Will Vegetarianism become impossible?

[essentialsaltes]

This story is not really about vegetarians. After all, most of us eat these staple crops as well, as do many of the animals we raise.

 

[HitchSlap]

How cool! I didn't even know this was an option.

Where do you think proteins come from?

 

[chevyontheriver]

Thanks for the explanation.
I object the idea of killing animal for food as a moral issue.

I don't object on moral issues, but having cleaned a chicken just once in my life I found it gross. I can see why others could consider it immoral to do the violence and dismemberment thing.

Your second reason sounds good. But that is a by product of a more fundamental problem which covers much wider issues. It is not a good reason to be a vegetarian.

Which is why I am not actually a vegetarian, but I do consume only small amounts of meat. Farmed meat has a huge carbon footprint and I want to live more gently on the land.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Agreed. As well, hemp has all of the amino acids. The only thing is that the government demonized that plant because of its wacky cousin, Mary Jean.
Humans can not only survive without meat, they are more healthy if they avoid it.

I would very much question that a completely meatless diet makes one more healthy.

 

[HitchSlap]

I would very much question that a completely meatless diet makes one more healthy.

Do you think daily consumption of meat is healthy?

 

[grasping the after wind]

I would not be concerned about the possibility that a vegetarian or vegan diet will be impossible in the future. With the advances in GMOs I'm pretty sure that no matter the CO2 levels crops with sufficient protein can be made available. And surely vegetarianism( if we are talking about some philosophically, politically or religiously motivated "ism") need not include a perfectly balanced diet with an exactly correct amount of protein. One often must be prepared to sacrifice a small part of one's physical well being for the sake of one's dearly held core beliefs.

 

[grasping the after wind]

Do you think daily consumption of meat is healthy?

What I think is irrelevant. My opinion about the healthiness of food is not authoritative. I did not make a statement about the subject at all , I questioned something that was stated as if it were a fact that unless some convincing evidence to support the statement is presented I suspect is actually simply an opinion.

 

[HitchSlap]

What I think is irrelevant. My opinion about the healthiness of food is not authoritative. I did not make a statement about the subject at all , I questioned something that was stated as if it were a fact that unless some convincing evidence to support the statement is presented I suspect is actually simply an opinion.

Have you read "The China Study"?

It's quite clear that meat causes hypertension, atherosclerosis, hypercholesterolemia, NIDDM, and obesity. As for nutrition, there is nothing in meat that cannot be obtained from a plant based diet.

 

[juvenissun]

I don't object on moral issues, but having cleaned a chicken just once in my life I found it gross. I can see why others could consider it immoral to do the violence and dismemberment thing.

That is a false moral.
What is the difference between killing a chicken and killing a cabbage?

 

[chevyontheriver]

That is a false moral.
What is the difference between killing a chicken and killing a cabbage?

The cabbage didn't complain in any way that I could discern. The chicken did.

 

[juvenissun]

The cabbage didn't complain in any way that I could discern. The chicken did.

Chicken, beef, pork, fish in the grocery store do not complain either.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Chicken, beef, pork, fish in the grocery store do not complain either.

Just because you didn't hear it doesn't mean the pig did not squeal.

 

[Tanj]

Have you read "The China Study"?

It's quite clear that meat causes hypertension, atherosclerosis, hypercholesterolemia, NIDDM, and obesity. As for nutrition, there is nothing in meat that cannot be obtained from a plant based diet.

Except B12

 

[juvenissun]

Just because you didn't hear it doesn't mean the pig did not squeal.

So is the cabbage.

 

[HitchSlap]

Except B12

That's right. Need a supplement for that.

 

[Tanj]

That's right. Need a supplement for that.

...which you get from...drum roll please....meat! (or bacteria)

 

[grasping the after wind]

Have you read "The China Study"?

It's quite clear that meat causes hypertension, atherosclerosis, hypercholesterolemia, NIDDM, and obesity. As for nutrition, there is nothing in meat that cannot be obtained from a plant based diet.

It is not clear at all. A poor diet and lack of proper exercise along with genetic propensities , not simply meat, are what cause those maladies. The China Study is junk science. The most egregious error being to draw conclusions for the entire human population while purposely using a genetically, culturally and ethnically homogeneous population as one's test group. Using that same test group as if it were representative of the entire human population one would erroneously conclude that humans are in general lactose intolerant.

 

[grasping the after wind]

The cabbage didn't complain in any way that I could discern. The chicken did.

Is the capacity to be able to complain, or at least communicate complaints in a way you can understand, really your sole determining factor in whether a living entity is worth feeling compassion for? I think it may well be for many. If one were to kill a person in a drugged state would it be morally upright as that person had no ability to complain ? Is it your contention that killing something that simply has no capacity to communicate their distress is morally superior to killing something that can show you how distressed it is? If an animal were sedated to the point of complete unawareness would you find it as morally fit to kill it as you find killing a cabbage to be? Do you have a hierarchy of the living i.e. are some of the living entitled to take the life of others of the living in order to eat? If so, then how do you determine which of the living each particular class of the living can morally feed upon? Should a leech, for instance, be morally ashamed for feeding upon a class of living beings that are more advanced than itself? I have a bunch more questions I would like raise on the subject but I am already becoming too wordy here.

 

[HitchSlap]

It is not clear at all. A poor diet and lack of proper exercise along with genetic propensities , not simply meat, are what cause those maladies. The China Study is junk science. The most egregious error being to draw conclusions for the entire human population while purposely using a genetically, culturally and ethnically homogeneous population as one's test group. Using that same test group as if it were representative of the entire human population one would erroneously conclude that humans are in general lactose intolerant.

How many people do you know who have stopped taking hypertensive, NIDDM, depression and cholesterol meds, after switching to a meat/dairy diet?

 

[chevyontheriver]

Is the capacity to be able to complain, or at least communicate complaints in a way you can understand, really your sole determining factor in whether a living entity is worth feeling compassion for?

Nope.

I think it may well be for many. If one were to kill a person in a drugged state would it be morally upright as that person had no ability to complain ? Is it your contention that killing something that simply has no capacity to communicate their distress is morally superior to killing something that can show you how distressed it is? If an animal were sedated to the point of complete unawareness would you find it as morally fit to kill it as you find killing a cabbage to be? Do you have a hierarchy of the living i.e. are some of the living entitled to take the life of others of the living in order to eat? If so, then how do you determine which of the living each particular class of the living can morally feed upon? Should a leech, for instance, be morally ashamed for feeding upon a class of living beings that are more advanced than itself? I have a bunch more questions I would like raise on the subject but I am already becoming too wordy here.

I think you are reading more into my words than my words convey.