Constant Thoughts of Condemnation With No Hope

Totally been there with you, man. It. Is. So. Hard.

Just a little about myself, so you can see how we're a bit similar...I was born and raised in a Christian home. I got saved when I was a kid, at VBS. At least, I think I got saved--I assume I did. I said the sinner's prayer, and after saying 'amen', I felt something. It was this sparkly, glittery, wonderful feeling. I remember that I had a huge smile on my face, and I looked at the girl sitting beside me to see if she, too, was smiling.

Does that mean my salvation was real? I don't know, but it's something I've held onto. During my childhood and teen years, I did really try to follow Jesus and be a 'good Christian'. However, I had several undiagnosed mental illnesses (OCD being one of them) that, looking back, really affected my life in general, but also my faith. For example, I had social anxiety. I was very shy, introverted, and super uncomfortable around people I didn't know. Read: church. I HATED going to church. I HATED going to church camp. I HATED going on ski retreats, to retreats, to parties, all of that. In my household, we went to church Sunday mornings, Sunday school, Sunday night, and Wednesday night, and I always, always hated it. Looking back now, I know that it's because I had social anxiety and was so shy, but back then I thought, I hate church--that must mean I don't like Christianity.

I didn't like reading the Bible. Why? Because I was a kid and found it boring. Not only that, but I was a kid and didn't understand it. Find me one kid that really can. I prayed, and I loved God and Jesus, but I was totally a 'baby Christian'. One thing I remember was going out into the back woods and yelling at Satan to 'LEAVE ME ALONE!'. To this day, I can't remember why I did that. Maybe I felt on-fire for God, or maybe I was so frustrated that I kept getting hit with temptation, or maybe it was something more sinister, or maybe the scrupulosity made me feel like I should do it, a compulsion. I don't know.

During this time, I had a few sinful addictions, namely an addiction to masturbation/inappropriate contentography and food. Unbeknownst to me, these were two ways that my childhood self used to manage her undiagnosed anxiety disorder/depression/OCD. I had no idea; I just knew that they made me feel better and I enjoyed eating and looking at inappropriate content. I tried to stop the inappropriate content, but it never lasted for long. I felt very guilty about it.

My mom always told me that I am very, very hard on myself. I've been called a perfectionist, which I never understood. After all, I was fat, and didn't have a spic-and-span room, and din't get 100% on all my school assignments, so how could I be a perfectionist? I didn't realize it then, but I had the mindset of...don't sin...be perfect. 'If you sin, you just aren't trying hard enough.' Needless to say, I still sinned. Often. And that discouraged me.

In my high school years, I prayed and prayed for God to tell me where He wanted me to go to school, what He wanted me to do with my life. I never got any answer from Him. I never felt His presence. Beyond that glittery feeling when I first 'got saved', I never felt ANYTHING from my faith. I would hear people at church talk and say, 'I was really worried about my son, but then I prayed and I felt a sense of peace wash over me like a warm blanket' or, 'I was asking God what I should do, and He told me to move to Florida.' Things like that. I never had that kind of experience, so I became even MORE discouraged and frustrated.

By this point, I was getting a bit bitter towards Christianity--maybe even towards God. I would be dragged to church against my will, forced to go and sit there awkwardly, and then I would see my classmates raising their hands during worship songs and talking about how much they love Jesus, and on Monday these same people would be at school cussing and wearing low-cut shirts and talking about sex. I was so put-off by that, because they were total hypocrites! (I was very judgmental back then. Now I know that we're ALL hypocrites to some degree, in some form or another.)

My parents said they wouldn't co-sign on a loan for me to go to college unless I went to a Christian one, which they knew I didn't want to. I wanted to go to the public college and live at home; they cornered me going into the ultra-strict Baptist school and living on campus. No jeans or tennis shoes except on Friday and the weekend, chapel five days a week, a required Bible minor, 3 'spiritual formation' activities each week...I hated it. I would go to chapel, have them scan my card, and then sit in the bathroom and read or do homework. I would say I did spiritual formation activities when I hadn't actually. The Bible minor classes were an annoying obligation. I hated being around people. In January '08, my doctor diagnosed me with anxiety and depression.

