That is one of the great benefits of holding to a highly flexible interpretation of the regulative principle of worship.
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2 Cor 3:6-11 Affirms the Law of God, and the New Covenant where it is written on the heart
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God did not give us a commandment, that we would not be able to keep through His power. Jesus came to save the lost so if some were false teachers- Jesus teaching in the temples on the Sabbath is not breaking the Sabbath commandment. In claiming so you are teaching Jesus, and the apostles are sinners. Jesus in His own Words said He did not break the commandments or sinned, Mat 15:10 John 8:46-47 Heb 4:15 1 Peter2: 21-22.
Sad, so now the blessing of rain is God breaking His own Sabbath. The Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27 the Sabbath is a commandment for man Exo 20:8-11 not God, man is not above God, we are to be His servants, to question or even insinuate that God is breaking the Sabbath because we have rain or sunshine on the Sabbath, just goes to show the lengths people go to try to get out of the Sabbath commandment- like something else could be more important than setting aside the day He asked us to, so He can spend time with us and bless and sanctify us because we can't sanctity ourselves, we need God Eze 20:12.
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The danger of pitting Paul's words against the Words of Christ.
People use Col 2:16 as a reason not to keep one of God's commandments, but Paul does not have the authority to countermand Jesus and its why we have this warning about Paul's writing. Paul never taught something different than Jesus. Paul was His servant, not the other way around.
2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
Paul was a servant of Christ Romans 1:1 and was commissioned to observe everything Christ commanded of him Mat 28:18-20
Did Paul not seek what is justice and righteous? Did he not want to join himself to the Lord? To love His name and serve Him just as Christ calls everyone to do though His Sabbath?
Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant
Did Paul forget the Sabbath that God commanded everyone to Remember and keep holy? Did he teach we could profane the Sabbath commandment?
Not according to scriptures- he and the apostles kept every Sabbath- decades after the Cross just as Jesus commanded them to observe everything He commanded.
Acts 13:42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. 43 Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God. 45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy; and contradicting and blaspheming, they opposed the things spoken by Paul. 46 Then Paul and Barnabas grew bold and said, “It was necessary that the word of God should be spoken to you first; but since you reject it, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, behold, we turn to the Gentiles. 47 For so the Lord has commanded us:
‘I have set you as a light to the Gentiles,
That you should be for salvation to the ends of the earth.’ ”
48 Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
Acts 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.
Paul obviously was not referring to the 4th commandment in Col 2:16 and he explains it in Col 2:14 that it's about handwritten ordinances, contrary and against which is not the Sabbath commandment finger written by God that He blessed and made holy that no man can reverse. Num 23:20 God alone wrote and spoke the Ten Commandments His perfect law Psa 19:7 that the no man has the authority above, including Paul. There is no thus saith the Lord that we can profane God's Sabbath- God in His own Words which we are to live by Mat 4:4 says for us to keep His Sabbath and not profane. We ought to obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29
People use Col 2:16 as a reason not to keep one of God's commandments, but Paul does not have the authority to countermand Jesus and its why we have this warning about Paul's writing. Paul never taught something different than Jesus. Paul was His servant, not the other way around.
2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.
Paul was a servant of Christ Romans 1:1 and was commissioned to observe everything Christ commanded of him Mat 28:18-20
Did Paul not seek what is justice and righteous? Did he not want to join himself to the Lord? To love His name and serve Him just as Christ calls everyone to do though His Sabbath?
Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:
“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.
2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”
6 “Also the sons of the foreigner
Who join themselves to the Lord, to serve Him,
And to love the name of the Lord, to be His servants—
Everyone who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And holds fast My covenant
Did Paul forget the Sabbath that God commanded everyone to Remember and keep holy? Did he teach we could profane the Sabbath commandment?
Not according to scriptures- he and the apostles kept every Sabbath- decades after the Cross just as Jesus commanded them to observe everything He commanded.
Acts 13:42 So when the Jews went out of the synagogue, the Gentiles begged that these words might be preached to them the next Sabbath. 43 Now when the congregation had broken up, many of the Jews and devout proselytes followed Paul and Barnabas, who, speaking to them, persuaded them to continue in the grace of God.
