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Why McConnell Dumped Trump

Discussion in 'General Politics' started by Michael, Jan 23, 2021.

  1. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Why McConnell Dumped Trump

    This is a really insightful article about the split that's happening in the GOP. I think one of the key points of the article is that corporate sponsors have started to withhold campaign contributions from the GOP after the riots and the subsequent votes by hundreds of GOP members to try to toss out the electoral college results.

    It will be interesting to see how this all plays out in the upcoming impeachment trial in the Senate. If Republicans continue to try to shield Trump from his attempted insurrection attempt, they risk losing a lot of corporate sponsorship and they'll alienate themselves from independent voters.

    If Republicans vote to impeach Trump, they also risk alienating themselves from Trump's supporters, but at least they can prevent Trump from running again in 2024 and prevent him from starting up a third party, both of which would be devastating to the Republican party.

    [​IMG]
     
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  2. Rachel20

    Rachel20 Well-Known Member

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    How so?
     
  3. Halbhh

    Halbhh Everything You say is Life to me Supporter

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    Yes, and if Trump started a new party, then it'd definitely lose, because in the U.S. generally it's just whoever gets the most votes (in most states there is no runoff). So, the Patriot and Republican parties would then be losing most elections, since they'd be competing against each other, splitting the non-Democrat vote.

    I think McConnell simply didn't want to live under the constant Mob rule that one can see was being established, as an ongoing threat over time. No one wants to live under the thumb of the Boss, the mafia way.

    Not when you'd had American freedom already. Few people would want to give up the good American life to live under Mob rule.

    Even if Trump didn't get convicted by the Senate, and ran as a Republican, and even won the primary, I think he'd definitely lose the election in 24' regardless.

    On Jan 6th, he permanently lost about 5%-8% of the U.S. vote, in an irreversible way.
     
  4. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    If the Senate convicts him, they can also vote (separate vote I believe) to prevent him from ever holding political office.
     
  5. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Yep. It's quite the dilemma for the GOP. If Trump runs in the next election, either as a Republican or an Independent candidate he'll lose, and he'll hurt the GOP either way. Trump is like a bad stain on the GOP. IMO they'd be better off making sure he can't hurt them ever again, and take their chances with current Trump supporters two years from now.

    I'm almost *certain* that Trump's bruised ego will cause him to run again in 2024. He'll certainly lose, but it will destroy any chance the GOP has of winning that election, and it will hurt them in House and Senate races too.

    I think it's time for the GOP to cut their losses and be rid of Trump for good.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2021
  6. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    McConnell privately says he wants Trump gone but faces backlash—CNN obtains 9-point memo to get rid of Trump - CNNPolitics

    I think a lot of Republicans feel the same way, but it's unclear how they will vote in the impeachment trial at this point. They're all making political calculations at this point, so there is a real possibility of Trump being convicted in the Senate this time. Since the Senate is now controlled by Democrats, the GOP can't prevent there from being a real trial with real witnesses. Those witnesses are likely to be devastating too.

    Supporters' words may haunt Trump at impeachment trial

    Jenna Ryan wants a pardon......

     
  7. Sophrosyne

    Sophrosyne Let Your Light Shine.. Matt 5:16

    +42,313
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    The GOP has one foot in the Grave and it is mostly their fault for cowardice and stupidity and if they make Trump a scapegoat for their ineptness then they deserve to have over 50 million voters flee to a 3rd party in 2002 and start outing Republicans who stood by as their party was destroyed.
     
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  8. Guinan

    Guinan "I'm not saying it's aliens, but it's aliens."

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    I'm glad to see McConnell finally standing up to Trump. It's about time he grew a backbone. Better late than never, I guess. I'm sure he's only stepping up like this in an effort to save his own neck.
     
    Last edited: Jan 23, 2021
  9. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
  10. civilwarbuff

    civilwarbuff Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I don't think there will be a trial. I think Justice Roberts, as a Constitutionalist, will decline to participate on the basis that Trump is not President (which is what the Constitution requires) which will then throw into doubt the Senate's right to try a private citizen (which is what the president becomes after leaving office) for impeachment. This rodeo has some ways to go before we get to the bull rides.
     
  11. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    I doubt that Justice Roberts will decline on such a basis.

    Legal scholars, including at Federalist Society, say Trump can be convicted
     
  12. civilwarbuff

    civilwarbuff Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Not according to the Constitution. That is the problem with leftists; they want the Constitution to say what they want not what it really says.
     
  13. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Legal scholars, including at Federalist Society, say Trump can be convicted

    It's not just "leftists" that disagree with you, it's the *majority* of legal scholars. I'd say that you're projecting at this point.

    The constitution certainly doesn't permit nor condone the things we saw on January 6th, and Trump is not immune from the responsibility of his actions and his words. He had his days, weeks and *months* in court and he provided no compelling evidence of voter fraud. Even Bill Barr and his own justice department looked into the issues and they too found *nothing* to support the belief that there was wide spread voter fraud that affected the outcome of any state election. Every state certified their results.

    Even *still*, Trump called his mob to DC that day. He lied to them repeatedly about a "stolen" election that he simply lost in free and fair elections. He lost not only the electoral college vote by more than 70 votes, he also lost the popular vote by more than seven million votes.

    He lied some more when he told the mob that Mike Pence had any legal authority to do *anything* about the outcome. Pence didn't even get to cast a single vote that day. Trump put his own VP in harms way when he lied to that mob before he sent them down to march on the Capitol.

    Trump had his own personal lawyer to tell the mob to go down there and have "Trial by combat". His other chosen speaker that day told them to "take names and kick ass". They did exactly what Trump and his lawyer asked them to do according to their own testimony.

