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Your position has no merit, nor do any of your claims. Where is your backing for this claim? I seem to remember a verse in John 14....Jesus doesn't answer prayers... it isn't his job. You brought it up... now let's see you provide "evidence" of your claim. You already have my position; Jesus doesn't answer prayer... now it is your turn.
This is coming from someone who doesn't bother to respond to other people's claims. You're not willing to listen to a word we say, so I am done with this fruitless argument with you. Oh, and having an open mind doesn't mean we blindly accept what you say.Look there really isn't any point in this. You have no interest in learning the truth. You have your perceptual set and refuse to have an open mind. It is like Jack Nicholson said: You can't handle the truth.
Be happy.
Ahhh The ole if you dont believe what I believe its because you cant see the truth angle eh? The problem isnt with me it is solely with your presentation. You provide no sources, no evidence and nothing substantial and expect everyone to just take it on your word only that you and you only know the truth. I have asked repeatedly for sources and the only thing you can come up with didnt even back up your false claims.KCDAD said:Look there really isn't any point in this. You have no interest in learning the truth. You have your perceptual set and refuse to have an open mind. It is like Jack Nicholson said: You can't handle the truth.
I don't care if you understand what I understand. What bugs me is that what you believe is not supportable with any argument you make. Gravity had NOTHING to do with inertia. Ghosts, angels, magic, miracles and demons have nothing to do with donkeys talking.Ahhh…The ole “if you don’t believe what I believe it’s because you can’t see the truth” angle eh? The problem isn’t with me it is solely with your presentation. You provide no sources, no evidence and nothing substantial and expect everyone to just take it on your word only that you and you only know the truth. I have asked repeatedly for sources and the only thing you can come up with didn’t even back up your false claims.
You have no interest in learning the truth only in repeating unsubstantial nonsense you refuse to back up. You have your perceptual set and refuse to have an open mind and refuse to back it up with anything substantial.
It is like Jack Nicholson said: You can't handle the truth. Here is the truth pal; you got nothing.
jawsmetroid;39668029Your position has no merit, nor do any of your claims. Where is your backing for this claim? I seem to remember a verse in John 14....
This is coming from someone who doesn't bother to respond to other people's claims. You're not willing to listen to a word we say, so I am done with this fruitless argument with you. Oh, and having an open mind doesn't mean we blindly accept what you say.
How would you know? I havent even told you what I believe. This isnt about what I believe it is about erroneous comments you made that you cant back up.KCDAD said:I don't care if you understand what I understand. What bugs me is that what you believe is not supportable with any argument you make.
Hello? Thats what I was telling you; didnt you read the links I gave you?KCDAD said:Gravity had NOTHING to do with inertia.
Strawman; I never even so much as hinted this. Where are you getting this rubbish?KCDAD said:Ghosts, angels, magic, miracles and demons have nothing to do with donkeys talking.
Strawman; I never even so much as hinted this. Where are you getting this rubbish?KCDAD said:You can not point out one Bible passage that shows Jesus answered any prayer.
Dude; you havent a clue what my theology is. I havent even discussed what my theology is to you. You are simply ranting nonsense now.KCDAD said:You theology is made of straw.
Whoa!!! Is this what UUMC teaches to its members? Explain to me how it is you consider yourself to be a Christian.KCDAD said:John 14:14??? How about all the people that had prayed in Jesus' name to save the miners in Utah? How about all those that prayed for the victims of Katrina or the tsunami? I guess the 6 million Jews and 4 million Christians, Roma, elderly, sick and homosexuals that died in Nazi concentration camps didn't say the right words. Dietrich Bonhoeffer, a Christian, certainly prayed in Jesus name for deliverance... and yet he died.
Did that verse say Jesus said "ask anything in my name" and "I will do it"?
Bitterness, eh? Do you know the meaning of 'in my name'? In His will, authority, character. It is not outside God's character to punish sinners. If you're angry, don't take it out on us. It's not going to get you anywhere.John 14:14??? How about all the people that had prayed in Jesus' name to save the miners in Utah? How about all those that prayed for the victims of Katrina or the tsunami? I guess the 6 million Jews and 4 million Christians, Roma, elderly, sick and homosexuals that died in Nazi concentration camps didn't say the right words. Dietrich Bonhoeffer, a Christian, certainly prayed in Jesus name for deliverance... and yet he died.