44 On the next Sabbath almost the whole city came together to hear the word of God. 45 But when the Jews saw the multitudes, they were filled with envy; and contradicting and blaspheming, they opposed the things spoken by Paul. 46 Then Paul and Barnabas grew bold and said, “It was necessary that the word of God should be spoken to you first; but since you reject it, and judge yourselves unworthy of everlasting life, behold, we turn to the Gentiles. 47 For so the Lord has commanded us:
‘I have set you as a light to the Gentiles,
That you should be for salvation to the ends of the earth.’ ”
48 Now when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and glorified the word of the Lord. And as many as had been appointed to eternal life believed.
Acts 18:4 And he reasoned in the synagogue every Sabbath, and persuaded both Jews and Greeks.
Paul obviously was not referring to the 4th commandment in Col 2:16 and he explains it in Col 2:14 that it's about handwritten ordinances, contrary and against which is not the Sabbath commandment finger written by God that He blessed and made holy that no man can reverse. Num 23:20 God alone wrote and spoke the Ten Commandments His perfect law Psa 19:7 that the no man has the authority above, including Paul. There is no thus saith the Lord that we can profane God's Sabbath- God in His own Words which we are to live by Mat 4:4 says for us to keep His Sabbath and not profane. We ought to obey God rather than men. Acts 5:29
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Leaf473
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I wouldn't describe it as confusing, but I do think it is interesting that Isaiah has us celebrating the new moon sometime in the future.
Even if we change new moon to month, it's still interesting that we're doing some kind of special worship each month.
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Not true, there were 8 yearly feasts and called Sabbaths. Then Col 2 mentions the Sabbath day. 16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, (eight of them) a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day. Why would Paul emphasize the Sabbath separately from the eight other Sabbaths if he didn't mean the one that come around once a week? link that verse with 2Cor3:6-12 and there in absolutely no grounds to claim the old covenant weekly Sabbath is binding on anyone. Also let me remind you that Gentiles have never been under the Sabbath demand. Also, Is 65 mentioning the Earth made new tells the reader that man would live to be over 100 and those who live lives are not in line with Heavenly rules will not live to be 100. Smoke that for a while before you use Is66:23 as your proof text.
Why does the SDA church judge, especially, members and others who eat non-kosher meat? Oh, I know, it is because the prophet wrote falsehoods, and the church will not stand up to defrock her. The infoolable has spoken and the hierarchy listens.
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Quite true. I tell my legalistic friends that when I come to the point of actually loving my neighbor as myself I will be able to turn my attention to their laws and regulations.
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The Ten Commandments is not replaced by the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit leads us to obeying God's law, they work in harmony not against. Anything less is rebellion and being of the carnal mind.
John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another [e]Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
Romans 8:4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
God's Spirit is given (resides) to those who obey
Acts 5:32 And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”
John 14:15 “If you love Me, keep My commandments. 16 And I will pray the Father, and He will give you another [e]Helper, that He may abide with you forever— 17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees Him nor knows Him; but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you. 18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.
Romans 8:4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit. 6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace. 7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
1 John 2:3 Now by this we know that we know Him, if we keep His commandments. 4 He who says, “I know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. 5 But whoever keeps His word, truly the love of God is perfected in him. By this we know that we are in Him. 6 He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked.
God's Spirit is given (resides) to those who obey
Acts 5:32 And we are His witnesses to these things, and so also is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him.”
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BobRyan said:
" Col 2 does not mention the weekly Sabbath at all - it refers to the "Shadows" of Lev 23 - the annual Sabbaths that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ. Hence all examples of worship services on Sabbath in the NT refers to the 7th day of the week , where "every Sabbath" Paul was preaching the Gospel to both gentiles and Jews Acts 18:4.
"It is no wonder that scripture says that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship". Is 66:23
I don't see how this is even a little bit confusing
I stated that Lev 23 has a list of annual Sabbaths that are shadow Sabbaths based in animal sacrifice at the time given. This is true -- in fact it is irrefutable and both you and I know it.
These seven annual feasts are:
Did you not find Lev 23???
1. New Moon is not mentioned in Lev 23.
2. New Moon is not mentioned as a Sabbath in the entire book of Leviticus.
3. New Moon is not mentioned in the entire book of Leviticus.
Here is my statement again --
Col 2 does not mention the weekly Sabbath at all - it refers to the "Shadows" of Lev 23 - the annual Sabbaths that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ. Hence all examples of worship services on Sabbath in the NT refers to the 7th day of the week , where "every Sabbath" Paul was preaching the Gospel to both gentiles and Jews Acts 18:4.
