What The Bible Says About Homosexuality

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Ted
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Hi glenagail,

Read over your post. So, it is your faith that the word is used to refer to homosexual slave traders? However, you refer to three, what are the other two and why do you find this one to be especially more 'correct'?

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted
 
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mdancin4theLord

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I grew up in the church and always looked at homosexuality as a sin. But I recently read the Bible from cover to cover and am now re-reading the NT and really studying what I am reading. I'll admit that I am struggling what to think on this issue.

In Roman's 8 we are given an absolute truth from the Bible... nothing can separate us from God's love. I believe this. The message of God's grace isn't for the "holy" or those who believe they are sinless... the message of grace is radical and clearly demonstrated by Jesus to be inclusive to all peoples and all understandings.

The verses that reference homosexuality seem to suggest the "sin" isn't same sex relationships, but those individuals who use sex solely for the purpose of gain, satisfaction, and selfish desire.

I would refer everyone to the parable of the wheat and weeds (Matthew 13: 24-30). I don't think homosexuality as a sin is clear in the Bible, much like you can't distinguish between the young wheat from the weeds. In the end God will make that final judgment. Paul said that God's grace is sufficient and nothing more is needed. This is the message to be proclaimed by everyone... sinners and those who attempt to live holy lives.


I believe that God is Holy...He can't look upon sin. I believe that all sex outside the marriage bed is just that. Sin separates one from God and He has made crystal clear what sin is in more than one scripture. If you can find me one example of sex outside marriage that isn't sin, I will change my position. The fact is you can't because God does not condone it for homosexuals or heterosexuals. In fact lust is sin and throughout scripture sodomy is condemned.


Matthew 19:4-6 says, “ And Jesus answered and said unto them, “Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.”

This shows Gods plan for creation...the order and function of the family and how it works....one male who leaves his parents...and cleaves to one female and they should become ONE. This is the only union God recognizes. There is not one example in thousands of years of history in the Bible where God condones same sex marriage....no example exists.

God tells us what will happen in the scriptures, it should not come as any surprise to anyone who reads the scriptures.
 
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mdancin4theLord

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As I mentioned earlier, I am struggling to understand this issue. I am not 100% positive that God looks at homosexuality as a sin.

I think the post by glennagail has some interesting points. When I read the bible, I thought Paul was condemning promiscuity and not so much homosexuality. That's why I don't want to be quick to judge on what is or is not a sin. Only God can say for certain.

This is one issue that I will probably never be completely satisfied on what God thinks. I am not gay, so it doesn't concern me personally. I just have faith that God loves his children and all that believe will be saved. Only those that reject Him will be denied salvation.

So you ever wonder why there is not one example of same sex marriage or unions where God seems to condone them in the entire Bible? Why when God instituted marriage it was one man and one woman?

When I try to make the case for anything, I do a deductive Bible study of the scriptures that pertain to the subject...then I weigh the evidence making a list of all the scriptures for and against to see which one seems more logical.

There is no case that i can see where God condones sex outside marriage or same sex marriage. None. At least none exists in the Old or New Testament. Sin is ANY SEX outside marriage period whether heterosexuals or homosexuals are doing it. This issue I believe has NOTHING to do with salvation as I believe only one sin keeps one from eternal salvation with God...and that is denying Christ. This is not a hate or a bashing issue.....everyones conduct is in question. This topic has to do with homsexuality. If we had a thread talking about all sex sin......or premarital sex...involving heterosexuals that would be sin too.

You said this issue does not really involve you...but if you are a Christian you should care and you should stand up for the Word and what Christ said telling people and sharing the Good News, especially about sin. I would urge you to do a study on this like I did, maybe that would help. :)
 
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mdancin4theLord

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Are we the same as animals, really? If we are then killing an ant is just as bad as killing a human morally. Killing an animal by hunting, fishing would be murder.

Cutting the grass would be wrong...think of the little critters in the grass. Walking down the street ........can't do........think of the little ants and bugs.

And dont even think of swatting a fly or mosquito..........
 
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glennagail

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I believe that God is Holy...He can't look upon sin. I believe that all sex outside the marriage bed is just that. Sin separates one from God and He has made crystal clear what sin is in more than one scripture. If you can find me one example of sex outside marriage that isn't sin, I will change my position. The fact is you can't because God does not condone it for homosexuals or heterosexuals. In fact lust is sin and throughout scripture sodomy is condemned.


Matthew 19:4-6 says, “ And Jesus answered and said unto them, “Have ye not read, that he which made [them] at the beginning made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh. Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.”

