• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.

Featured Why the Antichrist cannot be the Muslim Mahdi

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Douggg, Jun 9, 2019.

  1. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    The sequence of appearance in muslim prophecies are....

    First the Mahdi > then the dajjal > then Isa. In muslim prophecies, Isa don't appear until after the Mahdi is in a big battle with the dajjal.

    In you claim that the Mahdi will be the biblical Antichrist....to match with the muslim sequence, it would have to be this...

    First the Mahdi (the Antichrist) > then the dajjal (the coming real Jesus) > then Isa (the false prophet)

    Don't you see that is an impossibility?
    _________________________________________________________

    Tommorrow, some muslim could come along and claim "I am the Mahdi ! ". He could even gain a bunch of followers. And some Christians might say - oh, there's the Antichrist. Another version of Obama is the Antichrist, or Kissenger is the Antichrist, or the Pope John Paul is the Antichrist, etc.

    But what can't happen is step 2, the dajjal appear - because there is no-one in bible prophecy to play that part, having one eye or a bulging like a grape eye.

    If step 2 can't happen, then step 3 - Isa - can't happen.
     
    We teamed up with Faith Counseling. Can they help you today?
  2. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Chewbacca kree! Supporter

    +3,885
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican
    Why would Christians care about what prophecies Muslims believe in?

    How about none of the steps happening?
     
  3. Marilyn C

    Marilyn C Newbie Supporter

    +216
    Christian
    Married
    Hi Douggg,

    Remember the wicked one is very deceitful and controls by trickery and deceit.

    `Through his cunning he shall cause deceit to prosper under his hand...`(Dan. 8: 25)

    Marilyn.
     
  4. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Because eschatology is the study of the end times, and some Christians in that pursuit think that because of the muslim presence in the world and their Antichristian stance, and the threat they poise to Israel, and anyone who is not muslim, and the nature of forcing conversion to Islam - that the mulsim mahdi could be the biblical Antichrist.

    Step 1 can be a declaration, and someone could have the appearance of what the arch villain of the end times will do. Step 2 is impossible because the muslim dajjal concept is that the person has one eye or a bulging like a grape eye. However, there is no-one in the bible in the real prophecies that corresponds to meet that description.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2019
  5. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    The problem is, Marilyn, there are two other persons in Muslim end times prophecies that interact with the Mahdi. (1) Isa, the muslim Jesus. (2) and the dajjal, the muslim version of the Antichrist.

    There is no way for the muslim prophecies regarding Isa can be fulfilled - even by the theory that the false prophet in Revelation 13 will be Isa.

    Nor anyone the bible to act out being the dajjal. Such as, there is no way the real Jesus can fit the description of the dajjal.
     
  6. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Chewbacca kree! Supporter

    +3,885
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican
    As given in the bible not the religious books of false religions.
     
  7. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Merriam-Webster discitonary....

    Eschatology definition is - a branch of theology concerned with the final events in the history of the world or of humankind.

    At this forum - it is Christian eschatology, we hold.

    We measure other religions eschatology against what the bible says, right?
     
  8. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Chewbacca kree! Supporter

    +3,885
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican

    You should be sharing this with Muslims not Christians. This would be the best area for this topic:

    Debate Other Religions & Faiths
     
  9. ewq1938

    ewq1938 Chewbacca kree! Supporter

    +3,885
    United States
    Christian
    Single
    US-Republican
    Exactly the point I made in the previous post.

    No, "we" as Christians do not with other Christians since it's basically pointless. You should be talking to Muslims to show them their religious eschatology is wrong and convince them the religious eschatology of the bible is the correct eschatology. Presenting this to Christians is preaching to the choir as they say.
     
  10. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    The topic is for this forum because many Christians think that the Antichrist will be the Muslim Mahdi. One of the optional tags to create new threads on this forum is "Anti-Christ Muslim".

    And it is obvious that Islam will play a role in the end times, due to the Gog/Magog event.
    ____________________________________________________

    It could be appropriate to share with Muslims as well. But that has to be done elsewhere.

    ___________________________________________________________________
     
  11. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    It is not preaching to the choir, because there are many Christians everywhere believe that the Antichrist will be the Muslim Mahdi.

    Christians like Joel Richardson have written books on it. And pastors like John MacArthur hold that view.

    Go to You Tube and do a search on "Antichrist muslim mahdi". You will find plenty of videos by Christians thinking so.
     
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2019
  12. Seville90210

    Seville90210 Psalm 118:26

    263
    +105
    United States
    Baptist
    Single
    This is for educational purposes for all audiences: readers and viewers and not just a rebuttal.

    Striking and uncanny similarities between the biblical Jesus and the Muslim Dajjal, with bible verses.



