Why is Reformed Church in America in decline?

[jinc1019]

From what I read, the Reformed Church in America has lost something like one-third of its total membership in the last 40 years. Why is this happening? I know many mainline denominations are losing members, but the Presbyterian Church in America is rapidly growing and they both shared a reformed heritage. Thoughts? I know very little about the RCA so any information at all would be helpful.

Justin

 

[Anoetos]

The RCA is a liberal denomination and its membership trends are pretty much the same as other liberal denominations.

 

[hedrick]

Sociologists of religion have looked at this question for several decades. They have models of church growth that fit pretty well with what's actually happening. While new religions happen, and people change, most short-run changes in religious populations occur because of changes in the populations themselves. E.g. Moslem are growing, not because of mass conversions, but because of high birth-rates in Moslem-majority countries.

Similarly, the social groups that are normally attracted to mainline churches are declining in numbers. As I recall the fertility rate of mainline Christians has been much smaller than conservative Christians. Birth rates of conservative Christians are going down as well. This would lead you to expect that conservative churches might start seeing membership declines, and in fact that is happening. As I recall that explains about 2/3 of the difference. I believe the other third is explained by decreased conversion rates from conservative to mainline churches. But that too has a demographic explanation: it is correlated with a pretty dramatic decrease in upward social mobility over the same period. That decline bothers me for reasons other than church growth.

Here's one article about that: https://sociology.sas.upenn.edu/sit....edu/files/Birth_Dearth_Christian_Century.pdf. Also Birthrates Explaining Church Decline - YouTube.

Of course a church might start growing by becoming conservative, since it would then become attractive to the conservative population. But as long as mainline churches keep their existing population they would actually do better to remain liberal. I would certainly not stay with the church if it became more conservative, nor would most other members of my church.

 

[Anoetos]

There's no evidence that mainline church members are reproducing more slowly than conservative church members. What happens is that they reproduce and their children are not particularly "churched"; later they either never really develop any religious interest, or if they do, they tend to go where it's taken more seriously.

 

[hedrick]

There's no evidence that mainline church members are reproducing more slowly than conservative church members. What happens is that they reproduce and their children are not particularly "churched"; later they either never really develop any religious interest, or if they do, they tend to go where it's taken more seriously.

Did you read the paper I cited? Have you done any web searches to look at birth rate differences? The differential is lower now, but still exists even in recent studies I've seen.

The differential is getting less because birth rates are going down for conservatives. The PCA has stopped posting membership statistics on their web site, but here is some recent data: Against the Current: Presbyterian Church in America Statistics. It doesn't look good for the near future. Note particularly the decline in Sunday School attendance. As the report indicates, this shows the decreasing birth rates (though the scale that was used exaggerates the decline)

Southern Baptists are also seeing declines. http://www.abpnews.com/ministry/org...-baptism-membership-numbers-fall#.UjecvBbfbBE

None of us have ever gotten all of our high school kids back as adults. We've had to make up for that in other ways. That's no longer happening as much, and the trend is spreading to more conservative churches. We've all got to work on retaining young adults.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

From what I read, the Reformed Church in America has lost something like one-third of its total membership in the last 40 years. Why is this happening? I know many mainline denominations are losing members, but the Presbyterian Church in America is rapidly growing and they both shared a reformed heritage. Thoughts? I know very little about the RCA so any information at all would be helpful.

"Church attendance in developed countries has gradually declined. Research has attributed this decline to boredom during services, incompatibility of belief systems and lack of motivation.[16] One study published in the Journal of the Scientific Study of Religion, however, argues that at least in America, church attendance since the 1990s has remained stable at 25%.[17] A Gallup poll found that church attendance among Protestants has remained stable at roughly 45% since 1955, while church attendance among Catholics has dropped from 75% to 45%, although it has remained stable since 1995, despite negative stories in the news.[18] Another Gallup poll found a slight increase in church attendance over the past two years; associating this with an aging population.[19] This decline is particularly pronounced in European countries, where it is suggested that the secular culture overrides interest in religion.

