Worth your time, less than 7 minutes:Is Obama a Muslim? Robert Spencer

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PsychoeDial

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I've always believed Obama is a Muslim. That's why he was caught up being flustered by George Stephanopoulos.
I think also it is why Netanyahu isn't fond of Obama.

I also think this is why during his first run for office he had to work to explain why the pastor he claimed to know for some 20 years, a man he considered to be like an uncle, was a racist and preached racism from the pulpit.
I think Obama's handlers, staffers, sought a pastor that would say Obama was a parishioner in their church and Reverend White was the only one that would concede to that request.

Because listening to White preach from the pulpit when Obama was running for office sure didn't sound like an uncle that adored his nephew. And shortly after Obama gained office first term, White retired!
And built a mansion in an almost all white gated community having been given a multi-million dollar golden parachute when he left the church.

Millions? From his church?
Or, millions from Obama backers because White played the game asked of him?
Obama's politics don't make it appear he's Christian. But the sure make him appear to be a devout Muslim.
 
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AmericanChristian91

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If Obama is Muslim.....why does he.....

Drink alcohol?

Identify as Christian and go to Church?

Has political beliefs (pro-gay marriage, etc) that don't jive with Islam

Does not do the daily Muslim routine (praying certain amount of times, etc)

Not raising his family into Islam?

Doesn't sound like a Muslim to me.
 
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Tiny Bible

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I've always believed Obama is a Muslim. That's why he was caught up being flustered by George Stephanopoulos.
I think also it is why Netanyahu isn't fond of Obama.

I also think this is why during his first run for office he had to work to explain why the pastor he claimed to know for some 20 years, a man he considered to be like an uncle, was a racist and preached racism from the pulpit.
I think Obama's handlers, staffers, sought a pastor that would say Obama was a parishioner in their church and Reverend White was the only one that would concede to that request.

Because listening to White preach from the pulpit when Obama was running for office sure didn't sound like an uncle that adored his nephew. And shortly after Obama gained office first term, White retired!
And built a mansion in an almost all white gated community having been given a multi-million dollar golden parachute when he left the church.

Millions? From his church?
Or, millions from Obama backers because White played the game asked of him?
Obama's politics don't make it appear he's Christian. But the sure make him appear to be a devout Muslim.

I was going to post the transcript so that everyone here who has not watched the video could read what they refused to watch and learn. However, the transcriptionist must have been having a really bad day because it is nonsensical.

But that is as God wills I think. PeD, you won't change a peoples mind that is first made up to mock, scorn, ridicule, and as you rightly observed, froth at the mouth to vomit hate and then defecate on the faith by closing that inflammatory garbage with blessings and Christ's title.

The lesson for you here I think is what is being thrown back at you by those who never bothered to click play and in that I find every last remark ironic.
Just because the label is there doesn't mean the person is what their self-applied label says they are. :)

Yes, Obama was Muslim. Islam is patrilineal. His father was Muslim, his stepfather was Muslim. Ergo, Barack H. Obama was Muslim. When no one has bothered to read his books, or hit play, you know they are effectively saying they have no idea what they're talking about when they state Barack H.Obama is not or could not be Muslim. Otherwise, they're realize he himself admitted he was Muslim in one of his books when he talked about acting up during Koranic studies, attended only by Muslim students by the way, at SD Besuki in Jakarta.

As one would expect a Koranic studies class would entail all things related to Islam. Including praying the Salat, the second pillar of Islam being prayer, and including recitation of the azan, the call to prayer. The Sunni version of the azan is this:
God is the greatest.
I testify that there is no deity but God.
I testify that Muhammad is the Messenger of God.
Come to prayer.
Come to success.
God is the greatest.

There is no deity except God.



When Obama would have recited that during class, and committed to salat, in Jakarta he would be considered Muslim. He even repeated the azan to Nicholas Kristof of the New York Times in 2007. That in itself as a journalists story would reach countless Muslims around the world. That Obama said the Azan was one of the prettiest sounds he's ever heard and could recite it some 37 years after Koran class, says that prayer runs through his mind in contemporary times.

As the video reports, does all that mean Obama is still a Muslim? When he speaks of having found his Christian faith in one of his many books? The video explains how he could claim that too. And all in keeping with the tenets of Islam.

