Ain't Easy Being A Female Pastor In The South

[SUNSTONE]

Sinful to be a pastor or preacher? Yes. Teacher? Not necessarily. It depends on the subject matter and/or the pupil or pupils.

I'll get deeper and provide scripture later. I'm working and don't have time right now.

I would like to point out that this is not an equality issue. Men are of no more value to God than are women. It has to do with roles. If everyone wants to be the chief, you are left without indians.

For example: 10 people invest equally in a business. You now have 10 equal partners. All 10 partners will work for the company in order to make it grow. Can they all be the boss? They are equal, but in order to be successful, they must take on different (yet equal) roles. Someone has to hire and fire people, someone has to answer phones, someone has to sell, someone has to pack and ship, someone has to do the books. So a church or a marriage is. Equal partners, equal in value, with different roles. God laid out some of these roles for us in His word. Who are we to disagree because the culture has changed? God is the same yesterday, today and forever. Are we to expect Him to conform to us and our culture or are we to conform to Him and His will?

Those three things I listed are gifts of the spirit. Gifts that Paul did not seperate for men and women.

The verse you are going to say deals with a woman teaching a man. It doesn't say preach, or pastor, it says teach.
So if that is the case, then is a female college professor sinning with her job?
That verse that you will show, is talking about marriage.

 

[SUNSTONE]

It is easy enough to say that women are equal in some abstract sense, or to dismiss equality as a value pre-empted by your God, but in reality you are advocating a view that women are less than men in this life. The notion that requiring women to be subordinate to men is simply a question of different roles is pure double-speak. If this is what Christianity holds for women, then Christianity is an attack on women, and God merely a convenient excuse for inherently abusive politics.

Should a women be a firewoman if she isn't strong enough?

There are some Christians who believe that women shouldn't be preachers, pastors, or teachers. But looking at the bible in context it is clear that this isn't true.

Only in marriage is this the man to be the leader. But there are guidelines for that as well.

 

[Gabriel]

Brimshack,

You are entirley misunderstanding Christianity. From a biblical perspective wpman are revered, not opressed. The book of Ephesians is clear on how we are to treat women, our list of resposibilities is a long one indeed. We are commanded to love our wives as Christ loves the church. He gave His all for us and we are expected to be willing to do that for our wives. A truly biblical marriage is one of submission and sacrifice from both sides, not just one.


Sunstone,

Give me a break, dude. If you know it all why are you asking for other's opinions? Are you baiting so you can attack? If your preacher is not teaching, he is not doing his job. Paul is specific in that the teaching he speaks of is concerning scripture. A college professor does not fit into that category. Personally, I don't see the point in my continuing in this discussion. As I said, I have work to do and your mind is made up. I don't think you want to discuss as much as you want to show others why you think they are wrong. I don't have time for that.

 

[Brimshack]

It is easy enough to say that someone is revered. If in practice you demand that they accept a subservient status, then that this is merely double-speak. It is also double-speak to suggest that submission is required from both sides, when you know full well that in practice it is the women who are required to submit to the decisions of the men. And finaly, I don't care what ideal marriage your Bible prescribes. If all men and women were perfect, no hierarchy would mater, but since they are not, your requirement that women accept a subordinant role places them at the mercy of those less than perfect men. Such pleasant and idealist words serve merely to cloak a formula for oppression and abuse.

 

[afnospam]

Might add things like this don't make it any easier:
At a National Convention on "Reimagining God," sponsored by the Presbyterian Church U. S. A., "female participants suggested that God might be a woman and questioned Christ's divinity. At one point, conference leaders celebrated the Eucharist with milk and honey, instead of bread and wine."

 

[SUNSTONE]

Brimshack,

You are entirley misunderstanding Christianity. From a biblical perspective wpman are revered, not opressed. The book of Ephesians is clear on how we are to treat women, our list of resposibilities is a long one indeed. We are commanded to love our wives as Christ loves the church. He gave His all for us and we are expected to be willing to do that for our wives. A truly biblical marriage is one of submission and sacrifice from both sides, not just one.


Sunstone,

Give me a break, dude. If you know it all why are you asking for other's opinions? Are you baiting so you can attack? If your preacher is not teaching, he is not doing his job. Paul is specific in that the teaching he speaks of is concerning scripture. A college professor does not fit into that category. Personally, I don't see the point in my continuing in this discussion. As I said, I have work to do and your mind is made up. I don't think you want to discuss as much as you want to show others why you think they are wrong. I don't have time for that.

