Are you in an Anti-Free speech state?

ThatRobGuy

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No problem. Although this thread was about whether they should be allowed to discuss any problems at all with the companies in question. Individual matters, and whether the authorities are justified in requesting the content be removed, must be dealt with individually.
They're more than welcome to discuss them.

Public/private collabs are fairly common in certain sectors.


I think a lot of it boils down to the tone of the discussion and whether or not it's being framed as
Requesting a private meeting and saying "Here's this thing we perceive to be a problem, do you agree there's a problem? and if so, is there a chance we could meet to see if there's anything that can be done to address it more effectively?"
vs.
Calling them up to a Senate hearing via force (a subpoena) and putting them through a figurative "Sopranos-style Shakedown" saying "Gee, nice company you got there, be a shame if something were to happen like losing Section 230 protections...or perhaps my memory ain't so good, and I'll forget to re-authorize that $300 million worth of tax breaks and subsidies that I know you like so much. Capiche?"
(which is always the implication when you have these senate "grilling sessions".)

Let's be honest, when the government wants a private construction company to help them solve an infrastructure problem, they're not sending a subpoena to the owner of the company and making them sit through a 3-hour public grilling session where senator after senator asks a dozen variations of the same question "What are you gonna do to 'fix' this thing we don't like??"
 
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Mayzoo

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For years, we have discussed the alarming shift in the Democratic party on free speech with candidates running on pledges to censor opposing views and politicians supporting blacklisting and censorship on social media. Many citizens oppose such efforts to restrict their rights under the First Amendment, but are unaware of the work of their representatives to limit free speech. Now, a filing in the Supreme Court supporting censorship efforts by the Biden Administration has supplied a handy list of the anti-free speech states for citizens.

The 5th Circuit previously ruled in Missouri v. Biden that administration officials “likely violated” the First Amendment and issued a preliminary injunction banning the government from communicating with social media companies to limit speech.

Not surprisingly, the state of California is leading the effort to get the Supreme Court to reverse a decision enjoining the government from censorship efforts. California has long sought to impose speech limits on doctors, businesses, and citizens to silence opposing viewpoints.

However, 23 Democrat-led states joined this ignoble effort in signing on to the brief of California Attorney General Rob Bonta. The brief lauds past efforts of these states to combat “harmful content” on the Internet and to protect the public from “misleading information” through partnerships with social media companies.

So here is the list to see if you are residing in an anti-free speech state:
Yes, I willingly live in a state of Christianity. God commands censorship of mouth for all Christians as none of us has complete command of our "hearts".

Leviticus 19:11-13

Though shalt not bear false witness.

You shall not swear [an oath] falsely by My name, so as to profane the name of your God;

Colossians 4:6

Let your speech always be gracious, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how you ought to answer each person.

Ephesians 4:29

Do not let any unwholesome talk come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.

James 4:11


Do not speak evil against one another, brothers. The one who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, speaks evil against the law and judges the law. But if you judge the law, you are not a doer of the law but a judge.

Ephesians 4:32


Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you.

Romans 12:18


If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone.
 
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ralliann

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Romans 12:18


If it is possible, as far as it depends on you, live at peace with everyone.
That is what separation of Church and state gave us. . It depends on us, it is possible. When the constitution is kept. Doesn't infringe on a parents right to raise up our Children.

Eph 6:4 And, ye fathers, provoke not your children to wrath: but bring them up in the nurture and admonition of the Lord.

Pr 22:6 Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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I find it really weird that some people in USA blame the government for movies having gay characters. OR a mermaid with skin other than white.
If some people aren't ready to accept diversity, Then that is upto them, they don't have to watch the movies.
That's actually not something I've ever heard expressed. Not saying it hasn't happened, but when I hear people complaining about these things happening in movies, I typically don't hear them blaming the government for it.
Should erotica be in school libraries? No. But not all Trans or gay themes are erotica.
Society is diverse, some people are deeply prejudiced and conservative (close minded to differences, and change). Changing culture is a very difficult thing to do and comes with much resistance. But change in inevitable and acceptance takes time.
When Captain James T Kirk kissed Uhura in 1968. This came as a huge shock to many in USA. But now no one batters an eye lid.
Correct, which is why I mentioned that I'd like to see a reasonable middle ground on this. There's a big difference between "Detective novel where the main character happens to be gay" vs. the kind of stuff that's in the book "Flamer".