    1) At the 5:16-6:50 mark of the video, the Dajjal can bring rain or drought to wherever whenever He likes.

    Zechariah 14:17-18 NKJV
    17 And it shall be that whichever of the families of the earth do not come up to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of hosts, on them there will be no rain.
    18 If the family of Egypt will not come up and enter in, they shall have no rain; they shall receive the plague with which the Lord strikes the nations who do not come up to keep the Feast of Tabernacles.

    Hosea 6:3 NKJV
    Let us know, Let us pursue the knowledge of the Lord. His going forth is established as the morning; He will come to us like the rain, Like the latter and former rain to the earth.

    Amos 4:7 NKJV
    "I also withheld rain from you, When there were still three months to the harvest. I made it rain on one city, I withheld rain from another city. One part was rained upon, And where it did not rain the part withered.

    Zechariah 10:1 NKJV
    Ask the Lord for rain In the time of the latter rain. The Lord will make flashing clouds; He will give them showers of rain, Grass in the field for everyone.

    Ezekiel 13:13
    Therefore, thus says the Lord GOD, "I will make a violent wind break out in My wrath. There will also be in My anger a flooding rain and hailstones to consume it in wrath.

    Jeremiah 3:3
    Therefore the showers have been withheld, and no spring rains have fallen. Yet you have the brazen look of a prostitute; you refuse to blush with shame.

    Jeremiah 5:24
    They do not say to themselves, ‘Let us fear the LORD our God, who gives autumn and spring rains in season, who assures us of the regular weeks of harvest.’

    Joel 2:23
    Be glad, people of Zion, rejoice in the LORD your God, for he has given you the autumn rains because he is faithful. He sends you abundant showers, both autumn and spring rains, as before.

    Acts 14:17
    and yet He did not leave Himself without witness, in that He did good and gave you rains from heaven and fruitful seasons, satisfying your hearts with food and gladness."

    2) At the 7:30-7:50 mark, the Dajjal can raise the dead.

    I'll leave out the verses on this to save myself the extra work. I think everyone knows Jesus raised the dead during the first coming.

    3) At the 9:35-10:00 mark, the Dajjal can send unbelievers into hell.

    Matthew 13:41-42 New Living Translation (NLT)
    41 The Son of Man will send his angels, and they will remove from his Kingdom everything that causes sin and all who do evil. 42 And the angels will throw them into the fiery furnace, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    Matthew 23:33-36 New Living Translation (NLT)
    33 Snakes! Sons of vipers! How will you escape the judgment of hell?
    34 “Therefore, I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers of religious law. But you will kill some by crucifixion, and you will flog others with whips in your synagogues, chasing them from city to city. 35 As a result, you will be held responsible for the murder of all godly people of all time—from the murder of righteous Abel to the murder of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you killed in the Temple between the sanctuary and the altar. 36 I tell you the truth, this judgment will fall on this very generation.


    Matthew 24:50-51 New Living Translation (NLT)
    50 The master will return unannounced and unexpected, 51 and he will cut the servant to pieces and assign him a place with the hypocrites. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

    4) At the 5:00-5:12 mark, the Dajjal will never marry.
    I'll skip posting verses on this too. This is common knowledge about Jesus.

    5) At the 7:00-8:12 mark, the Dajjal travels to all cities of the world except Mecca and Medina performing miracles trying to convince everyone, particularly Muslims He is their Lord.

    At the first coming, Jesus also traveled all over Israel performing Miracles trying to convince everyone He is the Messiah. The link below list the places Jesus traveled to during His first coming. It's pretty much every cities and towns in Israel.

    New Testament places associated with Jesus - Wikipedia

    In the video below, Jesus is also appearing to Muslims in dreams and visions converting them getting them to believe He is their Lord.



    ================​




    0.00 to 2:00 mark. Four things the Dajjal will do for Israel and the Jews.

    1) The Dajjal will rule the world from Jerusalem eternally.

    Zechariah 14:16-17 New Living Translation (NLT)
    16 In the end, the enemies of Jerusalem who survive the plague will go up to Jerusalem each year to worship the King, the Lord of Heaven’s Armies, and to celebrate the Festival of Shelters. 17 Any nation in the world that refuses to come to Jerusalem to worship the King, the Lord of Heaven’s Armies, will have no rain.


    2) The Dajjal will regather the Jews back to Israel.

    Jeremiah 30:3-8 New Living Translation (NLT)
    3 For the time is coming when I will restore the fortunes of my people of Israel and Judah. I will bring them home to this land that I gave to their ancestors, and they will possess it again. I, the Lord, have spoken!”

