Adam, Eve and Noah’s Ark

[FaithT]

By that, I mean the verse I quoted does not say we come from stars, but there are verses that could be interpreted that we do come from stars. The Bible uses the word "dust" and science tells us that "dust" comes from stars. The elements are forged in the furnace of a star.

So where did the first man come from, then? Evolution from apes, or from the dust of the ground, and where did Eve come from? Adam’s rib or something else?

 

[FaithT]

That's OK. I was just explaining how I heard the slightly different homilies of both priests at my parish last week.

I know that a priest's homily can evolve from the first mass to the last mass. I've been told that by a priest.

Yes, it can change from one Mass to the next. We’ve had priests who write their homilies down and others who wing it, which would lead to a difference in homilies from the first Mass of the day to the last. About two months ago we had a good homily and I wanted to write down to put in my Christian planner, so I requested a copy of it but it turns out that this priest doesn’t write them out beforehand.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Yes, it can change from one Mass to the next. We’ve had priests who write their homilies down and others who wing it, which would lead to a difference in homilies from the first Mass of the day to the last. About two months ago we had a good homily and I wanted to write down to put in my Christian planner, so I requested a copy of it but it turns out that this priest doesn’t write them out beforehand.

I’ve seen priests who just wing it and those who publish their homilies. My present associate pastor has his homilies in outline on his pad and keeps checking to be sure he is on target. But the pastor, on the other hand, while he prepares, will go deep into tangent land.

 

[FaithT]

I’ve seen priests who just wing it and those who publish their homilies. My present associate pastor has his homilies in outline on his pad and keeps checking to be sure he is on target. But the pastor, on the other hand, while he prepares, will go deep into tangent land.

“tangent land“ LOL!

 

[FaithT]

“tangent land“ LOL!

I don’t like it when they go into tangent land. Just get to the point.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I don’t like it when they go into tangent land. Just get to the point.

There are good tangents and bad tangents. This guy has some good ones. I remember a professor in college that was one continual tangent. I think he was going senile. Those were not good tangents. That was my course in Plate Tectonics and Geomagnetic Reversals. I learned a lot ... from the textbook.

 

[FaithT]

I don’t like it when they go into tangent land. Just get to the point.‘

At the LCMS church the message is approx. 30 minutes. At first I didn’t mind but after awhile it started to seem like they were talking just to hear themselves talk.

 

[chevyontheriver]

I don’t mind a long one. I want a rememberable one.

 

[Diamond7]

So where did the first man come from, then? Evolution from apes, or from the dust of the ground, and where did Eve come from? Adam’s rib or something else?

Adam was the first man. Eve was the first woman. Before Adam and Eve 6,000 years ago, you had male and female. This actually goes back 3.5 Billion years with Pond Scum when sex began with recombination. (The term "pond scum" is a colloquial and imprecise term often used to refer to various simple aquatic organisms like algae, bacteria, and other microscopic life forms.)

1. Mitochondrial Eve: Mitochondrial Eve is the most recent common matrilineal ancestor of all humans, meaning she was a woman from whom all living humans today have inherited their mitochondrial DNA. Genetic studies suggest that Mitochondrial Eve likely lived around 100,000 to 200,000 years ago.
2. Y-chromosomal Adam: Y-chromosomal Adam is the most recent common patrilineal ancestor of all humans, meaning he was a man from whom all living humans today have inherited their Y chromosome. Genetic studies suggest that Y-chromosomal Adam likely lived around 200,000 to 300,000 years ago.

The archaeological and fossil record also provide evidence of early Homo sapiens and our evolutionary ancestors, dating back hundreds of thousands of years. The MRCA estimates align with the broader timeline of human evolution and the emergence of anatomically modern Homo sapiens.

The Sixth Day
…26Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness, to rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it.” 27So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and every creature that crawls upon the earth.”…

The six 24 hour days of Genesis Chapter One results in an age of the universe from our perspective of 14 billion years [14, 000,000,000 years]. From the Bible’s perspective of time for those six evocative days of Genesis, the number of our years held compressed within each of those six 24 hour days of Genesis, starting with Day One, would be, in billions of years, respectively, 7.1; 3.6; 1.8; 0.89; 0.45; 0.23. (23,000,000)

Each day is half the length of the day before it. So male and female were created on the sixty day. 23 million years ago. The earliest known primates appeared during the Paleocene epoch, which lasted from approximately 66 to 56 million years ago. Primates are a specific group of mammals.