Church attendance remains stronger among older adherents, and more common in women.[20][21] Some research asserts that younger generations show greater levels of religious adherence than the baby boomers, many of whom brought up their children in a non-religious environment.[22]

Another study associated church attendance with decreased risk of Alzheimer's Disease.[23]

The Pew Research Center has linked weekly church attendance with happiness.[24] The Iona Institute found increasing church attendance in Ireland, despite sex-abuse claims within the dominant Catholic Church.[25] The authors suggest the rise is due to the effects of the recession.

A 2005 EU survey found that belief was higher among women, increased with age, those leaning towards right-wing politics, and those reflecting more upon philosophical and ethical issues.[26]

Studies in general indicate that there is a higher rate of church attendance among married couples and those with bachelor's degrees than any other group. For instance, in a Pew Research survey from 1996, approximately 34% of high school dropouts went to church on a typical Sunday, while 44% of those with a college degree or higher did.[27] 48% of married individuals attended church on a typical Sunday, compared to 29% of divorced and 31% of never-married individuals. While it is likely that the well-educated and married might over-report their church attendance more often, nevertheless these findings demonstrate that they have maintained a stronger church-going identity than other Americans." - Church attendance - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[jinc1019]

I appreciate all of the responses, but I simply don't believe for a second that losing 1/3 of a church population in 20-30 years (as the PC USA has) is because of declining birthrates. That just statistically doesn't make sense. Other denominations, even ones who have declined, have not declined that rapidly.

Further, I think it's basic logic that if a church, any church, radically changes its theological positions on controversial issues, membership will likely be altered. To suggest that membership has been completely unaltered by this seems, on its face, incorrect. Obviously SOME people left that would have otherwise stayed.

I am not saying that there isn't some truth to the declining birthrate issue (I know there is), but I doubt very highly its the only major issue, even if it is the primary one.

Further, if your assessment was true, ALL churches would be in radically decline, and some are not...especially many independent non-denominational churches. If you want to argue that church membership across the country is uniformly down because there are less Christians before or Christians take less, on the whole, less seriously than before, I can accept that...but you still have to explain why the remaining Christians stay in some denominations and don't in others.

Also, I really was only concerned with this one church, the Reformed Church in America, not any other denomination. I am especially interested because the Christian Reformed Church in America appears to have much more steady numbers than the RCA....Any thoughts on this?

 

[hedrick]

The CRC is a bit more conservative than the RCA, I think. The RCA is considered mainline, the CRC not quite.

I understand your objection, but demographers have the data to do models of growth, and the models fit pretty well. Science is about believing evidence, not what you think is true.

No, not all churches would be in rapid decline. The evidence is that the groups associated with the mainline have, until recently, had fewer births than the groups associated with more conservative churches. (The difference being social class and education. Not that all conservative are ignorant, of course, but the mainline churches tend to have members in higher socioeconomic classes, and birth rates in those classes have over the last several decades been lower. Movement from lower classes to upper ones has also slowed from the period when mainline churches were growing.) That predicts a larger decline for mainline churches than conservative churches. In recent years the gap has decreased, which might predict that mainline churches would recover, but in fact some numbers suggest that what's happening is that conservative churches are starting to decline as well.

Please look at the paper I cited. Do a web search and look for birth rates and socioeconomic status. These are well-known things.

The PCUSA has an additional problem at the moment. So if you're speaking of the last 10 years or so, I agree with you that there's more going on than demographics. Congregations and individual members are moving from the PCUSA to more conservative churches because of its position on homosexuality. That is certainly not just demographics. It's likely to continue for a few years, I think. I believe something similar is happening to the ELCA. But the original question was about the RCA. That wouldn't apply to the RCA, because they still reject homosexuality (although the most recent statement seems to allow some flexibility). Thus I believe the answer for them is the generic answer applying to the mainline.

No faithful church takes theological positions in order to be popular. I believe the leadership of the PCUSA was well aware of the likely effects, and believed it was called to do this in order to be faithful. I agree. Even if it's the case that the way to be popular is to be conservative, that's not a path that I think any Christian would want to take. There are simply times when we're called to do things for which we'll pay a price.

 

[hedrick]

Incidentally, I am not convinced that theology is inevitably tied to class. The mainline is characterized by more than just moderately liberal theology. It is also characterized by boring worship and a church that requires lots of people to go to boring committee meetings. There are PCUSA churches that are growing, and there is a growing liberal wing of evangelicalism. For some reason most mainline congregations have been unwilling to change the way they do things. This ties them to a specific set of the population, who like worship services centered around academic lectures, and consider committee meetings a normal way of getting things done. That population is declining.

