Your opinion on our Presedent,George W. Bush Jr.,please.

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stray bullet

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Originally posted by juiblex
ugh. you know what? im sick of doing the research just to have my answers ignored on these boards. peoples exhibit A, the AA thread. forget it, if you want to accost me with the 'ideology' ad hominem, then you guys get nothing.

consider this argument moot.

I did nothing of the sort. I don't ignore you and I'm certainly not wanting to attack you. I'm trying to understand your viewpoint, specially why you were talking about Bush's economic policies and cited the Depression. His economic policies are nothing like the policies of the Depression.
 
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I did nothing of the sort. I don't ignore you and I'm certainly not wanting to attack you. I'm trying to understand your viewpoint, specially why you were talking about Bush's economic policies and cited the Depression. His economic policies are nothing like the policies of the Depression.

no, i never meant you... sorry, should be clearer. i just meant on the boards in general. i understand you would like some facts, but im a little too bogged down in work to get in to it, perhaps later.
 
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Rae

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I see...so you have no problem with Bush "keeping his options open" to use nuclear weapons on the innocent people of Iraq?

Sorry, but I don't think it's okay to irradiate another country because we don't like its leader, and I don't think it's okay to threaten to do so, even if it's just a ploy.
 
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Michael0701

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I snipped this out of an email my wife received the other day. Note: It is not the entire email, I left some out due to it's length.



 

Subject: Salute 
 
 

Have you noticed a difference in the salute given by our military men and women as President Bush walks by?
Most folks would not notice anything, but military people see it right away. 

Watch: When President Bush leaves his helicopter or Air Force One, the honor guards salute and face him as he
disembarks, then turn their faces towards him as he passes by. They continue to salute his back as he walks away. This kind of salute has not been seen in the previous eight years, though it is customary courtesy to the Commander-in-Chief. You see, soldiers aren't required to turn and face the President as they salute. They are not required to salute his back. They are only required to salute. They can remain face-forward the entire time. And that is what they did during Bill Clinton's entire Presidency. Our soldiers were forced to obey Clinton's orders, but they were not forced to respect him. From their salutes, we can surmise that they did not.


Why is such respect afforded to President Bush? He doesn't even know how to bite his lower lip and not get teary-eyed whenever he speaks! 

The following incident from Major General Van Antwerp may give us an insight. Gen. Antwerp is president of the Officers' Christian Fellowship. He lost nearly all his staff when the Pentagon was attacked Sept. 11. His executive officer LTC Brian Birdwell was badly burned and in the hospital when President Bush visited him. Our President spent time and prayed with Brian. As he was getting ready to leave, he went to the foot of Brian's bed and saluted. He held his salute until Brian was able to raise his burned and bandaged arm, ever so slowly, in return. The Commander-in-Chief never initiates a salute, except in the case of a Congressional Medal of Honor winner. The injured soldier did not have to return the salute. But he did, out of respect to his President - a Soldier's President. 

Congressman JC Watts (R. Oklahoma) said, "Character is doing the right thing when nobody is looking." The nation and world learned some of what our last President did when nobody was looking. That President was disbarred -- the worst disgrace (other than imprisonment) to a lawyer. 

CNN will have a difficult time shining his or his wife's tarnished images. 

In this time of war and danger, I am so grateful to have a President whom the soldiers salute -- fully.
 
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the_bUg

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Well, I am not the best candidate to be posting in this thread as my views tend to be rather extreme, but hey there has to be somebody out there willing to look past strong wording (which I find myself incapable of avoiding) and actually perhaps research the truths in what I will say. Moreover, I'm not the best public speaker and so more often than not my wording is murky at best.

Imho the united states of america is a murderous plutocracy guilty of heinous crimes against humanity all over the world (US foreign policy) who no one is willing to hold accountable for their actions.