This shows Gods plan for creation...the order and function of the family and how it works....one male who leaves his parents...and cleaves to one female and they should become ONE. This is the only union God recognizes. There is not one example in thousands of years of history in the Bible where God condones same sex marriage....no example exists.

God tells us what will happen in the scriptures, it should not come as any surprise to anyone who reads the scriptures.

You know I've been thinking about the verse in Matt. which is a quote from Gen. Not in the new testament but throughout the old testament the men of God had more than one wife. My son and I searched for scriptures when he was getting married to see what if any requirements there were to declare a couple married (he wanted to make sure to include them) there is none that is clear. Not sure what that means. I wonder if the reason that God did not put any same gender marriages in the bible is that, there just were not enough people who needed to know about that. He didn't write about people with mental illness either. Though I am quite sure, some of the people Jesus healed were mentally ill. I am also sure there were mentally ill people throughout all time. I by the way agree with you that sex outside of marriage is always wrong I'm just not sure that it means same gender marriage is wrong
 
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glennagail

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Hi glenagail,

Read over your post. So, it is your faith that the word is used to refer to homosexual slave traders? However, you refer to three, what are the other two and why do you find this one to be especially more 'correct'?

God bless you,
In Christ, Ted

I had to go back and read my post. It did refer to three now I have to go back and see if I saved the link that came from. It just made sense. I have read in other place ( I think even strongs) that traslate the word as meaning a male with many bed partners. Which is traslated into homosexual which I know is wrong because that is not what being gay is all about. I will get back to you if I can find it I will post the other three

blessings
glenna
 
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mdseverin

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What I find interesting is we outlaw gay marriage. If we allowed gay marriage, then it wouldn't be sex outside the marriage and not a sin. I know this is not going to convince anyone because everyone wants to say marriage is between a man and a woman. But just throwing it out there.
 
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mrmccormo

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What I find interesting is we outlaw gay marriage. If we allowed gay marriage, then it wouldn't be sex outside the marriage and not a sin. I know this is not going to convince anyone because everyone wants to say marriage is between a man and a woman. But just throwing it out there.
The question still remains whether or not God views that as "marriage". There are plenty of things the law permits that God still considers a sin.

"What God has joined together, let no man separate". So far, I've only been able to find examples of God joining together man and woman. So far, I've only been able to find doctrine that affirms a union between a man and a woman. Heck, I can even find examples where God tolerated marriage between one man and several women. But I cannot find a single instance in which God joined together two men in marriage or two women in marriage.

So, though the State may slap the word "marriage" on something, that doesn't mean that God has "joined them together".
 
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mdseverin

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The question still remains whether or not God views that as "marriage". There are plenty of things the law permits that God still considers a sin.

"What God has joined together, let no man separate". So far, I've only been able to find examples of God joining together man and woman. So far, I've only been able to find doctrine that affirms a union between a man and a woman. Heck, I can even find examples where God tolerated marriage between one man and several women. But I cannot find a single instance in which God joined together two men in marriage or two women in marriage.

So, though the State may slap the word "marriage" on something, that doesn't mean that God has "joined them together".

All true and I agree with you. But just for the sake of argument, there are a lot of things mentioned in the Bible that God neither directly condemns nor approves of (having multiple wives, slavery, etc.) So, just because God does not reference same sex marriage, it does not necessary mean he disapproves of it.
 
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mrmccormo

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All true and I agree with you. But just for the sake of argument, there are a lot of things mentioned in the Bible that God neither directly condemns nor approves of (having multiple wives, slavery, etc.) So, just because God does not reference same sex marriage, it does not necessary mean he disapproves of it.
There's a third option: things that God permits. God permitted multiple wives, divorce, rape, and slavery (there are actually some very facinating and pretty darn reasonable justifications for slavery in the OT law) because of our weak, sinful nature. There are explicit and specific laws regarding all of these things that he permits. But He never permits homosexuality. At worst, He condemns it, but at the least He certainly does not permit it nor approve it. The argument that God permits it out of His silence doesn't work, because God obviously took the time to permit certain things explicitly in Scripture. Like I mentioned, God even permits RAPE and laid down specific laws as to when rape should lead to forced marriage or the death penalty. Of course, God never declares that rape is not a sin. Rather, He gives us laws to deal with it. Once again, no such permission on homosexuality.

And we know that homosexuality existed during the time of the Bible. Heck, scientists would like us to believe that "it is natural" so therefore it certainly was around during Biblical times. So again, the argument of "the Bible is silent on airplanes. Are those wrong too?" is silly, because they didn't exist at the time.

