As to not derail another thread - Escalating Porn Use?

[DZoolander]

There's an argument made here reasonably often that porn usage escalates over time - in the type of porn being viewed. By that I mean - that someone may start out viewing something within the realm of "normal" - but over time that becomes insufficient to achieve it's goal - so they start looking for more and more hardcore (depraved) stuff. In a sense it's kind of like the arguments people have made in the past about drugs...like "eventually pot won't be enough, so you'll move on to coke...which will eventually not be enough...and soon enough you'll find yourself shooting up heroin in a back alley"

Mostly to the guys, is that really your experience? That what started out as just a normal interest and curiosity in sex eventually led you to someplace where you were watching obese midgets perform bestiality? lol

I ask because it's so foreign to my experience. I'm 47 years old - and for the majority of my life I had very little moral qualms about porn. It was simply something there. It achieved an end. My first exposure to it was finding a magazine when I was a little kid (and incidentally bringing it home to show my mom - hahaha - "what's this??"). From there I got a little older, began puberty, and took an interest in whatever magazines I could come across.

I remember SelecTV and it's scrambled stations - and spending late nights on Fri/Sat trying to fine-tune the UHF dial to find the sweet spot where I could eventually see an unscrambled boob. I remember when I moved out of the house and was old enough to buy a magazine myself. I remember my first g/f finding my stash of magazines. I remember when there were BBSes where you could spend a half hour downloading a single GIF. I remember when speeds increased and you could get stuff more easily.

Years and years of evolvement...and ya know...there wasn't a marked difference between what I wanted/hoped to see while trying to fine tune the UHF dial and what eventually became easily accessible. I found that I had fairly specific tastes in women, things that appealed to me, etc...all of which fell within the realm of what 99.9% of society would consider to be normal heterosexual relations. There really is no marked difference, and over a span of nearly 36-37 years, I can't say I've ever had the slightest interest in any depraved stuff.

So this whole "you become desensitized and need something crazier to get your fix" argument just seems foreign to me. It doesn't ring true.

I suppose this is mostly to the guys - but simply put - has your experience been different? Did your interests start out as normal - but turn into something that made you ashamed to look at yourself in the mirror over time?

 

[OK Jeff]

An addictive person will do as described. They do it with alcohol, drugs, porn, name it. It’s about dopamine in the mind and they crave it (whatever “it” is) and it takes more and more to get that “high”. The addictive person’s mind will go places he/she never thought possible in time. Some are not as susceptible as others.

 

[DZoolander]

That could be partly it. I've never had much of an addictive personality type. When I was a kid I went through a party phase. Everyone talks about how drugs can be addictive - but even though I had certain ones I enjoyed - truth is I could take it or leave it. When the party was over, the party was over, and there wasn't really a temptation to look back.

The only thing that gave me issues walking away from/addiction I ever had was probably nicotine.

 

[sdmsanjose]

So this whole "you become desensitized and need something crazier to get your fix" argument just seems foreign to me. It doesn't ring true.

I suppose this is mostly to the guys - but simply put - has your experience been different? Did your interests start out as normal - but turn into something that made you ashamed to look at yourself in the mirror over time?

I have seen porn in the past ( after my age of 35) but it never changed my preferences about sex or to need something crazier. It just increased my desire for my type of sex. I like sex with the opposite sex and without any bizarre or real extreme exotic sex.

So EZ, my guess is that we have had somewhat the same experience with porn and it promoting crazier sex stuff.…However; I do think that in some people porn can be progressive and in some cases lead to real trouble. Below is a portion of an article from Psychology Today that points out three potential troubles:

What Porn Does to Intimacy
3 studies find that explicit material can do more harm than most people think.
Posted Jul 16, 2014

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/tech-support/201407/what-porn-does-intimacy


1. Porn-free relationships are stronger, with a lower rate of infidelity.
That’s what Amanda Maddox and her colleagues found in a study of men and women, ages 18 to 34, who were in romantic relationships



2. Watching porn diminishes relationship commitment.
What these researchers discovered is that watching porn reminds you of all the potential sexual partners out there, which in turn lowers your dedication to the person you’re actually involved with.


3. The fantasy alternative leads to real-world cheating.
In another study, Andrea Mariea Gwinn, Nathaniel Lambert, and others further explored the nature of the other alternatives imaginatively offered up by pornography. They suggested two possibilities: First, that seeing physically attractive and sexually available partners on screen may heighten a person’s perceptions of his own possible partners. And second, that porn may make the idea of multiple sexual partners more appealing.