...but people, as the expression goes, "can't tell the sharks from the guppies anymore"

And while your example of the "Star Trek Kiss" was considered "earth shattering" at the time in the eyes of some, there are some key differences between something like that and some of the efforts we see today

...it's not that it's bad to break down certain barriers, it becomes problematic when people want go out in search of barriers that can broken down simply for employing the flawed logic of "rapid change for change's sake", sometimes for seemingly no other reason than just trying to "stay ahead of the curve"


With this particular topic (sex & gender), the trajectory of people seeking out changes to make on this would be the equivalent of if, in the realm of drugs, people said "Well, legalizing marijuana was a change, and it was a good change...therefore, all changes on the side of legalization are good, let's jump to advocating for the legalization of all these other drugs while simultaneously trying to scrap the age limits aspects"

People aren't looking at these situations/changes based on context or individual merits anymore.

It's very much become a situation where it's been reduced to the superficial assessment method of
"Pushing for any change on this topic is good/bad" vs. "Trying to block any change on this topic is good/bad"
(largely driven by tribalism)

And the proof is in the pudding.

Hypothetical, if I conducted a survey at Berkeley and asked the question "Do you think we should remove the books Gender Queer and Flamer from public Jr. High schools?" How many young progressives would I have to ask before I finally found one that said "Yeah, that's probably not appropriate material for 11-13 year olds"? (and was willing to give that answer in front of their peers)

And if I conducted a survey among people at a CPAC convention asking "Do you think it's okay for studios to include some gay characters in their movies/shows in order to have some additional representation, how many people would I have to go through before I got a "yes"? (and was willing to give that answer in front of their peers)

I'd be there a while, right?


The rapper/activist Killer Mike actually has a bit of sage wisdom on polarizing topics like these (and it was one he stated during a Black Voices summit when a Black conservative was on the same panel and was commenting that fatherless homes was one of the biggest issues facing the community and got booed). "You don't have to like the person, but don't hate the truth because you don't like the person who's tellin' it to you"

More established political writers have written about the same type of situation.

Ruy Teixeira (from the left) wrote a piece about what he called "The Fox News Fallacy", in which he talked about how it's a mistake for his fellow liberals to immediately disregard any position/idea just because it's mentioned by conservative pundit.

George Will (from the right) wrote a column in which he explained why he was voting for Biden (the first time he'd ever voted for a Democratic president in his 80 years), he stated that the fact that republicans were more focused on "opposing the democrats than actually legislating" was, in his words, "highlighting the unimportance of republican control", and stated further, that when people are simply looking to oppose the other team: “They will have leisure time to wonder why they worked so hard to achieve membership in a legislature whose unexercised muscles have atrophied” because they get elected purely out of hatred for the other team.

Obviously George is a much more eloquent writer than most people, but the general gist of what he's saying in "common man terms" is "If you vote based on who agitates the other team the most, you're going to get bottom of the barrel representation"
 
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ThatRobGuy

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That's great. Looks like we're all agreed.
On that part...but I feel like the selective quoting of my posts may indicate that we're not in 100% agreements on the other parts of what I was talking about lol.
(which is fine, and I can appreciate the type of humor being employed)

The problem with those types of discussions involving the government (and why all democracies attempt to put in strict safeguards to keep things within certain lanes) is simply due to a power dynamic.

Governments have to (and rightfully so) be careful since when you have a group of a 100 people (the US senate) who has huge influence on the laws/budgets/regulatory frameworks/subsidies/tax breaks/etc... for 330 million people....

It's tough for them to haul a sector leader up for a "grilling session" without the implication of "things could go poorly for you if you don't see eye to eye with us on this" at this point in the game.

For instance, had Facebook/Google never claimed a single tax break, never taken a single subsidy, never lobbied a politician for a favor, etc... It'd be easy for them to simply say "shove it, I'm not answering any questions, I'm invoking my rights".

But those waters are beyond muddied at this point.
 
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durangodawood

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.....For instance, had Facebook/Google never claimed a single tax break, never taken a single subsidy, never lobbied a politician for a favor, etc... It'd be easy for them to simply say "shove it, I'm not answering any questions, I'm invoking my rights".....
You dont forfeit rights or become a ward of the state by taking advantage of govt tax law or available benefits or incentives. This goes for individuals and corporations - unless the tradeoffs are specifically enumerated.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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You dont forfeit rights or become a ward of the state by taking advantage of govt tax law or available benefits or incentives. This goes for individuals and corporations - unless the tradeoffs are specifically enumerated.