I was at the school for a little less than a year, and that was the first time in my life that I ever doubted God's existence. Looking back on it now, I wonder if it was my scrupulosity (which had gone a bit dormant) that caused that. Anyway, I dropped out and moved into an apartment in July '09. I thought less and less about God, except for the occasional doubt about His existence (although if someone had asked me 'Who was Jesus?' I would have immediately, without hesitation, said 'The Son of God'). I tried to treat other people kindly, but I was living for myself, living in the world. When I turned 22 I developed an alcohol addiction and was still addicted to inappropriate content and food. I had a suuuuuuuper foul mouth on me and even, sometimes, used God's name in vain.

Fast-forward to last September. I'm morbidly obese, on disability for my anxiety and depression, which has gotten even worse over the years. I'm physically inactive because of the depression and because of some fused bones in my spine that cause me a lot of pain when I'm standing or walking. I'm miserable. I'm still living in sin, drinking heavily, eating a ton, looking at inappropriate content at least once a day, barely giving God a second thought...

And then I see a prediction about the blood moons, and I immediately thought it was the rapture going to happen. Suffice it to say, I had the crap scared out of me. I'm not sure why this one affected me so much...there was a prediction about the world ending in 2012, too, but I can't remember it scaring me like this did. Anyway, I was terrified. I prayed for the first time in years (besides the occasional 'thank you, God' or 'Please, God' when something really good or really bad happened). I told God I was sorry for straying, sorry for living for myself, sorry for this, sorry for that.

BOOM! The OCD was there--scrupulosity in full force. Blasphemous thoughts, intense fear, condemnation, thoughts that I was the anti-Christ, thoughts that I was being possessed by a demon, thoughts that God didn't want me, thoughts that my heart was hardened past the point of repentance...it was awful, and it went on for months. I spent hours giving into compulsions, researching the unforgivable sin, scary Bible verses, backsliding, grace, etc.

Anyway. That's my story. I'm doing SO much better now, thank you God, but I do sometimes still have my days of fear. I'm also taking Zoloft and it really, really helps. What has also helped me is getting to know God--what He is like. His attributes.

I'd say the reason you can't find a scripture about a person thinking they were saved, running from God, and then coming back in their late 30s to be saved is because there isn't one. None so specific, anyway. However! I'm sure you know the story of the prodigal son. He demanded his inheritance, went off and lived for himself, and when he ran out of money and couldn't make his life work on his own, he went crawling back to his father in shame--and his father welcomed him. Needless to say, the father in the story represents God.

Also, the book of Hosea (it's a bit of a scary read, like a lot of the OT, so I'll give you a run down). God's chosen people, the Israelites, have turned their backs on Him. They ignore Him. They don't follow His rules. They worship other gods. And all throughout the book, God expresses--through the prophet Hosea--that He wants them to come back to Him, that He will heal their backsliding and restore them. If that isn't an example of God accepting a person back, I don't know what is!

But, you've got OCD, and OCD is always going to find something to doubt. Believe me. As soon as I was convinced I hadn't committed the unforgivable sin, I was worried that I wasn't sufficiently repenting. As soon as I felt like I was repenting, I doubted God's existence. As soon as I convinced myself that God was real, it was back to the unforgivable sin, back to thinking I was hard-hearted, fear of Hell, on and on and on. It sounds like you're doing a ton of self-analyzing, and as hard as it is to NOT do that, and as much as you may think that it's the right thing to do, self-analyzing isn't often your friend. Not with OCD, especially this type of Pure-O OCD. Rumination is just another compulsion.