In my opinion the future of mainline theology is in liberal evangelical churches, and a few more flexible mainline churches, who will tie mainline theology to a style that appeals to more than the folks who traditionally would have gone to mainline churches.

 

[Apologetic_Warrior]

Incidentally, I am not convinced that theology is inevitably tied to class. The mainline is characterized by more than just moderately liberal theology. It is also characterized by boring worship and a church that requires lots of people to go to boring committee meetings. There are PCUSA churches that are growing, and there is a growing liberal wing of evangelicalism. For some reason most mainline congregations have been unwilling to change the way they do things. This ties them to a specific set of the population, who like worship services centered around academic lectures, and consider committee meetings a normal way of getting things done. That population is declining.

In my opinion the future of mainline theology is in liberal evangelical churches, and a few more flexible mainline churches, who will tie mainline theology to a style that appeals to more than the folks who traditionally would have gone to mainline churches.

This is pure speculation on my part, but I think you may be right, especially concerning worship. One of the reasons in my thinking is based on the impact of CCM as a whole. I am struggling here with how to put into words the blurred lines between theological liberals and conservatives on this topic. For example, there are many of the opinion that worship must be done a certain way, a very strict traditional way, like hymns for example, and that the new styled worship with a different sound and lyrics, is also tied to liberalism. They may even consider Churches liberal on the basis of their style of worship. Personally I am not one of those people, and honestly the music that fires me up to worship God the most these days, is Holy/Reformed Hip Hop/Rap by Lecrae and Trip Lee especially. I can imagine the traditionalists, old school Presbyterians, especially the older generation that did not grow up listening to that genre of music, have a difficult time relating to it, which is understandable. Don't get me wrong though, I can appreciate most music genres, it's just the fusion of sound Calvinist theology with creative grace filled lyrics, catchy beats with rhythmic flow get me excited about the faith, about Christ and also encourages me to think about important issues in life. I can go to Church, and even sing old traditional songs I love, but often, it feels too much like I am part of a show, one that does not connect with everyday life. Some people I think like if for that very reason, I do enjoy those brief and fleeting moments though where corporate worship is like practicing for Heaven. Something else I am liberal about, I have long thought that worship service should come after the preaching, if there be any coverts through the preaching, how much more joyful the worship would be. But I've yet to attend a Church that conducted a service in that order. I'd also like more comfortable seating, hard wood pews just make a person want to cry, maybe that's the point.

 

[hedrick]

This is pure speculation on my part, but I think you may be right, especially concerning worship. One of the reasons in my thinking is based on the impact of CCM as a whole. I am struggling here with how to put into words the blurred lines between theological liberals and conservatives on this topic. For example, there are many of the opinion that worship must be done a certain way, a very strict traditional way, like hymns for example, and that the new styled worship with a different sound and lyrics, is also tied to liberalism. They may even consider Churches liberal on the basis of their style of worship. Personally I am not one of those people, and honestly the music that fires me up to worship God the most these days, is Holy/Reformed Hip Hop/Rap by Lecrae and Trip Lee especially. I can imagine the traditionalists, old school Presbyterians, especially the older generation that did not grow up listening to that genre of music, have a difficult time relating to it, which is understandable. Don't get me wrong though, I can appreciate most music genres, it's just the fusion of sound Calvinist theology with creative grace filled lyrics, catchy beats with rhythmic flow get me excited about the faith, about Christ and also encourages me to think about important issues in life. I can go to Church, and even sing old traditional songs I love, but often, it feels too much like I am part of a show, one that does not connect with everyday life. Some people I think like if for that very reason, I do enjoy those brief and fleeting moments though where corporate worship is like practicing for Heaven. Something else I am liberal about, I have long thought that worship service should come after the preaching, if there be any coverts through the preaching, how much more joyful the worship would be. But I've yet to attend a Church that conducted a service in that order. I'd also like more comfortable seating, hard wood pews just make a person want to cry, maybe that's the point.

I assume you're speaking of evangelical churches. Theological liberalism is certainly not associated with new worship practices in the mainline. The mainline is by and large pretty traditional liturgically. This is often combined with fairly liberal theology.

