How many ages are there?

[Bobgf]

How many ages are there?

My premise is that a new age occurs every time there comes about new heavens and a new earth. A new age involves significant changes to our solar system and to earth's geography.

My thinking is that there are five ages:

1) pre-Adamic age
2) pre-Noahic age
3) this present evil age
4) the Kingdom age
5) the Eternal age


1)The pre-Adamic Age

In the pre-Adamic age (ie before Adam sinned) man and the beasts lived together harmoniously. There was no rain, but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground (Gen 2:5-6) Four headwaters: Pishon, Gihon, Tigris, and Euphrates. It's all there in Genesis chapters one and two.



2) The pre-Noahic Age

After Adam sinned, we entered the pre-Noahic age. Again, there was no rain on the earth, until Noah entered the ark (Gen 7:4), and afterwards we saw the first rainbow. It's estimated this age lasted maybe 1500 years. Again, it's all there in Genesis chapters three through seven.



3) This Present Evil Age

Then, after the cataclysmic heaven and earth changing events of the Flood, we come to a new age Paul calls "this present evil age" (Galatians 1:4). It's estimated since the Flood this age is about 4500 years now, with some 1000 years more to go, for a total of 7000 years since Adam.

This present evil age will see the man of sin revealed (2Thes 2:8), causing great tribulation (Matt 24:21), which ends with the rebellion of Gog/Magog (Rev 20:7-9), in which God's fiery judgment will consume all the nation's wicked (Eze 39:6), leaving mortals as rare as fine gold (Isa 13:12)

Quote: Matt 24:21-22
For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

I believe the 1000 year reign of Christ and his saints (Rev 20:4) will not be on earth but rather in the heavenly places vacated by Satan and his angels after the war in heaven (Rev 12:7-9)
The Kingdom of God begins in heaven, not on the earth (Rev 12:10).

Quote: Rev 12:10
Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down.


Revelation's sixth seal (Rev 6:12-17) follows immediately after that great tribulation and will bring about significant changes to our heavens and to earth's geography as well, constituting the beginning of the Kingdom age (Matt 24:29-30).



4) The Kingdom Age

Quote: Rev 6:12-14
I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.

Quote: Matt 24:29-30 (abridged)
Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken... and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

The Kingdom age will last many thousands of years to accommodate God's sworn promise to give the land of Canaan to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and to Israel, for a thousand generations (Psalm 105:8 and 1 Chronicles 16:15)

In the Kingdom age the wicked will die young, the wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox (Isa 65:17-25) This will be the Messianic Kingdom Age where Christ will rule with his twelve disciples (Matt 19:28)

Quote: Matthew 19:28
So, Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Quote: Acts 17:31
God has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.


IMO This age will end with the execution of Revelation's seventh seal with its seven trumpets and seven vials. All the unrepentant wicked who have ever lived will be judged, and those who still refuse to repent will be destroyed in the LOF.

Quote: Isa 24:21-22
In that day the Lord will punish the powers in the heavens above and the kings on the earth below. They will be herded together like prisoners bound in a dungeon; they will be shut up in prison and be punished after many days.



5) the Eternal Age

Many people conflate the Kingdom age with the Eternal age. In the former, sin and death still reign, but not in the later.

Quote: Rev 21:1f (abridged)
Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away...“Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God.

Bob..

 

[eleos1954]

How many ages are there?

My premise is that a new age occurs every time there comes about new heavens and a new earth. A new age involves significant changes to our solar system and to earth's geography.

My thinking is that there are five ages:

1) pre-Adamic age
2) pre-Noahic age
3) this present evil age
4) the Kingdom age
5) the Eternal age


1)The pre-Adamic Age

In the pre-Adamic age (ie before Adam sinned) man and the beasts lived together harmoniously. There was no rain, but streams came up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground (Gen 2:5-6) Four headwaters: Pishon, Gihon, Tigris, and Euphrates. It's all there in Genesis chapters one and two.



2) The pre-Noahic Age

After Adam sinned, we entered the pre-Noahic age. Again, there was no rain on the earth, until Noah entered the ark (Gen 7:4), and afterwards we saw the first rainbow. It's estimated this age lasted maybe 1500 years. Again, it's all there in Genesis chapters three through seven.



3) This Present Evil Age

Then, after the cataclysmic heaven and earth changing events of the Flood, we come to a new age Paul calls "this present evil age" (Galatians 1:4). It's estimated since the Flood this age is about 4500 years now, with some 1000 years more to go, for a total of 7000 years since Adam.

This present evil age will see the man of sin revealed (2Thes 2:8), causing great tribulation (Matt 24:21), which ends with the rebellion of Gog/Magog (Rev 20:7-9), in which God's fiery judgment will consume all the nation's wicked (Eze 39:6), leaving mortals as rare as fine gold (Isa 13:12)

Quote: Matt 24:21-22
For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be. And unless those days were shortened, no flesh would be saved; but for the elect’s sake those days will be shortened.

I believe the 1000 year reign of Christ and his saints (Rev 20:4) will not be on earth but rather in the heavenly places vacated by Satan and his angels after the war in heaven (Rev 12:7-9)
The Kingdom of God begins in heaven, not on the earth (Rev 12:10).

