Ron Paul vs Newt Gingrich on Fidelity.

Douger

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Ron Paul vs Newt Gingrich on Fidelity - A Matter of Consideration Before the Iowa Caucuses

Makes a very good point about who's the better man in this race and the risks of a Gingrich presidency.

The article could have covered so much more. For example, contrasting the way Dr. Paul has provided his medical services for free for the poor in his district rather than accept payments from government programs, while Gingrich took massive lobbying fees from a government sponsored entity.

The choice should be a no brainer, and I hope that Gingrich's climb in the polls can be chalked up to Republicans simply not knowing enough about the man.
 

linssue55

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Ron Paul vs Newt Gingrich on Fidelity - A Matter of Consideration Before the Iowa Caucuses

Makes a very good point about who's the better man in this race and the risks of a Gingrich presidency.

The article could have covered so much more. For example, contrasting the way Dr. Paul has provided his medical services for free for the poor in his district rather than accept payments from government programs, while Gingrich took massive lobbying fees from a government sponsored entity.

The choice should be a no brainer, and I hope that Gingrich's climb in the polls can be chalked up to Republicans simply not knowing enough about the man.

"for those who have not sinned, cast the first stone."

I am a sinner, you are a sinner, ALL are sinners....so whats the big deal?!

We are to forgive ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL who sin. This is an order!
 
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NightHawkeye

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Ron Paul vs Newt Gingrich on Fidelity - A Matter of Consideration Before the Iowa Caucuses

Makes a very good point about who's the better man in this race and the risks of a Gingrich presidency.

The article could have covered so much more. For example, contrasting the way Dr. Paul has provided his medical services for free for the poor in his district rather than accept payments from government programs, while Gingrich took massive lobbying fees from a government sponsored entity.

The choice should be a no brainer, and I hope that Gingrich's climb in the polls can be chalked up to Republicans simply not knowing enough about the man.
I had the opportunity to see Ron Paul in person this week when he spoke to a standing room only crowd at Iowa State University. He was well received. He is a man of conviction who apparently speaks honestly. There is little doubt in my mind that he will do well in the Iowa caucuses. His message of constitutional limited government and personal responsibility resonates in Iowa.

If he does do well in the caucuses, then the media attacks on Ron Paul will begin in earnest ... stay tuned.


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Harpuia

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"for those who have not sinned, cast the first stone."

I am a sinner, you are a sinner, ALL are sinners....so whats the big deal?!

We are to forgive ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL who sin. This is an order!

I don't know too many conservative Republicans willing to be quick to forgive Obama's sins, but only to accuse.
 
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EdwinWillers

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I don't know too many conservative Republicans willing to be quick to forgive Obama's sins, but only to accuse.
To which sins would you be referring?

From what I can tell the bulk of the accusations leveled at Barack Obama have nothing to do with his personal sins and everything to do with his ideology and policies.

That having been said, it's perhaps not at all improper to discuss either of those in the realm of sin inasmuch as the ruin and damage they've caused to countless people is no doubt related to the fundamental and inherent sinful nature of both his ideology and his policies, which policies stem from his ideology.
 
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Douger

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"for those who have not sinned, cast the first stone."

I am a sinner, you are a sinner, ALL are sinners....so whats the big deal?!

We are to forgive ALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL who sin. This is an order!
That doesn't mean we can't pick the kinder, humbler, and more Christian man to be our president.
 
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Harpuia

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To which sins would you be referring?

From what I can tell the bulk of the accusations leveled at Barack Obama have nothing to do with his personal sins and everything to do with his ideology and policies.

That having been said, it's perhaps not at all improper to discuss either of those in the realm of sin inasmuch as the ruin and damage they've caused to countless people is no doubt related to the fundamental and inherent sinful nature of both his ideology and his policies, which policies stem from his ideology.

