With the rise of secularism , what do you think the future holds ?

[RichardT]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

 

[Mendel]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

Neither

While I am no fan of men and women denying the One True G-d of Israel, I am quite touched by the charities run by secular humanists. I'm more then willing to let them comtinue with their good deeds and allow the Moshiach ben Dovid ( Blessed will be the day when he comes ) change their personal beliefs.

 

[RichardT]

Moshiach

sigh... This messiah that you will be following is not actually the messiah , he will be the antichrist.....

The messiah already came and died for your sins 2000 years ago... He did fullfill jewish prophecy , and he will set peace on the world in his second comming...

Unless my life is in vain , Jesus is Lord.....

 

[Mendel]

B'H
​

Unless my life is in vain

No life is in vain

 

[warghaha]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

It's good and it's bad too.

Good for the human unity regardless the religion/races they are.

Bad as too much secularism will open a door to so many ideologies.

Human will still be human. If they didn't fight for their religions/races, they will fight for their ideologies.

That's just my opinion though.

 

[psychedelicist]

If humanism really is on the rise, I predict a stronger focus on developing sciences and technologies that would be beneficial to the race, that are currently repressed, such as cloning, genetic engineering, stem cell research, etc.

The bad may be taking these sciences too far, as they all have the possibility to harm as much as help us.

 

[Abbadon]

Well, secularism is really about "hey, let people practice thier religions for themselves".

I've had people hassle me trying to get me to be a part of thier religion.

Even by members of the same bloody religion I'm in.

It's not fun.

Secularism is not a requirement that everyone be an atheist, or be an atheist outside the home. It's just progress in keeping government out of religion. If a government gets involved in religion:

-The government will side with the ones with the most money.
-Everyone is required to convert, and those that don't are persecuted, which Christianity doesn't support.
-Eventually, the religion is changed to what the government needs to meet it's own ends
-Those that don't worship the Emperor Caeser, son of Sol Invictus are thrown to the lions.

sigh... This messiah that you will be following is not actually the messiah , he will be the antichrist.....

Why not the second coming?

Why does it automatically have to be the antiChrist?

Good for the human unity regardless the religion/races they are.

Bad as too much secularism will open a door to so many ideologies.

The new ideologies will then separate people, continueing the endless cycle of acceptance to hatred.

 

[arunma]

Why not the second coming?

Why does it automatically have to be the antiChrist?

Probably because Jesus isn't the Messiah that modern Jews are looking for. If my understanding of Judaism is correct, Jews believe that their god will send a messiah to physically restore the Kingdom of Israel according to the borders mentioned in their Tanakh. Christians, on the other hand, believe that Christ Jesus the Son of God will institute a supernatural Kingdom, as was prophesied by Moses and the Prophets. These two views are not compatible with one another.

 

[Abbadon]

Physical and supernatural aren't compatible?

Golly. I guess we don't have souls, since we're physical.

BTW, the books we call the Old Testament. It's the Tanakh.

 

[arunma]

Physical and supernatural aren't compatible?

Golly. I guess we don't have souls, since we're physical.

BTW, the books we call the Old Testament. It's the Tanakh.

I'm aware of this. I make the distinction because Christians interpret the Old Testament very differently than Jews. As you know, we see Christ Jesus on every page of Old Testament Scripture, and it speaks about God's church before the First Advent.

Now as for the Kingdom of Heaven, in this case the Jewish and Christian understandings are not compatible. The Jewish "Olam HaBa" seems to be limited to a physical reign, and while Jews will one again worship their god, I am not sure what Gentiles are to do (perhaps Mendel can explain Jewish theology on this issue). In Christianity, the reign of the God of Heaven extends to all creation, and all things are subject to Jesus Christ. I'm not sure how these two views can be reconciled.

 

[Mendel]

B'H

Shalom,

I was merely here to comment on the topic of secularism. I have no desire to engage in useless debate over scriptural interpetation.


Peace.

-Mendel
​

 

[psychedelicist]

I agree with the Superjew. Take it to a different thread, this one holds too much interest for me to want it to be hijacked by this age old arguement.

 

[arunma]

B'H​

Shalom,​

I was merely here to comment on the topic of secularism. I have no desire to engage in useless debate over scriptural interpetation.​

Peace.​

-Mendel​

We need not debate the issue. I only wanted to emphasize the difference between Christianity and Judaism. Often times, people (mostly certain circles of evangelical Christians) believe that Judaism is "Christianity minus Jesus." I don't think this belief does justice to either Christianity or Judaism.