Agree or disagree?

 

[DZoolander]

Not quite sure, actually, whether I agree or disagree with those things. Mostly it's because to an extent they feel incomplete to me - and leave a lot of room for people to insert their own perspectives on the causality.

What I mean is...

1. Porn-free relationships are stronger, with a lower rate of infidelity.
That’s what Amanda Maddox and her colleagues found in a study of men and women, ages 18 to 34, who were in romantic relationships

How exactly is "strength" measured here? Is it the lower rate of infidelity? Are there other things that factor in? Like, most people I know that are completely and honestly "porn free" are the more religious people. Are they more faithful because absent of porn, they focus more on each other? Or are they more faithful because their faith has conditioned them to be out of fear of sinning?

2. Watching porn diminishes relationship commitment.
What these researchers discovered is that watching porn reminds you of all the potential sexual partners out there, which in turn lowers your dedication to the person you’re actually involved with.

I dunno. Does porn actually do that? I mean, I walk around in every day life and I see women all over the place. They're half the population and all. Quite a few of them are attractive as well. They're all capable of sex. lol It isn't like I live in my home 24 hours a day staring at my wife - circumstantially being conditioned to believe she's the only woman out there.

In a long term relationship, I think that commitment is a decision you consciously make. It doesn't just happen upon you by circumstance. That decision frames the context with which you view the world and other people. You either have decided to be faithful and not actively pursue other people, or you haven't. I don't know how porn would bear upon that with other people, but I know for me it would have little bearing on that.

The more important factor in whether or not I'd make that decision is how she treats me, and how I in turn treat her. The acknowledgement of other people existing wouldn't play any real part in that.


3. The fantasy alternative leads to real-world cheating.
In another study, Andrea Mariea Gwinn, Nathaniel Lambert, and others further explored the nature of the other alternatives imaginatively offered up by pornography. They suggested two possibilities: First, that seeing physically attractive and sexually available partners on screen may heighten a person’s perceptions of his own possible partners. And second, that porn may make the idea of multiple sexual partners more appealing.

This kind of goes hand in hand with the above.

My point of view on porn is that it's the lazy man's tool for masturbation. He's turned on, bored, or whatever...and he decides to have a go at himself. He wants some visual cues to assist in the process, and there you go. 15 minutes later he's likely forgotten about the whole episode and it's time to go about his day. At least for me, that's everything in a nutshell.

Never once did I ever see something and go "Wow, now that's what I'm missing. My eyes have been opened. This whole monogamous relationship thing isn't for me - what I really want are two women. That's what I've been missing."

Could it happen with other people? I suppose - lol - but I'm not usually given to speculating on what might happen with hypothetical people. I just know how I react to things, and how I perceive others I know have reacted to things. I've had my share of friends - and I can 100% guarantee you there was quite a bit of porn consumption going on - and I've never seen situations evolve that way.

So - dunno.

Have you ever seen that movie "Someone Like You" - where they comedically put forth this idea called "Old Cow, New Cow"? Basically it's this argument that men can't be faithful because what's new becomes old, and they'll always want something new. Reading these arguments about porn always kinda strikes me as the same type of thing. They're always built on these premises that assume the most base and simple minded explanations of human behavior. I think people are far more complex than that.

 

[evoeth]

Mostly to the guys, is that really your experience? That what started out as just a normal interest and curiosity in sex eventually led you to someplace where you were watching obese midgets perform bestiality? lol

Nope.

Porn was rampant in our (coed) dorms in college too. Complete with group viewing, mostly for the comedy value. You know what? Those people grew up and got married. Doctors, lawyers, teachers, professors. They're OK.

Frankly, I think that moral concern about pornography, homosexuality, sexuality in general is a preoccupation of the lower classes. I can't think of a person in my social group who cares.

 

[Observer]

Everyone is different. Some people will escalate and some won't. It's like anything else... take gambling, for example. Some people can ay slot machines twice a year and walk out after spending 10 dollars and not think about it much more. Some people can go every day and still only play 10 dollars. Others get in there and spend their life savings in a month.

 

[Motherofkittens]

Females in Western countries like watching porn almost as much as males and their usage is increasing each year. As for your question I think for most people, their experience is much like yours.

