• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

Will there be a false messiah reigning from Israel ?

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by dfw69, Oct 14, 2013.

  1. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    How many believe a false messiah will reign from Israel before the return of Jesus ?
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. YeShallTread

    YeShallTread Well-Known Member

    +174
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Republican


    :wave: I believe there will be a false Messiah that will deceive many people. Reigning from the literal location of Israel is another matter.
     
  3. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    Hello.. Thanks for your reply 😄
     
  4. Houly

    Houly Member

    258
    +9
    Christian
    Private
    Yeah, this exactly. I think he will claim his position in a temple in Jerusalem, but I know that could be wrong.

    2 Thessalonians 2 gives us these simple facts:

    • Before the Day of the Lord,
    • an individual man
    • will exalt himself above God,
    • and he will be worshiped by many.
    • That man's destruction will coincide with Christ's second coming.
     
  5. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    What location you believe he will show his ugly face?
     
  6. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,672
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    I voted one false messiah in Jerusalem. The other guy is a false prophet, a Jew, but not "the" false messiah.

    Technically speaking, in Judaism, priests are anointeds. The false prophet could be a false high priest (technincally making him anointed - which the word moshiach, messiah, actually means). But that's not being a king - which "the" messiah - Antichrist - would be in the role of perceived promised great king of Israel.

    The reason I say high priest, for the false prophet is that the confirmation of the Mt. Sinai covenant is supposed to be read by the tribe of the priests - for the 7 year cycle law that Moses began. The Antichrist himself must be from the tribe of Judah to be their perceived messiah. So I view the Antichrist as overseeing the commemorative ceremony there on the temple mount. With the false prophet, high priest (maybe), in tow.

    Doug
     
  7. ebedmelech

    ebedmelech My dog Micah in the pic Supporter

    +573
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Constitution
    You left out a choice..which is "Jerusalem on earth is nothing"...and it isn't according to scripture.

    The Jerusalem Jesus reigns over is the "Jerusalem above" of which we are citizens of through salvation.

    Paul has made it very clear that present Jerusalem is an allegory represented by Hagar. That would be Galatians 4:21-31:
    21 Tell me, you who want to be under law, do you not listen to the law?
    22 For it is written that Abraham had two sons, one by the bondwoman and one by the free woman.
    23 But the son by the bondwoman was born according to the flesh, and the son by the free woman through the promise.
    24 This is allegorically speaking, for these women are two covenants: one proceeding from Mount Sinai bearing children who are to be slaves; she is Hagar.
    25 Now this Hagar is Mount Sinai in Arabia and corresponds to the present Jerusalem, for she is in slavery with her children.
    26 But the Jerusalem above is free; she is our mother.
    27 For it is written, “Rejoice, barren woman who does not bear; Break forth and shout, you who are not in labor; For more numerous are the children of the desolate Than of the one who has a husband.”
    28 And you brethren, like Isaac, are children of promise.
    29 But as at that time he who was born according to the flesh persecuted him who was born according to the Spirit, so it is now also.
    30 But what does the Scripture say? “Cast out the bondwoman and her son, For the son of the bondwoman shall not be an heir with the son of the free woman.”
    31 So then, brethren, we are not children of a bondwoman, but of the free woman.


    Present Jerusalem is nothing...it's THE JERUSALEM ABOVE...and Jesus is reigning there now...all Christians are citizens of it.

    It comes down from heaven in Revelation 21:2:
    2 And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, made ready as a bride adorned for her husband.

    The free woman has a HUSBAND...think about that. :thumbsup: :amen:
     
  8. KNOWLEDGE BOMB

    KNOWLEDGE BOMB Junior Member

    514
    +18
    Non-Denom
    Single
    What makes you think it's the false messiah who sits on the throne?
     
  9. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    What if this coming false messiah rules for a season? And dies and his sons succeed him? All could be considered false messiahs

    The final antichrist or little horn is never accepted by the Jews ... He claims to be god... He makes an idol of himself .. He forces his law upon them... Seems to me he is taking by force with gentile nations behind him
     
  10. KNOWLEDGE BOMB

    KNOWLEDGE BOMB Junior Member

    514
    +18
    Non-Denom
    Single
    Ebed said:The Jerusalem Jesus reigns over is the "Jerusalem above" of which we are citizens of through salvation.

    KNOWLEDGE BOMB replies:

    Jesus goes down to the earth to conquer all (Rev 19:11-21)
    Jesus then reigns 1000 years (20:3)
    Then AFTER that the New Jerusalem comes DOWN out of Heaven. (21:1)

    which happens ONLY after those NOT found in the book of life are sent to lake of fire...

    The new Jerusalem is for the Father to rule.... While Jesus rules over all who denied him

    So this shows Christ reign on earth and is not the only verse to do so....
     
  11. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    Jesus warns to not follow any other messiah but to wait on his return that false messiahs will come
     
  12. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    I'm not sure where your stance is ... Do you believe Jesus comes to earth? Will a false messiah preceded him? Will Jesus rule on earth? Will the governments of the world continue?
     
  13. ebedmelech

    ebedmelech My dog Micah in the pic Supporter

    +573
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Constitution
    So explain why the writer of Hebrews speaks of "the Jeusalem above" as a present reality saying "she IS our mother."?
    Rev 19 is judgment of the world. Jesus doesn't come to show Himself as King of kings and Lord of lords to believers, we expect that...the world doesn't, they think they're running the show. Jesus comes to judge the world in righteousness, basically showing them He has been ruling and reigning since His resurrection...remember Matthew 28:18?:
    18 And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth.

    He has had ALL AUTHORITY since He was raised...to think otherwise is to deny scripture.

    Paul makes it plain as day in Ephesisans 1:18-22 and also Colossians 1:15-20. How Christians can read those passages and deny Christ reigns now is beyond me. They make it very clear.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2013
  14. ebedmelech

    ebedmelech My dog Micah in the pic Supporter

    +573
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Constitution
    My stance it there will be no false messiah reigning over earthly Jerusalem. It's a theological fabrication when you think about it.

    The only Jerusalem of significance is ABOVE! :amen:
     
  15. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    Ok but what about the rest of my questions?

    You forgot to vote.... :)
     
  16. ebedmelech

    ebedmelech My dog Micah in the pic Supporter

    +573
    Non-Denom
    Married
    US-Constitution
    OK...I chose the 1st one..."No. no one will ever reign over Jerusalem".

    Except who the Jews vote as Prime minister, right now that's Benjamin Netanyahu ...:D
     
  17. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,672
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Well, he will die at the hand of God (ezekiel 28:1-10), for going into the temple claiming to be God (2thess2), then God brings him back to life as the strong delusion to them who believed his lie that he is God in the first place.

    He doesn't make an idol of himself, that is something the false prophet will have the world do of him. It is an idol none the less.

    It's stages, dfw. In order as presented in the bible, if you took you bible starting with the little horn, first stage;

    then flip a few chapters to the prince who shall come, stage two, false king messiah, and into the gospels of the another that Jesus told Nicodemus they would accept;

    then keep flipping further toward the back, to 2thess2, the revealing man of sin, when he sells out to Satan, goes into the temple and claims to be God, stage three;

    then keep flipping to the last book of the bible, Revelation 13, the mortally wounded/come back to life, Antichrist-beast, stage 4.
     
  18. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,672
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    .
     
  19. dfw69

    dfw69 Senior Veteran

    +722
    Christian
    Married
    Lol ^_^
     
  20. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,672
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    I don't think your vote counts, eb, because you forgot to register as a futurist. :sorry: ;)


    Doug
     
Loading...