Quote: Rev 12:10
Now salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down.


Revelation's sixth seal (Rev 6:12-17) follows immediately after that great tribulation and will bring about significant changes to our heavens and to earth's geography as well, constituting the beginning of the Kingdom age (Matt 24:29-30).



4) The Kingdom Age

Quote: Rev 6:12-14
I looked when He opened the sixth seal, and behold, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became like blood. And the stars of heaven fell to the earth, as a fig tree drops its late figs when it is shaken by a mighty wind. Then the sky receded as a scroll when it is rolled up, and every mountain and island was moved out of its place.

Quote: Matt 24:29-30 (abridged)
Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light; the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken... and they will see the Son of Man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

The Kingdom age will last many thousands of years to accommodate God's sworn promise to give the land of Canaan to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, and to Israel, for a thousand generations (Psalm 105:8 and 1 Chronicles 16:15)

In the Kingdom age the wicked will die young, the wolf and the lamb will feed together, and the lion will eat straw like the ox (Isa 65:17-25) This will be the Messianic Kingdom Age where Christ will rule with his twelve disciples (Matt 19:28)

Quote: Matthew 19:28
So, Jesus said to them, “Assuredly I say to you, that in the regeneration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you who have followed Me will also sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

Quote: Acts 17:31
God has appointed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by the Man whom He has ordained. He has given assurance of this to all by raising Him from the dead.


IMO This age will end with the execution of Revelation's seventh seal with its seven trumpets and seven vials. All the unrepentant wicked who have ever lived will be judged, and those who still refuse to repent will be destroyed in the LOF.

Quote: Isa 24:21-22
In that day the Lord will punish the powers in the heavens above and the kings on the earth below. They will be herded together like prisoners bound in a dungeon; they will be shut up in prison and be punished after many days.



5) the Eternal Age

Many people conflate the Kingdom age with the Eternal age. In the former, sin and death still reign, but not in the later.

Quote: Rev 21:1f (abridged)
Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away...“Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God.

Bob..

The word age/ages in the bible is a generic term ..... the bible is not broken up into the ages as listed in your posting ... those are in accordance to particular theologies taught.

Dispensationalism is a theological system of interpreting the Bible that was first espoused by John Nelson Darby. Dispensationalism maintains that history is divided into multiple ages or "dispensations" in which God acts with humanity in different ways.

His Word is here a little .... there a little .... precept upon precept ... not according to ages as put forth by men.

Isaiah 28:10
King James Bible
For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

 

[Bobgf]

The word age/ages in the bible is a generic term ..... the bible is not broken up into the ages as listed in your posting ... those are in accordance to particular theologies taught.

Dispensationalism is a theological system of interpreting the Bible that was first espoused by John Nelson Darby. Dispensationalism maintains that history is divided into multiple ages or "dispensations" in which God acts with humanity in different ways.

His Word is here a little .... there a little .... precept upon precept ... not according to ages as put forth by men.

Isaiah 28:10
King James Bible
For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept; line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little:

Thank you, eleos1954, for pointing out these things to me.

I agree that history is divided into multiple ages or "dispensations" in which God acts with humanity in different ways.

For example, the proverb ‘The parents have eaten sour grapes, and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’

This proverb holds true for now (Ex 34:07), but God says this will not be so in the future (Jer 31:29).

Qoote: Jer 31:30
Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.


BTW I think there were other heaven and earth changing events that I didn't think of. One would be when Moses left Egypt circa 1500 BC, the plagues, the parting of the Red Sea, and large grape clusters (Num 13:23) that took two men to carry were supernatural events, probably involving extraterrestrial objects.

Another time was circa 700 BC when Hezekiah asked for a sign from God, and God made the stairway shadow go back ten steps (2Kings 20:11). Some think this supernatural event has caused the world to slow down from 360 days per year to the present 365 1/4.

And we shouldn't forget Joshua who asked for the sun and moon to stand still (Joshua 10:13) and they did.

Bob..

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

BobGF,

Here is a more accurate view of the ages...

GOD’S PLAN OF THE AGES

1.The Pre-Adamic Age – The Age of Angels

The First Age is from the creation of the universe to the creation of Adam, the age when the angels were the key focus of God’s dealings.

Time Period: Unknown, but likely to be many millions or even billions of years in duration.

Key Events: At some point before the creation of the heavens and the earth and before time began, God through His Son first created a host of multiple millions of holy angels, ‘sons of God’ (Job 38:6-7). God then created the universe with the earth instantaneously, which marked the beginning of time and the beginning of the ages. God created the earth in such a beautiful perfect condition, as a garden teeming with plant and animal life, that the angels responded with singing and shouts of joy. God put angels in charge of His beautifully created earth with Lucifer as the leading angel.

At some point in the Pre-Adamic Age, Lucifer who became Satan convinced a third of the angels to join him in a rebellion against God to usurp the throne of God in heaven. These rebellious angels were severely punished by God for their sins and He violently cast them back down to earth. This judgement of God against the sinful fallen angels resulted in a total global cataclysmic destruction of the earth’s surface and a sudden extinction of all Pre-Adamic plant and animal life. Since then, God has chained Satan and his fallen angels in spiritual darkness and confined them to earth and its atmosphere awaiting their final judgement in the Lake of Fire.