However it is complicated and not as yet well understood. Especially when it comes to younger and/or first time experiencers. It is possible for a young boy or girl to get an "abnormal fetish " because of watching porn and/or seeing that talked about and/or acted on in some form of capacity in their social setting.

What I am trying to get at is that some porn is harmless while others are definitely not. But I don't think a mature person, or at least most will go from typical porn to abnormal because of watching the typical porn.

 

[RDKirk]

Females in Western countries like watching porn almost as much as males and their usage is increasing each year. As for your question I think for most people, their experience is much like yours.

However it is complicated and not as yet well understood. Especially when it comes to younger and/or first time experiencers. It is possible for a young boy or girl to get an "abnormal fetish " because of watching porn and/or seeing that talked about and/or acted on in some form of capacity in their social setting.

What I am trying to get at is that some porn is harmless while others are definitely not. But I don't think a mature person, or at least most will go from typical porn to abnormal because of watching the typical porn.

I think this bothers me more. My first exposure to actual pornographic sexual intercourse in was long after I'd already started getting to know girls--heck not that long before I actually got married. But long after I'd learned what realistic relationships with women were.

The high school boys I lead at church have been watching the hardest of pornography since they were in late grade school...before they'd even begun engaging with girls as friends. They don't know what "reality" with women is, and a lot of them expect the kind of instant sex hookup they see in a pornographic flick to be representative of what a successful adult first date should be.

I can tell them, "regular women are not that way in real life," but it's like every other movie they watch...they're not sure who is telling them the whole truth.

 

[DZoolander]

Yeah, kids are exposed to things quicker than I was when I was young.

I mean, that first exposure to porn that I mention when I found a magazine. It wasn't a playboy or something like that. Nah, it was a hardcore porn magazine. Full on sex pictures, etc. And I was probably about 8 years old when I found it.

But, maybe that was a good thing, because I had no clue what I was looking at...whereas say I had been 13-14 and found it, maybe I would have processed it differently. But, as it was, I found the magazine, had no idea what I was looking at, so I took it home and laid it out on the dining room table.

"Hey mom, what's this?" lol

"Where did you find this?????"

"In the wash" (our house was close to a river)

"You do NOT go down there again." (then she took it away and probably burned it. haha)

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

My response is going to be blunt so if anyone is squemish about certain words or ideas, probably best not to read. I'm just being honest.

Yes, its totally true. While I won't talk about what things I looked at as time went on, it is like a high. You get less high off of what you have looked at so long so you find a new type of porn to get high from. And it can take you to some deep places. Thankfully I stopped going down some very dark and deep tunnels that would have lead to things that are beyond dark. I think its because the Holy Spirit was just strong enough that I had a sense of right or wrong. I realize that sounds stupid given the fact porn in any fashion is wrong. But there are some thresholds that you have enough strength (not of ourselves) to say "Nope, I'm not looking at that!". I am about 98% free of porn. I've stopped the "dark" stuff long ago thank God.

Now its just a matter of letting God and the Holy Spirit giving me the power to say no. And most of the time I can do it. Though I also have special setups on my computer that stop me from looking or even being tempted. And I know my weakness that always triggers things.... being overly tired, even more so when alone. As in I haven't slept for like 30+ hours.

I'm not excited that I am only 98% free. 2% is still 2% to much in my mind. To be very blunt, now that my wife has become more open to foreplay, its really helped me. I struggled alot with that before because sex was just a quick thing that was done with no real fun to it. Though it also helps when you accept sex isn't the more important thing in marriage.

To many look down at porn users as if they are scummy christians but we all have sins. And in many ways we all have addictions. Maybe drinking, maybe social media, maybe money. Not a single one of us is good the bible says. Its why more people need to help each other out so we can get rid of these issues we have. Not that we always will be able to. Some things people struggle with forever. My dad for example used to have a bad porn addiction before he met my mom (well he wans't saved at the time). After his "parts" stopped working because of surgery, I noticed he started looking up dirty things on youtube. Satan waits for little cracks so he can come back in and get you to sin again.

As for how it starts, it seems often before computers came about that it started because of magazines. For me I loved national geographic. But when I hit puberty I started thinking of tribal women (often naked/topless) in dirty ways. I was young and immature, now obviously I don't see half naked tribal women as anything sexual, they are just people who live that way. Just as some panic about a woman breastfeeding, I see no big deal about it. I mean I do feel you should cover up at least a bit in public, but if you don't I'm not going to say anything.

