Why is Messianic Judaism considered Judaism if they believe in Jesus?

[Chicken Little]

I've read all of those stories. I'm not getting your point.

Also, it is the Word of God, all of it that is written on our hearts. The Law is not written on our hearts alone.

you think you know them read them again. what was the first instructions? to come up . they didn't want to. read it .

 

[visionary]

Jesus Himself said all of the Law is within two commandments that we love the Lord our God with all our hearts, soul and minds and that we love our neighbor as ourself. Jesus Himself re-defined the law. Why would He have done that if we are to live by the Law?

That is not re-defining the Law. That is quoting Old testament.

 

[ToBeLoved]

The Old covenant was all about the need for the death of one to pay the penalty for sin. So we need a Messiah to break the bond of sin over us. It is in this New covenant with Him that we can learn to live without sin. Not by sacrifice but by walking in mercy, grace, truth, and in His Kingdom filled with obedient people to His Laws.

But under the Law the priests were able to temporaily atone for sin, so in that scenario with the law in effect why the need for Jesus? Why not keep sacrificing animals or things to God for sin? If you say the Old Covenant is better, than surely the sin problem is taken care of.

 

[ToBeLoved]

you think you know them read them again. what was the first instructions? to come up . they didn't want to. read it .

Please provide scripture to make your point because I am not understanding what you are saying.

'To come up' What does this mean?

 

[ToBeLoved]

That is not re-defining the Law. That is quoting Old testament.

Please provide the verses.

 

[visionary]

But under the Law the priests were able to temporaily atone for sin, so in that scenario with the law in effect why the need for Jesus? Why not keep sacrificing animals or things to God for sin? If you say the Old Covenant is better, than surely the sin problem is taken care of.

Under the covenant contract, the priests performed the rehearsal of what Yeshua as our High Priest would do for us.

 

[visionary]

Please provide the verses.

Deu 6:5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

Deu 10:12 And now, Israel, what doth the LORD thy God require of thee, but to fear the LORD thy God, to walk in all his ways, and to love him, and to serve the LORD thy God with all thy heart and with all thy soul,

Deu 11:13 And it shall come to pass, if ye shall hearken diligently unto my commandments which I command you this day, to love the LORDyour God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,

Deu 30:6 And the LORD thy God will circumcise thine heart, and the heartof thy seed, to love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, that thou mayest live.

Jos 22:5 But take diligent heed to do the commandment and the law, which Moses the servant of the LORD charged you, to love the LORDyour God, and to walk in all his ways, and to keep his commandments, and to cleave unto him, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul.

Watched who asked the question....

Mar 12:28 And one of the scribes came, and having heard them reasoning together, and perceiving that he had answered them well, asked him, Which is the first commandment of all? ....

They were looking for the biblical answer which Yeshua gave.

Mar 12:30 And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

 

[Open Heart]

No one could keep the law.

FYI the Old Covenant was never designed with the idea that it would be perfectly kept. Many of the laws are about what to do when you fall short, sin offerings, day of atonement, etc.

 

[ToBeLoved]

These of course cover the greatest commandment, but Jesus went even further. To give us the two commandments that fulfilled all of the law.

None of the verses you quoted talk about anything more than the greatest commandment.

I thought you said the Old Testament covered it? Is there more?

 

[ToBeLoved]

FYI the Old Covenant was never designed with the idea that it would be perfectly kept. Many of the laws are about what to do when you fall short, sin offerings, day of atonement, etc.

Exactly. Which is my point of why the Son of God came.

However, they have said the Old Covenant is superior so I'm giving them a chance to speak on why they feel it is.

 

[visionary]

These of course cover the greatest commandment, but Jesus went even further. To give us the two commandments that fulfilled all of the law.

None of the verses you quoted talk about anything more than the greatest commandment.

I thought you said the Old Testament covered it? Is there more?

A Jew would understand this and would not need further information, just like when Yeshua talked to the rich Jew about his committment and only mentioned the second. That is the part this Jew was having problems with... His love for fellow mankind.

 

[visionary]

Exactly. Which is my point of why the Son of God came.

However, they have said the Old Covenant is superior so I'm giving them a chance to speak on why they feel it is.

Neither is superior.. one is the rehearsal and one is the memorial... But it is not about the Law of God. .. it is about the law of Moses which explain the laws of God, the rehearsals, dietary and holy walk.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I'm not getting what you're saying. At that time they only had the Old Testament so if it was not said in the Old Testament than Jesus was saying something new.

It is either in the Old Testament or it is not.

 

[ToBeLoved]

That's not what Jesus said. Jesus said He came to fulfill the law. With a new and everlasting covenant. Note the word new.

 

[Chicken Little]

if you won't go read it all of it in context yourself it is chapters long .. do you really want to know ? well when you are ready you will look into it yourself and spend considerable time praying and reflecting on those chapters. about what is happening before after and during those events. right ?

 

[ToBeLoved]

You say there is something there that I am missing but you cannot explain what it is?

I have no idea what you are talking about. I cannot read your mind so if you do not tell me, I cannot know

 

[Lulav]

Jesus Himself said all of the Law is within two commandments that we love the Lord our God with all our hearts, soul and minds and that we love our neighbor as ourself. Jesus Himself re-defined the law. Why would He have done that if we are to live by the Law?

Not redefined, explained in full.

 

[ToBeLoved]

View attachment 163521

Not redefined, explained in full.

If that is true than why we're not these two commandments the only two?

So God only gave half the answers the first time? That does not make sense to me.

 

[Lulav]

If that is true than why we're not these two commandments the only two?

So God only gave half the answers the first time? That does not make sense to me.

Those two are the headings of everything in the Torah and prophets.

How do you love G-d? the Torah explains how'
How do you love your neighbor? The Torah explains how.

Those are the commandments, all which fall into one of the two headings or categories that Yeshua said were the 'greatest'.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Under the covenant contract, the priests performed the rehearsal of what Yeshua as our High Priest would do for us.

I've never heard that. Do you have verses for that? What part of the covenant contract? Where?