The abundant existence of fossils and vast deposits of fossil fuels throughout the world today bear witness to the past sudden extinction of Pre-Adamic plant and animal life resulting from God’s judgement against Satan and his fallen angels. Also, in addition to its long age, earth’s geology bears clear witness to massively cataclysmic upheavals of the earth’s surface in its past, such that even the seabeds were raised to form sedimentary mountains like the Himalayas. These also resulted from God’s global judgement of the sinful fallen angels.

Star distances and many other modern scientific methods all show that the earth is many millions, even billions of years old; hence the Pre-Adamic Age lasted for many millions, maybe even billions of years.

We give detailed answers to understand the scriptural, scientific and geological aspects of the truth of the Pre-Adamic Age.

2. The Adamic Age – The Age of Men

The Second Age is from Adam to Noah’s flood, the age when men were the key focus of God’s dealings.

Time Period: Approximately 1700 years in duration.

Key Events: The Second Age began approximately 6000 years ago when God renewed the earth’s surface and its heaven (the earth’s atmosphere). God created life as we know it today in six literal 24-hour days. He created Adam and Eve in His own image (Genesis 1:3-28).

Adam and Eve sinned when Satan tempted them and, as a consequence, the judgement of God’s curse fell upon them and all of their descendants. Thus, sin and death entered the human world (Genesis 3:1-7, Romans 5:12). The wickedness of men multiplied, and some of the fallen angels had ungodly relationships with women.

The Second Age ended approximately 4300 years ago with the destruction of Noah’s world by a global flood, but God saved Noah and his family (Genesis 6, Genesis 7).

3. The Age Of Israel Under The Mosaic Law

The Third Age is from Noah’s flood to Jesus Christ’s First Coming, the age when Israel under the Mosaic Law was the key focus of God’s dealings.

Time Period: Approximately 2300 years in duration.

Key Events: The Third Age began with God’s promise to never flood the earth again. God blessed Noah and his sons and instructed them to be fruitful, multiply and replenish the earth.

God became displeased with men when they built the tower of Babel, a symbol of man’s pride, unity and power. Consequently, God caused disunity and confusion among men by giving them different languages and scattering them across the globe. The descendants of Noah’s sons Shem, Ham and Japheth formed the nations that re-populated the earth.

God called Abraham and made a covenant with him known as the Abrahamic Covenant, a covenant of faith. God promised to make Abraham and his descendants a great and blessed nation, and also to bless all the families (nations) of the earth through the Seed of Abraham, who is Jesus Christ Himself.

God chose the Israelites, who are the descendants of Abraham, as a special people above all peoples in order to fulfil the Abrahamic Covenant. He chose Moses to lead the Israelites out of captivity in Egypt and He made a covenant with them at Mount Sinai called the Mosaic Covenant. It is a conditional covenant based on God’s laws and commandments. The most important commandments in The Mosaic Covenant are the Ten Commandments.

God punished the Israelites for breaking the Mosaic Covenant, and because of their sins and rebellion, God allowed foreign armies to take them captive. The time will come in the future when God will restore the Kingdom of Israel and He will enter into a New Covenant with His chosen people.

The birth of Jesus Christ, who is the Seed of Abraham, was the most important event to occur in this age. The Third Age ended approximately 2000 years ago with the crucifixion of Jesus Christ who died for the sins of the whole world.

4. The Age Of The Church Under God’s Grace

The Fourth Age is from the resurrection of Jesus Christ to His Second Coming, this present age when the Church under God’s Grace is the key focus of God’s dealings.

Time Period: Unknown, but probably not many more than 2000 years in duration.

Key Events: The Fourth Age began with the resurrection of Jesus Christ, which is the most central event in God’s Plan to reconcile all things to God the Father.

In this present Fourth Age, God is preparing His Church, His Bride, who are the called and chosen believers from both Israel and the Gentile nations. Many people claim to know Jesus Christ as their Saviour, but only a few are chosen to be God’s Elect. Many false prophets and false teachers come in Jesus Christ’s name, and they deceive many (Matthew 24:4-5).

There are two important signs to watch out for before this present age comes to an end. Firstly, the true Gospel of the Kingdom of God will be preached in all the world as a witness to all nations. Secondly, the earth will suffer a horrific judgement called the Great Tribulation. It will involve worldwide cataclysmic events and result in the earth’s population being decimated.

The Fourth Age will finally come to an end at the Second Coming of Jesus Christ when Satan is bound and confined to a pit, which will be his prison for a thousand years, to prevent him from deceiving the nations during Christ’s Millennial Kingdom (Revelation 20:1-3).

5. The Millenial Age Of The Kingdom Of God

The Fifth Age is the glorious reign of Jesus Christ on this earth with His resurrected Elect Bride, and the fulfilment of all the promises made to Israel and the Church.

Time Period: Exactly 1000 years in duration.