On the whole idea of Gee Dubbya being a good president, well let's take a look at what he advocates. Anybody who does some reading on issues of american foreign policy will begin to see the impacts that these seemingly benign words can actually have. The fact that over the past 10 years Iraq via continuos american bombings and american instated (via the UN) economic sanctions directly  <--(in my view) causing the deaths of over 500, 000 iraqi (source Unicef study) children makes it for me pretty difficult to believe that George W. Bush endorsing further violence against Iraq is a fit candidate for presidency.

In case you didn't know, the United States Millitary used depleted uranium tipped missiles in the persian gulf war which to this day have left toxins all over the country causing cancer and severe birth defects.

Moreover, to quote the article at the following link, "In an act of stark cruelty, the US dominated Sanctions Committee refuses to permit Iraq to import the clean-up equipment that they desperately need to decontaminate their country of the Depleted Uranium ammunition that the US fired at them. Approximately 315 tons of DU dust was left by the use of this ammunition.The Sanctions Committee also refuses to allow the mass importation of anti-cancer treatments, which contain trace amounts of radio-isotopes, on the grounds that these constitute '...nuclear materials.."

 (some of the content at this link will be extremely disturbing to some viewers as there is actual photographs of severly deformed children, so please excercise discretion if you do choose to view, and if you choose not to you should at least go an read the article. Pictures are after the article) If you are interested in learning about this subject you can go and google (it's a search engine to those who don't know, google.com) and enter in the search criteria, "uranium birth defects iraq" and you will come up with more than enough information.

Edit: I had to take out the links as I'm not allowed to plug them in on a post.

Unfortunatly, because of the state of American Undemocracy the possibility of any candidate being elected that will actually make steps towards a non murderous america is an impossibility. Remember what happened to JFK?

Well, I'm sorry this was not more concise but I have spurts of writting able which quickly come and fizzle so if this post seems unfinished it is because it is. I am so much right now in the process of learning about the side of american history that the EXTREMELY biased media chooses not to tell that many of my ideas them self (which I have probably not even put forth in this post) are still in their formation process.

I guess I want to finish by speaking about a few of the things that I believe. I believe that god is saddened and righteously angry about EVERY innocent death and even more so were the dead not saved. I believe it is our responsibilitie as christians to extend our hands and reach out to those without christ. I believe it is our responsibilitie to defend what is right, and this includes protecting the innocent. I believe that christ calls me to feed the homeless and clothe the naked. Make the lame to walk and the blind to see through christ who is in me. I believe that the bible tells us to turn the other cheek. Why should I value my life more than an Iraqi life? I know that I am saved, and should I die I go to be with my father, but someone dying prematurely who has not been ministered to effectively, well this is a tragedy. Yeah, I think that's it for now. Just to finish off I'm gonna post some more links (less disturbing then the one above) and then end my assorted ramblings.

I think it is very possible this post will be deleted, but I would like to ask the mods to think twice about it and ask yourself if this is actually innapropriate or perhaps has simply offended your sensitivities. I pray that God will teach us all of compassion and love, and not war and hate. 

 

Heard of Noam Chomsky? He submits articles here. (yet again couldn't put the link in, but if you are interested you can google "znet").


“Few of us can easily surrender our belief that society must somehow make sense. The thought that The State has lost its mind and is punishing so many innocent people is intolerable. And so the evidence has to be internally denied.”

— Arthur Miller
playwright
 
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stray bullet

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Translator:

Originally posted by the_bUg
Well, I am not the best candidate to be posting in this thread as my views tend to be rather extreme, but hey there has to be somebody out there willing to look past strong wording (which I find myself incapable of avoiding) and actually perhaps research the truths in what I will say. Moreover, I'm not the best public speaker and so more often than not my wording is murky at best.

I'm an extremist Canadian with a lot of anger to release here which I've built up from reading a lot of left-wing propaganda that people with my mindset eat up like flies on honey.

Imho the united states of america is a murderous plutocracy guilty of heinous crimes against humanity all over the world (US foreign policy) who no one is willing to hold accountable for their actions.

I'd like to start out my post by stating just how far I've left reality. Apparently, I forgot to what great lengths the US went to stop the bloodshed in Iraq during the Gulf War, where Bush tried desperatly to reduce the enemy soldier casualities.