Currently, the conclusion is that all current human mtDNA originated from a single population from Africa, at the time dated to between 140,000 and 200,000 years ago. The dating for "Eve" was a blow to the multiregional hypothesis, which was debated at the time, and a boost to the theory of the recent origin model.

​

 

[Diamond7]

So where did the first man come from, then? Evolution from apes, or from the dust of the ground, and where did Eve come from? Adam’s rib or something else?

The dust of the ground is what science calls star dust.

The phrase "dust of the ground" often refers to the biblical account of human creation found in the book of Genesis in the Bible. According to this account, God created the first human, Adam, from the dust of the ground and breathed life into him.

In a metaphorical sense, the phrase "dust of the ground" can be related to scientific concepts such as the origin of elements and the cosmic origins of the elements that make up our planet and, indeed, our bodies.

In astrophysics and cosmology, the term "star dust" typically refers to cosmic dust, which consists of tiny solid particles in space. These particles are composed of elements and compounds that were formed through various processes in stars and interstellar space. These elements and compounds include carbon, oxygen, nitrogen, and others essential for life as we know it. The Bible metaphorically refers to humans as stars in certain passages.

Man gets his mitochondrial DNA from a woman or the mother. Science would say Adam and Eve had the same mother. If God cloned her from Adam then the DNA would have come from Adams mother. Men are identified by their Y Chromsome and women are identified by the mitrocondral.

Here is Genesis 2:23 (NIV): "The man said, 'This is now bone of my bones and flesh of my flesh; she shall be called 'woman,' for she was taken out of man.'"
This phrase symbolizes the deep connection and unity between a man and a woman in the context of marriage. Adam recognizes Eve as being of the same human essence, originating from him but formed uniquely as his complement. It highlights the closeness and oneness that should exist between a husband and wife in a sacred and intimate relationship.
The passage continues to emphasize the establishment of the marital relationship and the concept of leaving one's family to form a new family unit with one's spouse, emphasizing the significance of this bond in human relationships.

This does not answer the question but it is the best that I can do right now.

 

[FaithT]

Adam was the first man. Eve was the first woman. Before Adam and Eve 6,000 years ago, you had male and female. This actually goes back 3.5 Billion years with Pond Scum when sex began with recombination. (The term "pond scum" is a colloquial and imprecise term often used to refer to various simple aquatic organisms like algae, bacteria, and other microscopic life forms.)

1. Mitochondrial Eve: Mitochondrial Eve is the most recent common matrilineal ancestor of all humans, meaning she was a woman from whom all living humans today have inherited their mitochondrial DNA. Genetic studies suggest that Mitochondrial Eve likely lived around 100,000 to 200,000 years ago.
2. Y-chromosomal Adam: Y-chromosomal Adam is the most recent common patrilineal ancestor of all humans, meaning he was a man from whom all living humans today have inherited their Y chromosome. Genetic studies suggest that Y-chromosomal Adam likely lived around 200,000 to 300,000 years ago.

The archaeological and fossil record also provide evidence of early Homo sapiens and our evolutionary ancestors, dating back hundreds of thousands of years. The MRCA estimates align with the broader timeline of human evolution and the emergence of anatomically modern Homo sapiens.

The Sixth Day
…26Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, after Our likeness, to rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, and over all the earth itself and every creature that crawls upon it.” 27So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the earth and subdue it; rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and every creature that crawls upon the earth.”…

The six 24 hour days of Genesis Chapter One results in an age of the universe from our perspective of 14 billion years [14, 000,000,000 years]. From the Bible’s perspective of time for those six evocative days of Genesis, the number of our years held compressed within each of those six 24 hour days of Genesis, starting with Day One, would be, in billions of years, respectively, 7.1; 3.6; 1.8; 0.89; 0.45; 0.23. (23,000,000)

Each day is half the length of the day before it. So male and female were created on the sixty day. 23 million years ago. The earliest known primates appeared during the Paleocene epoch, which lasted from approximately 66 to 56 million years ago. Primates are a specific group of mammals.

Currently, the conclusion is that all current human mtDNA originated from a single population from Africa, at the time dated to between 140,000 and 200,000 years ago. The dating for "Eve" was a blow to the multiregional hypothesis, which was debated at the time, and a boost to the theory of the recent origin model.

​

Ok, well here’s the deal, long story shortened. I was Catholic then joined the LCMS church. I’m leaning toward returning to the RCC but then sometimes I think maybe not. I keep vacillating. I agree with theistic evolution and the LCMS doesn’t. I know those who reject evolution have their reasons but it seems to me that they’re just grasping at straws. And I don’t want to grasp, I want the truth.