Did that verse say Jesus said "ask anything in my name" and "I will do it"?
I have read everything you wrote and responded. That you do not understand there is Truth outside the Roman Catholic Bible is not my fault nor concern.
Your arguments are repetitive and inconsequential. Quote Bible verses out of context all you want. You have not answered the question that haunts you... If anything is required of us, God's grace is not free. Your God is arbitrary, and limited in love, forgiveness and mercy. If the Bible is not 100% consistent and inerrant I have to think... oh no! Not that! Fundamentalism is NEVER good... not if it Islamic nor if it is Christian.
Here is the thread points you refer to…How would you know? I havent even told you what I believe. This isnt about what I believe it is about erroneous comments you made that you cant back up.
Hello? Thats what I was telling you; didnt you read the links I gave you?
Strawman; I never even so much as hinted this. Where are you getting this rubbish?
Strawman; I never even so much as hinted this. Where are you getting this rubbish?
Dude; you havent a clue what my theology is. I havent even discussed what my theology is to you. You are simply ranting nonsense now.
Yes... we teach people that God is Truth and Jesus is the way, the TRUTH and the life... there is no truth in the verse that says Jesus will do whatever you ask him to do.Whoa!!! Is this what UUMC teaches to its members? Explain to me how it is you consider yourself to be a Christian.
Bitterness, eh? Do you know the meaning of 'in my name'? In His will, authority, character. It is not outside God's character to punish sinners. If you're angry, don't take it out on us. It's not going to get you anywhere.
Strawman; I said nothing about animal sacrifice or Jesus blood. I simply said diseases are spread through blood in answer to your question of why it was considered unclean when a woman was in her menstrual cycle. That was the question you were asking and I provided an answer. You have yet to provide anything but strawman arguments and personal opinions.KCDAD said:Here is the thread points you refer to
First is your discussion of blood: it is dirty because it carries diseases but Jesus blood (and the blood of sacrificed animals in general) cleanses us.
Im not sure why you think leprosy being curable has anything to do with what I said. You said it wasnt contagious I proved to you with a link to a source that said you were wrong. End of story. So why are you now trying to add more to this?KCDAD said:Next is Leprosy slightly contagious ok, Ill concede that it is contagious however it is curable. It did require the isolation of victims in leper colonies.
Sorry doesnt work that way. If I said demons existed then yes I would have to provide proof that they do. I didnt say anything of the sort. This is a common tactic on these forums where when you have nothing you shift the onus to another. You claimed they do not exist and I asked for your proof and you admitted you had none. End of story.KCDAD said:Since you can not produce one demon, and EVERY mental illness can be explained by organic differences in the brain, it is up to you to provide a reason to believe demons exist and can possess people.
A claim backed up by science and of which I gave you several links. Note that you havent been able to back up one of your claims not one.KCDAD said:Then we get to your claim that gravity would hold everything in place if the Earth stopped its rotation
I didnt see you ask for a response to the seatbelt factor in car travel. Which post did you say anything about the seatbelt factor. I see where you are going with this now.KCDAD said:I dont see a response to the seatbelt factor in car travel.
How is gravity a red herring? It is what keeps us on the surface of the earth. Didnt you read any of the links I provided?KCDAD said:Also note that YOU first mentioned gravity as a red herring to alter the discussions direction.
Interesting, so explain to me how you know which way Jesus teaches you to live if the bible is full of errors and contradictions? To me that very statement is contradictory.KCDAD said:My calling myself a Christian is because of instead quoting irrelevant verses out of context, I actually try and live the way Jesus taught us to live.
What prompt you to say this to me? Did I say I believed Jesus would do whatever I ask him to do? Can you quote the post where I said that? Why cant you debate what I say instead of continually make stuff up and debate that?KCDAD said:there is no truth in the verse that says Jesus will do whatever you ask him to do.
