Your stand on homosexuality?

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Radrook

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If I had a certain behavior which I refuse to change because I consider it OK but a certain religious book and the religions based on it condemned, then I would reject the book and the religions and go to a religion or invent a religion that approves. I would not try to impose my personal interpretations or views on the book or on the religions which condemn it.
 
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BobRyan

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Yes indeed but what is disgusting is different for everyone. There are things in general that are but then there are specific things some find bad when others don't.

Which is why it is nice to have a "standard" for good vs evil - for sin vs righteousness - The Bible.
 
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BobRyan

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Can"t say as I agree, ChristsMercy. I think a great deal more needs to be said. I am wondering how many gays or other persons of alternative sexual lifestyles you have fever known. .

How many bank robbers have you known?
 
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Hoghead1

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Alright, Radbrook, then it also follows that a religion should not impose their views on a society that does not agree with them. Unfortunately, that is what happened in the past; and from what I see, many Christians today are trying to protest as much as they can to get legislators to change the laws so that they support their religious views on persons of alternative sexual lifestyles.
 
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Hoghead1

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I would be great, BobR, if you could stay on topic here. As to criminals, yes, I have had a lot of experience. Many of the clients I worked with in drug rehab. had criminal records as along as a mile, including rapists, murderers, pedophiles, you name it. I and my wife, a social worker, did have a counseling or rehab. program literally in a prison, up til the state cut the budget.
 
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Julie.S

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Which is why it is nice to have a "standard" for good vs evil - for sin vs righteousness - The Bible.
I understand that but I have trouble with things that are written during the time of an older civilization.
Of course there are some things that are the same as they where then. We do not have a lot of the things they once did though because we do not need them any longer. Laws where made and the world changed.
 
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Radrook

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I understand that but I have trouble with things that are written during the time of an older civilization.
Of course there are some things that are the same as they where then. We do not have a lot of the things they once did though because we do not need them any longer. Laws where made and the world changed.

So you have trouble with what was written about theft, dishonesty in commerce, adultery, habitual malicious lying, human sacrifice and incest as well because these things were also written during a time of an older civilization and because the world has changed?
 
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ChristsMercy

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Can"t say as I agree, ChristsMercy. I think a great deal more needs to be said. I am wondering how many gays or other persons of alternative sexual lifestyles you have fever known. I have an M.S.; in clinical psychology, am a licensed substance-abuse counselor, and have had oodles of experience with gays, lesbians, you name it. I find nothing sick, bizarre, or perverse in these people. Psychiatry now accepts such persons and no longer writes them off as sick, perverse, etc. Therefore, psychiatry has officially removed persons of alternative sexual lifestyles, such as gays, form its list of psychopathologies in the DSM-IV.
You aren't telling me you disagree, you are telling the bible. I didn't write it. Take it however you want. I unfortunately have to share a country and a planet with "people of alternative sexual lifestyles" so I know a few. Secondly, your "credentials" really have no bearing on what is morally just and right. Last of all, idc what you think, no matter how many people say a lie or falsehood, it will never be more true. So believe what you like, but stop trolling my comments, as this thread was meant to offer your opinion, not your critique of another members opinion.
 
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Julie.S

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So you have trouble with what was written about theft, dishonesty in commerce, adultery, habitual malicious lying, human sacrifice and incest as well because these things were also written during a time of an older civilization and because the world has changed?
It's good you asked that and the answer is no!

I also said "Of course there are somethings that are the same as they where then." Those things you mentioned have mostly stuck. I don't have a problem with that because those things are common sense mostly.

But on the same note the Bible has things in it that would be against the law today in a civilized society.
 
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Radrook

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It's good you asked that and the answer is no!

I also said "Of course there are somethings that are the same as they where then." Those things you mentioned have mostly stuck. I don't have a problem with that because those things are common sense mostly.

But on the same note the Bible has things in it that would be against the law today in a civilized society.

Then it really isn't the time-period in which it was written but other factors that are unrelated to the time period it was written in. Which is good since that other view is illogical while the view you provide now has a more rational basis.

But you raise certain issues that are very interesting.

You say that there are things which are recommended in the OT which present civilized societies would condemn? I agree. There certainly are. However, please keep well in mind that the OT condemns the LEGAL murder of millions of unborn humans being carried out with the approval of your civilized societies.