New Moon
Paul says this (with all the inserted eisegesis removed and not snip-slicing the sentence in half as in your quote of it ) --
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.(NKJV)
1. He is pointing to animal-sacrifice based events that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ as the Lamb of God.
2. Paul is specific that these are all shadow events - pointing forward.
No mention at all is made of the weekly Sabbath in Col 2.
AND in Col 2:16 Paul is not even deleting any scripture at all not even the feast days. If you are searching for "animal sacrifice events ended" then go to a text that actually talks about it - like Heb 10:4-10
2 Cor 3 does not delete "remember the Sabbath day" any more than it does "do not take God's name in vain" as the OP points out.
Are you reading the thread??
Acts 13 Gentiles specifically ask for more Gospel preaching to be scheduled for them "on the next Sabbath"
Is 66:23 specifically states that the Sabbath is for ALL MANKIND for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth.
Mark 2:27 shows Christ specifically stating that the Sabbath is made for all mankind
Are you reading the thread Bob?
But for this thread -- state a fact for the subject this thread. Then make a case for your POV
" Col 2 does not mention the weekly Sabbath at all - it refers to the "Shadows" of Lev 23 - the annual Sabbaths that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ. Hence all examples of worship services on Sabbath in the NT refers to the 7th day of the week , where "every Sabbath" Paul was preaching the Gospel to both gentiles and Jews Acts 18:4.
"It is no wonder that scripture says that for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth "from Sabbath to Sabbath shall all mankind come before Me to worship". Is 66:23
You can't repeat by way of affirmation what I just said about the annual Sabbaths in Lev 23 and then prefix it with "not true" without first pointing to something that is not true.
I don't see how this is even a little bit confusing
I stated that Lev 23 has a list of annual Sabbaths that are shadow Sabbaths based in animal sacrifice at the time given. This is true -- in fact it is irrefutable and both you and I know it.
These seven annual feasts are:
Did you not find Lev 23???
hint
1. New Moon is not mentioned in Lev 23.
2. New Moon is not mentioned as a Sabbath in the entire book of Leviticus.
3. New Moon is not mentioned in the entire book of Leviticus.
Here is my statement again --
Col 2 does not mention the weekly Sabbath at all - it refers to the "Shadows" of Lev 23 - the annual Sabbaths that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ. Hence all examples of worship services on Sabbath in the NT refers to the 7th day of the week , where "every Sabbath" Paul was preaching the Gospel to both gentiles and Jews Acts 18:4.
New Moon
hint - New Moon is never called a Sabbath in either OT or NT.
Paul says this (with all the inserted eisegesis removed and not snip-slicing the sentence in half as in your quote of it ) --
16 So let no one judge you in food or in drink, or regarding a festival or a new moon or sabbaths, 17 which are a shadow of things to come, but the substance is of Christ.(NKJV)
1. He is pointing to animal-sacrifice based events that point forward to the sacrifice of Christ as the Lamb of God.
2. Paul is specific that these are all shadow events - pointing forward.
No mention at all is made of the weekly Sabbath in Col 2.
AND in Col 2:16 Paul is not even deleting any scripture at all not even the feast days. If you are searching for "animal sacrifice events ended" then go to a text that actually talks about it - like Heb 10:4-10
false as the opening post points out -
2 Cor 3 does not delete "remember the Sabbath day" any more than it does "do not take God's name in vain" as the OP points out.
Are you reading the thread??
Start by reading scripture - Is 56:6-8 specifically singles out gentiles for Sabbath keeping.
Acts 13 Gentiles specifically ask for more Gospel preaching to be scheduled for them "on the next Sabbath"
Is 66:23 specifically states that the Sabbath is for ALL MANKIND for all eternity after the cross in the New Earth.
Mark 2:27 shows Christ specifically stating that the Sabbath is made for all mankind
Are you reading the thread Bob?
Less ad hominem -- more Bible facts please. BTW 1 Cor 5 shows that Paul believed in church discipline... interesting that you would oppose him there as well. Feel free to start a thread on your side topic.