As for depraved stuff, it depends on what you find as depraved. For example I've met some people who find porn involving... "bodily functions" depraved. Where as others will look at anything and consider something like child porn or necrophilia depraved. For me alot of porn is depraved. With those last two things being at the top of the list for depraved.

Then again as I said near the top, some people can stop themselves from looking at things better than others. So it just depends on the person. And more so if they are christian. My ex-atheist friends parents were into... well... things with their pets. Or at least he says they were. Obviously he could ahve been lying. But it really made me feel sick.

As someone else said above, I never really let the things I looked at make me feel I needed them when it came to real life sex. Though from what I have seen alot of couples have very basic... desires when it comes to sex. Outfits for example. Which I think is fine, not my thing really. I'm fine with basic sex.

Whats sad about porn is that like 90% of christian men have seen it/still look and something like 65% of christian women do too. But I'd say 99% of christians don't talk about the issue because of the shame involved. Heck, we talk about it on this forum but in person I think most of us would probably be silent.

Not quite sure, actually, whether I agree or disagree with those things. Mostly it's because to an extent they feel incomplete to me - and leave a lot of room for people to insert their own perspectives on the causality.

What I mean is...

1. Porn-free relationships are stronger, with a lower rate of infidelity.
That’s what Amanda Maddox and her colleagues found in a study of men and women, ages 18 to 34, who were in romantic relationships

How exactly is "strength" measured here? Is it the lower rate of infidelity? Are there other things that factor in? Like, most people I know that are completely and honestly "porn free" are the more religious people. Are they more faithful because absent of porn, they focus more on each other? Or are they more faithful because their faith has conditioned them to be out of fear of sinning?

2. Watching porn diminishes relationship commitment.
What these researchers discovered is that watching porn reminds you of all the potential sexual partners out there, which in turn lowers your dedication to the person you’re actually involved with.

I dunno. Does porn actually do that? I mean, I walk around in every day life and I see women all over the place. They're half the population and all. Quite a few of them are attractive as well. They're all capable of sex. lol It isn't like I live in my home 24 hours a day staring at my wife - circumstantially being conditioned to believe she's the only woman out there.

In a long term relationship, I think that commitment is a decision you consciously make. It doesn't just happen upon you by circumstance. That decision frames the context with which you view the world and other people. You either have decided to be faithful and not actively pursue other people, or you haven't. I don't know how porn would bear upon that with other people, but I know for me it would have little bearing on that.

The more important factor in whether or not I'd make that decision is how she treats me, and how I in turn treat her. The acknowledgement of other people existing wouldn't play any real part in that.


3. The fantasy alternative leads to real-world cheating.
In another study, Andrea Mariea Gwinn, Nathaniel Lambert, and others further explored the nature of the other alternatives imaginatively offered up by pornography. They suggested two possibilities: First, that seeing physically attractive and sexually available partners on screen may heighten a person’s perceptions of his own possible partners. And second, that porn may make the idea of multiple sexual partners more appealing.

This kind of goes hand in hand with the above.

My point of view on porn is that it's the lazy man's tool for masturbation. He's turned on, bored, or whatever...and he decides to have a go at himself. He wants some visual cues to assist in the process, and there you go. 15 minutes later he's likely forgotten about the whole episode and it's time to go about his day. At least for me, that's everything in a nutshell.

I'd say its just a mixed thing when it comes to those three things. But since its a topic people don't talk about to much, maybe that is common stuff. I do know of many times where a spouse left because the other spouse just couldn't stop looking at porn. Though they didn't realize just like drugs, its not an easy habit to kick. You may know its bad, but when something pops up on your screen you are like "Oh man, maybe just on quick look!". Then a minute later it turns into "Hmm, maybe another look!". Then a minute later you feel good inside and decide to do the "deed". You realize your past the line of no return. However thats not really true. Stopping at any point is still better then fully following through with it all.

I have never wanted any fantasy to come into my real world sex life. I also never understood the idea of cheating. If sex is that addicting that I need fantasy and would find someone to do that with, then I have way deeper issues and don't understand what sex in marriage is. As for relationship commitment, I find porn if anything makes you want to commit more to your marriage/relationship because you feel thats more important then porn. Not that you should start looking at porn so you commit better lol.

As for porn free marriages, eh. If your marriage is porn free then there will always be something else that will get in the way anyways. Marriage is hard and a ton of work. Issues will occur regardless if there is no porn in the way.