While that's technically true in a legal sense (in that you don't become a ward of the state)

If I was a business owner that got a little too cozy with politicians, and massive tax breaks and subsidies became a major part of my yearly budget planning, and the people who control those tax breaks and subsidies had strong opinions about what I should or shouldn't do on a particular facet of the business, you can surely see how that creates a messy situation.

The specific caveat that's unique to the social media companies is the Section 230 provisions. Senators are in the unique position that they could vote to repeal that tomorrow if they wanted to. (the effects of which could basically destroy a social media company or any service currently fitting the description of a "platform")


All it would take is the mere implication of "Well, y'know, if you don't change your ToS to reflect what we see is ideal, we could always vote with our colleague from SC next time he raises the matter of repealing 230", and it could be considered some serious coercion.

In lay terms, the implication is always there that "If you don't do what we want Mr. Zuckerberg/Pichai/Dorsey/Musk/etc... we could change that law that states that you're not liable for what people do on your platform" (which could basically tank any of those companies within a matter of months if they didn't have those protections)
 
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Bradskii

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On that part...but I feel like the selective quoting of my posts may indicate that we're not in 100% agreements on the other parts of what I was talking about lol.
That's likely true. And there may be cases where free speech must be protected even if you or I think what is being presented is undesirable. But that's a completely different matter to the one presented in the op. Which, despite the appeal to emotion in the very title of the thread, wasn't a matter of curtailing free speech. But was about an attempt to prevent discussions about what should or shouldn't be protected.
 
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stevil

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That's actually not something I've ever heard expressed. Not saying it hasn't happened, but when I hear people complaining about these things happening in movies, I typically don't hear them blaming the government for it.
So then, who is being blamed?
A specific producer, a specific director, a specific person in charge of casting?
All of Disney, all of Hollywood, all of liberals???

There are many Republicans campaigning on anti-wokeness e.g. DeSantis, as if having a specific politician is going to stop the movie industry having gay actors or gay characters or people with non white skin.
DeSantis has even tried using his political power to attack Disney. (over reach? Much!) but doing this to appease his base on a perceived culture war.
Correct, which is why I mentioned that I'd like to see a reasonable middle ground on this. There's a big difference between "Detective novel where the main character happens to be gay" vs. the kind of stuff that's in the book "Flamer".
Personally I have no idea what is in the book "Flamer" never read it, never looked into it. Or a book called "Gender Queer", I know nothing about this book. So I personally have no opinion as to their suitability for teenagers in public schools.
...it's not that it's bad to break down certain barriers, it becomes problematic when people want go out in search of barriers that can broken down simply for employing the flawed logic of "rapid change for change's sake", sometimes for seemingly no other reason than just trying to "stay ahead of the curve"
When it comes to movies and books and stuff. There are huge amounts of them. How do people get the world interested in their specific book or movie? Controversy seems to get people interested. Trying to break social norms, trying to be shocking etc. Some book writers and movie makers will go down that path. It's their choice. Govt and politicians should stay out of it.

But sometimes, what is controversial to some, is just the norm to others.
For example, society is full of gay people in gay relationships, full of people in inter racial relationships, full of Trans people. So why would it even be considered anything other than normal to have these appear in contemporary books and movies?
It also could be considered controversial to think that mermaids should have white skin, so if all mermaids were depicted this way in a movie, shouldn't someone be asking why?

Which ever way the movie makers go, someone is going to consider something controversial.
But ultimately this is a private enterprise, not government, not political. The movie makers can do whatever they want. Individuals in the public can choose to watch it or not watch it. Their choice. So what.
I don't see what the big deal is. And I don't see what it is that people want to do about it.

There is no conspiracy, there is no agenda, no liberal takeover, it's just individuals deciding what movies to make, what cast to hire, what characters to have in their stories. So what.

With this particular topic (sex & gender), the trajectory of people seeking out changes to make on this would be the equivalent of if, in the realm of drugs, people said "Well, legalizing marijuana was a change, and it was a good change...therefore, all changes on the side of legalization are good, let's jump to advocating for the legalization of all these other drugs while simultaneously trying to scrap the age limits aspects"
Only that sex isn't outlawed. Gay sex isn't outlawed. Men in dresses isn't outlawed, women in suits isn't outlawed.

People aren't looking at these situations/changes based on context or individual merits anymore.