But for this thread -- state a fact for the subject this thread. Then make a case for your POV
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If I loved my neighbor I would not be breaking the last 6 commandments. If I loved God I would not be breaking any of them. 1 John 5:2-3
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The text of Col 2 is clear - it is about the "shadow Sabbaths" -- which are the ones that are based in animal sacrifice.
Ex 20:8-11 the Sabbath commandment has no animal sacrifice.
Ex 20:11 points directly to Gen 2:2-3 at creation week - where once again there was no animal sacrifice.
The weekly Sabbath "made for mankind" not "Sabbath made just for Jews" Mark 2:27.
Is 66:23 points to the weekly Sabbath kept for all eternity after the cross , in the New Earth. Which directly addressed your "Sabbath ended" comment.
I don't see how that is even a little bit confusing.
indeed -- two creation events in our history when we get to Rev 21 so then two cycles for holy convocation
"from New Moon to New Moon AND from Sabbath to Sabbath" -- for all eternity after the cross for all mankind RATHER than "Sabbath deleted at the cross".
I have noted that on this thread a few times but as you have said in the past - you are not reading all the posts -- so I don't mind repeating the point.
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That begs my question. I did not ask you if you were guilty of breaking those particular six commandments. I simply asked you if you have loved your neighbor completely as you love you own self. A simple yes or no answer will suffice.
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Leaf473
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If the logic is that the Sabbath is celebrated at the end of Isaiah 66, thus we ought to celebrate it today, it follows that we ought to be celebrating the new moons today.
I'm glad you don't mind repeating
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I'm thinking one might not understand the biblical definition of love. I'll give you the scriptures again
1 John 5:2 By this we know that we love the children of God, when we love God and keep His commandments. 3 For this is the love of God, that we keep His commandments. And His commandments are not burdensome.
I'm a big believer in what others do or don't do is between them and God. There is nothing we can hide from Him. Ecc 12:13-14 Even if I broke all of the commandments against my neighbor and God, it would not change anyone else's moral obligation to obey them. We are not judged based on what others do or don't do or judged based on a sliding scale- we each have to stand before Jesus one day soon based on our own deeds. 2 Cor 5:10
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Obviously the whole point of the post was about the new moon feasts. You know, that portion of Isaiah 66:23 that you cut out of the verse. You didn’t even say anything about that which was the whole point of my post.
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It doesn't say feast in Isa 66:23.
And it shall come to pass That from one New Moon to another, And from one Sabbath to another, All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the LORD.
A New Moon, is how people kept tracks of the months since they did not have calendars back then.
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The text of Col 2 is clear - it is about the "shadow Sabbaths" -- which are the ones that are based in animal sacrifice.
Ex 20:8-11 the Sabbath commandment has no animal sacrifice.
Ex 20:11 points directly to Gen 2:2-3 at creation week - where once again there was no animal sacrifice.
The weekly Sabbath "made for mankind" not "Sabbath made just for Jews" Mark 2:27.
Is 66:23 points to the weekly Sabbath kept for all eternity after the cross , in the New Earth. Which directly addressed your "Sabbath ended" comment.
I don't see how that is even a little bit confusing.
Is 66:23 And it shall come to pass
That from one New Moon to another,
And from one Sabbath to another,
All flesh shall come to worship before Me,” says the Lord.
two creation events will have existed in Rev 21 so that in that New Earth we have two cycles for regular worship
As for the difference between the New Moon and the Sabbath.
1. The New Moon was never called a "Sabbath" in either OT or NT
2. The New Moon service is not one of the Ten.
3. There is no connection between New Moon and Sabbath such that the Sabbath can only be kept if you are keeping a New Moon service
4. There are no gentiles asking for "more gospel preaching on the next New Moon" unlike the case for Sabbath in Acts 13
5. There is no "New moon for gentiles" in Is 56:6-8 unlike the case for the weekly Sabbath - but there is New Moon for all mankind in Is 66:23
6. There is no "New Moon made for mankind" in Mark 2:27 unlike the case for the weekly Sabbath.
So while it is interesting that you may want to also keep the New Moon service (which of course you are free to do) it has little to nothing to do with the Sabbath topic.
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Why do you think Isaiah 66:23 means that the weekly sabbath will be kept for all eternity after the cross. Can you please highlight that portion of the verse?
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