The SONS of God came in to the daughters of man

[BobRyan]

Then why did God have them killed?

No text says "God killed the Nephilim because it was a sin to be Nephilim"
It says God wiped out all humans

- and it says the humans were Nephilim - "On the Earth in those days AND ALSO AFTERWARD - when the sons of God married the daughters of men"

So then - the humans got killed because of their sin not because of their "size".

 

[BobRyan]

Nephilim means “fallen”

no it does not. It means giant.
The Jews translated the text into Greek as "giant" not "fallen".

Nephilim (/ˈnɛfɪˌlɪm/; Hebrew: נְפִילִים Nəfīlīm

the Septuagint translates this word into the Greek becoming gigantes or “giant”.

Noah was perfect in his generations meaning that his bloodline

Gen 6 is not about DNA or blood lines.
God is not accusing Nephilim of existing as a result of mixed marriages in Gen 6:1-2 because the text says the Nephilim were there BEFORE That time - in fact Adam was giant, he was what Moses would call "Nephilim".

 

[Postvieww]

Agreed - lost of pagan myths/beliefs surrounding that idea.

But the Bible does not teach it.

Psalm 82:1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.

2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.

3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.

4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.

5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

7 But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

You would do well to open your Bible and your mind and listen to Dr Michael Heiser on this topic . He is very well versed on this,

 

[Postvieww]

No text says "God killed the Nephilim because it was a sin to be Nephilim"
It says God wiped out all humans

- and it says the humans were Nephilim - "On the Earth in those days AND ALSO AFTERWARD - when the sons of God married the daughters of men"

So then - the humans got killed because of their sin not because of their "size".

I implore you to open your Bible and your mind and listen to these videos. This man has forgotten more on this topic than either you or I have ever known. You are so far off base on this it makes me sad for you.

 

[Postvieww]

No text says "God killed the Nephilim because it was a sin to be Nephilim"
It says God wiped out all humans

- and it says the humans were Nephilim - "On the Earth in those days AND ALSO AFTERWARD - when the sons of God married the daughters of men"

So then - the humans got killed because of their sin not because of their "size".

It wasn’t a sin to be tall they were NOT human . They were born of a sinful relationship. God had his people wipe out giant clans in multiple places in scripture. Men, women , children and sometimes even the animals. Why would He do that?

 

[BobRyan]

Psalm 82:1 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.

2 How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.

3 Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.

4 Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.

5 They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.

7 But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.

Here is a suggestion -- listen to Jesus when it comes to Psalms 82

6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are sons of the most High. NIV

John 10:
34 Jesus answered them, “Is it not written in your Law, ‘I have said you are “gods”’? 35 If he called them ‘gods,’ to whom the word of God came—and Scripture cannot be set aside— 36 what about the one whom the Father set apart as his very own and sent into the world? Why then do you accuse me of blasphemy because I said, ‘I am God’s Son’? 37 Do not believe me unless I do the works of my Father. 38 But if I do them, even though you do not believe me, believe the works, that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

 

[BPPLEE]

no it does not. It means giant.
The Jews translated the text into Greek as "giant" not "fallen".

Nephilim (/ˈnɛfɪˌlɪm/; Hebrew: נְפִילִים Nəfīlīm

the Septuagint translates this word into the Greek becoming gigantes or “giant”.


Gen 6 is not about DNA or blood lines.
God is not accusing Nephilim of existing as a result of mixed marriages in Gen 6:1-2 because the text says the Nephilim were there BEFORE That time - in fact Adam was giant, he was what Moses would call "Nephilim".

The Nephilim (/ˈnɛfɪˌlɪm/; Hebrew: נְפִילִים Nəfīlīm) are mysterious beings or people in the Hebrew Bible who are described as being large and strong. The Hebrew word Nephilim is sometimes translated as "giants", and sometimes as its literal meaning "the fallen ones".