It's very much become a situation where it's been reduced to the superficial assessment method of
"Pushing for any change on this topic is good/bad" vs. "Trying to block any change on this topic is good/bad"
(largely driven by tribalism)
There are a great many people (myself included) that want small government, that want people to be able to make their own choices, that are accepting of diversity and equal rights. I think all barriers to equal rights should be immediately removed. It's not about finding limits or pushing boundaries, its not about trying to upset people. It's merely about just giving everyone equal rights.

It's not about political tribalism. I don't care who are liberals and who are conservatives. I don't care about what box people are trying to fit within.

Hypothetical, if I conducted a survey at Berkeley and asked the question "Do you think we should remove the books Gender Queer and Flamer from public Jr. High schools?" How many young progressives would I have to ask before I finally found one that said "Yeah, that's probably not appropriate material for 11-13 year olds"? (and was willing to give that answer in front of their peers)
Perhaps you would need to find people that have actually read the books and are aware of the content, words, pictures etc.
I reckon many people will likely defend or attack the books without knowing what is actually in them.

But if you got them to look at the controversial pages then you might get a real answer out of them.


And if I conducted a survey among people at a CPAC convention asking "Do you think it's okay for studios to include some gay characters in their movies/shows in order to have some additional representation, how many people would I have to go through before I got a "yes"? (and was willing to give that answer in front of their peers)
A better question might be, do they think government should set some rules and regulations as to what can be included in movies, e.g. should government be allowed to outlaw gay characters from movies and books?

It's kinda irrelevant on whether they think gay characters are OK or not OK. What is more important is their desire for govt to intervene or not.

The rapper/activist Killer Mike actually has a bit of sage wisdom on polarizing topics like these (and it was one he stated during a Black Voices summit when a Black conservative was on the same panel and was commenting that fatherless homes was one of the biggest issues facing the community and got booed). "You don't have to like the person, but don't hate the truth because you don't like the person who's tellin' it to you"
I don't get it though. Is this person grumbling or proposing some sort of change?
If change, then what change?
Are they saying they would outlaw divorce, or outlaw sex outside of marriage? or outlaw lesbians adopting children?

Ruy Teixeira (from the left) wrote a piece about what he called "The Fox News Fallacy", in which he talked about how it's a mistake for his fellow liberals to immediately disregard any position/idea just because it's mentioned by conservative pundit.
OK, I'm not sure how much of this goes on though.
George Will (from the right) wrote a column in which he explained why he was voting for Biden (the first time he'd ever voted for a Democratic president in his 80 years), he stated that the fact that republicans were more focused on "opposing the democrats than actually legislating" was, in his words, "highlighting the unimportance of republican control", and stated further, that when people are simply looking to oppose the other team: “They will have leisure time to wonder why they worked so hard to achieve membership in a legislature whose unexercised muscles have atrophied” because they get elected purely out of hatred for the other team.
I really don't like the USA political setup, when people no longer act gentlemanly then this is what your system gives you. A crippled government and a stagnating society. I wonder if this is what happened to Rome and led to their downfall?

Obviously George is a much more eloquent writer than most people, but the general gist of what he's saying in "common man terms" is "If you vote based on who agitates the other team the most, you're going to get bottom of the barrel representation"
Yes correct, people should vote for policies not trolls.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Personally I have no idea what is in the book "Flamer" never read it, never looked into it. Or a book called "Gender Queer", I know nothing about this book. So I personally have no opinion as to their suitability for teenagers in public schools.
There's some rather graphic scenes in it, feel free to google it if you want, I included the actual pictures from the book and caught a staff warning for it in a previous thread...but needless to say, it's certainly not "PG" content.

It was one of the books at the center of the Florida book ban controversy, and features pages depicting a certain type of "contest" involving a Mountain Dew bottle, in which the loser has to drink the contents of the bottle. (and despite it being an illustration, the characters involved are all under 18...for whatever that's worth)
When it comes to movies and books and stuff. There are huge amounts of them. How do people get the world interested in their specific book or movie? Controversy seems to get people interested. Trying to break social norms, trying to be shocking etc. Some book writers and movie makers will go down that path. It's their choice. Govt and politicians should stay out of it.

