MArtial arts has no place in a holy Spirit filled life

[Messy]

So, does anyone have an answer to this question?

To scare them off?

 

[hislegacy]

To scare them off?

First thank you for actually answering the question.

I guess that might be a possibility, but that is just as much a possibility as the swords were for self defense.

 

[Alithis]

So, does anyone have an answer to this question?

.. the question in no way,no mater what answer is given can justify submitting ones self to the doctrines and practices of eastern which is foundation and origin of martial arts .
or bowing the head and the knee to them .
we cannot serve two master .
i know some defend their "right" but that is a worldly attitude not an attitude of walking in the Holy Spirit .

The lord knows the number of the hairs of our head. He also has numbered our days ..do you think we can outwit the lord with a fancy chop to the neck and increase the number of our days? .. that is to trust in the arm of the flesh and not in God .
if the lord was speaking of self defense in that verse - then why did not the early church in the book of acts take up swords and defend themselves against Saul and his cohorts who were arresting them and having them imprisoned put to death ? simple -,because they were full of the Holy ghost and the love of God and considered it a privilege to suffer as our lord Suffered .
submit it to the lord Jesus in prayer ..ask him with an honest heart -things which are not of the lord open the way for wrongful spirits to enter ones life and home .. you can close that door by the power and the authority of the Lord Jesus .but first we must stop giving it permission by bowing to it .

 

[Alithis]

to any one -
and as iv said before ..if bowing at the door and bowing when kneeling on the floor after emptying ones mind (more eastern founded meditation which has no part in a Holy Spirit filled life ) is not an act of giving worth(to worship ..to attribute as worth our time and effort ,to value ) to another other then God .. then next time your at you dojo .. don't do it . stand up straight when you walk in the door .. and when your kneeling with the class and they ,in unison , bow the head to the floor ..don't you do it .. you sit with your back as straight as an arrow unto Jesus .

. after all that will be no problem .. you are a born again Christian are you not ?.. you will not ever dream of bowing to another in any shape or form what so ever ..nor will you ever compromise your faith . you read the story of Daniel, how he refused to bow the knee to ANYONE but the one true living God .. you sang the songs on Sunday .."i will give you all my worship (worth).." you told yourself your not like those folks that compromise ,you've always pictured yourself as one who will never bow to anything or anyone other then the lord Jesus ..he is your LORD ..

now is your chance to prove it - after all ,get riled up, you have been duped, here you are doing that one thing you always said as a disciple of Jesus you would never do .. and yet there you are ,duped into believing the carnal reasoning and buying the excuses .. and there you ,are presenting your body as an instrument of discipline unto an eastern pagan practice religion and philosophy .. and you kneel on your knees and bow your head to the floor in full submission to another that is not the Lord Jesus ..

so prove that is not you .. do not bow ..

If you think i challenge you to a difficult thing .. i don't .

I did this very thing ..did not bow ,sat with my back straight up- it did not go well ..i quit soon after and renounced the practice in order to give the lord Jesus more worth(worship) in my life .
maybe it will go better for you .. maybe it will be your opportunity to testify to the entire class of the truth of the lord Jesus and they will all repent and stop bowing .wouldn't that be wonderful -after all you tell yourself your there as an -outreach- ?
it is sad that in truth it is the devil reaching out to draw people away from god .. far more then the deception we tel ourselves .. - ask any one who attends ..do any say "ouhh i come to this class to learn more about Christianity and Jesus " .. no one ever said it did they . not surprising ,its not what they have come there for is why .

 

[Boidae]

I guess the real question is, will God always keep us from harm even when it involves someone else's free will to harm us.

Back when I was a teenager is jumped by six other teenagers, one wielding a baseball bat. I guess I could have let them beat me to a bloody pulp, but I chose to defend myself. I went after the kid with the bat first add I needed to even up the odds some. By the end either they were running away or on the ground sobbing. Me, I just got a couple bruises.

I will continue to tell my kids that they aren't to ever start a fight, however they can defend themselves to keep from injury. That lesson will not change as I know what it's like to get a beating from being bullied. I will not allow my kids to know what that feels like a we cannot control another person's free will, nor do I believe God does either.

 

[probinson]

To scare them off?