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

I was interrupted while I was posting, actually was called away to be asked to teach Bible study next week. I wanted to draw the correlation between the Greek mythology about Zeus as bull and Enoch 85 - 87,

"1. And after this I saw another dream, and I will show the whole dream to thee, my son. 2. And Enoch lifted up (his voice) and spake to his son Methuselah: 'To thee, my son, will I speak: hear my words--incline thine ear to the dream-vision of thy father. 3. Before I took thy mother Edna, I saw in a vision on my bed, and behold a bull came forth from the earth, and that bull was white; and after it came forth a heifer, and along with this (latter) came forth two bulls, one of them black and the other red. 4. And that black bull gored the red one and pursued him over the earth, and thereupon I could no longer see that red bull. 5. But that black bull grew and that heifer went with him, and I saw that many oxen proceeded from him which resembled and followed him. 6. And that cow, that first one, went from the presence of that first bull in order to seek that red one, but found him not, and lamented with a great lamentation over him and sought him. 7. And I looked till that first bull came to her and quieted her, and from that time onward she cried no more. 8. And after that she bore another white bull, and after him she bore many bulls and black cows.

9. And I saw in my sleep that white bull likewise grow and become a great white bull, and from Him proceeded many white bulls, and they resembled him. And they began to beget many white bulls, which resembled them, one following the other, (even) many.

1. And again I saw with mine eyes as I slept, and I saw the heaven above, and behold a star fell from heaven, and it arose and eat and pastured amongst those oxen. 2. And after that I saw the large and the black oxen, and behold they all changed their stalls and pastures and their cattle, and began to live with each other. 3. And again I saw in the vision, and looked towards the heaven, and behold I saw many stars descend and cast themselves down from heaven to that first star, and they became bulls amongst those cattle and pastured with them ⌈amongst them⌉. 4. And I looked at them and saw, and behold they all let out their privy members, like horses, and began to cover the cows of the oxen, and they all became pregnant and bare elephants, camels, and asses. 5. And all the oxen feared them and were affrighted at them, and began to bite with their teeth and to devour, and to gore with their horns. 6. And they began, moreover, to devour those oxen; and behold all the children of the earth began to tremble and quake before them and to flee from them."

"1. And again I saw how they began to gore each other and to devour each other, and the earth began to cry aloud. 2. And I raised mine eyes again to heaven, and I saw in the vision, and behold there came forth from heaven beings who were like white men: and four went forth from that place and three with them. 3. And those three that had last come forth grasped me by my hand and took me up, away from the generations of the earth, and raised me up to a lofty place, and showed me a tower raised high above the earth, and all the hills were lower. 4. And one said unto me: 'Remain here till thou seest everything that befalls those elephants, camels, and asses, and the stars and the oxen, and all of them.'"

Of course the animals in this vision are symbolic, and it carries on further. Point being, the ancients knew the Sons of God were in fact angels: Watchers that came to earth and corrupted themselves and the people of earth.

Then there's the Anunnaki of the Sumerians,
"he earliest known usages of the term Anunnaki come from inscriptions written during the reign of Gudea (c. 2144–2124 BC) and the Third Dynasty of Ur.[9][11] In the earliest texts, the term is applied to the most powerful and important deities in the Sumerian pantheon: the descendants of the sky-god An.[9][26]This group of deities probably included the "seven gods who decree":[27] An, Enlil, Enki, Ninhursag, Nanna, Utu, and Inanna.[28]"

Just as every culture has a legend of the flood, so too do the Sons of God appear in various forms of myth and legend. The Book of Enoch containing the chapters on the Watchers is said to have been written between 300-200 BC. So while it's not as old as the writings of Moses, it certainly predates the Sethite theory.
Also, while Enoch contains things that cannot be taken at face value such as the 3000 ells, and also in the section on the Luminaries, there are portions that are accurate. I'd look at it more as 1 and 2 Maccabees can be read as history, and also used for Hanukkah. After all Jude quotes Enoch 1:9 and Hebrews 4:13 quotes 1 Enoch 9:5. There is also prophecy in 1 Enoch 62 about the Son of man on His throne of Glory which Jesus uses that term in Matthew 25 "The throne of His glory" That's an exact quote, and in all the Old Testament, "throne of glory" is mentioned in 1 Samuel 2:8, and "throne of thy glory" in Jeremiah 14:21.
The millennium reign of Christ is also in the Book of Enoch.

 

[Postvieww]

Here is a suggestion -- listen to Jesus when it comes to Psalms 82

Jesus quoted Psalm 82 tell us why?

