way to understanding the other person's thoughts, hopes, feelings, and fears.

A lot of arguing goes on, on this site, but I wonder how much one side empathizes with the other.

Either way. Both sides.

Personally, I find this very related to the philosophy of ethics questions being discussed here in this thread.

 

[Jonathan95]

What do you think gives you the right to tell other people how to live their lives?

eg;
Marriage equality
Homosexuals
Abortion laws

God gives us the right. We need to save people's eternal souls.

 

[Meissner]

Can't speak for Meiessner, but I'm personally not a Poe.

What's interesting about Poe's Law is that it's as if it's the beginning of empathy.

If one can construct all of the arguments, ideas, points of view of a different position, one is well on the way to understanding the other person's thoughts, hopes, feelings, and fears.

A lot of arguing goes on, on this site, but I wonder how much one side empathizes with the other.

Either way. Both sides.

Personally, I find this very related to the philosophy of ethics questions being discussed here in this thread.

I second that, not a Poe, I wouldn't bother wasting mine or anybody else's time if I didn't think these discussions were important for a progressive world.

 

[Meissner]

God gives us the right. We need to save people's eternal souls.

O.K., lets go from there, what makes you think something like a soul has ever existed or could even possibly exist?

 

[FundiMentalist]

O.K., lets go from there, what makes you think something like a soul has ever existed or could even possibly exist?

Multiple choice:

A) God.
B) Somebody else (such as a certain book's authors).
C) Myself.
D) Dunno. All of the above. None of the above. The question doesn't apply.

How many places are there to which to terminate the infinite regress in a foundationalist epistemology?

 

[Meissner]

Multiple choice:

A) God.
B) Somebody else (such as a certain book's authors).
C) Myself.
D) Dunno. All of the above. None of the above. The question doesn't apply.

How many places are there to which to terminate the infinite regress in a foundationalist epistemology?

Ironically enough, probably infinite.

 

[FundiMentalist]

Ironically enough, probably infinite.

Yes, another option is to not bother with thinking one needs to terminate it.

Anyhow, for the actual content of the thread...

Marriage equality - Let people marry. Attend their weddings and celebrate. And when marriages get rough, help where one can.

Homosexuals - Not really interested myself, but their rights are their rights.

Abortion laws - Not simple for me. The "where does life begin" question seems to be seeking and morality of black-and-whiteness in the context of a biology of fluid, incremental development. The easiest to administer points are a) conception and b) birth. There's an element here that moves me deeply to protect those who can not protect themselves. I connect more strongly (on a continuum) with a full-term bubbly bouncing baby than I do with a soap-bubble-looking zygote or a shrimp-shaped embryo. I think many people want it easy to think about ethics where deeper compassion and empathy requires lots of effort and contemplation.

 

[Jonathan95]

O.K., lets go from there, what makes you think something like a soul has ever existed or could even possibly exist?

The bible says so.

There's Spirit, Soul, and Body in humans. Animals only have souls, so they don't have any afterlife.

Also, there's people that have been to Heaven and Hell, so.

 

[talitha]

What do you think gives you the right to tell other people how to live their lives?

eg;
Marriage equality
Homosexuals
Abortion laws

As a Christian I carry the message of life from God to the world. Part of the message of life is that God wants us all to be right with Him and live with Him for ever, so it is up to us (if not us, then who?) to preserve and proclaim what being right with God entails. We cannot make anyone do His will, but we can make it clear what His will is, at least in general terms.

What makes you think your god gave any of the instructions that are in the bible?

I know Him. The Bible is more or less His autobiography.

Trying to legislate laws to prevent consenting adults from doing what they wish with their lives (providing it isn't doing anybody any harm that they don't wish for) for no other reason than the fact that you don't like it, is bigotry and intolerance of the highest order, you have no right.

First of all, why do these discussions always go to laws, as if your average Christian had any power whatsoever to enact laws? Secondly, for me personally, I have pretty much decided to disengage from politics because it's no use, and my interests are with the Kingdom of God, not the rule of any man or woman or party. (need to change that icon) Third, "any harm they don't wish for"???? so it's okay to hurt, maim or kill someone provided he or she wishes for it? Wow.