    Trump has to be held accountable for his actions, for his lies and deception and his blatant and public attempt to overthrow the legally elected government of the United States. It wasn't just democrats the mob was after, they were chanting "Hang Mike Pence" too.

    This was all completely and totally avoidable. All Trump had to do was *tell the truth*, the *real* truth, and nothing but the truth. That's all that he had to do, and *none* of that would have happened.

    When Hillary Clinton lost the last election, she conceded it the *next day*. In spite of the fact that she actually won the popular vote by *millions* of votes, the Democrats didn't storm the Capitol. They didn't chant "Hang Mike Pence" and break doors and windows. Why? Because Clinton told them the truth. That's all Trump had to do too. Every losing candidate in my lifetime prior to Trump simply told the truth, and there were no riots.

    Everything that happened on January 6th was caused by Trump and his enablers in the house and senate *not telling the truth*! There are in fact consequences for his lies, including the death of a police officer and four other human beings.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2021
  14. civilwarbuff

    civilwarbuff Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Try studying the electoral college and how it works and why it was implemented.

    Look, I understand that the left simply does not like Trump and wants to prevent him from running again.....pure and simple. But that is not an adequate reason for impeachment. If the Senate goes ahead with this trial Schumer may not want to get too comfortable in the Majority Leader's office.....it will be a short stay come next election.
     
  15. civilwarbuff

    civilwarbuff Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Then the majority of the legal scholars don't understand the Constitution either. It plainly states 'the president' not 'the former president'. The senate has no authority to put a private citizen on trial which is exactly what Trump is now.
     
  16. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Right, and you do?

    It doesn't say "active" president either, and the majority of scholars acknowledge that point too.

    Trump must be held accountable for his words and actions. He lied and people died. That's a fact. All he had to do was tell the truth, but he didn't. Even his own head of the justice department told him (and everyone else) that the justice department had looked into the issue of voter fraud, and there wasn't any evidence that any state's outcome was affected by wide spread voter fraud. All the states certified their results and all the courts agreed. Trump had no legal or "honest" reason to summon his mob to DC on the 6th. He had no legal or honest reason to lie to the crowd and suggest to them that Mike Pence had any authority to overturn the electoral college results, when in fact Mike Pence didn't even have a vote in the matter that day.

    Trump *must* be held accountable for his actions, and he should be forbidden from ever running for public office ever again. He's a danger to our Republic because he *lies* about the very foundations of democracy, including but not limited to the outcome of elections!
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2021
  17. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Irony overload. Trump lost the last election by the same electoral college margin, yet you refuse to accept those results now. Talk about hypocrisy. You also totally missed the point of that sentence. Clinton *acknowledged* her loss in the electoral college. She didn't summon a mob to DC *in spite* of the fact that she won the popular vote. She *honored* our electoral college system even if she didn't like it. Trump has no honor. He did *not* support the states rights as Clinton did. That's the *key and substantive difference* between what happened in January of this year, compared to what happened in January of 2017. We had a peaceful transfer of power in 2017, and Clinton (both Clintons) were at Trump's inauguration in 2017. Trump wasn't even emotionally mature enough or man enough to even attend the inauguration this year and he doesn't honor our constitution or state rights, or tradition. All he cares about is himself. That selfishness cost HUMAN LIVES but he doesn't care.

    I didn't much like Bush Jr. either, but he wasn't a threat to the very foundations of our democracy. He didn't try to overthrow the government. He didn't call up states and demand that they find him votes, and threaten them.

    I don't want Trump to *ever again* be a threat to our democracy. He's just a man and he's not that important compared to our nation.

    That's not the reason they impeached him in the house in a *bipartisan* manner.

    I'm sure the democrats are painfully aware of the fact that their choices will have repercussions as it relates to answering to the voters of this country. They seem to have the courage to do what's right for our nation in spite of what it might personally cost them in the next election. Even Republicans in the house had the courage to tell the truth about our elections, and about Trumps actions, and I hope that will be the case in the Senate trial. It's not about doing what's politically advantageous, it's about doing what's right for our nation and holding Trump accountable for his actions.
     
    Last edited: Jan 25, 2021
  18. civilwarbuff

    civilwarbuff Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Leahy expected to preside over Trump impeachment trial instead of Chief Justice Roberts
    Hate to say I told you so.....but I told you so.....

    This unconstitutional trial by the senate of a private citizen is going to have terrible consequences that democrats will suffer for years to come.....be careful what you ask for, you may get it.
     
  19. Michael

    Michael Contributor Supporter

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    Well, you did call that one correctly. Kudos.

    I still don't buy the argument that it's unconstitutional, particularly since there is already historical precedent of a Senate trial after a person has left office.

    I simply don't see this impeachment trial as a Democratic or a Republican issue in the final analysis, I see this trial as *mandatory* if we're going to respect our constitution and protect our Republic. If inciting insurrection against the Republic of the United States isn't grounds for impeachment and grounds to be excluded from holding public office in the future, I don't know what is. We might as well remove the impeachment clause entirely if he's not held accountable for his words and his actions.

    Trump is by *far* the most dangerous politician to our Republic that has ever held office. He's pressured states to overturn their own election results. He and his lawyer have incited an insurrection attempt at the US Capitol, and he nearly got his own Vice President killed.

    If that's not valid grounds for impeachment, then nothing is.
     
  20. grasping the after wind

    grasping the after wind That's grasping after the wind

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    I don't see how they could stop Trump from starting up a new political party. I also would not be unhappy if the republican party were devastated. And the Democratic party as well. Neither of them hold many governmental values I agree with.
     
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