Womens roles in the church

[LoveofTruth]

So a woman can teach men if her husband is present. Where is that stated in scripture? And yes, Mary did preach the Good News. Preach simply means publicly proclaim a religious message which is what she did.

They dindn’t teach Apollo’s they “exhorted” hm the word exhorted means “to expose or declare” this is different than saying he was under the authority of Pricilla. They were evangelizing, testifying and exhorting

 

[LoveofTruth]

Hold on. If I may. 1Timothy5 is talking about the protection giving to widows. In verse 2 it is also just talking about older women, not elder. At least, that is how it reads in my Bibles.

The word elder is in the bible there.

 

[Sam91]

The word ekder is in the bible there.

I doubt that I am mistaken.

 

[LoveofTruth]

I doubt that I am mistaken.

You are in error again, scripture says ,

1 Timothy 5 - 2. The elder women as mothers; the younger as sisters, “

And there is one bible you should use for English the King James Bible

But that’s a 45 hour talk maybe another time

 

[Sam91]

You are in error again, scripture says ,

1 Timothy 5 - 2. The elder women as mothers; the younger as sisters, “

And there is one bible you should use for English the King James Bible

But that’s a 45 hour talk maybe another time

Yes but it means Elder to do with age not Church role.... unless someone has the Greek for both words? Are they the same word? The older widows' role was to take care of the sick under the direction of deacons, pray and serve.

 

[Sam91]

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

That's funny lol, the feminine singular presbytera never occurs in the bible. the feminine presbyteras occurs in 1 Timothy 5:2 and refers to aged women. You'd think if the plural occurs then a singular would be a given. But oh! Guess what Titus 2:3 says they are teachers! engaged in sacred things!

 

[Sam91]

That's funny lol, the feminine singular presbytera never occurs in the bible. the feminine presbyteras occurs in 1 Timothy 5:2 and refers to aged women. You'd think if the plural occurs then a singular would be a given. But oh! Guess what Titus 2:3 says they are teachers! engaged in sacred things!

Son do not forsake your mothers teaching... Yet the wife has no wisdom to be heard even if she is the same age as the MIL was when raising the child, to be future husband

 

[Zoii]

It just seems to me you guys struggle in this century to come to terms that women lead in every sphere of life and are scrambling for every verse you can find to stop a change that's already occurred. Time to realise that your patriarchal 1st century views are dead and join the rest of us in the 21st century

 

[Archivist]

They dint teach Apollo’s they “exhorted” hm the word exhorted means “to expose or declare” this is different than saying he was under the authority of Pricilla. They were evangelizing, testifying and exporting

The NIV doesn’t use that term, it says that they “explained to him the way of God.” That is teaching. Even the definition you offered, “expose or declare” can mean teaching.

 

[Archivist]

Women can be called of God to pastor, apostle, evangelist, teacher, or prophet.

However, women cannot be "Elder" since she cannot be the husband of one wife.

Ya falla?

Out of curiosity, does your church prohibit unmarried men from being Elders?

 

[JackRT]

It just seems to me you guys struggle in this century to come to terms that women lead in every sphere of life and are scrambling for every verse you can find to stop a change that's already occurred. Time to realise that your patronizing 1st century views are dead and join the rest of us in the 21st century

So very true, they are fighting a desperate rearguard action to defend patriarchy. In my view patriarchy is indefensible and its demise is welcome. Women and men are intellectual and spiritual equals and our "Biblical roles" are long outdated.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Priscilla was under the authority of her husband, who was there with her. Mary was a witness, not a preacher.

"And they remembered His words, and returning from the tomb they told all these things to the eleven and to all the rest. Now it was Mary Magdalene and Joanna and Mary the mother of James and the other women with them who told these things to the apostles," - Luke 24:8-10

This is the first time the Gospel was preached, and it was by women.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[LoveofTruth]

View attachment 222524

The word is "presbuteros- meaning (elderly) older, a senior...

KJV has it right as usual

and it is not making and elder "an official title or office."