I read a ton of books on God's grace. Looking back on it now, that may have been a compulsion...but heck, it did help. Sorry that my reply is so jumbled by the way, lol. I wanted to let you know you're not alone, and hopefully encourage you a bit, too, but I was like, what's important to talk about and what's not? Plus I'm a rambler

Hi Grace333, I want you to know my heart goes out to you. If there is anyone who understands it is me. I had a very powerful conversion to Jesus when I was 21. I am now 45 (well next Thursday anyways) I have dealt with this for about 25 years so far. I have had mental collapses, been suicidle, worn heart monitors and been on every kind of drug you probably could be on. I have been in the place of backsliding (sometimes I feel as though I am in a constant state of backsliding) where I thought there was literally no hope to come back to Jesus. I still deal with this often. The number of issues that have went through my mind in the past 25 year are to numerous to count. The torment I have experienced through fear at times is indescribable. It is a daily struggle.

When we are in the middle of the mental madness, sometimes it can be extremely difficult to put things in the correct perspective.

Here is some correct perspective:

The one thing I feel is often lacking in the conversations I have with others who experience this nightmare is satans role in all of this. There are SO many scriptures regarding how much the devil is out to destroy us, but yet we breeze over them for the most part. How many places in the Bible are there that talk about how he is a liar, a deceiver, the author of confusion, a roaring lion who going about seeking whom he may devour, I could go on...Does the 'Fiery darts of satan' ring a bell? Make sure you are giving credit where credit is do. Satan is the instigator of all of the mental toture you are going through. His objective is to destroy you life and relationship with Jesus. He wants to make you completely and utterly ineffective for God. Do you have a sensitive conscience? Yes. Does Satan know that and use it to his advantage? Yes he does. Does God know the tricks and deceit used by the devil? Yes He does. There is one thing you need to take heart in. You have a strong desire to want to be with Jesus. The Bible tells us that it is only by the power of the Holy Spirit anyone is able to see Jesus for who He is...The Son of God. Take heart that the Holy Spirit dwells in you!

There was a time during the transition from 2008-2009, where I had completely fallen. So much so that I was in a place of complete hopelessness. I was on the verge of killing myself. I was in the lowest point in my life. I have NEVER experienced pain and agony in the truest sense like I did at this time in my life. I begged God to show me that I could be forgiven for what I had done and been doing. I have NEVER been at a lower point in my life. My wife was extremely concerned for me. It was very, very, very bad. I was getting about 3 hours of sleep a night. I was at my end. I finally reached a breaking point that I had to know if I could be forgiven by God. I prayed and told God he had to tell me if I could be forgiven, that I could not live like this. Two days later I was up at 6am searching the Internet for any scripture or thing that would give me any relief (as I often did). I read some Charles Spurgen messages on Gods love for us among other things. Please know I had no idea what Scrupulosity was at this point in my life, so the previous 18-19 years of dealing with Christian mental battles and images I thought was normal. At around 8 I got up to get dressed for the day (this was New Years Eve 2008). As I reached the bottom of the stairs going to my bedroom God revealed Himself and His love for me in a way I had NEVER experienced in my life. I was completely taken up with His love for me. A true deep heart felt understanding, not a surface "Jesus loves you" way, if that makes any sense. As I reached my closet, the immediate question came to me "Am I forgiven". In what I can only describe as the most supernatural experience I have ever had in regards to understanding what Jesus did on the cross. The Holy Sprirt revealed to me that Jesus died for EVERY sin. Again, let me be very clear this was not a mental assent to what Jesus did. This was a very deep, deep understanding. The kind of thing that can change the course of a persons life.
Let me be VERY clear on this. There is not one sin on this planet, that if you trust in Jesus is not covered by the most powerful substance in the universe...the Blood of Jesus. I am a loop hole guy, so I immediately started thinking, well what about this, or what about that. But like a giant fist crushing a ant, The Holy Spirit squashed every thought that tried to present itself against what was being revealed to me. JESUS died for every sin, big or small...period. That day I experienced true joy, the kind of joy the Bible tells us about. About two weeks after this I started having the battle again. But this time I could look back to what God showed me. It saved my life.
I want you to understand something. No matter what you think, no matter what thoughts or feelings you experience, no matter how far you think you have fallen. If you could understand one hairs width of how much Jesus loves you, all of your concerns would melt away. If you believe in Jesus you are covered. Jesus acomplished ALL on the cross. When He said "it is finished"...it was completed and finished in total...the payment was made. If we are relying on our performance, we are all in trouble.
Now with that said I understand how it feels to feel like I have disappointed God. When I fall to a temptation, or sin I feel like I am disappointing my father. It is extremely painful, because I want Him to be proud of me. Like an earthly son wants to make his Father proud. But even in this I think my/our view is skewed. God sees Jesus when He looks at us, because we are covered by His Blood, so He cannot be anything but pleased with us. We have accepted the free Gift He has offered.
Please see satans hand in all of this. He wants to destroy you in total. Continue to look up sermons on Grace. That is what we really need to understand. Erwin Lutzer at Moody Bible Church has some excellent sermons on Grace. I get his podcasts and listen all the time. Also, go to "Liravox.org" and you can get John Bunyans "Grace Abounding to the Chief of Sinners" on audio for free. If you have never read or heard this, you will be shocked how this fantastic man of God went through the same things we do 450 years ago. This one thing alone has brought me tremendous peace through the years. At times I feel like we were born from the same womb.