My belief on why Jesus told His disciples to carry a sword;

Jesus made it clear that he laid down his life of his own accord. No one took it from Him. So I believe that he wanted to the disciples to be armed so that it was very clear that even though they had the means to fight back, Jesus chose to give up His life.

It's always been interesting to me that Jesus told His disciples to take a sword, but when they went to use those swords, He admonished them. People are quick to point out that Jesus said to take a sword as if this is an endorsement of carrying weapons to defend yourself, but they forget to mention that Jesus scolded Peter for using the sword He told him to take.

Any way, that's my belief. I don't believe Jesus was advocating carrying weapons with that scripture. I believe that He wanted to make it abundantly clear that even though they had the physical means to fight back, He gave up His life freely. Otherwise people may have wrongly concluded that He was captured against His will.

 

[hislegacy]

I guess the real question is, will God always keep us from harm even when it involves someone else's free will to harm us.

Back when I was a teenager is jumped by six other teenagers, one wielding a baseball bat. I guess I could have let them beat me to a bloody pulp, but I chose to defend myself. I went after the kid with the bat first add I needed to even up the odds some. By the end either they were running away or on the ground sobbing. Me, I just got a couple bruises.

I will continue to tell my kids that they aren't to ever start a fight, however they can defend themselves to keep from injury. That lesson will not change as I know what it's like to get a beating from being bullied. I will not allow my kids to know what that feels like a we cannot control another person's free will, nor do I believe God does either.

Amen!

I would gladly pay my life down for my faith. If offered physical death or renouncing my faith, my faith will stay in line.

However, if I am attacked I can and will defend myself.

Isa 1:17. God commands us to defend the fatherless

2 Chron 11:5 Rehoboam built cities for defense.

Throughout the centuries, including the first church that warriors,. Soldiers and mighty men of valor took up arms to defend themselves, the weak and their faith.

These broad brush assertions disparage and disgrace their love of God and faith. This broad approach, to sustain its validity has to ignore the ministers of the Gospel and the fruit of their ministries. It is just not a sustainable position.

Couple that with the author of the arrival having no credibility make it a religious sounding, but unsubstantiated claim.

 

[Frogster]

Just one quickie here..

Abraham slaughtered alot of people, he had sword and weapons, and David beyond a stone weapon with a giant, killed thousands, and God approved of these actions. In fact, after the killings, Abe was blessed!


Heb7:1 For this Melchisedec, king of Salem, priest of the most high God, who met Abraham returning from the slaughter of the kings, and blessed him;


1 Samuel 29:5
Is not this David, of whom they sang one to another in dances, saying, Saul slew his thousands, and David his ten thousands?

Slew is a violent uncontrolled action in the dictionary..ouch!

 

[Alithis]

two simple things .. the topic is "martial arts has no place in the SPIRIT FILLED LIFE ..

if a person attacks you .. you will raise your arms to defend yourself . big deal .pat your selves on the back .. who doesn't do that when punched at ?its not the topic

that has nothing to do with submitting ones self to the religions and philosophies which have their roots in the spirit of THIS world .in this particular topic ..the eastern martial arts . instead of submitting the topic in our hearts to the lord Jesus (lord being the operative word) are we to belligerently defy the spirit of the matter ? how is that the actions of one walking in harmony to the will of the Holy Spirit within a person who claims to be filled with the Holy Spirit ? -it isn't .

also just because through the centuries certain people did certain things . when did the actions of a few over ride the word of God ? it doesn't - not ever .that's just a weak attempt at self justification.
the Romans catholic church at certain times put to death people who would not submit to rome.. does that some how make it right to do so now ? of course not ..that would be basing the justification for our actions on the wrongful actions of mankind in the past .. not on the Word of God .where does the word of god say ..be ye followers of people who walked in the flesh ?

so please .. go ahead and show ..from the word of God what rightful godly part the "martial arts" have in the life of Holy Spirit filled believer ..

of course no one can because we are given no such directive by the lord in his word ..and he never contradicts his word .
we are however called directly to walk in obedience to the lord Jesus ..to love the lord our god with ALL out heart

 

[Alithis]

I guess the real question is, will God always keep us from harm even when it involves someone else's free will to harm us.