Elder is who they are, older people,more mature, not a title or office.

When elders is used for the men who oversee. They are mature men who watch over, and who may be one of the gifts of apostles, prophets, evangelist, pastors or teachers. To have an office of overseer is referring to a function more than a title.

Paul also says that every believer has some "office" meaning function or practice, Romans 12:4 KJV

 

[LoveofTruth]

"And they remembered His words, and returning from the tomb they told all these things to the eleven and to all the rest. Now it was Mary Magdalene and Joanna and Mary the mother of James and the other women with them who told these things to the apostles," - Luke 24:8-10

This is the first time the Gospel was preached, and it was by women.

-CryptoLutheran

Yes the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. And all can witness for Jesus. This was not the women teaching over the men and correcting or judging them.

 

[LoveofTruth]

So very true, they are fighting a desperate rearguard action to defend patriarchy. In my view patriarchy is indefensible and its demise is welcome. Women and men are intellectual and spiritual equals and our "Biblical roles" are long outdated.

No the order of the churches is for all churches of all time everywhere. The scripture is not outdated. The family is under attack today and men and women's roles and aspects of their gender are also under attack.

If there was a time for this teaching to be understood it is today

But as I say to some. The problem is not with me and my discussion of these things it is with scripture. many do not believe the simple word .

 

[Andrew Jeremiah]

Out of curiosity, does your church prohibit unmarried men from being Elders?

Prohibit?

There is no bondage in the Church on this matter.

When men reach a certain age (somewhere around 55-60) married or not, they are qualified elders. Remember, the elders in the early Church were set up this way under the Law of God.
Paul was a Pharisee. He applied the same familial instruction in the Church. These elders were only senior citizens. They were usually already a grandfather, and in the "Jewish" culture the grandfathers were already head or leaders of a tribal family (Judah, Levi, etc.), and Paul also KNEW that the Messiah that came and he was of "another time" was the completion of Judaism.

 

[LoveofTruth]

The NIV doesn’t use that term, it says that they “explained to him the way of God.” That is teaching. Even the definition you offered, “expose or declare” can mean teaching.

What I said was the meaning of exhort. And they were not in a church setting. There are different things that are done in a church gathering. Paul even says for the women to ask their husbands at home, but not to speak in the questioning way and judging way they did in the meetings. Yet they should still submit to their husbands at home in everything as scripture says.

"22 Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. 23 For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. 24 Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing.(Ephesians 5:22-24 KJV)

 

[Andrew Jeremiah]

Yes the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. And all can witness for Jesus. This was not the women teaching over the men and correcting f judging them.

Oh no. IT WAS a rebuke to the disciples when the Mary's came and told what they witness, what they experienced at the tomb and to correct those that ran away when Jesus was arrested, and later slaughtered on a Roman cross by the Hand of God.

Mark 16:11 (KJV)
11 And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.

Mark 16:13 (KJV)
13 And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.

Mark 16:14 (KJV)
14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.

The witness was a declaration. There was also an element of prophetic utterance since she was testifying of Jesus.

They believed not.

Her truth was a witness to their lie that the Master was dead.

 

[LoveofTruth]

Oh no. IT WAS a rebuke to the disciples when the Mary's came and told what they witness, what they experienced at the tomb and to correct those that ran away when Jesus was arrested, and later slaughtered on a Roman cross by the Hand of God.

Mark 16:11 (KJV)
11 And they, when they had heard that he was alive, and had been seen of her, believed not.

Mark 16:13 (KJV)
13 And they went and told it unto the residue: neither believed they them.

Mark 16:14 (KJV)
14 Afterward he appeared unto the eleven as they sat at meat, and upbraided them with their unbelief and hardness of heart, because they believed not them which had seen him after he was risen.

The witness was a declaration. There was also an element of prophetic utterance since she was testifying of Jesus.

They believed not.

Her truth was a witness to their lie that the Master was dead.

No they were not teachers over them or judging them they were simply witnesses and giving testimony of Jesus. Jesus is the one who rebuked them