Be encouraged - If you believe in Jesus, you ARE a Son of God, no matter what lies satan throws your way...period

333GRACE said:

Thanks for responding man. Your story is an encouragement to me. Sorry you have faced this as well but glad in the sense that I am not alone in this fight.

You are spot on with the self-analyzing...its a terrible habit.

I am reading "grace" books and books on "forgetting the past." As weird as it sounds, this whole process is starting to feel like a blessing in disguise.

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I've thought the same thing! Scrupulosity is so, so hard to deal with. I truly do believe it's the worst form of OCD. All OCD is terrible, but at least with the rest of them, the torture is only in this life...whereas with scrupulosity, we worry about this life, yes, but also--probably mostly--our eternity. Anyway, it's a horrible thing, but it has really taught me the meaning of 'cling to Jesus' and 'trust in God'. Granted, sometimes I have a hard time doing both, but even in the midst of my fears, sometimes all I can do is throw up my hands and say, you know what, God's going to do what He's going to do.

Also, Jesus tells the story about the self-righteous Pharisee who thanked God that they were 'not like the adulterers and the tax collectors' and that they 'prayed everyday'. I can't remember it verbatim, but it's something like that...and then there was the tax collector who KNEW he was a sinner and who KNEW he wasn't worthy of God, and he beat his chest and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner!' Jesus said that it was THAT man who was right with God. It's Luke 18:9-14.

Noah03 had some great things to say above ^. This forum has really, really helped me, and I hope it helps you too. I can't remember if you said in your post if you're seeing a counselor? I think I recall you saying you went to a Christian psychiatrist... (sorry, it's a lot to re-read lol). Anyway, if you're not seeing a counselor, I would definitely recommend that. Also, this page (link below) is very helpful. I would recommend sticking with his scrupulosity pages ONLY, so it doesn't turn into another compulsion. And, you know how it is--us with OCD/scrupulosity will read something and get scared by it because we over-think things and are really sensitive. Someone could say something and we'll completely misinterpret it and get terrified. So stick with the scrup pages!

http://www.net-burst.net/guilty/scrupulosity.htm

Noah03 said:

Hi Grace333, I want you to know my heart goes out to you. If there is anyone who understands it is me. I had a very powerful conversion to Jesus when I was 21. I am now 45 (well next Thursday anyways) I have dealt with this for about 25 years so far. I have had mental collapses, been suicidle, worn heart monitors and been on every kind of drug you probably could be on. I have been in the place of backsliding (sometimes I feel as though I am in a constant state of backsliding) where I thought there was literally no hope to come back to Jesus. I still deal with this often. The number of issues that have went through my mind in the past 25 year are to numerous to count. The torment I have experienced through fear at times is indescribable. It is a daily struggle.

When we are in the middle of the mental madness, sometimes it can be extremely difficult to put things in the correct perspective.