Suffice to say, you're not thus far dealing with people who care to engage in respectful dialog. Adults that remark using cartoons and bad movie memes are first a reminder of that child back in public school. You probably had them in your class. They were always making jokes and trying to get people to laugh, always at others, because they weren't interested in learning anything.

The same is obvious here today. Think of the time it takes for trolls to seek out cartoons or bad movie memes on a search engine. Save them to their computer, find a photo upload site, upload, copy the code, return to this thread tab and paste, write something acidic, and then post that reply. All of that time in mocking that video they know nothing about , defending a man they know nothing about, and they refuse to hit play and spend 7 minutes to learn what they don't know.

And why?
Because they , and this is key to understanding what you're dealing with, ridicule , condemn, insult, defecate on Christ's legacy in closing a hate filled screed, trust what the leftist media and others claim when they say Obama could never be Muslim, is not Muslim, never was Muslim. They trust the programming words of others, but they refuse to watch the informed talk of one who knows Islam and for seven minutes.

They ridicule and mock you citing others they believe who claim Obama isn't Muslim. While refusing to hit play and learn for themselves, exercise their own choice and responsibility to educate their ignorance, and watch what someone who has read Obama's own books admitting his affiliation with Islam has to say and the argument he can make citing the tenets of Islam as to how it is possible Obama can say he's Christian and still be a Muslim.


They don't care. :) No one in this thread cares about the truth.
They care about the behavior you see from them. That is what you're dealing with in this thread.


Or not. ;)
If you have a large ignore list filled with the most committed trolls names you'll find the threads here are far more peaceful and easy to read for the reason and respect that is posted. And you'll find those threads that are either posted by them to incite their own kind, flame bait, or are manipulated toward a flame platform, aren't showing up as readily in the "Recent Posts" or "New Posts" categories.
And you never see their names in threads either. They cease to appear, exist. It's a beautiful gift of God and the server here.
Pray for those that seek to overcome the good news folk with behavior straight out of the pit of Hell. After you ignore them. :hug: No good ever comes from hoping to reason with a troll. Because trolls are no good.
 
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PsychoeDial

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:hug: Thank you Tiny. I'll look for those references you made about Jakarta and such.
I worked with a guy that readily admitted to almost everyone at work that he was a proud contrarian.
I'd never heard of the affliction and didn't imagine he could possibly be using "contrary" as a self-identity. But, he was.
Turns out he said he loved to troll Internet forums so that he could get the best of people. He put a lot into perspective for his behaviors at work. And including why he never graduated in the way he should have in his department.

Reading your remarks for the first time in ten years he came to mind. Paul Michael. He ended up quitting our place. His wife left him. Then he committed suicide driving into a tree after downing a pint of Wild Turkey. A tragic end to a tragic man.
Thank you again for the support and insight. Unlike you I've never read one of Obama's books. I quite agree with Robert Spencer in that its odd how he wrote two autobiographies before he did anything major. Imagine the books when he leaves office.
 
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MoonofIsaiah

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<staff edit>
Remember, it is the net. Not everything is as it seems. We learned that didn't we? When the news came out about catfish ?

I like that video in the OP. I saved it and will email it to friends who encounter conflict if they mention Obama's apparent leaning toward the Muslim states and especially his failure to actually mouth the words, Muslim terrorist.

I direct you my sister and brother in Christ to this passage in order to overcome that what is apparent in this thread. Colossians 3:12. This is the NIV version text.
As God's chosen people, holy and dearly loved, cloth yourselves with compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience.

The element that has been identified as the enemy of our Lord in scriptures seeks to cloak his truth because evil is opposed to the light.
You may find those when you quote that scripture who will try to dissuade you from finding comfort in its words. Because they'll claim it applies only to the Jews. We are all part of the tribes of God's chosen when we are those whom Jesus died for. Do not let that detraction dissuade you from finding comfort.

<staff edit> God bless.
 
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BlessedHeart

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I don't understand where people get the notion that President Obama is a Muslim. The POTUS has little to no privacy at the best of times. It'd be common knowledge if Obama were performing ritual ablutions and praying to Mecca five times daily from the White House, attending the mandatory Friday prayers at his local mosque or making his Hajj pilgrimages on Air Force One. Posters above have already demonstrated he pays no heed whatsoever to established Islamic dietary restrictions, and even if he were a "secret Muslim", there'd be no reason for him to indulge in pork or alcohol. We don't eat pork products in my home and no one's ever proposed we might be Muslim. :)

I wonder, if he were a Muslim, why would that be a problem? Clearly, it would be a personal problem for him and the fate of his immortal soul. As a believer in Jesus, I hope he is redeemed in Christ. However, why would his religion make a difference in his role as national leader? Unless he is attempting to impose his religion on the populace, or his beliefs make him unable to perform his duties responsibly, why is his religion an issue?
 
