Your thoughts on...

[Chris V++]

Hi I'm a first time poster. Please delete if not appropriate for me to post. I was wondering what the Messianic perspective is on Icons, Sculpture, and Western religious art. I 'm learning about the Iconography tradition in Orthodox which is believed to date back to around the 1st Century. There is an icon depiction of St. Luke painting a portrait of Mary and Jesus with his hand being guided by an angel. The imagery in the icons are said to be divinely inspired and can even facilitate miracles and also reaching out to Saints for intercession. The Icon'writers' pray and fast and the icons are prayed over and left at the altar as part of the preparation.

I know Catholic and Orthodox churches have traditions that are said to date back to the apostles. So I'm thinking wouldn't traditions received from the Jewish apostles then have been rooted in Judaism? I know there was debate among the apostles about circumcision and also keeping other aspects of the law. Could there have been new traditions given such as Iconography? Was there anything like Iconography in Judaism or would it have been received in the same way as the protestant reformers received it.

I remember seeing a 'Naked Archeologist' documentary by Simcha Jacobovici where he visited an ancient Synagogue with, if memory serves, early Christian iconography-style paintings on the walls.

Thanks in advance!

 

[dqhall]

Hi I'm a first time poster. Please delete if not appropriate for me to post. I was wondering what the Messianic perspective is on Icons, Sculpture, and Western religious art. I 'm learning about the Iconography tradition in Orthodox which is believed to date back to around the 1st Century. There is an icon depiction of St. Luke painting a portrait of Mary and Jesus with his hand being guided by an angel. The imagery in the icons are said to be divinely inspired and can even facilitate miracles and also reaching out to Saints for intercession. The Icon'writers' pray and fast and the icons are prayed over and left at the altar as part of the preparation.

I know Catholic and Orthodox churches have traditions that are said to date back to the apostles. So I'm thinking wouldn't traditions received from the Jewish apostles then have been rooted in Judaism? I know there was debate among the apostles about circumcision and also keeping other aspects of the law. Could there have been new traditions given such as Iconography? Was there anything like Iconography in Judaism or would it have been received in the same way as the protestant reformers received it.

I remember seeing a 'Naked Archeologist' documentary by Simcha Jacobovici where he visited an ancient Synagogue with, if memory serves, early Christian iconography-style paintings on the walls.

Thanks in advance!

Attributing miracles to icons - religious art is idolatry. Paul was against idolatry.

During the Byzantine era some of the synagogue congregations used art to decorate their places. Archaeologists found a Zodiac mosaic floor in the ruins of a Byzantine synagogue at Beit Alpha in Israel. This Jewish congregation was Romanized/Hellenized. The Byzantine White Synagogue at Capernaum had some decorations of grapes, pomegranates, flowers, a menorah, etc. This was decorative. The Jews may have liked to look at them without thinking they were gods.

Some Christian art is decorative or illustrative. One ought not ascribe miracles to such things.

 

[Heber Book List]

Hi there, you are OK if you ask questions on this thread, which is what you have done.

Jews over the ages have taken seriously the command in Exodus 20:4, so I am thinking your question may not attract a great deal of information as regards Messianic Judaism.

Of course there are paintings and sculptures by Jews, but to take it further to become belief in some sort of worship and /or religious powers in inanimate objects is not a universal concept in Judaism. Kabbalah does use inanimate objects like necklaces, rings, and armbands, for protection, etc., but that is all I can think of, though someone else will have tell you about that as it is outside my area of understanding.

We do have some Eastern Orthodox posters on here, so perhaps they might give you some information.

 

[visionary]

I understand churches who venerate art would want to claim relationship to origin. I personally do not ascribed it that theory.

 

[Chris V++]

Thanks for all your replies. I started reading up on Kabbalah but haven't found anything yet that seemed to inspire Orthodox iconography.

I hope this doesn't seem like an absurd question, but if you had to choose, would you say MJ theology more closely resembles Protestant, Orthodox, or Catholic theology? Same question for tradition. Thanks again in advance!

 

[Heber Book List]

Thanks for all your replies. I started reading up on Kabbalah but haven't found anything yet that seemed to inspire Orthodox iconography.

I hope this doesn't seem like an absurd question, but if you had to choose, would you say MJ theology more closely resembles Protestant, Orthodox, or Catholic theology? Same question for tradition. Thanks again in advance!

There is no definitive MJ theology, as such - in fact a book has been written looking at all the MJ theologies. MJ is made up of many denominations, but the dominant strain is Protestant. As Catholics and Orthodox are the main groups with 'traditions' I'll leave them to comment on those