Here is some correct perspective:

The one thing I feel is often lacking in the conversations I have with others who experience this nightmare is satans role in all of this. There are SO many scriptures regarding how much the devil is out to destroy us, but yet we breeze over them for the most part. How many places in the Bible are there that talk about how he is a liar, a deceiver, the author of confusion, a roaring lion who going about seeking whom he may devour, I could go on...Does the 'Fiery darts of satan' ring a bell? Make sure you are giving credit where credit is do. Satan is the instigator of all of the mental toture you are going through. His objective is to destroy you life and relationship with Jesus. He wants to make you completely and utterly ineffective for God. Do you have a sensitive conscience? Yes. Does Satan know that and use it to his advantage? Yes he does. Does God know the tricks and deceit used by the devil? Yes He does. There is one thing you need to take heart in. You have a strong desire to want to be with Jesus. The Bible tells us that it is only by the power of the Holy Spirit anyone is able to see Jesus for who He is...The Son of God. Take heart that the Holy Spirit dwells in you!

There was a time during the transition from 2008-2009, where I had completely fallen. So much so that I was in a place of complete hopelessness. I was on the verge of killing myself. I was in the lowest point in my life. I have NEVER experienced pain and agony in the truest sense like I did at this time in my life. I begged God to show me that I could be forgiven for what I had done and been doing. I have NEVER been at a lower point in my life. My wife was extremely concerned for me. It was very, very, very bad. I was getting about 3 hours of sleep a night. I was at my end. I finally reached a breaking point that I had to know if I could be forgiven by God. I prayed and told God he had to tell me if I could be forgiven, that I could not live like this. Two days later I was up at 6am searching the Internet for any scripture or thing that would give me any relief (as I often did). I read some Charles Spurgen messages on Gods love for us among other things. Please know I had no idea what Scrupulosity was at this point in my life, so the previous 18-19 years of dealing with Christian mental battles and images I thought was normal. At around 8 I got up to get dressed for the day (this was New Years Eve 2008). As I reached the bottom of the stairs going to my bedroom God revealed Himself and His love for me in a way I had NEVER experienced in my life. I was completely taken up with His love for me. A true deep heart felt understanding, not a surface "Jesus loves you" way, if that makes any sense. As I reached my closet, the immediate question came to me "Am I forgiven". In what I can only describe as the most supernatural experience I have ever had in regards to understanding what Jesus did on the cross. The Holy Sprirt revealed to me that Jesus died for EVERY sin. Again, let me be very clear this was not a mental assent to what Jesus did. This was a very deep, deep understanding. The kind of thing that can change the course of a persons life.
Let me be VERY clear on this. There is not one sin on this planet, that if you trust in Jesus is not covered by the most powerful substance in the universe...the Blood of Jesus. I am a loop hole guy, so I immediately started thinking, well what about this, or what about that. But like a giant fist crushing a ant, The Holy Spirit squashed every thought that tried to present itself against what was being revealed to me. JESUS died for every sin, big or small...period. That day I experienced true joy, the kind of joy the Bible tells us about. About two weeks after this I started having the battle again. But this time I could look back to what God showed me. It saved my life.
I want you to understand something. No matter what you think, no matter what thoughts or feelings you experience, no matter how far you think you have fallen. If you could understand one hairs width of how much Jesus loves you, all of your concerns would melt away. If you believe in Jesus you are covered. Jesus acomplished ALL on the cross. When He said "it is finished"...it was completed and finished in total...the payment was made. If we are relying on our performance, we are all in trouble.
Now with that said I understand how it feels to feel like I have disappointed God. When I fall to a temptation, or sin I feel like I am disappointing my father. It is extremely painful, because I want Him to be proud of me. Like an earthly son wants to make his Father proud. But even in this I think my/our view is skewed. God sees Jesus when He looks at us, because we are covered by His Blood, so He cannot be anything but pleased with us. We have accepted the free Gift He has offered.
Please see satans hand in all of this. He wants to destroy you in total. Continue to look up sermons on Grace. That is what we really need to understand. Erwin Lutzer at Moody Bible Church has some excellent sermons on Grace. I get his podcasts and listen all the time. Also, go to "Liravox.org" and you can get John Bunyans "Grace Abounding to the Chief of Sinners" on audio for free. If you have never read or heard this, you will be shocked how this fantastic man of God went through the same things we do 450 years ago. This one thing alone has brought me tremendous peace through the years. At times I feel like we were born from the same womb.