I have some sympathy with the regulative principle. While I don't consider any specific style canonical, I think there are styles that are more and less conducive to worship. And like you, I think words matter. That's why a music diet consisting largely of praise songs seems like bad worship to me. I sort of like unaccompanied psalm singing, actually. And I'm a theological liberal by CF standards (though conservative by most other standards).

 

[AmericanSamurai]

I can't stand Contemporvana CCM churches that try to mix fauxhawks, the UFC, liberalized emergent church theology and Starbucks. I don't care how soft the chairs are, churches like that disgust me.

 

[drjean]

I think those who wish to have liberal beliefs go to the mega-feel good-churches instead of sticking with a reformed or going to a traditional one, but IDK for sure.

 

[jinc1019]

I think those who wish to have liberal beliefs go to the mega-feel good-churches instead of sticking with a reformed or going to a traditional one, but IDK for sure.

I think you should take a look into the Episcopal Church USA, one of the most traditional in terms of worship style with one of the most liberal theologies out there today.

 

[Charlie V]

I'm an elder in the reformed church. It's not a liberal denomination.
Someone at a recent classis meeting hit the nail on the head. The Reformed Church in America started as an extension of the Dutch Reformed Church. Its expansion model was, new Dutch colonies came to the New World and settled in areas, where they formed new Dutch Reformed Churches. We haven't changed our models since, but the number of new Dutch colonies coming to the New World has gone down. Actually, I think the denomination would grow if it BECAME liberal. It's not, but becoming liberal might grow the church, especially since it is predominantly in the North East.

 

[FireDragon76]

I don't know how it is with Reformed churches, but many Lutherans churches are uncertain of their mission in a post-Christian world, where the evangelical focus on individual salvation has become not only irrelevant, but incomprehensible. I think the Radical Lutheran approach that was so trendy and popular among the ELCA and certain LCMS types in particular, is problematic (and I actually agree somewhat with more conservative, confessional Lutherans on this point, it's a reductionistic presentation of the Christian faith). Not to mention, many mainline churches are downright stuffy and inwardly focused. Re-arranging deck chairs on the Titanic comes to mind. Some Lutherans are very comfortable being German-Americans at prayer, with the token minority to create the pretense of being genuinely inclusive.

I actually believe the Episcopalians are in a good position for growth. Probably because their identity has become more flexible. They seem to be focused heavily on just being "Jesus people" with tasteful liturgy and a generous but traditionally oriented orthodoxy.

 

[Radagast]

I'm an elder in the reformed church. It's not a liberal denomination.

Like the PCUSA, the RCA is at the liberal end of the spectrum. Like the PCUSA, it contrasts with smaller, more conservative, denominations at the other end.

 

[Charlie V]

Like the PCUSA, the RCA is at the liberal end of the spectrum. Like the PCUSA, it contrasts with smaller, more conservative, denominations at the other end.

What is liberal about the RCA, specifically?

 

[Radagast]

What is liberal about the RCA, specifically?

You're kidding, right?

Let's define the spectrum in Presbyterian terms:

1 (most liberal): PCUSA
2: ECO/Fellowship
3: PCA
4: OPC
5: (least liberal) various ultra-conservative micro-denominations

And here are some Reformed denominations:

a: Reformed Church in America
b: Christian Reformed Church in North America
c: Canadian and American Reformed Churches
d: United Reformed Churches in North America
e: Protestant Reformed Churches in America

Now pin the tails on the donkey: where do you think a-e fit on the 1-5 spectrum?

 

[Charlie V]

You're kidding, right?

I'm not kidding. And you didn't answer the question. I'm not asking you to rank denominations from more- to less- liberal. I'm asking what aspects are liberal.

Do you consider the RCA's interpretation of Old Testament prophecy liberal?
Do you consider the RCA's view of Christ's death and resurrection liberal?
Do you consider their readings of Psalms, or their interpretation of salvation liberal?
Is their version of the Apostles Creed more liberal than other denomination's version of the Apostles Creed?
Is the Heidelberg Catechism more liberal than catechisms used in other denominations, and if so, what part of the Heidelberg Catechism is liberal?

What, specifically, in their theology, is more liberal than other denominations?