 

[BobRyan]

The Nephilim (/ˈnɛfɪˌlɪm/; Hebrew: נְפִילִים Nəfīlīm) are mysterious beings or people in the Hebrew Bible who are described as being large and strong.

Indeed - but no text in scripture says that the term also means evil.

The Hebrew word Nephilim is sometimes translated as "giants"

agreed.

The fact that myth legend etc has evolved over time - does not change what we actually see in the text.

No Bible text suggests that sin is related to birth where some are born evil and others are born righteous.
Rather the Bible says all have a sinful nature and the Bible has no concept of "different species of humans" etc.
In addition Genesis 6 does not say "giants were born as a result of mixed marriages"
Nor does it say "humans born in mixed marriages need to be destroyed".

Rather it is because mankind became evil that they were destroyed.

5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

Does not say "wickedness of Nephilim was great" -- rather the entire focus is on 'man' -- "mankind" corrupt and wicked --
Not "physical defects" but rather moral corruption.

 

[BobRyan]

Jesus quoted Psalm 82 tell us why?

Because He was accused of blasphemy for saying He is the Son of God which would make Him God... (and in fact He was God)

 

[BobRyan]

I was interrupted while I was posting, actually was called away to be asked to teach Bible study next week. I wanted to draw the correlation between the Greek mythology about Zeus as bull and Enoch 85 - 87,

"1. And after this I saw another dream, and I will show the whole dream to thee, my son. 2. And Enoch lifted up (his voice) and spake to his son Methuselah: 'To thee, my son, will I speak: hear my words--incline thine ear to the dream-vision of thy father. 3. Before I took thy mother Edna, I saw in a vision on my bed, and behold a bull came forth from the earth, and that bull was white; and after it came forth a heifer, and along with this (latter) came forth two bulls, one of them black and the other red. 4. And that black bull gored the red one and pursued him over the earth, and thereupon I could no longer see that red bull. 5. But that black bull grew and that heifer went with him, and I saw that many oxen proceeded from him which resembled and followed him. 6. And that cow, that first one, went from the presence of that first bull in order to seek that red one, but found him not, and lamented with a great lamentation over him and sought him. 7. And I looked till that first bull came to her and quieted her, and from that time onward she cried no more. 8. And after that she bore another white bull, and after him she bore many bulls and black cows.

9. And I saw in my sleep that white bull likewise grow and become a great white bull, and from Him proceeded many white bulls, and they resembled him. And they began to beget many white bulls, which resembled them, one following the other, (even) many.

1. And again I saw with mine eyes as I slept, and I saw the heaven above, and behold a star fell from heaven, and it arose and eat and pastured amongst those oxen. 2. And after that I saw the large and the black oxen, and behold they all changed their stalls and pastures and their cattle, and began to live with each other. 3. And again I saw in the vision, and looked towards the heaven, and behold I saw many stars descend and cast themselves down from heaven to that first star, and they became bulls amongst those cattle and pastured with them ⌈amongst them⌉. 4. And I looked at them and saw, and behold they all let out their privy members, like horses, and began to cover the cows of the oxen, and they all became pregnant and bare elephants, camels, and asses. 5. And all the oxen feared them and were affrighted at them, and began to bite with their teeth and to devour, and to gore with their horns. 6. And they began, moreover, to devour those oxen; and behold all the children of the earth began to tremble and quake before them and to flee from them."

"1. And again I saw how they began to gore each other and to devour each other, and the earth began to cry aloud. 2. And I raised mine eyes again to heaven, and I saw in the vision, and behold there came forth from heaven beings who were like white men: and four went forth from that place and three with them. 3. And those three that had last come forth grasped me by my hand and took me up, away from the generations of the earth, and raised me up to a lofty place, and showed me a tower raised high above the earth, and all the hills were lower. 4. And one said unto me: 'Remain here till thou seest everything that befalls those elephants, camels, and asses, and the stars and the oxen, and all of them.'"

Of course the animals in this vision are symbolic, and it carries on further. Point being, the ancients knew the Sons of God were in fact angels: Watchers that came to earth and corrupted themselves and the people of earth.