    4 This is the message the Lord gave concerning Israel and Judah. 5 This is what the Lord says:

    “I hear cries of fear;
    there is terror and no peace.
    6 Now let me ask you a question:
    Do men give birth to babies?
    Then why do they stand there, ashen-faced,
    hands pressed against their sides
    like a woman in labor?
    7 In all history there has never been such a time of terror.
    It will be a time of trouble for my people Israel.
    Yet in the end they will be saved!
    8 For in that day,”
    says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies,
    “I will break the yoke from their necks
    and snap their chains.
    Foreigners will no longer be their masters.


    3) The Dajjal will liberate Israel.

    Jeremiah 30:3-8 New Living Translation (NLT)
    3 For the time is coming when I will restore the fortunes of my people of Israel and Judah. I will bring them home to this land that I gave to their ancestors, and they will possess it again. I, the Lord, have spoken!”

    4 This is the message the Lord gave concerning Israel and Judah. 5 This is what the Lord says:

    “I hear cries of fear;
    there is terror and no peace.
    6 Now let me ask you a question:
    Do men give birth to babies?
    Then why do they stand there, ashen-faced,
    hands pressed against their sides
    like a woman in labor?
    7 In all history there has never been such a time of terror.
    It will be a time of trouble for my people Israel.
    Yet in the end they will be saved!
    8 For in that day,”
    says the Lord of Heaven’s Armies,
    “I will break the yoke from their necks
    and snap their chains.
    Foreigners will no longer be their masters.



    4) Israel becomes the ruling capital of the world.

    Isaiah 14:1-2 New Living Translation (NLT)
    1 But the Lord will have mercy on the descendants of Jacob. He will choose Israel as his special people once again. He will bring them back to settle once again in their own land. And people from many different nations will come and join them there and unite with the people of Israel. 2 The nations of the world will help the people of Israel to return, and those who come to live in the Lord’s land will serve them. Those who captured Israel will themselves be captured, and Israel will rule over its enemies.

    Isaiah 60:10-12 New Living Translation (NLT)
    10 “Foreigners will come to rebuild your towns,
    and their kings will serve you.

    For though I have destroyed you in my anger,
    I will now have mercy on you through my grace.
    11 Your gates will stay open day and night
    to receive the wealth of many lands.
    The kings of the world will be led as captives
    in a victory procession.

    12 For the nations that refuse to serve you
    will be destroyed.


    Isaiah 49:23 New Living Translation (NLT)
    23 Kings and queens will serve you
    and care for all your needs.
    They will bow to the earth before you
    and lick the dust from your feet.

    Then you will know that I am the Lord.
    Those who trust in me will never be put to shame.”





    1:00-1:35 mark. The Dajjal rides a white horse in the sky.

    Revelation 19:11 New Living Translation (NLT)
    Then I saw heaven opened, and a white horse was standing there. Its rider was named Faithful and True, for he judges fairly and wages a righteous war.

    Note: The speaker in the video said the Dajjal will be riding a white donkey made of iron. This is being told to Muslims so they'll believe the Dajjal is flying in a plane made to look like a horse or donkey. The Muslims have all kinds or theories ready to refute the Dajjal's miraculous powers when He appears like in this video below.



    In addition, the Dajjal is said to defend Israel against her enemies, and also fight the Mahdi (biblical antichrist) and Isa (fake Jesus aka biblical false prophet).

    These are just some of the overwhelmingly striking and uncanny similarities between Jesus and the Dajjal.

    In the bible, there's only three prominent figures mentioned in the end times. In the Quran, there's also only three prominent figures mentioned in the end times.
    If the biblical antichrist is the Muslim Mahdi, the biblical false prophet is the Muslim Isa (false Jesus), than our Jesus could only be the Dajjal.

    Islamic Teaching on the Final Battle Between Christ and the Antichrist

    Definitions:

    The Dajjal is Islam’s Antichrist figure. According to Islam, the Dajjal will return and claim to be Jesus Christ. He’ll claim to be divine and He’ll fight for Israel. The Dajjal is actually the biblical Jesus Christ who returns as the King of kings. When the video refers to the Dajjal, or the Antichrist, it is really referring to the biblical Jesus Christ.

    The Mahdi is Islam’s awaited messiah. Muslims believe he will come to help them defeat the Christians and the Jews at the time of the end. He will attempt to rule the entire world. The Mahdi is the biblical Antichrist.

    Isa is Islam’s Jesus figure. Muslims believe Jesus was a great prophet but they do not believe He was the Son of God or Savior of the world. The Muslim Jesus will “return” and deny he ever said he was God. He will join together with the Mahdi. He will teach people about Islam and eventually direct people to worship the Mahdi. He is obviously not the real Jesus. The Muslim Jesus is the biblical False Prophet.