Be encouraged - If you believe in Jesus, you ARE a Son of God, no matter what lies satan throws your way...period

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Hi my friend I know this is an old post but everything you posted seems to hit on the head with all I've been dealing with.one thing I wrestled with is getting angry at God and feeling a bitterness at him that maybe I'm over analyzing. Did you experience anger and bitterness at God and his guidance and feel that he wasn't there and how did you get out of those feelings? Thanks in advance

sold4christ25 said:

Hi my friend I know this is an old post but everything you posted seems to hit on the head with all I've been dealing with.one thing I wrestled with is getting angry at God and feeling a bitterness at him that maybe I'm over analyzing. Did you experience anger and bitterness at God and his guidance and feel that he wasn't there and how did you get out of those feelings? Thanks in advance

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Hello sold4christ25! If I may ask a question for clarification, are you struggling with OCD/scrupulosity as well, or is it just anger in general?

Mari17 said:

Hello sold4christ25! If I may ask a question for clarification, are you struggling with OCD/scrupulosity as well, or is it just anger in general?

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Hi, i'm not sure but I think we've been over the ocd thing before . I feel I have it to a large degree but I also really,struggle with believing I'm forgiven because of the things my mind goes through.

I have a question for you ( since you seem to have a decent handle on the whole scrupulosity/ocd thing) - and forgive me if I've asked this before because my ocd revolves around my backsliding/sinning state, but, do you feel like ocd can also make us latch on to a repeating sign that makes us feel condemned, like seeing a repeated number ( for me its the number 7 that ive been holding on to for a few years when i felt that i walked away from God or God cut me off because i chose to continue in some sins that he had been speaking to my heart to change for a while ) that cross associates with a condemning thought and reaffirms that belief of being condemned ? Is that the ocd or a true sign?

333GRACE said:

I was raised in an IFBC and clearly remember the circumstances surrounding what has been my pain and fear for 30+ years. As a 5 year old I heard a Sunday night sermon about hell and that night I was unable to sleep. I ran to my parents' room in tears with unbearable fear and begged my dad to tell me what words I needed to say to God to make sure I didn't go to hell. I just repeated what he said but certainly had no concept of how sinful I was (or am) and no concept about the sacrifice of Christ. I simply knew hell was real and that God could save me from it. For the next 15 years I asked God to save me dozens (or more likely hundreds) of times. I dreaded salvation messages because of the fear that would strike me. Many times I ignored the fear but would later ask God "to save me if I'm not already saved" (repeated this over and over). I paid little attention to the sufficiency of Christ and His love and how wonderful He is. I was so fearful of dying that I would panic any time we were doing any activity that could result in my death (roller coasters, swimming, etc.). I spent my childhood with a fear of death and hell.

I felt called to ministry (not sure if that was a true calling) at an early age and attended college to be a pastor/evangelist...all while doubting my salvation. As a freshman in college studying Romans 9 I begged God to save me. I sat in the front row of church each week to learn about the Bible but instead would be overcome with fear. I repeatedly had to be told by pastors and mentors that I was saved and didn't need to keep "coming forward" after sermons. I decided again my Senior Year to follow God and that lasted a whole (3) months. I never did become a preacher or evangelist (as a profession).

For the next 10 years I ignored my fears and lived for myself. Claiming to be a Christian I partied with alcohol most every weekend. But I never stopped believing the truth of the Bible and that God is real and that Biblical salvation is the only way to heaven...I just didn't act like it. I defended the Bible to my "drinking" friends and would be pained to hear them curse God or talk down about Him. I married a wonderful Christian woman who had a definite conversion experience and loves God.