 

[Diamond7]

And I don’t want to grasp, I want the truth.

Maybe you should just read a Biology book and not get caught up in the Evolution Creationism discussion. They sell Biology books on Amazon for really cheap sometimes. They are very strict about what goes into a Biology book due to all the controversy. There is not that much difference between a High School and College Biology book. Of course, the High School book is aimed at the reading level of High School students.

My son went to first and second grade in a Lutheran School. I talked to the pastor about it once and he said they were very conservative. He said if they were more progressive people would leave the Church and he was doing all he could to keep them there.

 

[FaithT]

Maybe you should just read a Biology book and not get caught up in the Evolution Creationism discussion. They sell Biology books on Amazon for really cheap sometimes. They are very strict about what goes into a Biology book due to all the controversy. There is not that much difference between a High School and College Biology book. Of course, the High School book is aimed at the reading level of High School students.

My son went to first and second grade in a Lutheran School. I talked to the pastor about it once and he said they were very conservative. He said if they were more progressive people would leave the Church and he was doing all he could to keep them there.

I talked to my LCMS pastor many, many times about my opinions and he was okay with it as long as I knew God COULD do things like we’ve been discussing (God can do anything). But I just never felt good about going there with my beliefs.

 

[FaithT]

Maybe you should just read a Biology book and not get caught up in the Evolution Creationism discussion. They sell Biology books on Amazon for really cheap sometimes. They are very strict about what goes into a Biology book due to all the controversy. There is not that much difference between a High School and College Biology book. Of course, the High School book is aimed at the reading level of High School students.

My son went to first and second grade in a Lutheran School. I talked to the pastor about it once and he said they were very conservative. He said if they were more progressive people would leave the Church and he was doing all he could to keep them there.

I’ve read a lot of books on both sides of the topic. I don’t need another one. everybody seems to have an opinion but not fact.

 

[Diamond7]

I’ve read a lot of books on both sides of the topic. I don’t need another one. everybody seems to have an opinion but not fact.

There are no "two" sides, Science and the Bible is like our left and right hand. They totally agree with each other. They are like a pair of gloves. God used BOTH Science and the Bible. He wants us to know what He has done and is doing in our lives. The whole point of science is that "opinions" or hypotheses have to have something to substantiate and prove them to be true. Science is a method to study the evidence. Also there are rules for interpretation of the Bible that we learn when we go to Bible School.

People do misuse Science and they do misuse the Bible. Science has the power for good or evil. They can destroy the world and it is the Bible that restrains them from doing that.

It's clear from my perspective that I view science and the Bible as complementary and not in conflict. Lots of people, esp men and women of Science, do not see a conflict.

 

[FaithT]

There are no "two" sides, Science and the Bible is like our left and right hand. They totally agree with each other. They are like a pair of gloves. God used BOTH Science and the Bible. He wants us to know what He has done and is doing in our lives. The whole point of science is that "opinions" or hypotheses have to have something to substantiate and prove them to be true. Science is a method to study the evidence. Also there are rules for interpretation of the Bible that we learn when we go to Bible School.

People do misuse Science and they do misuse the Bible. Science has the power for good or evil. They can destroy the world and it is the Bible that restrains them from doing that.

It's clear from my perspective that I view science and the Bible as complementary and not in conflict. Lots of people, esp men and women of Science, do not see a conflict.

I‘m just a little sad because I really liked the LCMS church but my beliefs line up more with Catholicism. Especially on scientific topics like evolution and age of the earth.

 

[FaithT]

There are no "two" sides, Science and the Bible is like our left and right hand. They totally agree with each other. They are like a pair of gloves. God used BOTH Science and the Bible. He wants us to know what He has done and is doing in our lives. The whole point of science is that "opinions" or hypotheses have to have something to substantiate and prove them to be true. Science is a method to study the evidence. Also there are rules for interpretation of the Bible that we learn when we go to Bible School.

People do misuse Science and they do misuse the Bible. Science has the power for good or evil. They can destroy the world and it is the Bible that restrains them from doing that.

It's clear from my perspective that I view science and the Bible as complementary and not in conflict. Lots of people, esp men and women of Science, do not see a conflict.

I believe that God gave us scientists to teach us. They were gifted with high intelligence and a strong desire to learn about their various disciplines.

 

[Diamond7]

I believe that God gave us scientists to teach us. They were gifted with high intelligence and a strong desire to learn about their various disciplines.

Yes, God wants us to understand and He created us with the ability to understand.