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MoonofIsaiah

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I don't understand where people get the notion that President Obama is a Muslim. The POTUS has little to no privacy at the best of times. It'd be common knowledge if Obama were performing ritual ablutions and praying to Mecca five times daily from the White House, attending the mandatory Friday prayers at his local mosque or making his Hajj pilgrimages on Air Force One. Posters above have already demonstrated he pays no heed whatsoever to established Islamic dietary restrictions, and even if he were a "secret Muslim", there'd be no reason for him to indulge in pork or alcohol. We don't eat pork products in my home and no one's ever proposed we might be Muslim. :)

I wonder, if he were a Muslim, why would that be a problem? Clearly, it would be a personal problem for him and the fate of his immortal soul. As a believer in Jesus, I hope he is redeemed in Christ. However, why would his religion make a difference in his role as national leader? Unless he is attempting to impose his religion on the populace, or his beliefs make him unable to perform his duties responsibly, why is his religion an issue?

The Koran makes provisions for lying when a Muslim is in the midst of those who are infidel or enemies of Allah.

The Muslim can lie about their faith identity. They can also consume pork if it is a matter of life or death and that is all that there is to eat. Or when it is necessary again to survive and make an impression as one with the enemy so as to not be identified as a threat to them.

Consider what Obama has done while in office even when the GOP Congress tried to stop him. Now ask yourself, though there is no religious test to be POTUS, would the American voters that were on their feet behind a charming campaigner espousing his intention should he gain the office as one that will bring change they can believe in, have been so on their feet would he have stated publicly and six or seven years after 9-11-2001 that he was a Muslim?
 
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PsychoeDial

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I don't understand where people get the notion that President Obama is a Muslim. The POTUS has little to no privacy at the best of times. It'd be common knowledge if Obama were performing ritual ablutions and praying to Mecca five times daily from the White House, attending the mandatory Friday prayers at his local mosque or making his Hajj pilgrimages on Air Force One. Posters above have already demonstrated he pays no heed whatsoever to established Islamic dietary restrictions, and even if he were a "secret Muslim", there'd be no reason for him to indulge in pork or alcohol. We don't eat pork products in my home and no one's ever proposed we might be Muslim. :)

I wonder, if he were a Muslim, why would that be a problem? Clearly, it would be a personal problem for him and the fate of his immortal soul. As a believer in Jesus, I hope he is redeemed in Christ. However, why would his religion make a difference in his role as national leader? Unless he is attempting to impose his religion on the populace, or his beliefs make him unable to perform his duties responsibly, why is his religion an issue?

You'd have to ask the people that are opposed to thinking he could be a Muslim.
As to how could he perform his five prayers a day from the White house, staff and all who work for the president sign a confidentiality agreement. A non-disclosure agreement when he's in office. In some cases it extends to after the president has left office.
That of course makes sense given the sensitive nature of meetings and guests that visit the White house.
 
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PsychoeDial

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I wanted to add this also for that question earlier as to why we see Obama drinking beer and eating pork if he's Muslim.
And as we can read from the first post this discussion centered around the case for how Obama can be a Muslim while professing Christianity. It is not saying he is a Muslim. Though his behaviors in policy and his incapacity to mouth the words, Muslim terrorism, terrorists, speak for themselves also.

We may remember that pork and alcohol are also forbidden Christians. Therefore, it can't be said that he eats pork and drinks alcohol is proof he cannot be Muslim. If that were the case then those would be proofs he's not a Christian either.
 
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tulc

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I wanted to add this also for that question earlier as to why we see Obama drinking beer and eating pork if he's Muslim.
And as we can read from the first post this discussion centered around the case for how Obama can be a Muslim while professing Christianity. It is not saying he is a Muslim. Though his behaviors in policy and his incapacity to mouth the words, Muslim terrorism, terrorists, speak for themselves also.