So, I cannot accept the defense that "God neither condemns nor approves of homosexual behavior" as if that means anything. There is not a single instance when God permits it in either the OT or the NT. There are plenty of times when God condemns homosexuality (though defenders of the gay/lesbian lifestyle are quick to interpret these verses in their own special way, even though these verses were never interpreted that way for 1,000s of years), and He even takes the time to clarify and permit other things. He gives specifics as to when divorce is appropriate. He tells us that lust and anger are just as sinful as adultery and murder. He told Peter that "unclean" animals were fine to eat. Heck, God even clarified what a man should do if he has a "wet dream"! And yet, we can never find God clarifying, approving, or even permitting homosexuality. We can only find Him disapproving of it.

And I must wonder: are we doing anybody a favor by trying to justify it? The Bible is pretty clear that when we say "I have no sin", we make God out to be a liar. I am cautious to call anything "not sin". Jesus saved the life of the adulterous woman by saying "he who is without sin may cast the first stone", but Jesus still sent her away with the admonition to "go, and sin no longer". He never made excuses for her sin. Even though Christians can be very hateful and abusive to homosexuals (and we should stop that behavior), we can't defend them, send them away, and say "go, you are not a sinner".
 
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mdseverin

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There's a third option: things that God permits. God permitted multiple wives, divorce, rape, and slavery (there are actually some very facinating and pretty darn reasonable justifications for slavery in the OT law) because of our weak, sinful nature. There are explicit and specific laws regarding all of these things that he permits. But He never permits homosexuality. At worst, He condemns it, but at the least He certainly does not permit it nor approve it. The argument that God permits it out of His silence doesn't work, because God obviously took the time to permit certain things explicitly in Scripture. Like I mentioned, God even permits RAPE and laid down specific laws as to when rape should lead to forced marriage or the death penalty. Of course, God never declares that rape is not a sin. Rather, He gives us laws to deal with it. Once again, no such permission on homosexuality.

And we know that homosexuality existed during the time of the Bible. Heck, scientists would like us to believe that "it is natural" so therefore it certainly was around during Biblical times. So again, the argument of "the Bible is silent on airplanes. Are those wrong too?" is silly, because they didn't exist at the time.

So, I cannot accept the defense that "God neither condemns nor approves of homosexual behavior" as if that means anything. There is not a single instance when God permits it in either the OT or the NT. There are plenty of times when God condemns homosexuality (though defenders of the gay/lesbian lifestyle are quick to interpret these verses in their own special way, even though these verses were never interpreted that way for 1,000s of years), and He even takes the time to clarify and permit other things. He gives specifics as to when divorce is appropriate. He tells us that lust and anger are just as sinful as adultery and murder. He told Peter that "unclean" animals were fine to eat. Heck, God even clarified what a man should do if he has a "wet dream"! And yet, we can never find God clarifying, approving, or even permitting homosexuality. We can only find Him disapproving of it.

And I must wonder: are we doing anybody a favor by trying to justify it? The Bible is pretty clear that when we say "I have no sin", we make God out to be a liar. I am cautious to call anything "not sin". Jesus saved the life of the adulterous woman by saying "he who is without sin may cast the first stone", but Jesus still sent her away with the admonition to "go, and sin no longer". He never made excuses for her sin. Even though Christians can be very hateful and abusive to homosexuals (and we should stop that behavior), we can't defend them, send them away, and say "go, you are not a sinner".

All very interesting points. The only thing I would clarify is that I don't think homosexual Christians are saying they do not have sin, just that gay sex is not a sin if they are in a committed relationship.

The reason why I am so interested in this topic is because the pastor that confirmed me and played a very instrumental role in my Christian life is gay. His sermons and guidance really made me love going to church and developed my faith. At the time I was a member of this church he was not "out." I just recently found this out when I did a Google search to see where he was a pastor at.
 
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christdiedforus

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All true and I agree with you. But just for the sake of argument, there are a lot of things mentioned in the Bible that God neither directly condemns nor approves of (having multiple wives, slavery, etc.) So, just because God does not reference same sex marriage, it does not necessary mean he disapproves of it.


Well then you just don't know what the scriptures say or you can't come to an agreement with what God has said.

“At last!” the man exclaimed. “This one is bone from my bone,
and flesh from my flesh!
She will be called ‘woman,’
because she was taken from ‘man.’”
This explains why a man leaves his father and mother and is joined to his wife, and the two are united into one.
The scriptures never anywhere say or condone anything other than this, you are mistaken, like so many others. Grasping at straws while denying Gods truth. That certainly does not substantiate your case except in your own mind. God does not condone what you are saying anywhere in scripture but He does condone a man being married to a woman. Nothing more, nothing less.

just that gay sex is not a sin if they are in a committed relationship.