Back when I was a teenager is jumped by six other teenagers, one wielding a baseball bat. I guess I could have let them beat me to a bloody pulp, but I chose to defend myself. I went after the kid with the bat first add I needed to even up the odds some. By the end either they were running away or on the ground sobbing. Me, I just got a couple bruises.

I will continue to tell my kids that they aren't to ever start a fight, however they can defend themselves to keep from injury. That lesson will not change as I know what it's like to get a beating from being bullied. I will not allow my kids to know what that feels like a we cannot control another person's free will, nor do I believe God does either.

no the real question is .. will we trust God over our own strength .
will we trust him that though he allow us to be slain.. yet will we praise him.?will we love him first and foremost above all else and prove we do by being wiling to forsake all for his name sake

or will we hold fast to the fickle passing things of this world and resist the call to take up the cross and follow the lord Jesus

 

[Alithis]

Amen!

I would gladly pay my life down for my faith. If offered physical death or renouncing my faith, my faith will stay in line.

However, if I am attacked I can and will defend myself.

Isa 1:17. God commands us to defend the fatherless

2 Chron 11:5 Rehoboam built cities for defense.

Throughout the centuries, including the first church that warriors,. Soldiers and mighty men of valor took up arms to defend themselves, the weak and their faith.

These broad brush assertions disparage and disgrace their love of God and faith. This broad approach, to sustain its validity has to ignore the ministers of the Gospel and the fruit of their ministries. It is just not a sustainable position.

Couple that with the author of the arrival having no credibility make it a religious sounding, but unsubstantiated claim.

thata bold claim you begin with ..

iof its true then this chalange would be extremly easy for you
and as iv said before ..if bowing at the door and bowing when kneeling on the floor after emptying ones mind (more eastern founded meditation which has no part in a Holy Spirit filled life ) is not an act of giving worth(to worship ..to attribute as worth our time and effort ,to value ) to another other then God .. then next time your at you dojo .. don't do it . stand up straight when you walk in the door .. and when your kneeling with the class and they ,in unison , bow the head to the floor ..don't you do it .. you sit with your back as straight as an arrow unto Jesus .

. after all that will be no problem .. you are a born again Christian are you not ?.. you will not ever dream of bowing to another in any shape or form what so ever ..nor will you ever compromise your faith . you read the story of Daniel, how he refused to bow the knee to ANYONE but the one true living God .. you sang the songs on Sunday .."i will give you all my worship (worth).." you told yourself your not like those folks that compromise ,you've always pictured yourself as one who will never bow to anything or anyone other then the lord Jesus ..he is your LORD ..

now is your chance to prove it - after all ,get riled up, you have been duped, here you are doing that one thing you always said as a disciple of Jesus you would never do .. and yet there you are ,duped into believing the carnal reasoning and buying the excuses .. and there you ,are presenting your body as an instrument of discipline unto an eastern pagan practice religion and philosophy .. and you kneel on your knees and bow your head to the floor in full submission to another that is not the Lord Jesus ..

so prove that is not you .. do not bow ..

If you think i challenge you to a difficult thing .. i don't .

I did this very thing ..did not bow ,sat with my back straight up- it did not go well ..i quit soon after and renounced the practice in order to give the lord Jesus more worth(worship) in my life .
maybe it will go better for you .. maybe it will be your opportunity to testify to the entire class of the truth of the lord Jesus and they will all repent and stop bowing .wouldn't that be wonderful -after all you tell yourself your there as an -outreach- ?
it is sad that in truth it is the devil reaching out to draw people away from god .. far more then the deception we tel ourselves .. - ask any one who attends ..do any say "ouhh i come to this class to learn more about Christianity and Jesus " .. no one ever said it did they . not surprising ,its not what they have come there for is why .
__________________

 

[Boidae]

no the real question is .. will we trust God over our own strength .
will we trust him that though he allow us to be slain.. yet will we praise him.?will we love him first and foremost above all else and prove we do by being wiling to forsake all for his name sake

or will we hold fast to the fickle passing things of this world and resist the call to take up the cross and follow the lord Jesus

I will defend myself and family from a threat to our life and limb.

I do not believe God wants us to stand there and just let our family be slain. If that's what you want to do, by all means, go ahead. Me? Nope, I will defend us, and if I do die doing that, I will die knowing I did all I could to defend us.