    Islam the Anti-Christ Religion – Fortress of Faith

    For the next few days I want to talk about Islam, the Antichrist Religion. We will be looking at how Islam fits into biblical prophecy.

    We will be looking at Islam’s doctrine of eschatology, or doctrine of last things. Islam is waiting for three people, the Mahdi (Islamic Messiah), Isa (Islamic Jesus), and the Dajall (Islamic false Messiah). The Dajall will claim to be the Messiah, but Islam believes he will be an impostor.

    These things sound kind of familiar to those of us who know Bible prophecy. It almost sounds like I am talking about the Book of Revelation, but as we look closer, you will see that Islamic prophecy is the mirror image of Bible prophecy. The Mahdi is the person we, as Christians, often refer to as the Antichrist. The false prophet of Revelation is the Muslim Isa (Jesus). The Islamic Dajall is our Messiah.



    Look who Muslims promote as 'Antichrist' - WND - WND

    LOOK WHO MUSLIMS PROMOTE AS 'ANTICHRIST'


    Guess who is being promoted as the “Antichrist” in a new 52-part video documentary making the rounds on YouTube?

    The Islamic production company responsible makes the case that the endtimes global leader, also known as “the Beast of Revelation,” will actually be the Christian and Jewish Messiah.



    Who is the Dajjal Islamic Antichrist? | Amos37


    @Douggg, if you're gonna try to refute this, please provide evidence from the bible and not personal theories.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
  13. tranquil

    tranquil Newbie

    971
    +105
    Christian
    Married
    Dajjal is from Zechariah 11:17
     
  14. tranquil

    tranquil Newbie

    971
    +105
    Christian
    Married
    Dajjal is not the real Jesus.

    this is a possible scenario, I don't necessarily think this has to be the case:

    Dajjal = decoy Christian 'antichrist'
    Mahdi = Christian 'antichrist' = Islamic messiah that defeats the Islamic antichrist
    Isa = Christian false prophet

    read Matthew 24:24 Many false christs & prophets will arise. They are telling a story that deceives people.
     
  15. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    tranquil, the false prophet in Revelation 13 has the people of the world make an image of the beast - basically an idol - and has the world worship the image, and anyone refusing will be killed.

    For the false prophet to be the muslim Isa, their Jesus, the question has to asked is making an idol for people to worship something that Jesus would do? It simply doesn't match with what Jesus would do.

    The whole idea of the Antichrist being the muslim Mahdi fails when a person actually starts to dig into it.
     
  16. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    @Douggg, if you're gonna try to refute this, please provide evidence from the bible and not personal theories.[/QUOTE]
    I have been giving you reasons from the bible. But you seem to like videos.

     
  17. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    The Muslim do not teach that Jesus will make an idol and have the world worship it - like the False Prophet does in Revelation 13. The False Prophet and the Muslim Isa are not a match.
     
  18. tranquil

    tranquil Newbie

    971
    +105
    Christian
    Married
    Muslims have their own test of faith also. It is entirely possible that good Muslims (Muslims that pass their test) will become Christians when we save them from the real antichrist. see Isaiah 19:24-25

    As to the idol worship, just because that is not what Jesus would do, does not mean that that invalidates their eschatology... there is Christian eschatology even though there will be Christian idolatry.

    And keep in mind, this 'living image' could very well have the appearance of being the 'holy ghost' to some.

    Again, there are many antichrists; your insistence on there only being one is misleading you.
     
  19. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Islam will end when Gog/Magog takes place. That will leave muslims in the position of what to believe. I think most will still believe in a montheist God - one God - but it won't be Allah. Many will turn to become Christians.

    Right after Gog/Magog, the prince who shall come person becomes the Antichrist by being perceived by the Jews as the messiah and anointed the King of Israel. Which he confirms the Mt. Sinai covenant for 7 years acting out the role of being the King of Israel. A big speech from the temple mount, that God gave the land of Israel to the children of Israel as theirs forever.

    The complete end times picture is condensed in Ezekiel 38-39. Gog/Magog, then the 7 years, then Jesus returns to earth.

    Take away the possibilty that the false prophet could be the muslim Isa because the false prophet creates idol worship - there is no one in bible prophecy to act as the Muslim Isa.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
  20. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +1,577
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    How many little horn, prince who shall come, revealed man of sin, the beast - are there in bible prophecy?

    They each are only one. And all of them are one person. That one person is universally called the Antichrist by nearly everyone.

    It is correct that it is one person. But the term Antichrist only applies to when the person is in the role of being the King of israel, one that is not approved by God.
     
Loading...