Brihaha

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Desperation perhaps. Our workforce has become entitled, lazy and unreliable in America. And GOP politicians have a rather large culture war to maintain on immigration. No ideas for solutions, merely the grievance of the base to placate.
 
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comana

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Desperation perhaps. Our workforce has become entitled, lazy and unreliable in America. And GOP politicians have a rather large culture war to maintain on immigration. No ideas for solutions, merely the grievance of the base to placate.
The “entitled, lazy, and unreliable “ workforce can be better described as not going above and beyond for wages that barely pay rent and expenses.
Seeing Boomers work themselves into broken and sick bodies as they enter retirement is a warning to enjoy life today because there are no guarantees of a pleasant retirement tomorrow.
 
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Brihaha

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The “entitled, lazy, and unreliable “ workforce can be better described as not going above and beyond for wages that barely pay rent and expenses.
Seeing Boomers work themselves into broken and sick bodies as they enter retirement is a warning to enjoy life today because there are no guarantees of a pleasant retirement tomorrow.
You have a valid point. I felt consequences from pulling 12 hour shifts in my 40s. My workforce criticism was towards the younger generation who feel entitled to a paycheck for standing around on their phones. Our ethical workers are rapidly dwindling and we can see the consequences in higher turnover rates and lower productivity. If younger workers even approached fulfilling their job duties, never mind going above or beyond, I would not have made the comment.
 
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Say it aint so

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Desperation perhaps. Our workforce has become entitled, lazy and unreliable in America. And GOP politicians have a rather large culture war to maintain on immigration. No ideas for solutions, merely the grievance of the base to placate.
I think America is ranked number 4 with workforce production given all nations.
 
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Brihaha

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I think America is ranked number 4 with workforce production given all nations.
I found this data from 2023. USA is tenth in GDP per capita. In GDP per hours worked USA is only eighth. The writer describes the data as demonstrating that many Americans live to work rather than working as a means to live. The average full-time employee averages 41.5 hours per week with 11% of workers endure 50+ hours per week in America. It seems ironic and unfortunate that some Americans are killing themselves working simply to live.

I was fortunate to find a gig last year that only demands I work three or four afternoons per week. Time is more valuable than money for some Americans.

 
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SavedByGrace3

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Needing a living wage does not mean your employer has to pay you one for menial work. What? You expect a paper clip counter to make 100 K a year? If you are not making enough to live on, get a better job. If you do not have the skills to get a better job, go to tech school and get some training. I worked in a cotton mill for 21 years. I never made more than 21K a year. The mills all shut down in the 80s and 90s and I went back to college and got an Associates degree in computer programming. I retired 20 years later as a systems engineer making 80K with a good pension. Never did I think that anyone owed me anything. We home schooled our kids and they are all into 6 figures now. They worked, they got the degrees and certificates needed to become employed in good paying jobs. We taught them to not expect any help except from family and God.
Stealing from one person and giving it to another is not charity. It is not compassion. YOU take from your good and give it to others. Kudos to you for doing that. Don't force your religion on us.
 
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comana

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Needing a living wage does not mean your employer has to pay you one for menial work. What? You expect a paper clip counter to make 100 K a year? If you are not making enough to live on, get a better job. If you do not have the skills to get a better job, go to tech school and get some training. I worked in a cotton mill for 21 years. I never made more than 21K a year. The mills all shut down in the 80s and 90s and I went back to college and got an Associates degree in computer programming. I retired 20 years later as a systems engineer making 80K with a good pension. Never did I think that anyone owed me anything. We home schooled our kids and they are all into 6 figures now. They worked, they got the degrees and certificates needed to become employed in good paying jobs. We taught them to not expect any help except from family and God.
Stealing from one person and giving it to another is not charity. It is not compassion. YOU take from your good and give it to others. Kudos to you for doing that. Don't force your religion on us.
I’m happy you were able to train for and procure a better job. Education is very expensive today and it’s rare to find a job offering a pension.

a living wage just means a wage in line with the cost of living of the economy. A wage that is enough for rent and basic bills, groceries, etc. I believe any job offering full time hours should meet this standard.
 