We're to love our wives as Christ loved the church and gave His life for it. What part of allowing her to come to harm is us lying our lives down for her?

 

[Stormy]

Never mind

 

[hislegacy]

I will defend myself and family from a threat to our life and limb.

I do not believe God wants us to stand there and just let our family be slain. If that's what you want to do, by all means, go ahead. Me? Nope, I will defend us, and if I do die doing that, I will die knowing I did all I could to defend us.

We're to love our wives as Christ loved the church and gave His life for it. What part of allowing her to come to harm is us lying our lives down for her?

Amen and amen.

 

[Frogster]

I will defend myself and family from a threat to our life and limb.

I do not believe God wants us to stand there and just let our family be slain. If that's what you want to do, by all means, go ahead. Me? Nope, I will defend us, and if I do die doing that, I will die knowing I did all I could to defend us.

We're to love our wives as Christ loved the church and gave His life for it. What part of allowing her to come to harm is us lying our lives down for her?

You got it! You're right!

 

[Alithis]

I will defend myself and family from a threat to our life and limb.

I do not believe God wants us to stand there and just let our family be slain. If that's what you want to do, by all means, go ahead. Me? Nope, I will defend us, and if I do die doing that, I will die knowing I did all I could to defend us.

We're to love our wives as Christ loved the church and gave His life for it. What part of allowing her to come to harm is us lying our lives down for her?

What part of trusting God is not loving you wife lol.
ands whats it got to do with martial arts having no place in a spirit filled life?

 

[Boidae]

What part if trusting God is not loving you wife lol.
ands whats it got to do with martial arts having no place in a spirit filled life?

You are forgetting the other person's free will which God is not going to go against. I trust God that he will give me the strength to defend my family against aggressors. What kind of husband would I be if I allowed my wife or children to be injured or worse when I stood there and did nothing, when I could have done all I can to keep them from harm? If my wife was to divorce me because of something like that, I would probably help her to do so, because I am not much of a husband if I allowed them to come to harm.

What is martial arts mainly considered?

It's used for self defense. At least when I had started to take a course in Tae Kwon Do back in college that is what was said time and time again. If is for self defense or defense of others only. It is never used to start a fight. I never finished the class as my class load was too high and I had to drop it.

 

[Frogster]

You are forgetting the other person's free will which God is not going to go against. I trust God that he will give me the strength to defend my family against aggressors. What kind of husband would I be if I allowed my wife or children to be injured or worse when I stood there and did nothing, when I could have done all I can to keep them from harm? If my wife was to divorce me because of something like that, I would probably help her to do so, because I am not much of a husband if I allowed them to come to harm.

What is martial arts mainly considered?

It's used for self defense. At least when I had started to take a course in Tae Kwon Do back in college that is what was said time and time again. If is for self defense or defense of others only. It is never used to start a fight. I never finished the class as my class load was too high and I had to drop it.

exactly. Like Jesus would just stand there and watch Mary get attacked!

 

[hislegacy]

thata bold claim you begin with ..

iof its true then this chalange would be extremly easy for you

I wish we could stay to the topic and not get all personal about this



and as iv said before ..
if bowing at the door and bowing when kneeling on the floor after emptying ones mind (more eastern founded meditation which has no part in a Holy Spirit filled life )


As I have said before:

Bowing is NOT an act of worship it is a show of respect for the instructor and/or opponent. So feel free to stop saying it is if you are going to consider dressing me personally.

Let me restate:

You are 100% incorrect when it comes to this issue. Bowing is a show of respect, NOT AN ACT OF WORSHIP OF ANY TYPE, FORM OR FASHION. My prayer is that God would open the eyes of people understanding when they read this.


is not an act of giving worth(to worship ..to attribute as worth our time and effort ,to value ) to another other then God .. then next time your at you dojo ..

seventh time I am asking you not to address the person, but the topic of the thread - please stop doing this. It is rude and unmannerly IMHO.


I will also invite you to go back and re-read my post verbatim and you will see that I was involved the martial arts in my late teens, which is a very long time ago. I have no dojo to go to.