Key Events: The Fifth Age will begin with the Second Coming of Jesus Christ and the First Resurrection, which is the resurrection of God’s Elect, the Bride of Christ.

The Millennial Kingdom of God will be a glorious thousand-year age when Jesus Christ will rule and reign with His Bride on earth. Christ and His Bride will rule over the mortal fleshly people who survive the Great Tribulation and their descendants born during the Millennial Age.

The Millennial Kingdom of God will be a time of fulfilment of all the promises made to Israel and the Church. It will be a time of great blessings for Israel and all nations, and the whole earth will become like the Garden of Eden and full of the knowledge of the Lord as the waters cover the sea.

The Fifth Age will end with the release of Satan from his prison (Revelation 20:7).

6.The Lake Of Fire Judgement Age

The Sixth Age is the age of judgement and reconciliation of all resurrected unbelievers and all fallen angels.

Time Period: Unknown, but likely to be of a short duration.

Key Events: The Sixth Age will begin with the Second Resurrection when all of mankind, who have lived and died throughout the ages, will be resurrected from the dead with the exception of the Bride of Christ who has already been resurrected in the First Resurrection.

Satan, who will be released from his prison at the end of the Millennial Age (the Fifth Age), will go out and deceive the great multitudes of resurrected unbelievers (the non-elect), represented as Gog and Magog, who rise in the Second Resurrection in their immortal yet still unsaved bodies. Satan will lead these deceived unbelievers in a rebellion against Jesus Christ and His Bride. This rebellion will be easily crushed by God’s devouring fire.



Jesus Christ will deliver the Eternal Kingdom of the New Heaven and the New Earth to God the Father, and Father God Himself will come down to earth to dwell with men. Everyone will enter the Eternal Kingdom of God of the New Heaven and the New Earth where there will be no more death, no more pain, no more sorrow and no more curse, and Father God will be all in all. Thus, Jesus will bring to completion Father God’s Plan of the Ages for the Universal Reconciliation of all things (1 Corinthians 15:24-28, Colossians 1:15-20, Revelation 21:1-6).

God’s one family will ultimately consist of Father God as the head of the family, His Son Jesus Christ as the only begotten Son of God (John 3:18), all of humanity as the adopted sons of God (Romans 8:15, Ephesians 1:5) and all angels as the created sons of God (Job 1:6).

As 1 Corinthians 2:9 says, “Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, nor have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for those who love Him”. We love God because He first loved us, and He loves the whole world.

The earth will become the headquarters and governing planet of the universe in God’s Eternal Kingdom. Jesus Christ will begin the Seventh Age and it will never end, as it will last for eternity. Truly, it will be the glorious Eternal Sabbath Rest from all sin, all ungodliness and all unrighteousness for all of God’s creation.

The important thing to remember is we are near the end of the Church ages last 100 years. Christ can come at any moment during this time. we are currently at the 79-year mark, based on Israel's return to the promised Land in 1944

 

[eleos1954]

Thank you, eleos1954, for pointing out these things to me.

I agree that history is divided into multiple ages or "dispensations" in which God acts with humanity in different ways.

For example, the proverb ‘The parents have eaten sour grapes, and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’

This proverb holds true for now (Ex 34:07), but God says this will not be so in the future (Jer 31:29).

Qoote: Jer 31:30
Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.


BTW I think there were other heaven and earth changing events that I didn't think of. One would be when Moses left Egypt circa 1500 BC, the plagues, the parting of the Red Sea, and large grape clusters (Num 13:23) that took two men to carry were supernatural events, probably involving extraterrestrial objects.

Another time was circa 700 BC when Hezekiah asked for a sign from God, and God made the stairway shadow go back ten steps (2Kings 20:11). Some think this supernatural event has caused the world to slow down from 360 days per year to the present 365 1/4.

And we shouldn't forget Joshua who asked for the sun and moon to stand still (Joshua 10:13) and they did.

Bob..

My point was the use of the word "age" ..... does not define a period of time (start timeframe/end timeframe)

Dispensation is a way of ordering things—an administration, a system, or a management.The dispensation theology is the idea of divine administration of a period of time; each dispensation is a divinely appointed age. This theology was Darby's idea of how things are organized .... not God's.

This is not so .... it's here a little there a little ... precept upon precept ... using His Word as a whole.

Thank you, eleos1954, for pointing out these things to me.

I agree that history is divided into multiple ages or "dispensations" in which God acts with humanity in different ways.

For example, the proverb ‘The parents have eaten sour grapes, and the children’s teeth are set on edge.’

This proverb holds true for now (Ex 34:07), but God says this will not be so in the future (Jer 31:29).

Qoote: Jer 31:30
Instead, everyone will die for their own sin; whoever eats sour grapes—their own teeth will be set on edge.


BTW I think there were other heaven and earth changing events that I didn't think of. One would be when Moses left Egypt circa 1500 BC, the plagues, the parting of the Red Sea, and large grape clusters (Num 13:23) that took two men to carry were supernatural events, probably involving extraterrestrial objects.

Another time was circa 700 BC when Hezekiah asked for a sign from God, and God made the stairway shadow go back ten steps (2Kings 20:11). Some think this supernatural event has caused the world to slow down from 360 days per year to the present 365 1/4.

