SackLunch said:
When I was in college, I was all up into Nostradamus prophecies. One day, I picked up the book "Armageddon, Oil, and the Middle East Crisis" by John Walvord. It opened my eyes to Bible prophecy. For example, I did not know that every prophecy in the Bible has come true with 100% accuracy. The Bible is the only Holy Book that can predict the future with such precision. Also, I did not know that so much of the Old and New Testaments were devoted to specific prophecies about the future.
One prophecy I love is about Jesus. Isaiah 53 talks in great deail about the life of Jesus WAY before Jesus was born. It is such an accurate prophecy it will put your haris on end. How could it be? How could words written in a book come true so accurately? It could only happen because a supreme being outside of time penned His word through men.
While we can all agree at Christmastime that Jesus was a fulfillment of dozens of Bible prophecies, one prophetic doctrine has been causing significant controversy within the Christian community - the Pre-Trib Rapture. The Pre-trib rapture teaches that believers in Jesus Christ will be supernaturally transformed into spiritual beings and taken up to be with Jesus just before the Tribulation judgements of the Book of Revelation begin. So just what ARE the evidences for this belief? Let's take a brief look.
God's promises of the pre-trib rapture are many. Revelation 3:10 promises us that God will
keep us from the Tribulation to come. In Titus 2:13, Paul refers to the pre-trib rapture as our "Blessed Hope and the glorious appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ" (Paul would not have said our "hope" is to go through the Tribulation -what kind of hope is that!). And in 1 Corinthians 15:52, God tells us that living believers will be "changed" and taken up in the Rapture.
But most notable is 1 Thessalonians 4:17: "Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." Now if THIS isn't a description of what we know of as the Rapture today, I don't know what is. We who are ALIVE will be CAUGHT UP! So what should we do with the knowledge of the Rapture? The next verse sums it right up:
"Wherefore comfort one another with these words." We are to TALK about the Rapture and COMFORT ONE ANOTHER with the hope of the Rapture!!
So we know what the Bible says about the pre-trib Rapture. But has anyone ever actually been raptured before? Surprisingly, the answer is YES. In 2 Corinthians 12:2, Paul was raptured to receive visions. In Revelation 4:2, John was raptured to receive the vision of the end times. Enoch and Elijah were both raptured or "taken up." So as you can see, the Rapture is most certainly in the Bible.
Some say, "Ah no, we can't predict when Jesus will come back because He told us not to set dates, and that we wouldn't konw anyways."
Not so fast. Jesus told us we would not know "the day nor the hour." But then why did He give us signs in Matthew 24, Mark 13, and Luke 21? Why would he spell it out for us if he didn't want us to know? Why did He give us so many "be on guard and watch" parables just after His prophecies of the end times? We are not to set dates, that's true. But Jesus gave us these signs to watch for so that we would realize what is happening and prepare ourselves spiritually for it.
In fact, Jesus commanded us to WATCH for the Rapture. After Jesus brings us through all the signs and prophecies of the end times in Mark 13:37, he ends the discourse with this command:
"And what I say unto you I say unto all, WATCH."
So yes, the pre-trib Rapture doctrine IS Biblical. The Rapture IS in the Bible. Let's look forward to our Blessed Hope, because it's COMING SOON!!
OK I came in on this late but here goes:
God's promises of the pre-trib rapture are many.
Not correct. God promises that we are not appointed to Wrath. The tribulation is not sysonymous with wrath.
As a matter of fact, many of the verses you used to describe the rapture actually DO describe the rapture and as clear as that may seem to us, most pre tribulation rapture teachers use those to describe a different event the "second coming". The problem is, as you noticed, the second coming IS the rapture. These verses are very clear that the rapture involves Jesus visibly coming back to get us! Most pre trib teachers (and some major motion pictures) teach that we will be raptured in secret and just disappear. Looking at these verses, it is obvious that this is not the case. In fact there is not one verse that describes the rapture as a secret event. A problem with your original post is that you say these verses support a pre-trib rapture. While they do support a visible rapture, nowhere do they say that it will happen before the tribulation.
I challenge any of you out there who really want to learn what Revelation says to go through and read it. But this time, dont make assumptions. Don't assume a pre-trib rapture and you will notice that those verses commonly used to support a pre trib theory don't really say that. When studying the bible, it is a good idea to study the unclear scriptures in light of the clear scriptures. For example, since there is no clear verse to say there will be a rapture specifically before the tribulation, don't make that assumption when deciphering other verses. This mistake has lead to this verse being interpreted as the rapture:
"After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the first voice which I heard was as it were of a trumpet talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will show thee things which must be hereafter."
(Rev 4:1)
If you just read the section (read the context too) it obviously describes John being spiritually called to heaven to see a vision of the end times. But, if you are assuming a pre-trib rapture, you have to make it so that this verse IS the rapture and that John represents the church being raptured. It seems pretty clear that John represents JOHN!
Some other problems with the pre-trib theory (other than the fact that the pre-trib rapture is totally assumed) are:
The rapture is cleary described right after the sixth seal. There is no reason to assume that these events are not chronological (unless you first decide that there will a pre-trib rapture, in which case, it CANT be chronological). The events in the first six seals give us details on what things will happen during the tribulation. You may notice that these things are not Gods wrath being poured out but to the contrary they describe satans wrath!:
"Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time."
(Rev 12:12)
Then, right at the events of the sixth seal, the people cry out "And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?"
(Rev 6:16-17)
As soon as we hear the announcement that the day of His wrath has come, we see a description of the rapture (not before the 144,000 are sealed).
You mentioned that we are told to comfort one another with the words that He is coming! I agree! With the understanding that we will suffer tribulation:
"These things I have spoken unto you, that in me ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer; I have overcome the world."
(Joh 16:33)
The news of His coming before He pours out His wrath is STILL comforting!
You quoted Revelation 3:10. I'm glad you brought that up! It says:
Because you have kept the Word of My patience, I also will keep you from the hour of temptation (NKJV says "tribulation") which will come upon all the habitable world, to try those who dwell upon the earth.
(Rev 3:10)
The word keep does not mean "remove". The original Greek word is tereo which means, litterally, "to guard".
So, if you assume this verse means exactly what it says, we will be in the midst of tribulation that would necessitate our being "guarded".
I could continue but if you want more information, you can check out my website at
prewrath.bravehost.com
Anyone hoping to really study Revelation, there is good news! It is not confusing at all! It only gets confusing when you try to fit a presupposition into it. I encourage everyone to read Revelation straight through (nothing too in depth) and forget everything that you've been taught. See what the bible really says. If you are intent on proving me wrong instead of seeing if I'm right or not, you will not be able to but you also will never find the truth. Don't surround yourself with people who teach what you want to hear:
"For a time will be when they will not endure sound doctrine, but they will heap up teachers to themselves according to their own lusts, tickling the ear."
(2Ti 4:3)
But be like the bereans who tested what they were taught to see if it was what the scriptures said. I encourage you to check to see whather the pre-trib theory is correct. But do not just assume it is. Likewise, do not just take my word for it. Check it out!
"For where envying and strife are, there is confusion and every foul deed. But the wisdom that is from above is first truly pure, then peaceable, gentle, easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy."
(Jam 3:16-17)
Peace and Godspeed!
Adam
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