On the whole idea of Gee Dubbya being a good president, well let's take a look at what he advocates.

Let me make my arguments by regurgitating the propaganda I've gobbled up like maggots on fecies.

Anybody who does some reading on issues of american foreign policy will begin to see the impacts that these seemingly benign words can actually have. The fact that over the past 10 years Iraq via continuos american bombings and american instated (via the UN) economic sanctions directly  <--(in my view) causing the deaths of over 500, 000 iraqi (source Unicef study) children makes it for me pretty difficult to believe that George W. Bush endorsing further violence against Iraq is a fit candidate for presidency.

Rather than blaming the people at fault, I'll blame the US President. Liberals, such as myself, commonly ignore the actual causes of problems and find it easier to blame high up political or social leaders. Notice, I never mention Hussein or his regime, as this would be putting the fault on the actual persons resposible.

Unfortunatly, because of the state of American Undemocracy the possibility of any candidate being elected that will actually make steps towards a non murderous america is an impossibility. Remember what happened to JFK?

Because more people out of touch with reality like myself aren't involved in politics, democracy is therefore dead. Only in places controlled by liberal groups whose failed mentalities continue to cause economic and social damage, does democracy, in my warped mind, exist.

Well, I'm sorry this was not more concise but I have spurts of writting able which quickly come and fizzle so if this post seems unfinished it is because it is. I am so much right now in the process of learning about the side of american history that the EXTREMELY biased media chooses not to tell that many of my ideas them self (which I have probably not even put forth in this post) are still in their formation process.

I'm reading the proganda legitimate news-sources don't pick up. <they don't it for a reason, it's called credibility>

I guess I want to finish by speaking about a few of the things that I believe. I believe that god is saddened and righteously angry about EVERY innocent death and even more so were the dead not saved. I believe it is our responsibilitie as christians to extend our hands and reach out to those without christ. I believe it is our responsibilitie to defend what is right, and this includes protecting the innocent. I believe that christ calls me to feed the homeless and clothe the naked. Make the lame to walk and the blind to see through christ who is in me. I believe that the bible tells us to turn the other cheek. Why should I value my life more than an Iraqi life? I know that I am saved, and should I die I go to be with my father, but someone dying prematurely who has not been ministered to effectively, well this is a tragedy. Yeah, I think that's it for now. Just to finish off I'm gonna post some more links (less disturbing then the one above) and then end my assorted ramblings.

I want to associate my propanda with Christian morals and values, as you all might be less likely to immediatly reject it.

I think it is very possible this post will be deleted, but I would like to ask the mods to think twice about it and ask yourself if this is actually innapropriate or perhaps has simply offended your sensitivities. I pray that God will teach us all of compassion and love, and not war and hate.&nbsp;

I'd like to plea that my trollings go untouched by playing the "God" card. Nothing like reminding the mods you are a Christian brother to avoid trouble.

No hard feelings, this was meant as more humorous (as I came off seeming totally opposed to your views) than harsh. :)

I just find it fun sometimes.

God Bless.
 
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Underdog

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How come all who like the president refer to him as Bush, George Bush, or George W Bush, while people who don't like him, refer to him as 'Dubya'? For me, this display of immaturity and lack of respect for the individual, (whether you agree with his policies or not), greatly reduces the credibility of whatever else is said in the post. Like him or not, he is our president, and more importantly, a fellow human being, and should be treated with the same respect that you or I want to be treated.

That being said, I have mixed feelings about Bush. He is not the world's top public speaker. That's for sure. He looks like a deer in the headlights....lost, confused and scared. He does not have a sense of dignitary or diplomatic protocol. I saw him at some kind of meeting, and he was rocking back and forth on his chair like an eight year old.

On the other hand, I think he has an honest heart, and I think he is trying to do what's best for America.

For what it's worth, I have heard some claim that he is not really at the helm, but is merely a puppet, yielding to advisors every step of the way. This might be true, but further magnifies my earlier point that Bush is not the evil man some would make out to be. You can't have it both ways. Either Bush is soley masterminding all these contraversial policies, or he is not. And, if he is not, then you will have to agree with my overall view of him........He is in way over is head, and out of his league as the President of the United States.
 
