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Featured Will Jesus still judge Christians for our past sins?

Discussion in 'Christian Philosophy & Ethics' started by Cement, Mar 21, 2019.

  1. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    So im aware that Jesus was that lamb that took away the sins of the world but also there is the fact that in heaven there are rewards and crowns. I suppose that some crowns will be given to those that endured those that helped others and those that spread and died for the gospel. It is said that every action and thought will be thoroughly known on the day of judgement this must mean that even though we had our sins cleansed it does not excuse us from our past deeds. Must be a very long list and time for every human person. I am well aware that God exists outside of time and that the whole body of Christ can communicate with him simultaneously.
     
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  2. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

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    If I understand your question, you are asking about sins prior to baptism. At 1 John 4 there is a statement regarding fears new converts had regarding previous sins:

    1Jo 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casts out fear, because fear involves torment. But he who fears has not been made perfect in love.

    It's in response to those early converts, mostly from Judaism, who still feared punishment for their previous sins. In the Jewish law, there are a number of sins that could not be atoned for. Those we call mortal sins today. Adultery is one such sin. If a man committed adultery there was no sacrifice under the Law to atone for it. But Christian baptism erases even those sins. Paul said to the Jews:

    Act 13:39 “and by Him everyone who believes is justified from all things from which you could not be justified by the law of Moses.
     
  3. Daniel9v9

    Daniel9v9

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    It's impossible to comment on what Christ will judge as God alone is Judge. However, when it comes to damnation, the unbelievers will be judged according to their deeds. Believers, born again by the Holy Spirit, in Christ, however, when talking about salvation, will be judged by the works of Christ, not by their own piety or sins. Christ paid for all sins in full.

    Rather than worrying about what God will judge, we should instead take comfort in that God is the supremely good and righteous Judge - whatever He decrees is far better than what we conceive. To believers in Christ, God's judgement should be viewed as a good thing, and with John, we can say "Amen. Come, Lord Jesus!"
     
  4. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    Would it be fair to have one sin absolved and not the other? Furthermore I ask and this is sincere why would a person who after baptism sins in Adultery be held to account and not the former who has not been yet baptized. I have even heard such false ideas being spread that people would sin and then later be baptized so as not to be judged for those sins. Its clearly a diabolical lie. I believe that the Bible clearly says that All sins no matter from what era were to be judged.
     
  5. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    I understand your concern but the Bible makes it very clear that one should Fear the Lord. Fear is not always a bad thing when it helps us avoid sin during temptation. I see that we all have a thing called free will. God would not force his own will upon us unless we accept it and one of the requirements is obeying him by staying away from sin. If we sin we lose out on his benefits earthly and heavenly. Do you see.
     
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  6. HTacianas

    HTacianas Well-Known Member

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    That people would sin before baptism knowing that it would be forgiven is true. It was the custom during the time of the early Church for people to put off being baptized as long as possible so as to have all of their sins forgiven by baptism.

    That a person who sins prior to baptism and has that sin forgiven falls within the meaning of repentance. The idea of repentance was used as a military term in those days. During times of rebellion between an empire and a client state, the empire would send an army to crush the rebellion. But prior to crushing it, it was the custom to offer "space for repentance". The meaning is that if any of those participating in the rebellion will lay down their arms and surrender, anything they did previously in furtherance of the rebellion would be pardoned. Those who refused to "repent" would be destroyed. So those who met the terms were pardoned, while those who refused were destroyed.

    I suppose that should someone previously receiving pardon were to then rebel again, they would be punished, even while those who repented previously were pardoned.
     
  7. Daniel9v9

    Daniel9v9

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    It is true that we should fear the Lord. But the word "fear" used in this context has more to do with reverence than fright; we should not fear punishment (1 John 4:18), but rather, in reverence, trust in Christ's plain and simple message: "Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned."

    On works in relation to Salvation, as the best Biblical summary, I would quote:
    "For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them." - That is, we don't create ourselves, nor do we sustain ourselves, but God created us and God prepared good works. The Holy Spirit in us produces good works (Galatians 5:22-23), but we are judged on Christ's works with respect to salvation - not our own. In this way, we can rightly say: (1) We must do good and be holy for God is holy, and (2) but salvation is entirely from God.

    Luke 17: "So you also, when you have done all that you were commanded, say, ‘We are unworthy servants; we have only done what was our duty."
     
  8. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    I dont think this is particularly sound advice to not fear the Lord. Remember the great fear that struck the church when Ananias and Sapphira were struck down. He holds the iron rod in his hand and we are like clay to him. There are some days where i loath out of fear to reading the Old Testament because I know God does not change only our perception of him changes. I think modern Christianity just does not do a very good job of addressing this area very well and in an effort of being a more inclusive seeker friendly it glosses over those areas. Lets Remember that the Lord himself became like an enemy of Israel when they sinned and God did not even spare his own Son so why would he spare us from punishment exactly?
     