Isnt it your church that teaches you how to follow Jesus? How do you know how to follow Jesus if the bible is full of errors and contradictions?KCDAD said:My being a Christian is about following Jesus, not the church.
And yet... blood is what cleanses us...Tawhano;3967553]I said nothing about animal sacrifice or Jesus blood. I simply said diseases are spread through blood in answer to your question of why it was considered unclean when a woman was in her menstrual cycle. That was the question you were asking and I provided an answer. You have yet to provide anything but strawman arguments and personal opinions.
I am talking about how the Bible and those who read it. The standard response was they are unclean (sinners) and need to be isolated from society.Im not sure why you think leprosy being curable has anything to do with what I said. You said it wasnt contagious I proved to you with a link to a source that said you were wrong. End of story. So why are you now trying to add more to this?
You can not prove a negative... since no one can prove they exist, there is no reason to believe they do. End of story.Sorry doesnt work that way. If I said demons existed then yes I would have to provide proof that they do. I didnt say anything of the sort. This is a common tactic on these forums where when you have nothing you shift the onus to another. You claimed they do not exist and I asked for your proof and you admitted you had none. End of story.
I never said anyone would fly off the Earth. I said they would continue, per inertia, to travel at 1000 miles per hour when the world stopped revolving. Now it is you that are putting words in my mouth.Note that you havent been able to back up one of your claims not one.
I didnt see you ask for a response to the seatbelt factor in car travel. Which post did you say anything about the seatbelt factor. I see where you are going with this now.
Law of Inertia: Every object in a state of uniform motion tends to remain in that state of motion unless an external force is applied to it. Laymens terms: If a ball is rolling forward it will continue to roll forward until something stops it.
I assume you are referring to when you turn a corner in a car (or come to a stop) you are seemingly forced to the opposite of which the car is moving. What actually is happening is that your mass carries on forward until the seatbelt restrains you as per the Law of Inertia. So what would happen if the earth stopped rotating? How does that effect your movement? You will still proceed forward of course. Will you fly off the earth in a straight line? No, gravity prevents that. So what happens? You simply continue on in the direction you were heading the same as when you were in the car. The seatbelt kept you from continuing to move forward in the car and gravity will prevent you from continuing forward off the earth.
Ok, I'll back off. Do you believe the Bible where it says whatever we ask, God will give us? Of course not. Not even if we ask is Jesus name.What prompt you to say this to me? Did I say I believed Jesus would do whatever I ask him to do? Can you quote the post where I said that? Why cant you debate what I say instead of continually make stuff up and debate that?
No. The church doesn't teach me how to follow Jesus. That is through the Holy Spirit and reason.Isnt it your church that teaches you how to follow Jesus? How do you know how to follow Jesus if the bible is full of errors and contradictions?
Why God created us? Love and relationships.So any time a prayer is ignored it is because the prayer was not in "his will, authority or character".
Isn't that convenient? Pray for whatever you want in my name and if I do it, then you know it was in my will, authority or character and if not... well, er, uh... it wasn't in my will, authority or character.
So much for ask ANYTHING. Faith the size of mustard seed and move this mountain. When two or more of you are gathered in my name and agree... it will be done. ANYTHING, except.
It will be done.... except when it isn't.
Of course it outside God's will to punish sinners. Why do you think that it rains on the just and the unjust? What do you think is the entire point of the book of Job? Why do the wicked prosper and righteous suffer... because of God's will? BLASPHEMY!
This survivor theology is nonsense. Everyone who suffers, suffers because it is God's will. Everyone who dies, it is because it is God's will. Everyone who is rich, healthy and powerful is because it God's will.
What's the point of living if everything is God's will? Oh, I can guess at your answer... OBEDIENCE. Yeah, I am sure that is why God created us... so we would worship and obey.
Yep that is right. I see now why you think the bible is full of errors and contradictions; you dont understand it. Explain to me how this is supposedly a contradiction.KCDAD said:And yet... blood is what cleanses us...
Yeah so? They didnt have the cure for leprosy back then.KCDAD said:I am talking about how the Bible and those who read it. The standard response was they are unclean (sinners) and need to be isolated from society.