And we shouldn't forget Joshua who asked for the sun and moon to stand still (Joshua 10:13) and they did.

Bob..

My point was the use of the word "age" ..... does not define a period of time (start timeframe/end timeframe)





This is not so .... it's here a little there a little ... precept upon precept ... using His Word as a whole.





Dispensation is a way of ordering things—an administration, a system, or a management.The dispensation theology is the idea of divine administration of a period of time; each dispensation is a divinely appointed age. This theology was Darby's idea of how things are organized .... not God's.





Dispensationalism/futurism/preterism were/are theological ideas put forth by the jesuits (coming out of the council of Trent) during the counter reformation, to take the focus off the papal system as being the antichrist system (of which all the protestant reformers believed) and their (the jesuits) attempt to destroy protestantism (and they still do this) .... permeates MANY so called "protestant" denominations. Protestants have largely forgotten their roots (being misled) and have accepted various theologies that are in opposition to what the reformation was all about and their revelations of what the bible actually teaches.

The idea of dispensationalism was picked up by Darby from these jesuit teachings.

One can research this online for themselves.

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

Help me to understand then by quoting all scripture...if Darby was wrong prove it with scripture.

Sincerely.

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

P.S. Please don't read tone into my last post. Just an honest request for information that I can reference.

Thanks in advance!

 

[keras]

There are 4 defined ages for mankind on earth.
1/ Adam to Abram - Exactly 2000 years.
2/ Abraham to Jesus - exactly 2000 years.
3/ Jesus' Resurrection to His Return, now: nearly another 2000 years.
4/ the final 1000 years of the benign reign of Jesus and King over the world.

This gives God's decreed time for mankind of 7000 years, as indicated in Genesis by the 7 'days' of Creation.

 

[Bobgf]

There are 4 defined ages for mankind on earth.
1/ Adam to Abram - Exactly 2000 years.
2/ Abraham to Jesus - exactly 2000 years.
3/ Jesus' Resurrection to His Return, now: nearly another 2000 years.
4/ the final 1000 years of the benign reign of Jesus and King over the world.

This gives God's decreed time for mankind of 7000 years, as indicated in Genesis by the 7 'days' of Creation.

keras, where do you stand on God's sworn promise to give the land of Canaan to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Israel for a thousand generations, IOW forever?

Where does that fit in your chronology?


at the mouth of two or three witnesses every word can be established (Deut 19:15)

The two witnesses to God's sworn promise are: 1 Chron 16:15 and Psalm 105:8

He remembers his covenant forever, the word that he commanded to 1,000 generations.


Bob..

 

[keras]

keras, where do you stand on God's sworn promise to give the land of Canaan to Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and Israel for a thousand generations, IOW forever?

Where does that fit in your chronology?

The New Testament makes it clear - we Christians are the Israel of God, Galatians 6:14-16 The descendants of Abraham by faith and also by descent, as everybody on earth today must have some of Abrahams genes. Ephesians 2:11-18, Galatians 3:26-29

Thinking that a group of people in the Middle East, who claim to be Israel, are the only recipients of God's Promises, is wrong and conflicts with many Bible Prophesies.
We will go to and will settle into all of the holy Land soon after the forthcoming Lord's terrible Day of fiery wrath. Deuteronomy 32:34-43, Jeremiah 31:8-9, Psalms 107:103
Many things must take place, but when Jesus Returns and destroys all the ungodly enemies, THEN the Land will be in the possession of the Christian peoples of God; from every tribe, race, nation and language; forever. Revelation 5:9-10

 

[JulieB67]

I believe there are 3 ages -Pre Adamic (angels), the age that were are in presently and there will be another to come with the new heavens and earth.

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

The New Testament makes it clear - we Christians are the Israel of God, Galatians 6:14-16 The descendants of Abraham by faith and also by descent, as everybody on earth today must have some of Abrahams genes. Ephesians 2:11-18, Galatians 3:26-29

Thinking that a group of people in the Middle East, who claim to be Israel, are the only recipients of God's Promises, is wrong and conflicts with many Bible Prophesies.
We will go to and will settle into all of the holy Land soon after the forthcoming Lord's terrible Day of fiery wrath. Deuteronomy 32:34-43, Jeremiah 31:8-9, Psalms 107:103
Many things must take place, but when Jesus Returns and destroys all the ungodly enemies, THEN the Land will be in the possession of the Christian peoples of God; from every tribe, race, nation and language; forever. Revelation 5:9-10

Let's not misuse Bible texts. Galatians 6:14-16 means...

Paul is once more denouncing the false-teaching Judaizers who are attempting to strong-arm the Galatian believers into getting circumcised in order to be truly right with God (Galatians 2:4). Paul has revealed part of their motive: boasting about conversion numbers. In other words, these false teachers are not truly concerned about the people of Galatia or even about serving God. They're trying to earn bragging rights about their salesmanship.

Paul now implies that he could play that game, too, if he was like the Judaizers. After all, he has been instrumental in converting many, many people to faith in Christ. But Paul says clearly that he refuses to do such a thing. He will not boast about what God has accomplished through him. Paul says he will boast in just one thing: the cross of Christ. Everything that Paul has, that anyone in Christ has, is possible only because Jesus died on that cross for our sins to set us free.