Before he was President, during the election, there was his history of smoking marijuana, being a member of Wright's church, etc. etc. Not much "forgiveness" for the guy who did that, but we should forgive a guy who divorced while the spouse was fighting cancer simply because he has an R next to his name and not a D or an I.
 
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Nothing like encouraging people to vote because of a single issue which I thought we aren't suppose to do. Since when did fidelity become a big issue? It is nothing new, just better known about.

The caucuses are just over 3 weeks away and I still don't know for sure who I will be supporting.
 
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Harpuia

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I am tempted to register as a Republican temporarily to put my vote for Ron Paul, since I found out Nevada won't allow write-ins in the general.

I don't know if it's too late though to register, and if so, should I REALLY register Republican just to place my vote?
 
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NightHawkeye

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I am tempted to register as a Republican temporarily to put my vote for Ron Paul, since I found out Nevada won't allow write-ins in the general.

I don't know if it's too late though to register, and if so, should I REALLY register Republican just to place my vote?
If Ron Paul is your guy, then your choice seems clear.

If, on the other hand, you're gaming the system, why bother ... :doh:

.
 
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Ron Paul is liked precisely because he has characteristics that other politicians seem to lack.

He seems to sincerely act upon his beliefs, seems to have thought them through and is consistent.

On those points he is head and shoulders above his rivals like Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney who seem to be for sale to the highest bidder.

If only all our politicians were such people so that other ideologies could be properly represented and politics could be about the conflict of ideas rather than the conflict of campaign chauffeurs.
 
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linssue55

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I don't know too many conservative Republicans willing to be quick to forgive Obama's sins, but only to accuse.


I do not talk for other believers, only myself.

I have and will continue to forgive Obama, like I am commanded, also I will continue to pray for him, for hoping that he will apply the word of God (which he hasn't so far), but I leave him in the Lord's hands.

The Lord KNOWS ALL the facts, the Lord CAN handle Obama.

"Hate the sins, love the sinner." (with Agape love).

Seems you JUDGE all republicans like you say WE judge Obama?! If you are a believer, then you shouldn't judge either.

Correct?

APPLY what the Lord teaches, not to come here and condemn others that you have no idea what is in their hearts, ONLY the Lord knows that.

Shed your human view point and REPLACE it with Divine Viewpoint. This IS His wish for us.
 
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EdwinWillers

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Before he was President, during the election, there was his history of smoking marijuana, being a member of Wright's church, etc. etc. Not much "forgiveness" for the guy who did that, but we should forgive a guy who divorced while the spouse was fighting cancer simply because he has an R next to his name and not a D or an I.
For the record, I forgive Barack Obama for smoking marijuana.

As to Barack Obama's ideological and policy record, forgiveness isn't remotely the issue. Stopping him from further ruination and destruction is.
 
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Harpuia

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For the record, I forgive Barack Obama for smoking marijuana.

As to Barack Obama's ideological and policy record, forgiveness isn't remotely the issue. Stopping him from further ruination and destruction is.

No, I ain't talking about policies since other than surprisingly enough, the foreign affairs category, Obama hasn't been doing that great a job (and I'm still ticked about him letting Bernanke bail out banks while leaving the middle class high to dry). I'm speaking about the moral stuff that came in before his campaign.
 
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linssue55

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That doesn't mean we can't pick the kinder, humbler, and more Christian man to be our president.


What we should do is pick the candidate that represents the constitution and our bill of rights, that is who we go for.

The policies are what is important to save this country.

I don't care if the canidate has one eye, purple with pink polka dot skin.

I want my country back, THIS is the issue.

Their sin in no ones business, THAT is between them and the Lord.

THE LORD CAN HANDLE IT!


Also, keep in mind ....that a christian out of fellowship, IS WORSE than an unbeliever.

Christians out of fellowship are....Carnal, grieving and quenching the Holy Spirit, revesionism, black out of the soul, the sin unto death....this is what a christian becomes when they are not filled with the spirit.

