Attributes of a Perfect God
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If God sends a sinner to hell, He is not perfectly compassionate. If God does not send a sinner to Hell, He is not perfectly just.
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Only if that sinner were to live in hell for all eternity. However, since the bible teaches they will be destroyed in that fired we don't have to worry about that.
Death for the sinner would be a welcomed gift heaven. Sin is enmity against God, and if the sinner were forced to live in heaven, it'd be more of a torture for them then hell fire.
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John Stuart Mill argued that suicide was immoral because the act precluded the victim from future autonomy. In parallel, destroying a person completely precludes him from everything of value in the future, even in a sub-optimal existence (i.e. Hell). Why is it better to not exist at all than to exist in Hell?
How can a thing which is infinitely and perfectly good (i.e. Heaven) be torture? It implies that the goodness of Heaven is either limited or imperfect (or both).
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squint
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James 2:
13 because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment!
Not all attributes are equal. The insistence of PERFECT JUDGMENT/JUSTICE would result in ONLY GOD EXISTING. There is only ONE Perfect.
I do fully expect the impetus of HATRED of our fellow man which is OF THE DEVIL that insists on eternal death or torture of same WILL have 'its' JUST reward:
JUDGMENT WITHOUT MERCY.
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Have you ever been on fire?
Besides that, the bible says the wages of sin is death. Not eternal life in misery.
Not at all. Sin is enmity against God, by its very nature it cannot be in His presence. It's for this reason that Satan along with His angels were cast out.
Everything in heaven would be a constant rebuke against those who have lived their entire lives in rebellion against God. Sin is a horrible thing and a mystery at that. The only way a sinner would be happy in heave is if God made them be happy, but God will not force the will.
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God never intended to send anyone to hell, people and angels chose that, so he is perfectly just in giving them what they want.
A perfectly compassionate God sent his only begotten Son to die for those who chose to disobey, so that they could find a way to live with him forever. Perfect compassion. Perfect God. Perfect Father.
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squint
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Says WHO??
I doubt there is a person on these boards who denies that God WILL either permanently eradicate or burn alive forever the DEVIL and his messengers.
That IS Gods Justice. They will receive NO MERCY. They cannot 'choose' their fate in this matter. It's a DONE deal...well done. toasty done.
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Aibrean
Honest. Maybe too Honest.
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squint...let me elaborate
The debate of: eternal suffering by an eternal hell vs. a brief suffering and then cease to exist
^ that is off-topic to this specific thread. We just need to reference hell in general, not over debate on how it is in hell.
The debate of: eternal suffering by an eternal hell vs. a brief suffering and then cease to exist
^ that is off-topic to this specific thread. We just need to reference hell in general, not over debate on how it is in hell.
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DArceri
Exercise daily -- walk with the Lord.
Actually, for those who suppress the Truth and defy God are said to be 'in-Adam', and God says to them, not My Will be done, but yours be done.
God does not see His 'sheep' as sinners for they seek to do His Will and are determined to be 'IN-Christ'. He nailed their sins to the cross!!!...... You should know this as a Christian!!!!!
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Both. Jesus is the intersection.
It's the foundation of Christianity.
Now, to get to very elementary soteriology, you may look at that intersection via vicarious atonement (for example, Augustine) or Christus Victor (I'd suggest Gustaf Aulen's classic book on that) or ransom - whatever floats your boat, but they are all Christocentric. And thus embracing BOTH points: justice and mercy, Law and Gospel - with CHRIST being the intersection (which is why we are CHRISTians).
.
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PT Calvinist
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Both, He is the ultimate standard.
" 'Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with what is my own?' "- Matthew 20:15
" 'Is it not lawful for me to do what I wish with what is my own?' "- Matthew 20:15
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M
MamaZ
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It is He who knows true compassion and Justice. It is men who think they know it.
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[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]For it must indeed be said 'God is not just', not as atheists say, who only see the world and do not notice on it the cross or the empty tomb, but on the basis of the cross, the tomb and Easter. This contradicts many theologians who are petrified in their own human idea of justice, and seek to impose it on God . . . God is not just. He is infinitely more than just. He is the foolishness of love that never ceases coming down into our hell to raise us up again.[/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Clément, Olivier [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]The Roots of Christian Mysticism[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif] [NCP 1982, 1993 p305-306][/FONT]
[FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]Clément, Olivier [/FONT][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif]The Roots of Christian Mysticism[/FONT][FONT=Verdana, sans-serif] [NCP 1982, 1993 p305-306][/FONT]
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F
freeport
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Separating the two creates a strawman argument.
As people know God is both, they should strive to understand that instead of doubting it.
'Seek and you will find', 'you do not need teachers, for the Holy Spirit teaches you all things'... we do have an obligation to believe God and seek out His Face believing we have the Holy Spirit to lead us into all truth.
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