Iran Launches Attack on Israel

Chesterton said:

At the end of this post to me you say "I have very little respect for people who misrepresent the facts...", so please point out where I said I hate BLM.

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Chesterton said:

Everyone knows they pulled it. It was because of public outrage. But obviously they meant it or they wouldn't have done it in the first place. But I'm curious - I don't recall them saying it was "uniformed". What was uninformed about it? How was it uninformed?

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Chesterton said:

A distaste? Wow I'd hate to think what the Nazi's would have done if they'd actually hated the Jews.

Some "half-breeds" were sterilized, but the Nazis wanted to sterilize all half-breeds, so it was not particular to Arabs.

There were some Arabs in prisons camps, but not for being Arab.

In 1936, the Nazi Office of Racial Politics, in response to a question from the German Foreign Ministry, classified non-Jewish Turks as Europeans, but "left unanswered the question of how to think about the obviously non-European Arabs, Persians, and Muslims."[88] Later that year, ahead of the Summer Olympic Games in Berlin, the Nazis responded to questions from the Egyptians by saying that the Nuremberg racial laws did not apply to them.​

Racial policy of Nazi Germany - Wikipedia

Also, see Why Hitler Wished He Was Muslim - The Wall Street Journal

And it sounds like you're already familiar with the Wiki page, but I'll link it just in case. The opening sections discuss Hitler and Himmler's feelings toward Islam. Relations between Nazi Germany and the Arab world - Wikipedia

Again, your last sentence about misrepresenting facts immediately follows another instance of you misrepresenting facts. I did not say Hitler wanted to make Germany a Muslim nation.

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Jamdoc said:

Because we're judging the body of beliefs rather than individual's adherence to them. If someone doesn't believe their Holy books then you are going to have to go person to person because what they believe is not their religion but their own personal code.

If someone understands and believes the bible, and reads it, cover to cover and understands and believes what it says, the Christian bible points to an eschatological redemption of the Jews, so we see the Jewish people as important because God's plan says they will still be there and redeemed. We support the Jews and support Israel not for ourselves, but because God has declared their redemption and we believe that. We do it for God's sake, even when you say we're "the problem" rather than people shooting missiles at you.

If someone understands and believes the Qur'an and the Hadiths, then they believe Jews have been forsaken by God for violating His commandments. Which to be fair, both Muslims and Christians can see the history of the Jews as one of Chastisement and Scourging by the Lord, and even you looking at your own Tanakh must be able to see it. Passages talk about your very name being used as an insult and a negative proverb. Is that not the last 2000 years of persecution and marginalization for you? However the difference is Christians who read and understand the full bible, see that this is Chastisement, not forsaking, God will never utterly forsake His promises to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, there is promised redemption in our book. But for Islam their traditions involve the slaughter of the Jews in the last days. Any Muslim who fully reads, understands, and believes their scriptures is therefore very dangerous.

Now sure, you are right, many Muslims do not fully believe their own scriptures or have not fully read them all and just listened to radical clerics who do, or moderate clerics who don't.
and within Christianity there are many self proclaiming Christians who have not read the bible, or don't believe it. Anyone claiming to be a "Christian Nationalist" much less a "Christian Ethnonationalist" either has not read their bible, or does not believe it, and only gets exposed to radical teachers who take verses out of context in order to suit their wicked agenda.
The Christian bible is utterly incompatible with white supremacy for one.

But there's not a lot you can really do about religious people who do not even believe their own scriptures, they're a lost cause. You might be able to straighten out some of the ones who are just plain ignorant and don't know those verses are out of context and that the overall book promises the redemption of Jews so no Jesus was not some super-hitler Anti-jew the way they may see them. Anyone with that belief does not know Jesus. Jesus is Himself, a Jew.
you can't be the "Lion of the tribe of Judah" otherwise.


that said.. I don't know if I'd want to "straighten out" any Muslims who are just ignorant about their own scriptures and teach them to be "true Muslims"...
I'd want to teach them Jesus instead.

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Vanellus said:

A brief summary of this post seems to be that Jamdoc is claiming to understand the Bible and the Koran better than anybody who disagrees with Jamdoc.

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JosephZ said:

It appears Israel responded to Sunday's attack from Iran with a limited strike, as expected. Each country has now shown they can reach targets within each other's borders, so hopefully this will be a deterrent for any further escalation between the two countries.

Iranian air base reportedly attacked in ‘limited’ Israeli reprisal strike

Explosions were heard near the Iranian city of Isfahan early Friday as Israel reportedly launched a heavily anticipated reprisal strike for an Iranian attack on Israel days earlier, defying international pressure to stand down.

The apparently limited nature of the strike, reportedly carried out with drones rather than missiles or airstrikes...

According to CNN, quoting a senior US official, Israel told the US the attack was not targeting Iranian nuclear facilities. Both CNN and Fox News quoted officials describing the attack as “limited.”

Israel’s Home Front Command said there were no special instructions for staying near bomb shelters, indicating no Iranian response was expected.

The air base in Isfahan has been home to Iran’s fleet of American-made F-14 Tomcats — purchased before the 1979 Islamic Revolution.

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JosephZ said:

Taqiyya is an invention of anti-Islamic propagandist in an effort to discredit Muslims.