It is by the cross of Jesus, Paul says, that the world has been crucified to him and him to the world. In other words, because he has been justified by faith in Christ and what He accomplished on the cross, Paul no longer needs the approval of the world. The world has nothing to offer to him, just as the world, at large, certainly does not want what he has to offer. Because of the cross, Paul is free from all of that while the Judaizers remain enslaved to their sinful worldliness (Galatians 3:23–29).

What does Ephesians 2:11 mean?​

Paul transitions from his discussion of salvation by grace through faith to an explanation of our unity in Christ. Writing to Gentile Christians, he begins by stating that these people are still uncircumcised. This stood in strong contrast to circumcised Jews, who saw that ritual as a necessary sign of membership among God's chosen people. In addition, these non-Jewish believers were often dismissed as "the uncircumcision" by those who held to traditional Judaism. In other words, they were both labelled as outsiders and treated as outsiders. To traditional Judaism, these were people who did not belong to God's family.

Paul's point here is these attitudes were completely manmade. The physical condition of circumcision was something people could do, but it was only a symbol. The spiritual, "true" circumcision was something only God could change. Paul will begin a transition in verse 13 to show that this separation on the basis of circumcision has ended thanks to Jesus. Through Him, all people can believe and become part of God's one united family. These Gentile Christians were no longer excluded but were now family with all of God's people.

What does Ephesians 2:12 mean?​

Paul provides five negative aspects of the lives of his readers prior to knowing Christ:

First, is separation; the relationship and love they now knew in their hearts did not previously exist. Second, they had no connection with the people of God and were considered foreigners by the Jewish people. Third, they were not part of God's promises. God's Old Testament covenants were made with the Jewish people, not the Gentiles. They were left out of these previous arrangements. Fourth, they had "no hope" prior to knowing Christ. Paul uses this phrase in one other place, describing how when believers die the surviving believers do "not grieve as others who have no hope" (1 Thessalonians 4:13). Fifth, they were "without God in the world."

These five traits, along with the conditions mentioned in verse 11, offer a list of reasons which had excluded Paul's readers from God's family prior to salvation. These negatives will be contrasted with God's positive provisions through Jesus, beginning in the next verse.

What does Ephesians 2:13 mean?​

All of the drawbacks described in verses 11 and 12 implied that Paul's Gentile readers had been far from God. In this verse, Paul notes that everything has changed with Jesus. These believers had been "far off," but now they had been "brought near." Their relationship and proximity had changed all because of Christ. As mentioned in prior verses, this change has absolutely nothing to do with human worth, or human effort (Ephesians 2:8–9). It is purely due to the grace of God.

Emphasis is also made regarding the "blood of Christ." Paul mentions this phrase only one other time in 1 Corinthians 10:16, in relation to communion. However, Hebrews includes the phrase in 9:14, noting the blood of Christ can "purify our conscience from dead works to serve the living God." First Peter 1:19 adds that the precious blood of Christ is "like that of a lamb without blemish or spot." Christ's blood is perfect to remove the flaws which have separated us from God, and makes us acceptable to Him.

What does Ephesians 2:14 mean?​

Paul continues to describe how a saving faith in Christ changes our spiritual status. Jesus does not simply give peace; He is peace. It is because of who He is and what He has done on the cross, through the outpouring of His blood (Ephesians 2:13) that we can be at peace with God (Romans 5:1). Through Jesus, both Paul and his readers, Jews and Gentiles, were unified. All people can now become family: equals through the salvation provided in Jesus Christ.

In addition, Paul makes an interesting reference to removing a "dividing wall of hostility." Much debate surrounds the meaning of this phrase. Some have suggested a connection with the wall of the Jewish temple. Others see a reference to the tearing of the temple veil at the crucifixion (Matthew 27:51). However, Paul does not appear to have a physical wall in mind, but rather a personal barrier which previously existed between Jews and Gentiles. This seems to fit best with the context of the passage, which is focused on Gentiles becoming part of the family of God. The use of the wall metaphor is likely a simple reference to the idea of a city wall, which divided those who lived in the city (the citizens) from those outside (the foreigners).

What does Ephesians 2:15 mean?​

The word translated as "abolish" here is the Greek word katargēsas. This literally means "to render inoperative," or "to remove all power from." Paul's intent is to say that the purpose of the Law had been completed. He calls the law good in other places (Romans 7:12; 1 Timothy 1:8), yet his emphasis here is that it no longer separated Jews and Gentiles from one another. Instead, the focus of a believer should be on common salvation, in Jesus, which makes us one family.

Instead of the traditional conflict between Jews and Gentiles, God's intent with the gospel was a family based on Christ rather than law, rooted in salvation rather than circumcision. The result of this change was "peace." Paul would open his letter with peace (Ephesians 1:2), highlight it throughout his letter (Ephesians 2:14, 15, 17; 4:3; 6:15) and end with peace (Ephesians 6:23). He greatly emphasized peace, both as a Jew among Gentiles, and speaking to a city that had long known war and conflict. Peace was greatly desired by many yet found only in the one Lord Jesus Christ.