O.K., lets go from there, what makes you think something like a soul has ever existed or could even possibly exist?

We all know instinctively that we are not just made of meat, so to speak. That the soul exists is in my book a given.

 

[Theofane]

What do you think gives you the right to tell other people how to live their lives?

eg;
Marriage equality
Homosexuals
Abortion laws

Personally, I don't think I have that right. And when other people tell me how I should live my life, I'm never quite sure how to respond without violating the Golden Rule.

 

[Theofane]

There's also this,

First, do no harm.

As a child, we used to say,

Stick and stones may break my bones,
But words will never hurt me.

I don't believe that's necessarily true. I suspect the brutality of the psychological realm and of verbal assaults can be nearly as severe as that of physical pain alone.

At the core of the question of the OP is, what gives one the right to tell...

What gives anyone "the right" to be verbally mean?

An Atheist has this "right" secured for himself because nothing compels him to be otherwise.

 

[FundiMentalist]

An Atheist has this "right" secured for himself because nothing compels him to be otherwise.

[Well, society does compel all of us much through the rule of law as well as others exhibiting power outside altruistic motives, but otherwise...]

True, true.

It's all upside from here!

I'm compassionate, not because I have to be, but because I choose to be.

 

[FundiMentalist]

We all know instinctively that we are not just made of meat, so to speak. That the soul exists is in my book a given.

That's what's call axiomatic. It needs no proof.

The existence of an immortal soul is axiomatic for nearly all Christians, all New Testament authors, and maybe a few of the authors of Hebrew Scripture too.

It's not necessarily Biblical, if Biblical is taken to mean universally shared belief by all authors of the Bible.

 

[Theofane]

[Well, society does compel all of us much through the rule of law as well as others exhibiting power outside altruistic motives, but otherwise...]

True, true.

It's all upside from here!

I'm compassionate, not because I have to be, but because I choose to be.

Awesome!

 

[Cuddles333]

Well, if anyone thinks that the teaching of the New Testament (Christian motivated legislation, etc.) impedes too much on our personal freedoms, try taking a look at countries that are not Christian.

 

[Theofane]

What makes you think your god gave any of the instructions that are in the bible?

God identifies Himself as the author of Scripture. The Bible is called God's Word.

 

[Jonathan95]

What makes you think your god gave any of the instructions that are in the bible?

Because of

(2 Timothy 3:16) Every Scripture is God-breathed (given by His inspiration) and profitable for instruction, for reproof and conviction of sin, for correction of error and discipline in obedience, [and] for training in righteousness (in holy living, in conformity to God's will in thought, purpose, and action),

Also, many other things confirm the bible stories are true.

Like the walls of Jericho, which fell inwards. Not outwards like they should. Also, there's a big imprint where the walls fell, like angels smashed them to the ground.

Bible prophecies that have been fulfilled and are fulfilled today.

 

[Jonathan95]

That's what's call axiomatic. It needs no proof.

The existence of an immortal soul is axiomatic for nearly all Christians, all New Testament authors, and maybe a few of the authors of Hebrew Scripture too.

It's not necessarily Biblical, if Biblical is taken to mean universally shared belief by all authors of the Bible.

Ofcourse it's biblical.

 

[AlexBP]

What do you think gives you the right to tell other people how to live their lives?

eg;
Marriage equality
Homosexuals
Abortion laws

The First Amendment gives me the right to say whatever I choose to say. If others don't like what I'm saying, they're free to choose not to listen to me.

Trying to legislate laws to prevent consenting adults from doing what they wish with their lives (providing it isn't doing anybody any harm that they don't wish for) for no other reason than the fact that you don't like it, is bigotry and intolerance of the highest order, you have no right.

That's an interesting perspective. Consider that our government currently regulates what clothing can be legally sold, what food can be legally produced, what cars can be legally driven, what wages can be paid, what hours an employee can work, what recreational substances we can ingest, and literally millions of other things. According to what you've said, all of these things are bigotry because they prevent consenting adults from doing what they wish. If you think that the government enforces millions of examples of bigotry, one would have to wonder why you are selectively worked up about a few instances of "bigotry" but not about all the rest.

It's also worth noting that anti-abortion laws are not contained in your definition because abortion harms someone, namely the unborn child who is destroyed.