Then there's the Anunnaki of the Sumerians,
"he earliest known usages of the term Anunnaki come from inscriptions written during the reign of Gudea (c. 2144–2124 BC) and the Third Dynasty of Ur.[9][11] In the earliest texts, the term is applied to the most powerful and important deities in the Sumerian pantheon: the descendants of the sky-god An.[9][26]This group of deities probably included the "seven gods who decree":[27] An, Enlil, Enki, Ninhursag, Nanna, Utu, and Inanna.[28]"

Just as every culture has a legend of the flood, so too do the Sons of God appear in various forms of myth and legend. The Book of Enoch containing the chapters on the Watchers is said to have been written between 300-200 BC. So while it's not as old as the writings of Moses, it certainly predates the Sethite theory.
Also, while Enoch contains things that cannot be taken at face value such as the 3000 ells, and also in the section on the Luminaries, there are portions that are accurate. I'd look at it more as 1 and 2 Maccabees can be read as history, and also used for Hanukkah. After all Jude quotes Enoch 1:9 and Hebrews 4:13 quotes 1 Enoch 9:5. There is also prophecy in 1 Enoch 62 about the Son of man on His throne of Glory which Jesus uses that term in Matthew 25 "The throne of His glory" That's an exact quote, and in all the Old Testament, "throne of glory" is mentioned in 1 Samuel 2:8, and "throne of thy glory" in Jeremiah 14:21.
The millennium reign of Christ is also in the Book of Enoch.

agreed a lot of syncretism in all of that.

It looks to me like there were a few traditions about Enoch that survived over the 1000's of years and were edited/added-to/ etc with a lot of syncretism flooding into what may have been a good early tradition -- yet over 1000's of years corrupted.

Notice that no one has that book as part of scripture and also note that scripture that is genuine is never "lost" for centuries at a time.

 

[BPPLEE]

Indeed - but no text in scripture says that the term also means evil.

agreed.

The fact that myth legend etc has evolved over time - does not change what we actually see in the text.

No Bible text suggests that sin is related to birth where some are born evil and others are born righteous.
Rather the Bible says all have a sinful nature and the Bible has no concept of "different species of humans" etc.
In addition Genesis 6 does not say "giants were born as a result of mixed marriages"
Nor does it say "humans born in mixed marriages need to be destroyed".

Rather it is because mankind became evil that they were destroyed.

5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7 So the Lord said, “I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

Does not say "wickedness of Nephilim was great" -- rather the entire focus is on 'man' -- "mankind" corrupt and wicked --
Not "physical defects" but rather moral corruption.

You selectively edited my post. You left out that Nephilim is also translated as fallen ones.
What you did might be cute to you or maybe you think you’ve proven your point but you haven’t

 

[Postvieww]

Because He was accused of blasphemy for saying He is the Son of God which would make Him God... (and in fact He was God)

True now who were the gods in Psalm 82?

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

True now who were the gods in Psalm 82?

Since this has been brought up, I have heard this used to promote the heretical "Little gods" doctrine teaching we are Little gods and Elohim creates after His kind when we're born again.
Now this could refer back to those fallen ones and the hybrid offspring, most certainly. Also the serpent told Eve, ye shall become as gods. Elohim can be used as other gods, or in rare cases human magistrates: judges. (Though Benai HaElohim is ALWAYS angels in the Hebrew Scriptures as we've earlier discussed)
Psalm 82 context is one of those rare instances in scripture where Elohim can mean judges, or angels such as those who come before Him as in Job 1 & 2. The entire Psalm is about judging rightly,

"God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
How long will ye judge unjustly, and accept the persons of the wicked? Selah.
Defend the poor and fatherless: do justice to the afflicted and needy.
Deliver the poor and needy: rid them out of the hand of the wicked.
They know not, neither will they understand; they walk on in darkness: all the foundations of the earth are out of course.
I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes.
Arise, O God, judge the earth: for thou shalt inherit all nations."

To reply to the rest:

Now one thing I hope we don't get too sidetracked on here is the fact that as in the days of Noah, so shall it be when the Son of man comes. Yes, people appear as life goes on as normal, marrying and giving in marriage, etc; but they do this while the entire world is plunging into darkness and violence, the occult, adultery, etc - ALL of which are taking place now.