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Arcangl86

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Needing a living wage does not mean your employer has to pay you one for menial work. What? You expect a paper clip counter to make 100 K a year? If you are not making enough to live on, get a better job. If you do not have the skills to get a better job, go to tech school and get some training. I worked in a cotton mill for 21 years. I never made more than 21K a year. The mills all shut down in the 80s and 90s and I went back to college and got an Associates degree in computer programming. I retired 20 years later as a systems engineer making 80K with a good pension. Never did I think that anyone owed me anything. We home schooled our kids and they are all into 6 figures now. They worked, they got the degrees and certificates needed to become employed in good paying jobs. We taught them to not expect any help except from family and God.
Stealing from one person and giving it to another is not charity. It is not compassion. YOU take from your good and give it to others. Kudos to you for doing that. Don't force your religion on us.
$21k in 1980 had the same buying power as $80k today. If you were really making $21k you were making a pretty good living.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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$21k in 1980 had the same buying power as $80k today. If you were really making $21k you were making a pretty good living.
Was there... did both. Not even close.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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I’m happy you were able to train for and procure a better job. Education is very expensive today and it’s rare to find a job offering a pension.

a living wage just means a wage in line with the cost of living of the economy. A wage that is enough for rent and basic bills, groceries, etc. I believe any job offering full time hours should meet this standard.
Not if you are a full time paper clip counter. A person in a menial job should not make the same as a skilled, trained worker. Makes no sense. Even socialism says "from each according to their ability..." which means most people would suddenly not be able to even sort paper clips. And what person with the skills of a surgeon is going to be content to live with a mere living wage. "To each according to their need." Bare living.
Recipe for disaster. Nobody will want to work, which means the state will force you to work. That means no more living in mom's basement playing video games. Nope... Has never worked and never will.
Most states, including the state I live in, will virtually pay for your 2 year degree with pell grants, state, and local grants. In the US, if a person wants to learn a skill... they can do it.
 
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comana

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Not if you are a full time paper clip counter. A person in a menial job should not make the same as a skilled, trained worker. Makes no sense. Even socialism says "from each according to their ability..." which means most people would suddenly not be able to even sort paper clips. And what person with the skills of a surgeon is going to be content to live with a mere living wage. "To each according to their need." Bare living.
Recipe for disaster. Nobody will want to work, which means the state will force you to work. That means no more living in mom's basement playing video games. Nope... Has never worked and never will.
Most states, including the state I live in, will virtually pay for your 2 year degree with pell grants, state, and local grants. In the US, if a person wants to learn a skill... they can do it.
This post is out of touch with reality. I’m not sure why you went on a socialism rant either.
I have declined to apply for many full time jobs that paid near poverty rates all while requiring a college degree. A person should be able to work and pay necessary bills, buy groceries, etc. with or without extra education. Also, employers get what they pay for.
 
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USincognito

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This post is out of touch with reality. I’m not sure why you went on a socialism rant either.
I have declined to apply for many full time jobs that paid near poverty rates all while requiring a college degree. A person should be able to work and pay necessary bills, buy groceries, etc. with or without extra education. Also, employers get what they pay for.
It's weird how many conservatives can't see beyond their bipolar worldview and think they only choices are starvation wages for menial task workers (who they claim to respect) or UBI where everyone sits at home smoking pot and watching Oprah reruns. It seems inconceivable to them that we could pay folks who do hard, but unskilled labor, a living wage.
 
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RDKirk

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Needing a living wage does not mean your employer has to pay you one for menial work. What? You expect a paper clip counter to make 100 K a year? If you are not making enough to live on, get a better job. If you do not have the skills to get a better job, go to tech school and get some training. I worked in a cotton mill for 21 years. I never made more than 21K a year. The mills all shut down in the 80s and 90s and I went back to college and got an Associates degree in computer programming. I retired 20 years later as a systems engineer making 80K with a good pension. Never did I think that anyone owed me anything. We home schooled our kids and they are all into 6 figures now. They worked, they got the degrees and certificates needed to become employed in good paying jobs. We taught them to not expect any help except from family and God.
Stealing from one person and giving it to another is not charity. It is not compassion. YOU take from your good and give it to others. Kudos to you for doing that. Don't force your religion on us.