We may remember that pork and alcohol are also forbidden Christians. Therefore, it can't be said that he eats pork and drinks alcohol is proof he cannot be Muslim. If that were the case then those would be proofs he's not a Christian either.

I'm not seeing the proof to support that Christians can't eat pork or drink alcohol. :wave:
tulc(likes when people support things) :)
 
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PsychoeDial

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I'm not seeing the proof to support that Christians can't eat pork or drink alcohol.
tulc(likes when people support things) :)
<staff edit>

Fundamentalist Christians would tell you they don't consume alcohol for that reason.
Romans 14:20
1 Corinthians 6:9-10
Galatians 5:21
1 Timothy 3:3-8
Titus 1:7

OT
Proverbs 23:20-21
Isaiah 28:1-8

<staff edit>
 
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Albion

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If Obama is Muslim.....why does he.....

Drink alcohol?

Identify as Christian and go to Church?

Has political beliefs (pro-gay marriage, etc) that don't jive with Islam

Does not do the daily Muslim routine (praying certain amount of times, etc)

Not raising his family into Islam?

Doesn't sound like a Muslim to me.

It's clear, as you note, that he's not a practicing Muslim. On the other hand, most of the ISIS fighters don't appear to be, either, and what difference it seems to make to Muslims is hard to observe. None of the proudly Muslim students I knew in college adhered to these kinds of rules of behavior, either.

It would probably be better to say he's sympathetic to Islam. Maybe even partial to Islam, considering the great number of policy decisions he's made that favor Muslims and Islam. And why couldn't he be such, given that this is part of his heritage/ancestry, etc.?
 
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MoonofIsaiah

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I wanted to add this also for that question earlier as to why we see Obama drinking beer and eating pork if he's Muslim.
And as we can read from the first post this discussion centered around the case for how Obama can be a Muslim while professing Christianity. It is not saying he is a Muslim. Though his behaviors in policy and his incapacity to mouth the words, Muslim terrorism, terrorists, speak for themselves also.

We may remember that pork and alcohol are also forbidden Christians. Therefore, it can't be said that he eats pork and drinks alcohol is proof he cannot be Muslim. If that were the case then those would be proofs he's not a Christian either.

As I recall SDA do not consume pork and according to Leviticus 11 or alcohol. The World Wide Church of God also abstain from pork, alcohol, and shellfish as well. Messianic Jews also I would think. Catholics abstain from pork , all meat, during Lent if I remember correctly.
Those are just a few I can think of. I'm sure there are more I just don't know which at the moment.

As to alcohol, I believe it is not wise for a Christian to consume due to the nature of the spirits that can lead to dependency. And of course it doesn't serve the body but only harms it.
Jesus turned water into wine at the Canaanite wedding however, it was tradition for Jewish weddings. And we don't read that he imbibed. Wine was served at the last supper and that as a ritual between Christ and his disciples. Many of us know there are verses against drunkenness etc...
This is a good article about alcohol that appeared not that long ago in Christian Post.
Christians and Alcohol: An Abstinent View

By Rev. Mark H. Creech, Christian Post Columnist
January 27, 2014

There were three categories of laws as you know in the OT. Ceremonial laws, Civil laws which pertained only to the Jews, and the Moral laws which still apply today.

I appreciate your request of the disruption energy that enters in regularly. Though if you venture to the history of their posts you'll see that is typical. Along with the behavior intending to get on the nerves of people that in itself makes the motives clear here. Threads are like unto real conversations. If you met someone who did this :wave: and made this face :sorry:every time they spoke and then added something in third person, the conversations people had would turn toward that which is very wrong with that behavior. Best to ignore trolls. Especially when they spend years here. :hug::holy: Be Blessed.
 
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tulc

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As I recall SDA do not consume pork and according to Leviticus 11 or alcohol. The World Wide Church of God also abstain from pork, alcohol, and shellfish as well. Messianic Jews also I would think. Catholics abstain from pork , all meat, during Lent if I remember correctly.
Those are just a few I can think of. I'm sure there are more I just don't know which at the moment.
Two points: It might have been more accurate if you had said: "Some Christians don't eat pork." I know several that don't (some for spiritual, some for health concerns) and I know many that do eat pork. The problem with your statement was it was (IMHO) overly broad. Second point: eating/not eating pork is addressed several times in Scripture, but what you eat is itself considered of secondary importance to doing so with a clear idea of why you do what you do do you feel guilty when eating pork? Then don't eat it. If you don't feel guilty, eat away. Either way, what we're told is not to judge your brother or sister for having either belief. It's not your concern. And that's the important thing. :)

As to alcohol, I believe it is not wise for a Christian to consume due to the nature of the spirits that can lead to dependency. And of course it doesn't serve the body but only harms it.
I pretty much agree with this, with the proviso that again it's not something we're to judge each other about.