Exodus: 21:
22"If men struggle with each other and strike a woman with child so that she gives birth prematurely, yet there is no injury, he shall surely be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him, and he shall pay as the judges decide. 23"But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life,…

Also please keep in mind that today's so-called civilized societies have been known to establish death camps in order to systematically exterminate other human beings efficiently and systematically, via a slow starvation or via poisonous gas. Also, keep well in mind that today's so-called civilized societies are currently aiming diabolical weapons at one another, including at you, that not only threaten human existence but the existence of all life on Earth-both plant and animal.

One civilized society even incinerated or horrendously deformed hundreds of thousands of civilians by dropping those diabolical bombs on residential areas.

So in view of these facts, the term civilized sounds a bit hollow. IMHO

So how do those things stack up against your common sense?
 
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Julie.S

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Then it really isn't the time-period in which it was written but other factors that are unrelated to the time period it was written in. Which is good since that other view is illogical while the view you provide now has a more rational basis.

But you raise certain issues that are very interesting.

You say that there are things which are recommended in the OT which present civilized societies would condemn? I agree. There certainly are. However, please keep well in mind that the OT condemns the LEGAL murder of millions of unborn humans being carried out with the approval of your civilized societies.

Also please keep in mind that today's so-called civilized societies have been known to establish death camps in order to systematically exterminate other human beings efficiently and systematically, via a slow starvation or via poisonous gas. Also, keep well in mind that today's so-called civilized societies are currently aiming diabolical weapons at one another, including at you, that not only threaten human existence but the existence of all life on Earth-both plant and animal.

One civilized society even incinerated or horrendously deformed hundreds of thousands of civilians by dropping those diabolical bombs on residential areas.

So in view of these facts, the term civilized sounds a bit hollow. IMHO
Do you think I know none of those things?

Then again I'm not sure I believe all the Bible at this point I'm in a transition period right now.

I know the world is a harsh and sometimes bad place. It's civilized in ways it once was not though.

Remember I can also go and call some of the things you believe illogical if I wanted to.
 
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Radrook

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Do you think I know none of those things?

Then again I'm not sure I believe all the Bible at this point I'm in a transition period right now.

I know the world is a harsh and sometimes bad place. It's civilized in ways it once was not though.

Remember I can also go and call some of the things you believe illogical if I wanted to.

I agree that we have made certain progress in certain areas.
What I don't see is why we should consider the worldwide unanimous religious Christian approval of anal intercourse between males progress and its condemnation as being uncivilized.

Using that criteria, we would need to conclude that the ancient Greeks who viewed homosexuality as normal were more civilized than the Hebrews because the Hebrews didn't. That criterion for judging the degree of a society's being civilized or not just seems strange to me. Sorry. No offense intended but it just seems irrelevant to the term civilized.


BTW

No, I am sure you definitely are familiar with those things. But sometimes a reminder is called for if we fail to see such things as relevant to our views. Transition? OK. But in that transition there are claims you are making and I am calmly responding to those claims because I assumed that you are here to discuss these issues .

Please feel free to call anything I say illogical so we can discuss it. That is if indeed you wish to continue the discussion. If not, then, peace and thanks for the calm decent replies.
 
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Armoured

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Care to clarify?
I thought it was fairly obvious.

"Then they need to grow up and get a grip on reality.

Nobody has the right to "not be offended".
If you do disgusting things and people notice, expect some criticism." Awfully strong from someone who appears to be offended and doesn't wish to be criticised.
 
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Widlast

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I thought it was fairly obvious.

"Then they need to grow up and get a grip on reality.

Nobody has the right to "not be offended".
If you do disgusting things and people notice, expect some criticism." Awfully strong from someone who appears to be offended and doesn't wish to be criticised.
You liberals really have no clue, do you?
 
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Widlast

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I'm not a liberal, and even 8f I were, it wouldn't invalidate my point.
You had no "point".
Homosexuality is deviant behavior. Whether you analyze it from a moral, religious, or biological point of view, it is abnormal behavior. The whole point of "sex" is reproduction. Doing things that are a deviant mockery of the reproductive act are the definition of perversion.
 
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