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Corey

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A quick note about Reagan and his tax cuts. From 1981 to 1989, the tax burden on the top quintile of income earners decreased by approximately 15% while the bottom quintile the burden INCREASED by 15%.

I don't have the statistics available to me, though IIRC, there was a net decrease in jobs during the Reagon era. There was a net increase during Clinton's. Lest we not forget, Clinton increased taxes on the top bracket, and the economy seemed to do just fine.

Onto George:

AWOL for 22 months as a Air National Guardsman...yeah, that's integrity.

Legacy to Yale, performed middling yet still got into Harvard...which by the way, the students in the MBA program work in group not individually (anyone hear of social loafing?)

Displays an inability to think on his feet. Despite winning against Gore in the debates, my [admittedly armchair] opinion is that I coulda beat him. There is no way Bush would win in a formal debate.


He has already violated his oath to uphold the Constitution...Paraphrasing "I will appoint judges who will not do that..." referring to the Ninth Circuit Court's ruling on the Constutionality of "Under God" in the pledge. "No religious test shall be required to hold office." <from the Constitution>.

Blatantly engaging in class warfare...the tax cut is for the rich...

My biggest peeve...interfering in the process of science using blantantly political appointees.

John Ashcroft...enough said.

My opinion of the man as a leader is low. I'm fairly certain he's a very nice person and someone, that if knew him, I would get along with.
 
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Evangelion

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This...

he seems to think hes in some sort of Clint Eastwood movie where he can just shoot up all 'em bad guys and come out looking the hero.

personally, i would want a president who was vaguely intelligent. for example:

"You don't need to be smart to be president"
--Republican Congressman J.C. Watts_ - said at a February campaign appearance on Bush's behalf. Washington Post, 6/11/00

"Actually, I -- this may sound a little West Texan to you, but I like it. When I'm talking about -- when I'm talking about myself, and when he's talking about myself, all of us are talking about me."
--Hardball, MSNBC, May 31, 2000

"It's clearly a budget. It's got a lot of numbers in it."
--Reuters, May 5, 2000


oh dear. why do i get the impression hes just a bad sock puppet?

...deserves the widest possible hearing. :cool:
 
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gwyyn

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So if I went digging in all your guys pasts, and brought to everyone's attention the 'bad' things you have done in your PAST! Does that make you less of a man now, less of a leader, less of a citizen????

Just wondering, cause everyone seems to be living in the past!!
Can't change it, get over it??
 
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Evangelion

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gwynn -

So if I went digging in all your guys pasts, and brought to everyone's attention the 'bad' things you have done in your PAST! Does that make you less of a man now, less of a leader, less of a citizen????

Well, seeing as I never made any such accusations about Mr Bush, I hardly think that your objection is relevant. :)

Just wondering, cause everyone seems to be living in the past!!

Are they?

Can't change it, get over it??

Is that your advice to Mr Bush?

Good advice! :cool:
 
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Underdog

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Originally posted by Hector Medina
Underdog,

Thats an interesting statment there.

How do you think we'd be would If Al Gore were President???


In Christ,

Hector

Who knows? We could be worse off. We could be better off. We could be in the same boat. I am addressing the thread topic, my opinion of George Bush. I am not about to entertain all the what-ifs, or choosing the lesser of evils in this thread.

Aren't you able to address the performance of a president - pragmatically?

I'll say again, Bush seems to be in way over his head, and out of his league, as the President of the United States.
 
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Evangelion

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gwynn -

My point was for those who dug up the personnel past of Bush, I was just wanting to know if it's ok to judge your character by all the 'wrongdoings' of your past??

It's OK if your character hasn't actually changed since then.

I might be wrong, but it seems to me that this is precisely what the Dubya detractors are suggesting. (And of course, the same was true of Clinton detractors when he was in power.)

That's politics, ma'am. :cool:
 
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