One thing oft gets overlooked, that is the whole "alien abduction" phenomenon. It's been going on since 1947, mainly picking up in frequency during the 1950s and continuing to this day. A big part of this phenomenon is reproductive experiments. There is physical evidence of these demonic visitations (for the "aliens" are demons, fallen ones, not ET's), in the form of marks and scars left on bodies, and very often people report experimentation with their reproductive organs, the taking of sperm and ova.

However, throughout the centuries this has happened. The Fairey lore of the British Isles and Scandinavia is rife with supernatural beings taking humans and mating with them. In fact J.R.R. Tolkien uses the historical mythologies borrowed from Western Europe in his Hobbit and Lord of the Rings, as well as his other writings, and we see Elves (known as the Eldar) mating with humans and producing offspring that are 'half elven". Well, that's just a fantasy fiction you say? No: he used real historical mythology and languages, delving deep into them to create a mythology for the British Isles. We also know that oft times certain science fiction and fantasy literature proves to be prophetic, or holding veiled truths we later learn to be accurate.

"The Indigo Elves use Tolkien’s literary mythology, but they do so selectively. Like in most Elven groups, Valar rituals play no role in Indigo Elves. In several posts group leader Ravenwolf actively discourages Valar‐directed rituals, stressing that Tolkien considered the Valar to be angels, not gods to be worshipped. Ravenwolf equates Eru with the Christian God, but that is of little relevance to the group’s discussions which focus on the nature of the Elves and leave it to the individual members to follow whatever deities they want. More than other Elven groups, the Indigos draw strongly on Laurence Gardner and Nicholas de Vere (cf. ch. 12), and a red thread in the group’s discussions is the attempt to harmonise grail lore, Biblical narratives, the Atlantis myth, and Tolkien’s literary mythology. This goes together with an unusually strong focus on Elven descent (as opposed to Elven incarnation) compared to contemporary Elven and Other‐ kin groups in general. "
- Davidsen, Markus Altena: The spiritual Tolkien milieu : a study of fiction-based religion Netherlands, Universiteit Leiden; Issue Date: 2014-10-16, pg 339

Whole point is we should be keenly aware of what is going on and realize we are right now living in a time as Noah. That means we should be humble, living holy and godly lives, awaiting the return of our Lord Jesus, for He said to look up when these things begin to come to pass, for your redemption draweth nigh. We should not lose focus of this one integral point. We are living in very interesting times, and the seriousness of being prepared for the Lord's return is being overlooked by many who continue to love this present world and the things of this world.

"For the grace of God that bringeth salvation hath appeared to all men,
Teaching us that, denying ungodliness and worldly lusts, we should live soberly, righteously, and godly, in this present world;
Looking for that blessed hope, and the glorious appearing of the great God and our Saviour Jesus Christ;" - Titus 2:11-13

 

[Postvieww]

Since this has been brought up, I have heard this used to promote the heretical "Little gods" doctrine teaching we are Little gods and Elohim creates after His kind when we're born again.

I do not subscribe to the doctrine that we are "little gods"!

Now this could refer back to those fallen ones and the hybrid offspring, most certainly. Also the serpent told Eve, ye shall become as gods. Elohim can be used as other gods, or in rare cases human magistrates: judges. (Though Benai HaElohim is ALWAYS angels in the Hebrew Scriptures as we've earlier discussed)
Psalm 82 context is one of those rare instances in scripture where Elohim can mean judges, or angels such as those who come before Him as in Job 1 & 2. The entire Psalm is about judging rightly,

I believe Psalm 82 refers angels such as those in Job 1,2 & 38. I see no reason God would tell human judges you will die like men since all men die like men.

 

[Kokavkrystallos]

I do not subscribe to the doctrine that we are "little gods"!

I believe Psalm 82 refers angels such as those in Job 1,2 & 38. I see no reason God would tell human judges you will die like men since all men die like men.

You definitely have a point there, "all men die like men" - therefore these "elohim" would be ones that under normal circumstances wouldn't die.
Thank Yahweh for college Hebrew!

Literal Psalm 82:1, "Elohim nitssab ba'adat-El beqereb Elohim yishpot."
"God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods."
"God takes His stand in congregation (of the) divine (El) among gods He judges."
El = God, God like ones, mighty men or heroes, angels, gods (false), in most cases it means supernatural gods.

Then this, "I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. But ye shall die like men, and fall like one of the princes."

