I'm going to start this off by giving you a little challenge. I'd like you to justify just one of the innumerable evils committed by Yahweh in the Old Testament. In 2 Chronicles 21:14-20. I'll post the passages.
21:14 Behold, with a great plague will the LORD smite thy people, and thy children, and thy wives, and all thy goods: 21:15 And thou shalt have great sickness by disease of thy bowels, until thy bowels fall out by reason of the sickness day by day. 21:16 Moreover the LORD stirred up against Jehoram the spirit of the Philistines, and of the Arabians, that were near the Ethiopians: 21:17 And they came up into Judah, and brake into it, and carried away all the substance that was found in the king's house, and his sons also, and his wives; so that there was never a son left him, save Jehoahaz, the youngest of his sons. 21:18 And after all this the LORD smote him in his bowels with an incurable disease. 21:19 And it came to pass, that in process of time, after the end of two years, his bowels fell out by reason of his sickness: so he died of sore diseases. And his people made no burning for him, like the burning of his fathers. 21:20 Thirty and two years old was he when he began to reign, and he reigned in Jerusalem eight years, and departed without being desired. Howbeit they buried him in the city of David, but not in the sepulchres of the kings.
There you have it: wickedness (the "Kings of Israel" weren't good guys), idolatry, leading the people astray, rebelling against God.6 He followed the ways of the kings of Israel, as the house of Ahab had done, for he married a daughter of Ahab. He did evil in the eyes of the LORD.
11 He had also built high places on the hills of Judah and had caused the people of Jerusalem to prostitute themselves and had led Judah astray.
7 Nevertheless, because of the covenant the LORD had made with David, the LORD was not willing to destroy the house of David. He had promised to maintain a lamp for him and his descendants forever.
It's pretty simple. The god of the bible is immoral. There's really nothing more to say. If your daughter or son didn't love you, would it be justification enough to torture them for an eternity in your basement? Of course not. Why would it okay for a god? It wouldn't. But religious people will say that god is above that and can do as he pleases. It makes no sense though. He puts these laws into place, but doesn't follow them himself. How does that make sense? How did he come up with those rules if he does not himself believe in them
Did you ever create anything in school art class? If you did, was it immoral of you to destroy it when its purpose had been fulfilled or it failed to fulfill the purpose for which you designed it?
Justify Yahweh's vicious murders.
Justify Yahweh's vicious murders.
Only an atheist would ask a believer to "justify God"--the Creator and Ruler of the Universe. God needs no "justification" and hubris is not a Christian strong suit.
ephraim
MY BROTHER,Translation: My brother, I can't prove anything.
And no ability to prove the imaginary, apparently.MY BROTHER,
There is no need to "prove" the obvious
And no ability to prove the imaginary, apparently.
1. The burden of proof remains on those who make a claim of anything. Saying God exists does require proof, as much as you hate that fact.1."Proving the imaginary" is strictly the domain of the benighted minority who hold that there is no God--those trying to prove, essentially, that the Universe accidentally and for no particular reason or purpose created itself out of nothing in an unknown manner.
2.The situation is analogous to a man with his eyes tightly closed trying to convince his sighted friend standing beside him that the sunset the friend is enjoying and describing to him doesn't really exist because he can't see it.
ABBA'S FOOL,
ephraim
MY BROTHER,1. The burden of proof remains on those who make a claim of anything. Saying God exists does require proof, as much as you hate that fact.
It's pretty simple. The god of the bible is immoral. There's really nothing more to say. If your daughter or son didn't love you, would it be justification enough to torture them for an eternity in your basement? Of course not. Why would it okay for a god? It wouldn't. But religious people will say that god is above that and can do as he pleases. It makes no sense though. He puts these laws into place, but doesn't follow them himself. How does that make sense? How did he come up with those rules if he does not himself believe in them
MY BROTHER,
Isn't saying that there is no God likewise making a claim and should it not likewise require proof?
If there are 10 people standing on the beach and 9 of them see a beautiful sunset and one of them, a blind man, sees nothing--upon whom does the burden of proof lie?
Those who have experienced God for themselves far outnumber those stuck in the cold of a godless darkness, for whatever reason, with no understanding and no personal experience of God's reality--upon whom does the burden of proof lie?
i have no need to prove God's existence because, having experienced Him for myself, i have no need of "proof"--the union has been made and the relationship realized. As i have done, so others must do for themselves--no one can "prove" God to another--all spiritual truths are experiential the other must prove for himself God's reality as i did. There are no shortcuts. i suggest you get on your knees and get to work.
ABBA'S FOOL,
ephraim
"I have no need to prove God's existence". You do have a need if you care about whether you are right or wrong.
Now we're talkin'.MY BROTHER,
You appear to miss the point--i HAVE PROVEN GOD'S REALITY BY EXPERIENCING HIM FOR MY SELF. God, from my personal knowledge and experience is alive, well, and very much in Love with each one of His children. End of story.
As far as proving that to you--can't be done. You can, however, experience it for yourself, thus proving it to yourself. There is no other way.
If i can use a very crude analogy: Suppose we are both virgins until i get married and have my first sexual experience. i come back and rave to you about how pleasurable the experience was.
ABBA'S FOOL,
ephraim