What does Ephesians 2:16 mean?​

The peace Christ brings to believers includes unity, as members of a single "body" of the church. This unity is interestingly exemplified using a symbol of death: the cross. Though Paul frequently mentions the sacrifice of Jesus in Ephesians, this is the only place the cross is specifically mentioned. He uses it to highlight his next phrase, where he notes that Jesus' crucifixion resulted in the end of the spiritual hostility between Jews and Gentiles. More importantly, it removed the spiritual obstruction between man and God. The connection of "cross" and "kill" is clear. Christ's cross—an instrument of execution—killed these spiritual barriers.

Both Jews and Gentiles were responsible for sending Jesus to the cross. Similarly, both Jews and Gentiles could benefit from the payment Jesus made on the cross. Through Christ, Jew and Gentile had equal access to salvation through faith in Jesus, becoming part of one family of God. Paul would teach in 1 Corinthians 1:18, "For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God." The cross does not make sense to unbelievers, but to the saved it represents God's power to change lives.

What does Ephesians 2:17 mean?​

Jesus is our peace (Ephesians 2:14), and He explicitly preached peace (John 14:27; Matthew 5:9). Notice, too, Paul's reminder that Jesus "came" to earth. He had eternally existed prior to coming to earth (John 1:1–3), yet came to offer peace to all people, Jews and Gentiles. He offered peace both to the "distant" Gentiles, as well as to the "nearby" Jewish nation. Through the apostles and early believers, Jesus offered peace to those in Israel as well as to those "far off" in realms well beyond the Promised Land (Acts 1:8).

God has always been concerned for people beyond just the nation of Israel. Examples from Jonah (God's concern for Nineveh), Daniel (the Babylonians), and Jesus Himself reveal that God's love extends to all who believe in Him. Thanks to the cross of Christ, all people have the same access to God. This message was to be spread to all nations or people groups (Matthew 28:19–20), something already taking place during Paul's ministry to Ephesus and beyond.

What does Ephesians 2:18 mean?​

Paul's emphasis in this verse involves two parts. First, it is clear Paul wants to highlight the common access Jews and Gentiles have to salvation through Jesus. In Romans 1:16 he likewise wrote, "For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek." Paul preached in a particular order, starting with the Jews in a community and then to Gentiles, but the goal was bringing the message of salvation to all people.

Second, Paul again emphasizes the roles of each part of the triune God. All three persons of the Trinity are involved in the process of salvation. Salvation is found in Jesus, who gives us the Spirit to live within us, who grants access to the Father. All three persons operate at the same time in unique ways, yet are all identified as one and the same God.

As the Word of God clearly shows, these passages have nothing to do with us becoming Jews during the 1000 year reign or the everlasting kingdom.

If you disagree please state your sources and their meanings.

Thanks in advance!

 

[keras]

Let's not misuse Bible texts. Galatians 6:14-16 means...

....exactly what it says.
Any attempts to make it mean that Christians are not the Israelites of God, is a contradiction of the entire Plan of God. Which is to obtain for Himself a group of people who have freely chosen to believe in Him and to keep His Commandments.

They are people from every tribe, race, nation and language, as per Ephesians 2:11-18, and they will be Christs priests and His co-rulers. Revelation 5:9-10

As the Word of God clearly shows, these passages have nothing to do with us becoming Jews during the 1000 year reign or the everlasting kingdom.

No one becomes a Jew., spiritually, or impossibly: physically. That is shockingly bad false teaching.
Those who claim the belong to the House of Judah, face Judgment and punishment as Prophesied. Zephaniah 1:14-18, Isaiah 22:14, +
Only a remnant will survive. Isaiah 6:11-13, Romans 9:27

We Christians do not become Israelites, we are already the Overcomers for God; literally His true faithful people and we see them in Daniel 7:25 and Revelation 13:7, during our final test.

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

Just wanted to make sure that's what you we trying to say.

 

[Bobgf]

The New Testament makes it clear - we Christians are the Israel of God, Galatians 6:14-16 The descendants of Abraham by faith and also by descent, as everybody on earth today must have some of Abrahams genes. Ephesians 2:11-18, Galatians 3:26-29

Thinking that a group of people in the Middle East, who claim to be Israel, are the only recipients of God's Promises, is wrong and conflicts with many Bible Prophesies.
We will go to and will settle into all of the holy Land soon after the forthcoming Lord's terrible Day of fiery wrath. Deuteronomy 32:34-43, Jeremiah 31:8-9, Psalms 107:103
Many things must take place, but when Jesus Returns and destroys all the ungodly enemies, THEN the Land will be in the possession of the Christian peoples of God; from every tribe, race, nation and language; forever. Revelation 5:9-10

Well we must be careful in what we teach, James 3:1
Not many of you should become teachers, my fellow believers,
because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly.


keras, you referenced Deut 32:35-43 to show God's vengeance on Israel.
Here's what Deut 32:35-43 ends with; Deut 32:43 abridged:
Rejoice, O Gentiles, with His people...
He will provide atonement for His land and His people.