So a christian is better?! This is NOT a requirement to become Pres. The GREAT believers in the bible SINNED PLENTY BAD when they were out of fellowship, didn't they?! Just because a person is a believer does not mean they don't sin and can't raise total havoc, I mean look what Obama has done so far, BECAUSE his Policies are KILLING this nation.

This is about our country, the constitution, liberty, freedom, Bill of Rights and the RIGHT to CHOOSE.

The very things that the Lord Jesus Christ gives us. This is the issue.....not there stupid, private sins.
 
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EdwinWillers

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No, I ain't talking about policies since other than surprisingly enough, the foreign affairs category, Obama hasn't been doing that great a job (and I'm still ticked about him letting Bernanke bail out banks while leaving the middle class high to dry). I'm speaking about the moral stuff that came in before his campaign.
Well, I forgot to forgive him smoking cigarettes too - but I readily forgive him that as well - and his golfing, and his lack of church attendance. All forgiven.

But do you think it not worth discussing his ideology and policies in the realm of sinfulness? I mean, the destruction and carnage they're causing for countless people must have some basis in sin inasmuch as the policies stem from the ideology, don't they?

And if they are sinful, it's appropriate to discuss forgiveness - which we are obligated to do; but aren't we also obligated in some manner to seek to stem the carnage [that sin is] causing?
 
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Harpuia

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Well, I forgot to forgive him smoking cigarettes too - but I readily forgive him that as well - and his golfing, and his lack of church attendance. All forgiven.

But do you think it not worth discussing his ideology and policies in the realm of sinfulness? I mean, the destruction and carnage they're causing for countless people must have some basis in sin inasmuch as the policies stem from the ideology, don't they?

And if they are sinful, it's appropriate to discuss forgiveness - which we are obligated to do; but aren't we also obligated in some manner to seek to stem the carnage [that sin is] causing?

I'm just solely referring to the whole being quick to forgive just because he is a part of an affiliation and Obama on the other hand is not affiliated with them. It isn't really a political thing so much as it is a personal thing for me, because the Gingrich/Obama example I give is how it's like I've seen with too many Christians. They're so quick to forgive one of their own in church but will accuse, bash, and harass people that are not like them into submission, even if they did nothing wrong.

Where I came from, a church-going conservative could commit murder and his churchmates would be quick to forgive, but a non-church going liberal just breathes the wrong way and he is harassed for it to no extent.

True, liberals do it too, but most of them don't hide behind Jesus to stake their claims.
 
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NightHawkeye

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Where I came from, a church-going conservative could commit murder and his churchmates would be quick to forgive, but a non-church going liberal just breathes the wrong way and he is harassed for it to no extent.
Allow me to suggest, Harpuia, that the issue for you is the distinction between words and actions.

Many of the most vocal "Christians" have failed spectacularly in living up to espoused ideals. Some have apparently even been deliberately hypocritical. It's ugly to look at, but it is what it is.

I was raised in the Bible belt and experienced first-hand, on multiple occasions, the sting of self-righteous hypocrisy. At one point in my childhood, the Reverend Donald Wildmon ... who captured national media attention from time to time regarding family values ... lived next door. Suffice it to say, the right Reverend Wildmon didn't think too highly of the way I was being raised.

Let it go, Harpuia ... set your own sights on a less-hypocritical standard.

Matthew 6:1 Take heed that ye do not your alms before men, to be seen of them: otherwise ye have no reward of your Father which is in heaven.

2 Therefore when thou doest thine alms, do not sound a trumpet before thee, as the hypocrites do in the synagogues and in the streets, that they may have glory of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 3 But when thou doest alms, let not thy left hand know what thy right hand doeth: 4 That thine alms may be in secret: and thy Father which seeth in secret himself shall reward thee openly.

5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 6 But thou, when thou prayest, enter into thy closet, and when thou hast shut thy door, pray to thy Father which is in secret; and thy Father which seeth in secret shall reward thee openly.

