Bobby Jindal proposes doing away with Supreme Court

Nic Samojluk said:

Gays can buy any cake offered for sale. It is unfair for gays to force me to bake a cake that is offensive to my religion. It would be unfair to force an artist to sculpt or paint an indecent work of art.

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You're not being forced, you agreed to do it when you opened a bakery to the public.

"Indecent art" is not a protected class.

Nic Samojluk said:

Yes, they are killing a sacred ritual invented by God. It represents an act of rebellion against heaven.

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No they are not.

Nic Samojluk said:

They can disagree, but they have no right to impose this on the entire country.

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Actually they do. Because, you know, it's kinda like their job.

PapaZoom said:

We must be talking about two different things.

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Then perhaps it would be helpful to pay attention to the conversation.

Nic Samojluk said:

It means that offering a marriage certificate to those who do not qualify is wrong. Marriage is not a right, but a privilege to those who comply with the requirements. Society does not offer college or university degrees to those who do not qualify.

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You say they don't qualify, the law disagrees with you. Deal with it.

PapaZoom said:

It's better if you were to give a specific example of something that is actually happening rather than asking a generalized question. Besides, we're specifically talking about the SSM issue and there's no need to speculate on questions that are not currently issues.

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Something happening; gays being denied service in some circumstances; cakes, photo's etc.

I mentioned, what if these owners who wished to deny service when they wanted to, would be able to, if they first notified the public they serve, which situations they would deny customers.

You stated forewarning the public should not be done and it wouldn't fly, because businesses would be targeted because they discriminate. I then asked you, why would this fly, because denying service to the public, is likely to be discovered anyway, as we have.

If you walked into a publically accommodating business to buy a product or service you wanted from that establishment specifically, what would your reaction be if you were turned down because of the owners religious beliefs?

TLK Valentine said:

Name one liberal presidential contender (heck, name one liberal politician) who has ever -- ever -- proposed dissolving the Supreme Court at any time for any reason.

Just one will do.

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FDR wanted to pack the court which is also the same. He wanted to put more judges on there in order to get the expansion he wanted on the commercial clause

Nic Samojluk said:

Yes, and 82 percent disapprove of abortion. For me the killing of innocent unborn children is worse than gay marriage.

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Wrong.

The United States is split right down the middle on abortion.

http://www.gallup.com/poll/170249/split-abortion-pro-choice-pro-life.aspx

Nic Samojluk said:

Yes! Imagine if one day the university that granted you a hard earned degree begins to give it away to anybody who does not qualify for it. Your piece of paper will loose value.

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The problem is, not everyone agrees with your qualifications.

Nic Samojluk said:

They can disagree, but they have no right to impose this on the entire country.

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Well they do, if they have a majority.

Nic Samojluk said:

Did you miss the testimony of those who have worked in restaurants and testified that such things do occur sometimes? I think that from now on I will eat at home!

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I asked you what kind of Christian would spit in a cake they were selling to someone?

Nic Samojluk said:

Yes! Imagine if one day the university that granted you a hard earned degree begins to give it away to anybody who does not qualify for it. Your piece of paper will loose value.

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This particular "university" has been handing out "degrees" in drive-thru chapels to drunken couples for a long time now. If you think the value of your marriage certificate lies in its exclusivity, then you have strange values.

Nic Samojluk said:

Gays can buy any cake offered for sale. It is unfair for gays to force me to bake a cake that is offensive to my religion. It would be unfair to force an artist to sculpt or paint an indecent work of art.

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In states/localities in which anti-discrimination laws apply to sexual orientation are in place, the question the baker has to ask himself is pretty much "would I be willing to make the exact same cake for a straight couple?". If the answer is "yes" then, failing to make the cake (or rather, supplying the cake, as you can use a third party if need be) is a violation of the law.

Scenario A:
- "Hi, I'd like to order a cake, it's for a same sex wedding".
- "Sorry, we don't make wedding cakes"
(Legal)

Scenario B:
- "Hi, I'd like to order a cake, it's for a same sex wedding".
- "Sorry, we make wedding cakes, but not for same sex weddings"
(Illegal)

Scenario C:
- "Hi, I'd like to order a cake, it's for a same sex wedding. I'd like you to write 'yay same sex marriage' all over it.
- "No. I have a religious objection to that"
(Legal)

Scenario D:
- "Hi, I'd like to order a cake, it's for a same sex wedding. I want one that looks just like this one in your brochure here."
- "No. I have a religious objection to that"
(Illegal)

DaisyDay said:

This particular "university" has been handing out "degrees" in drive-thru chapels to drunken couples for a long time now. If you think the value of your marriage certificate lies in its exclusivity, then you have strange values.

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Isn't that the "university" with the Britney Spears "degree"?

bhsmte said:

The problem is, not everyone agrees with your qualifications.

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No, the problem is that Nic Samojluk does not get to decide what the qualifications are.

AirPo said:

No, the problem is that Nic Samojluk does not get to decide what the qualifications are.

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Yea, that too.

TLK Valentine said:

Packing the court is not the same as dissolving it -- somewhat less permanent.

But I see your point.

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It is also worth pointing out that term limits have been implemented, meaning it is unlikely any president will have the opportunity to pack the court in the future.

bhsmte said:

Something happening; gays being denied service in some circumstances; cakes, photo's etc.

I mentioned, what if these owners who wished to deny service when they wanted to, would be able to, if they first notified the public they serve, which situations they would deny customers.

You stated forewarning the public should not be done and it wouldn't fly, because businesses would be targeted because they discriminate. I then asked you, why would this fly, because denying service to the public, is likely to be discovered anyway, as we have.

If you walked into a publically accommodating business to buy a product or service you wanted from that establishment specifically, what would your reaction be if you were turned down because of the owners religious beliefs?

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It's not about being gay. It's about SSM and it's about servicing a gay wedding. No gays are walking into a store and told "we don't serve gays."