I do not have twenty dollars in my wallet. That is a negative. I just looked in my wallet and I have no twenties. I just proved a negative.KCDAD said:You can not prove a negative... since no one can prove they exist, there is no reason to believe they do. End of story.
Nope, not putting words into your mouth at all. You said If that process stopped, the entire contents of this planet would continue flying eastward at around 1000 miles per hour... and flying means being airborne. If that isnt what you meant then I simply misunderstood you because of the words you used. At any rate I explained the effects of inertia and it still applies to whether you go flying off the planet or just go flying eastward.KCDAD said:I never said anyone would fly off the Earth. I said they would continue, per inertia, to travel at 1000 miles per hour when the world stopped revolving. Now it is you that are putting words in my mouth.
Cool, now you are going to ask me questions and answer them for me as well.KCDAD said:Do you believe the Bible where it says whatever we ask, God will give us? Of course not.
You have demonstrated your ability to reason. If something doesnt fit in your box then it is discarded without careful examination. I have repeatedly asked you for sources and evidence to back up your claims and you have failed to produce one. I have serious doubt that you follow anything through reason since you demonstrate a lack thereof. If you dont understand how the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us then I also doubt you follow through the Holy Spirit.KCDAD said:No. The church doesn't teach me how to follow Jesus. That is through the Holy Spirit and reason.
Im sure you think you know what you are talking about but I am afraid nothing you say is making any sense as to your false claims that the bible is contradicting itself with this issue. Also they didnt literally wash themselves with the blood nor are we to literly dring the blood of Jesus. I would ask you for the source of your premise but I know better because you have none.KCDAD said:We are to drink the blood of Jesus. The Old Testament Hebrews literally washed themselves in the blood of their sacrifices... we are not talking about blood removing impurities form the cells.
KCDAD said:And you can't catch leprosy with casual contact or by just being in the vicinity of someone. Never mind. Forget about leprosy.
You just dont get it do you? You cant prove they dont exist and I cant prove they do. The problem is that I never said one way or the other if they exist or not so it is not my problem to prove it one way or the other. You on the other hand insist they dont exist despite not being able to prove it; so much for your ability to reason. It is unreasonable to tell somebody they are wrong about something you cant prove and expect them to believe you. My rebuttal is simply that you cant prove they dont exist and therefore your arrogant statement that you are right and everyone who believes otherwise is wrong is in fact a fallacious argument.KCDAD said:Perhaps your twenties are invisible or hidden... you better check again. Maybe they just appeared after you closed your wallet... better check again. What proof is your word anyway? Perhaps you wouldn't recognise a twenty if you saw it. Your independent looking into your wallet is nothing close to proof. (oh by the way... there are no demons, angels or leprechauns in my wallet either... that does prove they don't exist?)
You display your rudeness like it is something to be proud of.KCDAD said:What proof is your word anyway? Perhaps you wouldn't recognise a twenty if you saw it.
They are flung through the windshield because of inertia. Didnt you read any of the links I gave you?KCDAD said:Gosh, genius, how does someone go through the windshield of their car in an accident when their seatbelt isn't there to stop them... CRAWL? TUNNEL? No, they fly through the windshield.
Dont give me this crap; you are the one who doesnt answer questions. I am giving you the correct response. You simply can not see the truth because you are blinded by your own pride.KCDAD said:I have to ... you don't answer questions. If you disagree with my assessment, give me your correct response.
I asked for resources for what reason? Youre kidding right? I ask for resources because you cant be trusted in your statements and in a debate it is customary to provide sources to back up your comments. You have not been able to provide one shred of evidence for anything you have said.KCDAD said:You ask for sources... for what reason? Either what I say is true or not. Can the sun stop in the sky? No. Can donkeys talk? Never.
Apparently you are unaccustomed to debating. When you make a statement as fact you need to back that up with some sort of source to show that it isnt just your opinion you are offering.KCDAD said:I don't need a source for those statements. YOU or anyone else needs a source to explain how it is possible under ANY circumstance.
You have demonstrated that you have no idea what the bible says. You have demonstrated quite clearly that nothing you say can be interpreted as anything but misinformation.KCDAD said:The Bible says so... SO? There, so do I.
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