The word taqiyya isn't found anywhere in the Qur'an, but here is the definition:

Takiya (taqiyyah, taqiyya); “The principle of dissimulation of one’s religious beliefs in order to avoid persecution or imminent harm, where no useful purpose would be served by publicly affirming them.”

Below is the ONLY verse found in the Qur'an that mentions lying as being acceptable.

"As for anyone who denies God after having once attained to faith - and this, to be sure, does not apply to one who does it under duress, the while his heart remains true to his faith, but only, to him who willingly opens up his heart to a denial of the truth upon all such falls God's condemnation, and tremendous suffering awaits them" (Qur'an 16:106)

This following hadiths makes it clear that lying is forbidden in Islam:

Verily, truthfulness leads to righteousness and righteousness leads to Paradise. A man may speak the truth until he is recorded with Allah as truthful. Verily, lying leads to wickedness and wickedness leads to the Hellfire. A man may tell lies until he is recorded with Allah as a liar. (Sahih al-Bukhari 5743, Sahih Muslim 2607)

"Avoid falsehood, for falsehood leads to wickedness, and wickedness to Hell; and if a man continues to speak falsehood and makes falsehood his object, he will be recorded in God's presence as a great liar. And adhere to the truth, for truth leads to good deeds, and good deeds lead to Paradise. If a man continues to speak the truth and makes truth his object, he will be recorded in God's presence as eminently truthful." (Sunan Abu Dawood vol. 3, no. 4971)

Aisha reported: There was no behavior more hateful to the Messenger of Allah, peace and blessings be upon him, than dishonesty. A man would tell a lie when speaking in the presence of the Prophet and he would not be satisfied until he knew that he had repented. (Sunan al-Tirmidhi¯)

The following hadith says it is one of the greatest of sins.

"Beware I inform you regarding the greatest of the mortal sins: Associating anything with Allah, disobeying parents and lying!" (Wasaelush Shia)

According to the teachings of Islam, a Muslim is only permitted to lie about one’s religious beliefs in order to avoid persecution, imminent harm or death. In all other cases lying is forbidden and will lead to Hell.

There are exceptions where a Muslim can tell a minor lie to keep peace and harmony among others, an example of this would be like if a wife asks her husband if a certain dress makes her look fat, and he answers "no" even when it's obvious that it does. Flat out lying and deceit is not acceptable though.

Here's a good video on the subject and how the myth of tiqiyya came about. (Be sure to read the comments below the video as well)

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Jamdoc said:

it's what Romans 11, and Revelation 7, so not even just "oh that's old testament that's already fulfilled we only follow the New Testament" Christians, but the New Testament itself says that there is an end times redemption of the Jews
and the Hadiths say there is an end time hunting down of the Jews.
That is what the texts say.

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Jamdoc said:

So Hamas is, by their own beliefs, all going to hell for lying about their casualty figures like 500 dead when a Palestinian Islamic Jihad rocket landed in a hospital parking lot?

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Vanellus said:

But when the IDF lie about a huge Hamas base beneath Al Shifa Hospital that's ok.

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Slibhin said:

Several articles on the incident have variations of BLM Chicago repudiating this particular meme. Not hard to find if one cares to. I generally give people the benefit of the doubt unless they repeat an error or past conduct gives me reason to question.

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Slibhin said:

I don't see the humour in the holocaust. Would you prefer another word to distaste? How about animus? Hatred? Contempt? Please pick one and insert it if you prefer and get back to the actual topic.

I'm not interested in an opinion piece by the WSJ. It's paywalled anyway so I can't read it... did you? He never wished he was Muslim and you are taking his comments out of context.

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Slibhin said:

There were plenty of Arabs in concentration camps, and I know because my grandfather was in one therefore I take his word and oceans of documentation over yours.

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Slibhin said:

Trying to instill hatred for Muslims in me by conflating them with nazi's if pretty despicable if you ask me.

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JosephZ said:

Millions of Muslims participated on the allied side of the war during WWII, how many collaborated with the Nazis?

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JosephZ said:

It was in the tens of thousands, with the highest number I can find being 70,000. The estimated numbers I have found for Muslims that joined the allied forces range from 2.5 million to 5.5 million. Using the highest estimate for the number of Muslims that joined the Nazis and the lowest number that joined the allied forces, it comes to just 3% of Muslims in WWII siding with the Nazis. The actual percentage is likely even lower. Most of the estimated 3% of Muslims that joined the Nazis did so for self-serving reasons, not because they sympathized with the Nazi ideology. So trying to make a link between the Muslims and the Nazis is a futile effort.

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Chesterton said:

A few things: Many of these Muslims were Indian and other non-Arab, and this lady I'm chatting with keeps playing that game where you use Muslim and Arab interchangeably as if they're the same thing.

You seem to want to suggest that these soldiers were volunteers who wanted to fight for Britain because they love Jews. No, they were drafted, and when you're drafted you either do your duty or go to jail.

Also, many, many of the Muslims were fighting the Japanese and Italians.

By the way, many countries in the Middle East insisted on getting an Arabic translation of Mein Kampf. When it finally arrived it sold well. Hitler had minor changes made, such as changing the word "anti-Semetic" to "anti-Jewish".

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