I am convienced you are wrong. Until I am convienced other wise, my mind is made up.

Whats the matter? Did I hit on your one verse? Have you given up so quickly?

The bible clearly says that it is unlawful for a women to teach a man, does it not?
The verse doesn't say anything about in church, or out of church. It says its unlawful, period. So by that, it means inside a church, and outside a church, if you take that verse literally. I don't take that verse literally, I take it in context of the rest of the verses around it. That verse is followed by the Adam and Eve verse, saying that it was Eve that was decieved. Its talking about marriage.

But I will wait for your verses, when you get home if you wish.

Have you ever listened to Joyce Myers?

 

[SUNSTONE]

It is easy enough to say that someone is revered. If in practice you demand that they accept a subservient status, then that this is merely double-speak. It is also double-speak to suggest that submission is required from both sides, when you know full well that in practice it is the women who are required to submit to the decisions of the men. And finaly, I don't care what ideal marriage your Bible prescribes. If all men and women were perfect, no hierarchy would mater, but since they are not, your requirement that women accept a subordinant role places them at the mercy of those less than perfect men. Such pleasant and idealist words serve merely to cloak a formula for oppression and abuse.

The women is under the husband, the husband is under God.

So if you poke your wife with a stick, God will poke you with a stick. See how that works?
So if you want to boss your wife around, tick her off, and basicly ruin a good thing, go ahead. Is that what you think the Christian marriage is?

Its like a football team. The coach is the husband, and the wife is the team.
Coach calls a play......"servant get me a beer!"
Team runs the play.

Is that how you see the Christian marriage?

 

[SUNSTONE]

Might add things like this don't make it any easier:
At a National Convention on "Reimagining God," sponsored by the Presbyterian Church U. S. A., "female participants suggested that God might be a woman and questioned Christ's divinity. At one point, conference leaders celebrated the Eucharist with milk and honey, instead of bread and wine."

This example has nothing to do with the topic.

 

[Brimshack]

"The women is under the husband, the husband is under God.

So if you poke your wife with a stick, God will poke you with a stick. See how that works?
So if you want to boss your wife around, tick her off, and basicly ruin a good thing, go ahead. Is that what you think the Christian marriage is?"

Well I see the theory, but it is a pretty flimsy justice system indeed that answers concrete violations of women with theoretical punishments by a God. In the end this is just another way of saying that we won't take responsibility for justice in this life, we'll just wait for God to sort it out.

 

[SUNSTONE]

"The women is under the husband, the husband is under God.

So if you poke your wife with a stick, God will poke you with a stick. See how that works?
So if you want to boss your wife around, tick her off, and basicly ruin a good thing, go ahead. Is that what you think the Christian marriage is?"

Well I see the theory, but it is a pretty flimsy justice system indeed that answers concrete violations of women with theoretical punishments by a God. In the end this is just another way of saying that we won't take responsibility for justice in this life, we'll just wait for God to sort it out.

There are sowing and reaping laws. Most people believe that what goes around comes around. And that goes right along with the word of God.

There are some things that you trust God with. But there are some things that God trusts you with. One would be for the husband to make sure that the marriage is headed in a proper productive way.
Because if he doesn't then he is responsible. God can't force a good marriage, His hands are tied. The only control that God has, is what you give to Him, through prayer and things of that sort, and also sowing and reaping.

But don't think that God is going to just right every wrong. You are responsible just like everyone else.

 

[Brimshack]

Point stands.

 

[SUNSTONE]

If we don't take responsibility in this life, and that God will sort it out, then why do we have a government?

 

[Isaac112086]

goveremnt is against responsibilty

perhaps you could give women some rights, that men don't have, then that would alow the statement that men and women are equal, but otherwise it's a lie, the only way your cirle works, if in some way, women has a hand over god, at which point he isn't even a diety


once again, it doesn't matter if you cloak your bigiotry in god, the bible or anything else, it is still just that

it doesn't matter how many times you repaint a doghouse, it's still a doghouse

 

[SUNSTONE]

goveremnt is against responsibilty

perhaps you could give women some rights, that men don't have, then that would alow the statement that men and women are equal, but otherwise it's a lie, the only way your cirle works, if in some way, women has a hand over god, at which point he isn't even a diety


once again, it doesn't matter if you cloak your bigiotry in god, the bible or anything else, it is still just that

it doesn't matter how many times you repaint a doghouse, it's still a doghouse

What rights do men have that women don't have?