The old rules don't work anymore the way they used to. For instance, you got a "good pension." There's no such thing as "good pensions" anymore.

Even systems engineers today are running scared. I have a weekly bible study with a group of systems engineers I've been studying with for 20 years now (I'm not a codedawg, I'm a wirehead myself).

They're hoping to retain their jobs until they retire, but with ten years left for most of them, they see a shakey future. AI will put most of them out of work within five years. Oh, wait. Last year I said "five years." Now, I'm thinking only one or two years before most current systems engineers will be on unemployment.

Oh, well...everyone can still work hard and become rocket scientists.
 
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DaisyDay

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Not if you are a full time paper clip counter. A person in a menial job should not make the same as a skilled, trained worker. Makes no sense. Even socialism says "from each according to their ability..." which means most people would suddenly not be able to even sort paper clips. And what person with the skills of a surgeon is going to be content to live with a mere living wage. "To each according to their need." Bare living.
Recipe for disaster. Nobody will want to work, which means the state will force you to work. That means no more living in mom's basement playing video games. Nope... Has never worked and never will.
Most states, including the state I live in, will virtually pay for your 2 year degree with pell grants, state, and local grants. In the US, if a person wants to learn a skill... they can do it.
The problem highlighted in this thread is that because no one want the menial job at poverty wages, employers need want to hire children to do it and politicians are helping them out by changing child labor laws.
 
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Hammster

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“Henning, Sanders’s spokesperson, stated that the federal Fair Labor Standards Act, which prohibits children under 18 from doing certain dangerous work — such as manufacturing or construction — still applies to labor practices in Arkansas. The FLSA was enacted in 1938 and limits the hours children can work so they have plenty of time to go to school, do homework, and get enough sleep to stay awake in class.”

Takes care of that. :)
 
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iluvatar5150

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Desperation perhaps. Our workforce has become entitled, lazy and unreliable in America. And GOP politicians have a rather large culture war to maintain on immigration. No ideas for solutions, merely the grievance of the base to placate.

I wonder how long it’ll take for right-wing propaganda to start pointing the finger at management that’s ineffective, incompetent, and/or greedy.

I know WAY more people who are passionate about their work and burnt by bad managers (myself included multiple times over) than I know people looking to collect a paycheck and slack off.

You have a valid point. I felt consequences from pulling 12 hour shifts in my 40s. My workforce criticism was towards the younger generation who feel entitled to a paycheck for standing around on their phones. Our ethical workers are rapidly dwindling and we can see the consequences in higher turnover rates and lower productivity. If younger workers even approached fulfilling their job duties, never mind going above or beyond, I would not have made the comment.
High turnover isn’t an indicator of poor worker ethics. There is no ethic demanding worker loyalty. High turnover is an indicator of poor management.
 
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rambot

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“Henning, Sanders’s spokesperson, stated that the federal Fair Labor Standards Act, which prohibits children under 18 from doing certain dangerous work — such as manufacturing or construction — still applies to labor practices in Arkansas. The FLSA was enacted in 1938 and limits the hours children can work so they have plenty of time to go to school, do homework, and get enough sleep to stay awake in class.”

Takes care of that. :)
Takes care of what?
 
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comana

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I wonder how long it’ll take for right-wing propaganda to start pointing the finger at management that’s ineffective, incompetent, and/or greedy.

I know WAY more people who are passionate about their work and burnt by bad managers (myself included multiple times over) than I know people looking to collect a paycheck and slack off.


High turnover isn’t an indicator of poor worker ethics. There is no ethic demanding worker loyalty. High turnover is an indicator of poor management.
IMO high turnover is always a reflection of poor management. I have seen far too many managers promoted to the position because they were great at their job rather than because of great leadership skills. They were miserable to work for. I am still at my current job solely because my manager is amazing. Otherwise I would be long gone already.
 
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