The dojo's that I am aware of are Christ centered. Something I have mentioned, but have not been addressed as of yet.

don't do it . stand up straight when you walk in the door .. and when your kneeling with the class and they ,in unison , bow the head to the floor ..don't you do it .. you sit with your back as straight as an arrow unto Jesus .

. after all that will be no problem .. you are a born again Christian are you not ?..

request number eight to stop making things personal and address the topic instead of the poster.

You assume too much.

You obviously don't have a clue about me personally, nor are you welcome to address me personally and making these accusations.

Please stop.


you will not ever dream of bowing t another in any shape or form what so ever ..nor will you ever compromise your faith .


fourth time - bowing is a sign of respect, not worship. When you enter, you bow to the instructor or opponent as a sign of respect, NOT worship. I'm hoping you are catching onto that.

you read the story of Daniel, how he refused to bow the knee to ANYONE but the one true living God .. you sang the songs on Sunday .."i will give you all my worship (worth).." you told yourself your not like those folks that compromise ,you've always pictured yourself as one who will never bow to anything or anyone other then the lord Jesus ..he is your LORD ..

now is your chance to prove it - after all ,get riled up, you have been duped, here you are doing that one thing you always said as a disciple of Jesus you would never do .. and yet there you are ,duped into believing the carnal reasoning and buying the excuses .. and there you ,are presenting your body as an instrument of discipline unto an eastern pagan practice religion and philosophy .. and you kneel on your knees and bow your head to the floor in full submission to another that is not the Lord Jesus ..

Again, this is inflammatory saying that I do any of the things bolded an underlined above. Please stop falsely accusing me o ungodly acts. You are mistaken, I have never and would never do such things. nine times now I am asking you to please stop addressing me personally and stay to the topic of the thread.

so prove that is not you .. do not bow .

If you think i challenge you to a difficult thing .. i don't .

I did this very thing ..did not bow ,sat with my back straight up- it did not go well

Being disrespectful never goes over well. Ignoring policies and rules willfully always ends in some type of action.

..i quit soon after and renounced the practice in order to give the lord Jesus more worth(worship) in my life .
maybe it will go better for you .. maybe it will be your opportunity to testify to the entire class of the truth of the lord Jesus and they will all repent and stop bowing .wouldn't that be wonderful -after all you tell yourself your there as an -outreach- ?
it is sad that in truth it is the devil reaching out to draw people away from god .. far more then the deception we tel ourselves .. - ask any one who attends ..do any say "ouhh i come to this class to learn more about Christianity and Jesus " .. no one ever said it did they . not surprising ,its not what they have come there for is why .
__________________

Are there some schools that get spiritual and promote Eastern theology. Sure there are. Those are the ones we shouldn't get involved with.

However, There are numbers of others who have taken what the devil meant for bad and transformed it into a tool for God. They are still considered Martial Arts, but focus on physical training and mediating on scripture - yes, the very Word of God is being taught in these dojo's

The teaching thread point out only one side and completely ignores what Spirit filled and Spirit lead Believers are doing in the Martial Arts.
.

 

[Alithis]

Are there some schools that get spiritual and promote Eastern theology. Sure there are. Those are the ones we shouldn't get involved with.

However, There are numbers of others who have taken what the devil meant for bad and transformed it into a tool for God. They are still considered Martial Arts, but focus on physical training and mediating on scripture - yes, the very Word of God is being taught in these dojo's

The teaching thread point out only one side and completely ignores what Spirit filled and Spirit lead Believers are doing in the Martial Arts.
.

if bowing down is not an act of giving worth (worship) and an act of being submissive to something other then God ..then prove it . save it for the lord Jesus only and do not do it any more .. wont be a problem .
put the claims to action .. actions speak louder the words .

If a thing holds no worth in ones life .one does not even bother to defend it ..One simply does not care about it .
we only defend that which we esteem as important ,that which we give worth to ,that which we worship .

if the word of god was being is being preached ,, then again.. that question arises ..the one everyone has absolutely ignored... show me from the word that is preached ..what place does martial arts have in a Holy Spirit Filled life .?

you cant because that which is born of flesh is flesh and that which is born of the Spirit of God is Spirit ..
we are to seek GODS will and do it ..not our own .

the only self defense i see going on here is people defending their own will without any respect for gods will what so ever .