In 2011, I decided to "give up" my partying ways and go back to God. What happened then could only be described as pure torture. I began to read the Bible, Ephesians specifically. For the first time in my life the words "In Christ" jumped off the page at me and I began to go into full panic mode. What did that mean? How had I missed that part of the Bible? While working so hard to get saved I had missed the fact that Christ was the answer. What was later described as "scrupulosity" began to take over my life. I was terrified that I had missed my call to be saved. That I had rejected Christ too long. That I was never saved and could never be. The sins of my past rushed into the forefront of my mind. I prayed through Psalm 51 in wretched tears. I attempted on numerous occasions to "surrender to Jesus" only I couldn't. My mind would not allow me to. At times I felt close but couldn't fully accept Jesus as Savior because something was blocking me. That "block" to me was my indication that I had missed my chance. For nearly 6 months I could barely eat, sleep, work...be a person frankly. I went to many a Christian counselor while refusing medication. But in the end, a Christian Psychiatrist convinced me to take Zoloft. In a matter a weeks it worked. I survived, kept my job, and kept my marriage. The panic went away. The anxiety went away. But in the back of my mind I felt it was only because of the meds and not because I had surrendered. I stayed away from anything that would bring anxiety on (tough passages, conferences). I attended church and would cry most times bc I wanted what others had but couldn't get. But the meds took the constant worry away.

Fast forward to January of 2016. I have two beautiful children, a great wife, great job, great new church and church friends. But its happening again. I am back to terrible thoughts of condemnation with no way of escape. I began a Bible reading program January 4th and have been slowly getting worse since. I cannot read the Bible without terrible anxiety and condemnation. I cannot pray without intense pain in my mind and heart. Every week at church I have to hold back my tears as the worship music plays. I sing and love it but know its real to others and not me.

I am at a loss for what to do. I know Jesus is Lord and the only way to God. I believe the Bible in its entirety. And I know its only God's grace that I have anything or anyone in my life. But my mind will not allow it to be real for me.

I cannot find any scripture where a person thought they were saved, ran from God and then came back in their late 30s to be saved. I have never felt Joy or Peace or longed for a relationship with Christ. Only wanted to get out of hell. I don't believe I rejected God as a child...I did what I thought was right to get saved.

Does anyone have a similar story yet have found victory in Christ?

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I can so relate. I thought I became a Christian when I was 16. I know things changed. I loved scripture, going to church, sharing Christ with others and what He did for me. Then I turned away, stopped having anything to do with church, etc. I sought other things—relationships. When the relationship ended, I returned to God. This happened again. However, the sins were numerous. I won’t bother with the details. Just know I lived like the world. Once again, when the relationship ended, I returned to God. This behavior repeated 2 more times. i am now 67. This is where I find myself:
I am in constant fear of hell and under constant condemnation. While I believe in Christ (even the devil believes), I can no longer have a personal faith. I have searched for and prayed to God for some kind of hope, restoration. I am convinced I have crossed the line and now am rejected by God with no recourse.

I base all of this on scriptures.

Heb 10:26-29. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Matthew 7:21-27
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

Numbers 15:24-31 - ““ ‘But anyone who sins defiantly, whether native-born or foreigner, blasphemes the Lord and must be cut off from the people of Israel. Because they have despised the Lord’s word and broken his commands, they must surely be cut off; their guilt remains on them.’ ””
‭
Hebrews 6:4-6 - “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”
‭‭
2Peter 2:20-22 - “If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and are overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them. Of them the proverbs are true: “A dog returns to its vomit,” and, “A sow that is washed returns to her wallowing in the mud.””

Romans 9:13 and following

I now cannot pray, read the Bible, go to church, listen to sermons or Christian music, attend bible studies, etc. because I become very uncomfortable and distressed; believing I am now an enemy of God (reprobate) and under the wrath of God. Therefore, I now longer can claim any of the promises in scripture for those who are in Christ. I also think to myself why bother to try and return, repent or seek God. When I’ve tried, I obtain no comfort or hope. Only the same—over and over. My sins, as never before, are brought to my mind constantly. My thoughts about all of this are so obsessive I cannot function properly.

I probably can’t be helped. However why I am posting this is I would like someone to talk to, i.e., how to live under this torment. Suicide is not the option because I believe I’m going to hell.

Fearful said:

probably can’t be helped. However why I am posting this is I would like someone to talk to, i.e., how to live under this torment. Suicide is not the option because I believe I’m going to hell.