7 But when ye pray, use not vain repetitions, as the heathen do: for they think that they shall be heard for their much speaking. 8 Be not ye therefore like unto them: for your Father knoweth what things ye have need of, before ye ask him.

9 After this manner therefore pray ye: Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.

10 Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.

12 And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors.

13 And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you: 15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

16 Moreover when ye fast, be not, as the hypocrites, of a sad countenance: for they disfigure their faces, that they may appear unto men to fast. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward. 17 But thou, when thou fastest, anoint thine head, and wash thy face; 18 That thou appear not unto men to fast, but unto thy Father which is in secret: and thy Father, which seeth in secret, shall reward thee openly.

19 Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal: 20 But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal: 21 For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.

22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light. 23 But if thine eye be evil, thy whole body shall be full of darkness. If therefore the light that is in thee be darkness, how great is that darkness!

24 No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.

25 Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment? 26 Behold the fowls of the air: for they sow not, neither do they reap, nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are ye not much better than they? 27 Which of you by taking thought can add one cubit unto his stature? 28 And why take ye thought for raiment? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow; they toil not, neither do they spin: 29 And yet I say unto you, That even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Wherefore, if God so clothe the grass of the field, which to day is, and to morrow is cast into the oven, shall he not much more clothe you, O ye of little faith? 31 Therefore take no thought, saying, What shall we eat? or, What shall we drink? or, Wherewithal shall we be clothed? 32 (For after all these things do the Gentiles seek: ) for your heavenly Father knoweth that ye have need of all these things. 33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
34 Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

 
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Douger

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What we should do is pick the candidate that represents the constitution and our bill of rights, that is who we go for.

The policies are what is important to save this country.

I don't care if the canidate has one eye, purple with pink polka dot skin.

I want my country back, THIS is the issue.

Their sin in no ones business, THAT is between them and the Lord.

THE LORD CAN HANDLE IT!


Also, keep in mind ....that a christian out of fellowship, IS WORSE than an unbeliever.

Christians out of fellowship are....Carnal, grieving and quenching the Holy Spirit, revesionism, black out of the soul, the sin unto death....this is what a christian becomes when they are not filled with the spirit.

So a christian is better?! This is NOT a requirement to become Pres. The GREAT believers in the bible SINNED PLENTY BAD when they were out of fellowship, didn't they?! Just because a person is a believer does not mean they don't sin and can't raise total havoc, I mean look what Obama has done so far, BECAUSE his Policies are KILLING this nation.

This is about our country, the constitution, liberty, freedom, Bill of Rights and the RIGHT to CHOOSE.

The very things that the Lord Jesus Christ gives us. This is the issue.....not there stupid, private sins.
There is a tremendous amount of correlation between one's personal and public life. In both personal and public life, Gingrich has a history of, lying, cheating and promoting his own interests above those of others.
It would be fool hardy to say "gee, let's give this guy commander in chief powers, veto powers, appointment powers, etcetera."
 
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NightHawkeye

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There is a tremendous amount of correlation between one's personal and public life. In both personal and public life, Gingrich has a history of, lying, cheating and promoting his own interests above those of others.
It would be fool hardy to say "gee, let's give this guy commander in chief powers, veto powers, appointment powers, etcetera."
On the other hand, Gingrich is one of the few elected political officials who has demonstrated accomplishments based on campaign promises ... for example, Contract with America, balanced budget, etc.

Gingrich was thrown under the bus by his own party ... at the peak of his accomplishments. His "ethics" violations consisted of a "book deal". That never made sense to me ... still doesn't. If either the Democrats or Republicans could have convicted him of a greater offense, no doubt they would have.

The fact that Gingrich was again thrown under the bus by his own party at the beginning of this primary season when all his "establishment" handlers abandoned him, makes this all the more interesting. During all of this presidential campaign, Newt has been a positive force and established decorum for all candidates during the debates which focused on substance rather than minutiae.

It is that matter of substance over minutiae which has elevated Newt to the premiere position he holds currently ... IMHO.


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