  9. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    I believe these people had deluded themselves into thinking such things. People came up with all kinds of things from the Jewish legalistic loopholes to the Indulgences of the Church. God does not play games like we do. He knows our heart inside and out even when we do not understand it.
     
  10. Daniel9v9

    Daniel9v9

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    Because our punishments fell on His Son, for this is the Gospel message.
     
  11. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    Yes but that does not mean that we get to go scot free sinning around. The Lord punishes the Christian sinner and if you deny this then I dont know what to say. So I say that because if you see that any habitual sinner still in bondage of sin they are clearly not getting it.

    Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, normen who practice homosexuality,[2] 10nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards,nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.
     
  12. Jonaitis

    Jonaitis Well-Known Member

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    For the Christian, there is therefore now no condemnation for us in Christ (Rom. 8:1), we are washed and forgiven by the blood of the cross. Whatever we have committed in the past, what we may commit right now, and what we may commit in the future is covered (however, that doesn't justify committing sin as Paul says in Romans). Scripture is clear that God will discipline us if we sin, but he does not see us as sinners. Will God bring up our deeds, as believers, at judgment day? I am inclined to believe so, but I do not know the details.

    I don't know if I believe the reward system some Christians hold to. Our Lord Jesus said that the first will be last, and the last will be first; those that worked all day will be rewarded with the same reward as those that worked for only one hour.
     
  13. Daniel9v9

    Daniel9v9

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    Yeah, that means those outside the body of Christ. Again, we are absolutely to do good works and to live holy lives, but not because our salvation depends on it. We cannot finish the work of Christ, for it is already completed in the person and works of Christ. This Gospel message is not to be confused with a new kind of Law, when it in fact is a deliverance from the Law - a Law that no one is able to keep, except for Christ Himself.

    As I already said, God does indeed punish evil, but He does not punish those in Christ as if Christ’s work is insufficient. The works of Christ are complete and we are saved apart from the Law; by God’s grace.
     
  14. Oscarr

    Oscarr Senior Veteran Supporter

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    Perhaps you missed reading the Scripture, "Your sins and iniquities I will remember no more." And "Jesus who knew no sin, was made sin for us so that we have become the righteousness of God in Christ." And, "If we judge ourselves, we will not be judged."

    It is interesting also, that Jesus is our judge, and because He prays to the Father for us continually, He is going to be our defence lawyer at the same time!

    Hey, if all else fails, read the Bible!
     
  15. eleos1954

    eleos1954 God is Love Supporter

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    “The Ancient of Days was seated. ... His throne was a fiery flame. ...
    The court [judgment] was seated, and the books were opened” (Daniel 7:9, 10).
    “We have an Advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous” (1 John 2:1).
    “The Father ... has committed all judgment to the Son” (John 5:22).
    “The Devil ... the accuser of our brethren, who accused them before our God day and night, has been cast down” (Revelation 12:9, 10).
    “These things says the Amen, the Faithful and True Witness, the Beginning of the creation of God” (Revelation 3:14).
    (See also Colossians 1:12–15.)

    God the Father, the Ancient of Days, presides in the judgment. He loves us very much (John 16:27). Satan is our only accuser. In the heavenly court, Jesus, who loves us—and is our best friend—will be our attorney, judge, and witness. And He promises that judgment will be “made in favor of the saints” (Daniel 7:22).

    Amen and Thank you Jesus!
     
  16. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    No I believe Christians are also punished for their sins. Please state to me in the Bible where it says we are free from sin consequences? This Grace only Theology is only half of the message. We are called to live sin free and free because Jesus set us apart for himself but we must work together to remove sins shackles and not be bound to anything in this world. Any other way to preach the gospel is to leave a door open to antinomialist beliefs. I believe in freewill and I believe in Gods Grace and they work together much like the Eastern Orthodox Church has viewed it we must abide therein.
     
  17. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    I can pick out verses too. There is nothing that says that Christian that goes on sinning will go unpunished and that God wont hold it against him.
     
  18. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    Arent Saints the ones who endure until the end? Doesn't that mean they must not commit sin?
     
  19. Cement

    Cement Active Member

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    God may withhold rewards, withhold healing withhold pleasures as a consequence of sin to Christians. I believe he does not see us as sinners but even so there is a heavy price to pay if one indulges in sin as a Christian who knows the law.
     
  20. klutedavid

    klutedavid Well-Known Member

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    To believe in Jesus means to trust that the blood of Jesus fully reconciles us to His Father.

    Romans 4:8
    “Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will not take into account.”

    We do not rejoice in Jesus because some of our past sins are taken into account. We rejoice because we are seated with Christ in the heavenly realms, and our past sins are not taken into account.

    We are a new creation in Christ and everything is new, the former things have passed away.
     
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