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Something similar had happened to me, with the thoughts. Ask God to pull you out of the hole you find yourself in.

What helped me was putting on Christian music anyway and listen to it until they change. It will force the thoughts, feelings to come up, which will force you to confront them, pray about them and pour it out to God.

The thoughts / feelings that come up are very uncomfortable, condemning, they make you feel alone, isolated, not a child of God, but the opposite.

You have to force yourself to keep listening to the music and confront it. Like I said, will be uncomfortable and hopefully there will be tears.

Fearful said:

I can so relate. I thought I became a Christian when I was 16. I know things changed. I loved scripture, going to church, sharing Christ with others and what He did for me. Then I turned away, stopped having anything to do with church, etc. I sought other things—relationships. When the relationship ended, I returned to God. This happened again. However, the sins were numerous. I won’t bother with the details. Just know I lived like the world. Once again, when the relationship ended, I returned to God. This behavior repeated 2 more times. i am now 67. This is where I find myself:
I am in constant fear of hell and under constant condemnation. While I believe in Christ (even the devil believes), I can no longer have a personal faith. I have searched for and prayed to God for some kind of hope, restoration. I am convinced I have crossed the line and now am rejected by God with no recourse.

I base all of this on scriptures.

Heb 10:26-29. For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

Matthew 7:21-27
“Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.’

Numbers 15:24-31 - ““ ‘But anyone who sins defiantly, whether native-born or foreigner, blasphemes the Lord and must be cut off from the people of Israel. Because they have despised the Lord’s word and broken his commands, they must surely be cut off; their guilt remains on them.’ ””
‭
Hebrews 6:4-6 - “It is impossible for those who have once been enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift, who have shared in the Holy Spirit, and who have fallen away, to be brought back to repentance. To their loss they are crucifying the Son of God all over again and subjecting him to public disgrace.”
‭‭
2Peter 2:20-22 - “If they have escaped the corruption of the world by knowing our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and are again entangled in it and are overcome, they are worse off at the end than they were at the beginning. It would have been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than to have known it and then to turn their backs on the sacred command that was passed on to them. Of them the proverbs are true: “A dog returns to its vomit,” and, “A sow that is washed returns to her wallowing in the mud.””

Romans 9:13 and following

I now cannot pray, read the Bible, go to church, listen to sermons or Christian music, attend bible studies, etc. because I become very uncomfortable and distressed; believing I am now an enemy of God (reprobate) and under the wrath of God. Therefore, I now longer can claim any of the promises in scripture for those who are in Christ. I also think to myself why bother to try and return, repent or seek God. When I’ve tried, I obtain no comfort or hope. Only the same—over and over. My sins, as never before, are brought to my mind constantly. My thoughts about all of this are so obsessive I cannot function properly.

I probably can’t be helped. However why I am posting this is I would like someone to talk to, i.e., how to live under this torment. Suicide is not the option because I believe I’m going to hell.

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This is a very, very common obsession, and many people with this kind of OCD feel like they have no hope. You are not alone! Do you have any support, any kind of resources, for helping you to deal with this?
Here are two resources that I would like to recommend, as a starting point...
Jaimie Eckert's blog; she also offer coaching.
The Facebook support group Christianity and Anxiety Disorders.

sold4christ25 said:

Hi, i'm not sure but I think we've been over the ocd thing before . I feel I have it to a large degree but I also really,struggle with believing I'm forgiven because of the things my mind goes through.

I have a question for you ( since you seem to have a decent handle on the whole scrupulosity/ocd thing) - and forgive me if I've asked this before because my ocd revolves around my backsliding/sinning state, but, do you feel like ocd can also make us latch on to a repeating sign that makes us feel condemned, like seeing a repeated number ( for me its the number 7 that ive been holding on to for a few years when i felt that i walked away from God or God cut me off because i chose to continue in some sins that he had been speaking to my heart to change for a while ) that cross associates with a condemning thought and reaffirms that belief of being condemned ? Is that the ocd or a true sign?

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I am so sorry, it seems that I never responded to this! How have you been doing lately?