 

[DZoolander]

One thing that kind of caught my eye in your post...

You get less high off of what you have looked at so long so you find a new type of porn to get high from.

When you say that - are you talking about the natural tendency to get bored of what you've seen a few times and the desire to see something different...or that you're looking for an entirely new TYPE of porn to view in order to get that "high"?

The distinction I'm drawing is... Say you've got a video. You've seen that video like 10 times now. You know what happens. Odds are, you're gonna want to see a different video because that video is starting to become boring to you.

But - that's not the same as...

"I'm bored of seeing man/woman in positions x, y and z altogether. What I need to see is some animals thrown into the mix. I'd like to see a donkey."

lol

When you say that someone needs something "new to get that high from" - are you referring to the scenario I painted where you're just looking for more of the same type of stuff that you just haven't seen before...or are you talking about the "progressing toward wanting to see a donkey in the mix"?

 

[NothingIsImpossible]

A combination of both really. Or at least I seen bordem and wanting to see something new as the same thing. Or if its easier I can just say you have a new fetish you want to get into. Maybe you start with just seeing women naked. Then you want to see sex. Then you want to see multiple people having sex. Then maybe you move on to something else in a new direction like looking for redheads or nudists...etc.

One problem I find to be common with any porn is once someone marries, they have a hard time being excited after awhile with their wife because they are so used to seeing something new that they tend to go back to porn. Or even look at porn before having sex just to get excited.

If I could I would go back in time and tell myself stay away from porn. I may be much better now but it still left damage. Of course I think about other addictions like drugs or drinking and realize they have even worse side effects. Heck, I'd rather have an addiction to selfies. It doesn't have to many side effects other than people thinking your vain.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

I think it depends on the person as to whether or not their porn use escalates.

I think my porn use started around a time when I had great frustration with women. That has resolved some so for me, my use has actually become less frequent and hasn't escalated in type. That said, many things depicted is not something has any place in a sexual relationship with anyone I care about.

Perhaps one thing to keep in mind like with any media is that what is depicted is not reality.

 

[PreviouslySeeking...]

Porn is a tool for most people. Once they figure out what they like, they have the right tool for the job & they are set. It is something they control. A minority have an issue with addiction and porn becomes less a tool and more a habit. For those folks, usage tends to spiral over time.

I'm a woman. I don't view porn as inherently dangerous. I didn't really view porn until I was an adult in a committed relationship. It didn't shape my sexual interests or affect my relationships. I've never lost a relationship to porn usage. Honestly, at my age a lot of my married friends view it occasionally as a couple and infrequently when solo.

 

[RDKirk]

Yeah, kids are exposed to things quicker than I was when I was young.

I mean, that first exposure to porn that I mention when I found a magazine. It wasn't a playboy or something like that. Nah, it was a hardcore porn magazine. Full on sex pictures, etc. And I was probably about 8 years old when I found it.

But, maybe that was a good thing, because I had no clue what I was looking at...whereas say I had been 13-14 and found it, maybe I would have processed it differently. But, as it was, I found the magazine, had no idea what I was looking at, so I took it home and laid it out on the dining room table.

"Hey mom, what's this?" lol

"Where did you find this?????"

"In the wash" (our house was close to a river)

"You do NOT go down there again." (then she took it away and probably burned it. haha)

Even then, hardcore pictures are not quite the same as hardcore video.

And a lot of hardcore video.

Years of hardcore video, before a boy even has a first date with a girl.

And more hardcore than what was hardcore years ago.

 

[HerCrazierHalf]

Even then, hardcore pictures are not quite the same as hardcore video.

And a lot of hardcore video.

Years of hardcore video, before a boy even has a first date with a girl.

And more hardcore than what was hardcore years ago.

And like violence on TV, teaching that these depictions don't reflect reality are key.

I grew up watching a cartoon skunk regularly sexually harass a cat, a Martian making terroristic threats, and many many assualt and battery for comedic relief. And those were children's shows.

 

[RDKirk]

And like violence on TV, teaching that these depictions don't reflect reality are key.

I addressed that earlier.

The first time my daughter fired a handgun, she looked back at me and declared, "Television lies!"

The fact that she knew, intellectually, that guns had significant recoil did not automatically dismiss the possibility that people really could run and gun without any apparent note of recoil.

I talk to young boys about different facts of life very frequently, and they do usually believe what they see consistently in the media to some extent more than what some old man tells them is the real truth.