Galatians is refiring to Christians, spiritual Israel, a special called out people of God
After the fullness of the Gentiles has come in (Rom 11:25),
Then Jesus will return and work from Zion on redeeming earthly Israel (Act 15:14-16)

Romans 11:25-27
For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in.
And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written:
“The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;
For this is My covenant with them, When I take away their sins.”

Acts 15:14-16
God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles...
“After this I will return and rebuild David’s fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild, and I will restore it.



BOTTOM LINE

The two witnesses: 1 Chronicles 16:14-18 and Psalm 105:7-11

God's sworn promise to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and Israel is still in force.
They will possess the land of Canaan forever (ie until the sun and moon are no more).


7 He is the Lord our God; his judgments are in all the earth.

8 He remembers his covenant forever, the promise he made, for a thousand generations,

9 the covenant he made with Abraham, the oath he swore to Isaac.

10 He confirmed it to Jacob as a decree, to Israel as an everlasting covenant:

11 “To you I will give the land of Canaan as the portion you will inherit.”


So in saying Jesus is coming quickly (Rev 22:20) that fits in nicely here.
Two thousand years is a short time relative to the kingdom age of a thousand generations.


Bob..

 

[parousia70]

How many ages are there?

The Bibe Speaks of only two ages. "This age" and "the age to come".

Biblically, those are the only ages ever defined in scripture.

Extra biblical traditional definitions and speculations of multiple ages abound, as evidenced by this thread, but Biblically (if that matters to anyone), there are only 2 ages.

“Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God.

Isn't this what we currently enjoy?
What part of this is NOT a present reality?

Let's see.
1) The tabernacle of God is with men today - 1 Corinthians 6:19-20, Check.
2) God dwells with us today - 1 Corinthians 3:16, Check
3) We are God's People today - 1 Peter 2:10, Check
4) God Himself is with us today - Matthew 18:20, Check
5) God is our God today - Hebrews 12:29, Check

Yep. EVERY aspect of this is a present, fulfilled reality.

 

[keras]

keras, you referenced Deut 32:35-43 to show God's vengeance on Israel.
Here's what Deut 32:35-43 ends with; Deut 32:43 abridged:
Rejoice, O Gentiles, with His people...
He will provide atonement for His land and His people.

We know what is God's Land, as given to Abraham; Genesis 15:18 No one people has occupied all of it as yet.
But who exactly are His people? Are they those mixed race peoples who call themselves Israelis, living in a small part of that Land?

Or are they those people from every tribe race nation and language, who believe in God and have accepted His Son as their Redeemer now?
True faithful Christian peoples, the people Jesus came to save, His flock, as John 10:1-27 tells us.

Jesus came to save the House of Israel; Matthew 15:24. The House of Judah has a quite different future and nowhere does the Bible teach they will be saved and redeemed, excepting for a small remnant, who have to be Christians now.

To you I will give the land of Canaan as the portion you will inherit.”

We know who will inherit the holy Land: Psalms 37:28, Romans 9:24-25, Jeremiah 25:3-4, Isaiah 57:13b
And who will not: Matthew 8:12

 

[Bobgf]

Isn't this what we currently enjoy?
What part of this is NOT a present reality?

This is a reality for the church but not yet for all of mankind.

Jesus came to save the House of Israel; Matthew 15:24. The House of Judah has a quite different future and nowhere does the Bible teach they will be saved and redeemed, excepting for a small remnant, who have to be Christians now.

Oh my! You only need to do a little bible search for "house of Judah" to see the many references that show the Jews will first be chastised and punished for their wickedness, but afterwards they will again become "my people", that is a people belonging to God.

 

[keras]

Oh my! You only need to do a little bible search for "house of Judah" to see the many references that show the Jews will first be chastised and punished for their wickedness, but afterwards they will again become "my people", that is a people belonging to God.

This is the sort of punishment that God has in mind: Isaiah 22:14 and many other Prophesies that confirm that only a remnant will survive.

However, you have your own beliefs about God's Plans for the Church and Israel. Genuine Bible searching reveals that the House of Israel are God's faithful people,. from every tribe, race, nation and language.
The House of Judah faces punishment and removal from the holy Land. Matthew 8:12

 

[Soul_Tsunami]

The weakness of Judah now appeared more than ever. Now also they discovered their carnal confidence and their carnal security. They looked to the fortifications. They made sure of water for the city. But they were regardless of God in all these preparations. They did not care for his glory in what they did. They did not depend upon him for a blessing in their endeavors. For every creature is to us what God makes it to be, and we must bless him for it, and use it for him. There was great contempt for God's wrath and justice, in contending with them. God's design was to humble them and bring them to repentance. They walked contrary to this. Actual disbelief of another life after this is at the bottom of the carnal security and brutish sensuality, which are the sin, the shame, and the ruin of so great a part of mankind. God was displeased at this. It is a sin against the remedy, and it is not likely they should ever repent of it. Whether this unbelief works by presumption or despair, it produces the same contempt of God and is a token that a man will perish wilfully.

I believe this is in reference to the unpardonable sin...which in my understanding is the denial of the free gift.