And they can say that all they like but until God says it they are wrong.
 
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mrmccormo

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All very interesting points. The only thing I would clarify is that I don't think homosexual Christians are saying they do not have sin, just that gay sex is not a sin if they are in a committed relationship.

The reason why I am so interested in this topic is because the pastor that confirmed me and played a very instrumental role in my Christian life is gay. His sermons and guidance really made me love going to church and developed my faith. At the time I was a member of this church he was not "out." I just recently found this out when I did a Google search to see where he was a pastor at.
mdseverin, would you say that pre-marital sex is not a sin as long as it is done in a "committed relationship"?

God already defined what a "committed relationship" is. He called it "marriage", and he defined it as a man being joined to his wife in the sight of God. To say that God is silent on the marriage between two men or two women is about as silly as saying that God is silent on the marriage between a man and broomstick. God already defined marriage. Does a gay "committed relationship" or even a gay "marriage" according to the laws of the government fit God's definition of a "committed relationship"?
 
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Inviserator

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I believe God is OK with a man loving another man, and a women loving another women, but I don't believe he is OK with them having sex. If someone is truly saved, they wouldn't take a chance, even the smallest one of offending God by willfully doing something that "might" be sinful. As far as homosexual sex, I think you have to be completely self deluding to say that it is not sinful. I don't know what Bible they are reading but mine is clear on the issue.

So if they have so much "Love" for each other, let them love without sex. If they feel the relationship fruitless without sex, then I guess sex is all they were worried about anyway. If God explicitly told me that I may not have sex with my wife ever, I wouldn't. Sex isn't even that big of a deal (Since baptized by the Holy Spirit), I find it fascinating how all these people grab and grasp trying to hold on to the flesh, all the while professing how much they love the spirit.
 
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scrofford

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All very interesting points. The only thing I would clarify is that I don't think homosexual Christians are saying they do not have sin, just that gay sex is not a sin if they are in a committed relationship.

The reason why I am so interested in this topic is because the pastor that confirmed me and played a very instrumental role in my Christian life is gay. His sermons and guidance really made me love going to church and developed my faith. At the time I was a member of this church he was not "out." I just recently found this out when I did a Google search to see where he was a pastor at.

So if you think that gay sex is not a sin, and that it's ok to live a homosexual lifestyle while proclaiming to be a Christian is ok, then I guess you don't agree with what the Bible says right?

If that's the case, then how can you even be a Christian? The Bible is very explicit and clear when it talks about homosexuality. You cannot be a Christian and be a homosexual. It's that simple. It's plain as day in the Bible.

I'm not saying homosexuals can't become Christians. Not at all. But when they do decide to give their lives to Christ, they must change their lifestyle. It's the same for anyone who is living a lifestyle contrary to the Word of God no matter what it is.
 
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scrofford

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I believe God is OK with a man loving another man, and a women loving another women, but I don't believe he is OK with them having sex. If someone is truly saved, they wouldn't take a chance, even the smallest one of offending God by willfully doing something that "might" be sinful. As far as homosexual sex, I think you have to be completely self deluding to say that it is not sinful. I don't know what Bible they are reading but mine is clear on the issue.

So if they have so much "Love" for each other, let them love without sex. If they feel the relationship fruitless without sex, then I guess sex is all they were worried about anyway. If God explicitly told me that I may not have sex with my wife ever, I wouldn't. Sex isn't even that big of a deal (Since baptized by the Holy Spirit), I find it fascinating how all these people grab and grasp trying to hold on to the flesh, all the while professing how much they love the spirit.

This is also flawed. The intent of the heart is still present and its your heart that condemns you. Just because you don't commit the act doesn't mean its not in the heart. God looks at the intent of the heart.

Not to mention, if you have it in your heart, sooner or later it's going to come out in your actions. That's with anything.

Again, the Bible says that homosexuality is wrong. You cannot be a Christian and live for God if you continue any way in that lifestyle. It's that simple.
 
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That practicing homosexuality is against God is within the bible. That said it's also true that homosexuality would have died out if it were a genetic freak (no offspring)

God is love but God is, first and foremost, justice. That means Heaven and Hell, right and wrong. Homosexuality is perversion of His order which He allows to live until the time of judgement, created by Satan.

So what if you are homosexual? Are you the "cursed and damned?" No, but you have been handed a cross that is hellish to bare. To crave human love is in God's plan "it is not good that the man is alone"

I do not know the answer, other than abstinence.

The fundamental thing is that you are clean with God. This world not only ends but it's forgotten, the moment you die and are judged. Nothing, no-one and nadda you ever held true means squat when you face Him.
 
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