Interesting "VuBenai Elyon" is "Children of the Most High" or "and Sons of the Most High" -
Most literal translation:
"I said gods you are, (comma) and children of the Most High all of you (kolhekem), (comma) Nevertheless like men you will die, (comma) and like one of the princes fall."

"The Princes" = HaSarim. "Sar" is prince and can mean patron angel, or ruler/rulers of God (principalities). Same word used in Daniel 10:13 which speaks of the "prince" of the kingdom of Persia (Sar) and Michael one of the chief princes (HaSarim)

Given the context of Psalm 82, I'd say most definitely is discussing the angels and principalities, especially with what you threw out there about dying like men.
Consider Isaiah 14:14-15 where it's talking about "Lucifer" (actually Helel Ben Shahar) says something very similar: "I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit."

Thanks! can there be any doubt now?

I've been in churches where they digressed slowly down the path to dominion, prosperity gospel, little gods; then after that all they wanted to teach was that so it's time to "come out from among them and be ye separate saith the LORD."

 

[Simon_Templar]

The arguments presented against the angelic interpretation are weak at best.

The fact that the New Testament calls human beings "sons of God" through Jesus Christ has virtually no bearing on how the phrase sons of God was used in the Old Testament. This is like saying that when George Washington used the word "intercourse" he was talking about sex, because that is how we use the word today (except worse actually).

The fact that Angels are not taken and given in marriage is irrelevant, because the whole point of the claim is that these angels deliberately sinned by "leaving their first estate" which means they deliberately went against their nature and left the mode of existence that they would normally carry on. Moreover, it is stated that the sin of the fallen angels was like that of Sodom, indicating, most likely that it had some kind of sexual component, specifically an aberrant, unnatural sexual component.

Angelic beings do not, by nature, have physical form or bodies. However, they are capable of appearing in physical form and manipulating a body, which the Bible makes clear they do.

As such an angelic being would not have it's own native DNA in the way a human being would. However, there is nothing to indicate that they would be incapable of either taking human genetic material and modifying it into DNA that they sort of make their own.

In my opinion, the motivation of these angels was procreation itself, not sexual lust. They recognized the unique power God gave to human beings of being able to produce offspring of their own, something the angels by their nature could not due. I think the point of what they did was essentially to co-opt the human gift of procreation to attempt to essentially make creations of their own, offspring they would essentially engineer into their own vision of what they wanted their offspring to be.

 

[Simon_Templar]

You need to accept the obvious - first instead of trying to "just say no" to all the obvious answers.

God created mankind and the world - sinless, perfect etc. The entire conditions for life were optimum.

Tornadoes did not spring up the moment Adam ate the fruit.

Perfect conditions for life existed both inside and outside the garden. Since God made the WORLD perfect not just a garden.

What they did not have - was access to the Tree of Life after the fall. Humans no longer had that access.

So while nature began to decay it was very slowly - it is not until long after the flood that you find the first account of someone sick or feeble.

Not sure why this is supposed to be "confusing"

Except the Bible never says that God created the entire world perfect, and actually there is language in the Creation account that would indicate otherwise.

When God tells Adam and Eve to subdue the earth and have dominion over it, the language he uses is that of conquest by force. The image being presented is that it was Adam's job to first protect and preserve the Garden, and second to subdue the rest of the world to the God's order which at that point existed only in the Garden. The idea here is not that the world outside the Garden was evil, but that it was wild, perhaps even chaotic and the mandate that God gave to man was to go out and tame the world, and bring it into subjection to God's order, as Man was God's representative, in the triple ministry of Priest, Prophet, and King.


Regarding Noah being a Nephilim, this is based on some Jewish conjecture. In the Old Testament Nephilim exist before the Flood, but also exist in Canaan during the conquest of Canaan. Jewish sages and thinkers tried to solve that problem in various ways. One of those ways was by supposing that Noah may have been a Nephilim himself. This idea, however, is both completely unnecessary, and also largely goes against scripture.

 

[tonychanyt]

I think the point of what they did was essentially to co-opt the human gift of procreation to attempt to essentially make creations of their own, offspring they would essentially engineer into their own vision of what they wanted their offspring to be.

Let proposition P1 = The sons of God in Gen 6:2 were angels having sexual intercourse with human females.

True?