Jesus turned water into wine at the Canaanite wedding however, it was tradition for Jewish weddings. And we don't read that he imbibed. Wine was served at the last supper and that as a ritual between Christ and his disciples. Many of us know there are verses against drunkenness etc...
Well...remember this Scripture:
Matt.11:16-19 said:
16 But whereunto shall I liken this generation? It is like unto children sitting in the markets, and calling unto their fellows,

17 And saying, We have piped unto you, and ye have not danced; we have mourned unto you, and ye have not lamented.

18 For John came neither eating nor drinking, and they say, He hath a devil.

19 The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, Behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners. But wisdom is justified of her children.
Jesus Himself said He drank, even pointed out it was one of the differences between Him and John the Baptist. I don't believe Jesus got drunk, but He did seem (according to this) to have had the occasional drink.

This is a good article about alcohol that appeared not that long ago in Christian Post.
Christians and Alcohol: An Abstinent View

By Rev. Mark H. Creech, Christian Post Columnist
January 27, 2014



Thanks! I skimmed it and will read it deeper later tonight!

There were three categories of laws as you know in the OT. Ceremonial laws, Civil laws which pertained only to the Jews, and the Moral laws which still apply today.


I appreciate your request of the disruption energy that enters in regularly. Though if you venture to the history of their posts you'll see that is typical. Along with the behavior intending to get on the nerves of people that in itself makes the motives clear here.[/quote
...well I'm sorry that the way I post is so disruptive and unpleasant for you. I really don't mean to be it's just how I write.

Threads are like unto real conversations. If you met someone who did this :wave: and made this face :sorry:every time they spoke
Let me address this here: this form of communication on CF is pretty limited you can't see facial expressions, body language or hear intonation all of which is very important when we have a conversation in 3D world. By using the smilies I'm trying to replace some of the things that are lost if I do this: :wave: I'm saying "this is my point" when I do :) I'm letting you know I don't mean this in a harsh or mean sort of way. This one :sorry: is my way of saying "I don't want to argue with you but have you considered this idea/information when you formed your opinion?" You might want to say to yourself when reading my posts in the future: "He doesn't intend this to be a put down, he's just not a very good communicator sometimes!" :sigh:

and then added something in third person,
I actually only do this after I sign my name, so if it annoys you you could just stop reading my posts when you see "tulc".

the conversations people had would turn toward that which is very wrong with that behavior.
hope the above helps in the future. :wave:

Best to ignore trolls.
even better would be to figure out if they are trolls, or if they're just a little lacking in their communication skills. :wave:

Especially when they spend years here. :hug::holy:
I think you'll find most actual trolls don't last long here on CF, our mods end to weed them out pretty fast, so if someones been here for a long time they're most likely not trolls, they just tend to be posters who, for whatever reason, might just post in a style you don't care for?

Be Blessed.
I have been, and pray you would be also!
tulc(PsychoeDial should probably stop reading right back there after the "c") :)
 
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PsychoeDial

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It's clear, as you note, that he's not a practicing Muslim. On the other hand, most of the ISIS fighters don't appear to be, either, and what difference it seems to make to Muslims is hard to observe. None of the proudly Muslim students I knew in college adhered to these kinds of rules of behavior, either.

It would probably be better to say he's sympathetic to Islam. Maybe even partial to Islam, considering the great number of policy decisions he's made that favor Muslims and Islam. And why couldn't he be such, given that this is part of his heritage/ancestry, etc.?
It's not clear that ISIS are not practicing Muslims. They're Sunni Wahabi Muslims .
When Obama practiced Islam as a young man it's hard to say he's not still Muslim. I wonder, did you watch the video?
 
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PsychoeDial

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Some of the things they do would be hard to describe as actions required by their faith.
Being their actions follow the Koran and those behaviors exhibited by Muhammad, that's not true.
However, this discussion isn't about ISIS.

Did you watch the video?
 
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