 

[spinto]

We need not debate the issue. I only wanted to emphasize the difference between Christianity and Judaism. Often times, people (mostly certain circles of evangelical Christians) believe that Judaism is "Christianity minus Jesus." I don't think this belief does justice to either Christianity or Judaism.

Well just reading the thread so far serves a perfect example of why society needs to be politically secular. Look at the stuggle just in this short conversation so far! In America we should each go about our spirituality as we individually see fit. It's freedom of religion. But as far as government is concerned, it should see us all as citizens with the right to practice or not practice our many religions... End of story. It's the only way to be fair and not start a civil holy war.

 

[sidhe]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

Oh yeah.

Secularism is good, because it keeps government out of religion, and I don't want government butting it's head into what I'm doing.

 

[Orontes]

I'm not sure I understand the question. When you mention the "rise of secularism" are you thinking of the West since the 17th Century? Secularism across Arabie or the Subcontinent does not seem to be all that on the rise. In China, Communist secularism, despite the press of the Cultural Revolution does not seem to have succeeded in purging the religious/cultural penchants of the Middle Kingdom. If you confine your focus to the Industrial World then Western Europe seems largely to have moved into a post-Christian phase, Japan also has left behind its Buddhist/Shinto past. South Korea has gone the other direction with over 50% of the population now declaring themselves Christian. The U.S. still has large swaths of its population that self-identify as believers. Canada may find itself somewhere between the U.S. and Western Europe. Given the Industrial World is basically capitalist and democratic the divide between believers and non-believers will remain a question of personal conviction and rhetoric rather than state imposed forced adherence to any particular stance. The 21st Century in the Industrial World? Science will continue, personal liberty will remain the standard and dogmatism the foible of individuals rather than the concern of law.

 

[CalUWxBill]

Secularism is important to a world with religious differences. Besides, I think it is much more rewarding to find faith through a faithful search, than through force or arrogant persuasion. With tolerance and freedom, and a little hope and luck, peace in a global scale will be possible. Unfortunately as stated above, this secularism is not global.

 

[Arthra]

This is an interesting question and following some of the discussion here I find it extremely sad and regretable that there is not a recognition that the God of Judaism is also the same God of Christianity:

Jesus replied to the question which is the greatest of all the commandments?

'This is the first:

Listen Israel the Lord our God is the one Lord and you must love the Lord our God with all your heart with all your soul and with all yuor mind and all your strength" Quoting Deuteronomy 6:4-5

and read the rest direct from the succeeding verses of Deuteronomy 6:6-9:

"Let these words I urge on you today be written in your heart. You shall repeat them to your children and say them over to them whether at rest in your house or walking abroad at your lying down or at your rising...."

If the oneness of God is not recognized by the people of faith then I anticipate a continued rise of secularism and materialism.

I would also say that we have the degree of secularism we have today as a result and natural reaction to the diviseness and lack of spiritual leadership in the religious community. Secularism is the result I believe of the lack of leadership and unity of the religious community.

One reason I encourage inter-faith dialogue and cooperation is to build the solidarity of believers and promote enlightened religious concepts that can solve some of the social ills facing humanity.

But recognizing the oneness of God is a fundamental step in that direction.

The next is recognizing the oneness of the world's great religious traditions

and the third is recognizing the oneness of humanity. If we do not recognize the oneness of the human race we cannot develope the necessary social institutions to resolve the issues of lack of education, disease and poverty, so this is the true humanism. People like John Woolman, Martin Luther King and Mahatma Gandhi knew this.

The spiritual life and scientific outlook of mankind are not contradictory but can complement one another.

- Art

 

[Eudaimonist]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

It all depends on what sort of secularism you mean. There are many possible secularisms, and several currently exist.

I'd say that Communism had been an abysmally poor secularism. However, there are far better ones around. I personally hope the better ones prosper.

 

[Lilly of the Valley]

Do you think this is a good/bad thing and why ? I would like your oppinions on this...

It's bad because it's basically the rise of people rejecting and denying God. How is that good? It isn't. It can also lead to more hostility toward those that have faith based views due to secularism being on the rise and becoming the norm of society.