But sometimes, what is controversial to some, is just the norm to others.
For example, society is full of gay people in gay relationships, full of people in inter racial relationships, full of Trans people. So why would it even be considered anything other than normal to have these appear in contemporary books and movies?
Yes and no...there are things that are going for "shock value" vs. things that are going for "try to make this shocking thing normalized". They're two different things. I don't have a problem with shock value in age appropriate settings. I've watched and showed my friends the movie "Ichi the Killer"...but my friends I showed that to were adults, and I wasn't trying to portray the actions of the movie as something "normal"

For instance, Tarantino is clearly going for some shock value in some of his works, but he's not suggesting that things that occur in his movies should be considered normal in a society. Despite all the gun play in his films, he's an advocate for gun control when it comes to the "real world"
Perhaps you would need to find people that have actually read the books and are aware of the content, words, pictures etc.
I reckon many people will likely defend or attack the books without knowing what is actually in them.

But if you got them to look at the controversial pages then you might get a real answer out of them.
You'd think that, but with regards to those books I mentioned, the content is easily accessible...anyone with access to Google and is aware of the books has likely already seen the content.
 
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stevil

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Yes and no...there are things that are going for "shock value" vs. things that are going for "try to make this shocking thing normalized". They're two different things. I don't have a problem with shock value in age appropriate settings. I've watched and showed my friends the movie "Ichi the Killer"...but my friends I showed that to were adults, and I wasn't trying to portray the actions of the movie as something "normal"
What is it that would be considered "shocking" that others think should be "normalised"?
Can you be specific here so that I can see the problem.

You'd think that, but with regards to those books I mentioned, the content is easily accessible...anyone with access to Google and is aware of the books has likely already seen the content.

People only have limited time in their busy lives. Not everyone thinks this topic is worth much effort.
I'm not even that interested in what is in those books.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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What is it that would be considered "shocking" that others think should be "normalised"?
Can you be specific here so that I can see the problem.
With regards to the book Flamer?

The content is a bunch of boys having a masturbation contest in a Mountain Dew bottle and whoever finishes the deed last has to drink it.

Is that specific enough?

Because the book as a "gay theme", some people on the left think it's their political duty to defend it against removal, and try to equate removal attempts as "an attack against the gay community".
People only have limited time in their busy lives. Not everyone thinks this topic is worth much effort.
I'm not even that interested in what is in those books.
If they're going to take a strong position on it, they'd better do their homework, otherwise they need to sit down and shut up about it.

For instance, the "Oh, well if DeSantis wants it banned, that must mean I should defend it" and "Oh, if DeSantis wants it banned, that must mean we should ban it" logic isn't going to fly.
 
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ralliann

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So then, who is being blamed?
A specific producer, a specific director, a specific person in charge of casting?
All of Disney, all of Hollywood, all of liberals???
Well yes. We used to call it radicals, activists etc. Some people were just run of the mill, liberals.
There are many Republicans campaigning on anti-wokeness e.g. DeSantis, as if having a specific politician is going to stop the movie industry having gay actors or gay characters or people with non white skin.
DeSantis has even tried using his political power to attack Disney. (over reach? Much!) but doing this to appease his base on a perceived culture war.
Yes, because it is getting political, you are making it political in you deciding what is appropriate in Schools in this area. It really became a big deal in the schools. Attempting to tell parents what is to be taught and they should have no say in the matter..When Politicians agree with that yes it became political, not by those parents doing. They did not even know it, until they found out. It began with covid and video classes at home instead of in classroom. OOPS parents seen and heard.. Istead of 1plus one equals two, it was johnny and joey and what they do. Parents were stunned
Personally I have no idea what is in the book "Flamer" never read it, never looked into it. Or a book called "Gender Queer", I know nothing about this book. So I personally have no opinion as to their suitability for teenagers in public schools.
Let the parents decide what is suitable or not. That is how it gets unpolitical. Teach our kids what we thought we sent our kids there. Reading, writing, arithmetic etc. we pay for it, and they are our kids.
 
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Bradskii

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Let the parents decide what is suitable or not.
Exactly right. Excellent idea. If you don't want your kids to read a certain book then you sit them down and say 'I don't want you to read this book.'
 
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OK, sure. I can agree with that.
But people aren't robots, they have emotions.

You cannot control people nor program their emotions. They are free to have emotions.
But government isn't there to control people, nor to pander.

I find it really weird that some people in USA blame the government for movies having gay characters. OR a mermaid with skin other than white.
If some people aren't ready to accept diversity, Then that is upto them, they don't have to watch the movies.

But govt is there to support a safe and stable society and so that means needing to protect people against racial hatred, against discrimination in the workplace or even the market place.

Beyond that, movie companies, social media companies are free to make their own choices and decisions. Govt is free to consult with them towards anti hatred, anti discrimination, anti misinformation that may lead to needless deaths. And these companies are free to ignore Govt if they wish.

Should erotica be in school libraries? No. But not all Trans or gay themes are erotica.
Society is diverse, some people are deeply prejudiced and conservative (close minded to differences, and change). Changing culture is a very difficult thing to do and comes with much resistance. But change in inevitable and acceptance takes time.
When Captain James T Kirk kissed Uhura in 1968. This came as a huge shock to many in USA. But now no one batters an eye lid.
The “things-aren’t-like-we-want-them-to-be!” folk transverse the political spectrum and that’s a good thing!
Sometimes the Venn diagram of them and the “things-aren’t-like-they-used-to-be” people can have a lot of overlap, but probably not as much as it used to.
 
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stevil

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Istead of 1plus one equals two, it was johnny and joey and what they do. Parents were stunned
I presume the sex-ed lesson is about 1-2 hours in the whole school year. and that parents are given advance warning and are allowed to pull their kids out of that particular lesson.
Let the parents decide what is suitable or not. That is how it gets unpolitical. Teach our kids what we thought we sent our kids there. Reading, writing, arithmetic etc. we pay for it, and they are our kids.
Unless of course, the parents have become partisan. Perhaps have a short Sex-ed where parents can opt that their kids don't have to do it.

Regarding what is in the school library, that stuff is just extra, for the kids to read in their spare time, they get to choose what books to take out and read, no one is forcing them.
 
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stevil

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With regards to the book Flamer?

The content is a bunch of boys having a masturbation contest in a Mountain Dew bottle and whoever finishes the deed last has to drink it.
That's pretty gross.
Seems inappropriate, but personally, I wouldn't go out of my way to get the school to get rid of it.

If they're going to take a strong position on it, they'd better do their homework, otherwise they need to sit down and shut up about it.
I don't care one way or another.
For instance, the "Oh, well if DeSantis wants it banned, that must mean I should defend it" and "Oh, if DeSantis wants it banned, that must mean we should ban it" logic isn't going to fly.
OK
 
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durangodawood

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While that's technically true in a legal sense (in that you don't become a ward of the state)

If I was a business owner that got a little too cozy with politicians, and massive tax breaks and subsidies became a major part of my yearly budget planning, and the people who control those tax breaks and subsidies had strong opinions about what I should or shouldn't do on a particular facet of the business, you can surely see how that creates a messy situation.

The specific caveat that's unique to the social media companies is the Section 230 provisions. Senators are in the unique position that they could vote to repeal that tomorrow if they wanted to. (the effects of which could basically destroy a social media company or any service currently fitting the description of a "platform")


All it would take is the mere implication of "Well, y'know, if you don't change your ToS to reflect what we see is ideal, we could always vote with our colleague from SC next time he raises the matter of repealing 230", and it could be considered some serious coercion.

In lay terms, the implication is always there that "If you don't do what we want Mr. Zuckerberg/Pichai/Dorsey/Musk/etc... we could change that law that states that you're not liable for what people do on your platform" (which could basically tank any of those companies within a matter of months if they didn't have those protections)
Sec 230 makes some sense in a lot of ways. Are you proposing it be overturned once and for all because the lingering threat of it being overturned gives congress potential leverage over the companies?
 
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ralliann

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I presume the sex-ed lesson is about 1-2 hours in the whole school year. and that parents are given advance warning and are allowed to pull their kids out of that particular lesson.
Why would sex ed need to be on that? I do not know your age but, Sex was to teach kids to prevent unwanted pregnancies, due to the sexual revolution.
There was definitely the attitude that waiting was best. As with "parenthood" was really forefront and we in no way were ready (that was in your mind unavoidably). Planned parenthood the whole nine yards and the pill. There is no need to teach young kids about sex, just to teach them how people have sex. It is school to prepare them to be employable. Whatever happened to that?
Unless of course, the parents have become partisan. Perhaps have a short Sex-ed where parents can opt that their kids don't have to do it.

Regarding what is in the school library, that stuff is just extra, for the kids to read in their spare time, they get to choose what books to take out and read, no one is forcing them.
Go ahead and start independent organizations to offer them that. Hey be the new planned parenthood. Unless your partisan that is.
 
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