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Why Is Jesus A Minor Character

Discussion in 'Traditional Theology' started by timothyu, May 14, 2020.

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  1. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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  2. OldWiseGuy

    OldWiseGuy Wake me when it's soup. Supporter

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    Maybe the church is filled with 'tares' (like the Scilla that has taken over my lawn). :eek:
     
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  3. dzheremi

    dzheremi Coptic Orthodox non-Egyptian

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    If the persistent infestation of Judaizers, various adoptionists, neo-Sabellians, Arians, and other heretics on these messageboards is anything to go by, the issue may be that whoever is leading the congregations these people are a part of have either imbibed these heresies themselves or refuse to tell the congregation they are supposed to shepherd that these things are wrong, probably because that same congregation is more in love with playing at being first century Jews or Ebionites than actually worshiping the Lord Christ with His Good Father and the Holy Spirit in the all-perfect uncreated and indivisible Holy Trinity. I see it all the time here, and it is always baffling. Judaism is wrong, and not salvific. The Jewish works of the law will not save you.

    A balanced, well-rooted church will preach according to the cycle of readings as is appropriate for the liturgical year. It is these renegades and rootless people who scoff at such things as 'traditions of men' (as though the Lord Christ and His apostles and disciples had none) who go off on their own to preach according to their own desires who have these problems. It is hard to feel bad for them in that case, though of course the people themselves should be rescued from bad theology served up by charismatic theological illiterates.
     
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  4. JackRT

    JackRT Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I agree, an excellent article.

    For a great many, Christianity is no longer the religion of Jesus but has become a religion about Jesus. This happened quite early as is supported by the creeds --- Nicean Creed, Athanasian Creed, Apostles Creed -----. All list what a believer must believe and say next to nothing about the ethical code which Jesus taught and lived his life by. I think this has to do with the transition of the Early Church away from its original Jewish identity into a Gentile (Greek philosophical) identity in the second century.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2020
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  5. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    And as a result ignore His gospel of the Kingdom and His teachings that as God is within us, we are not to focus on our flesh but upon the spirit within us which has no interest in the things of the flesh. Jesus tried to lead us away from the world of man and back to God and the Kingdom/governance of God over the governance of man. Christianity took us back to the world and governance of man.
     
  6. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Of course God may have had a plan, other than forwarding scriptures after the fall of Judah, in a church of renegade gentiles, to ensure their survival. Better to have a field of tares running the religion where a few actual grains can come in and infest than the other way around.The other way around the church never would have survived in the world of man.
     
  7. Not David

    Not David Der Romisch Katechumene

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    Since when is allowed to preach against Traditional Christianity in this forum?
     
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  8. dzheremi

    dzheremi Coptic Orthodox non-Egyptian

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    More Judaizing nonsense. Can this get out of the TRADITIONAL THEOLOGY subforum forever, please? Tradition as recorded in the scriptures tells us that the Gentiles are not to be burdened with the customs and laws of the Jews, as decided by the fathers of the Apostolic council in Jerusalem recorded in the Acts of the Apostles. That has been good ever since then for every type of people, and only in the modern era has this desire to emulate the Jews come back among those who have no roots of their own, who don't know how to read the scriptures, and hence who can only see the Jewish culture in them and as a result set the Church up against itself. This is utter foolishness.

    Those Christians closest to the Jews of Jesus' time -- Neo-Aramaic and Syriac-speaking Christians -- most definitely affirm the Nicene creed. That you perhaps don't or don't see the point of doing so is to your shame, not to theirs.



    Christianity has all the connections to Judaism that the Church in her wisdom has seen fit to baptize, and while different groups of Christians made that decision at different points (e.g., there is more of an outwardly 'Hebraic' character among the Orthodox Christians in Ethiopia and Eritrea than in the Church in Egypt or Albania or wherever), they did still all make that definitive break. To look at that as some kind of wound for Christianity is the height of blasphemy, as though Judaism is meant to remain a salvific mode of life even after Christ our God -- Whom the Jews mostly rejected, and today still reject -- came and established the Way, which was unpalatable to the Jews because their religion is fundamentally about other things. And long may it be so. Judaizing is anti-Christ poison, and is to be put down wherever it arises.
     
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  9. Not David

    Not David Der Romisch Katechumene

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    The problem is viewing Christ as an anarchist Jewish revolutionary, that's why they think organized Christianity is not about Christ.
     
  10. dzheremi

    dzheremi Coptic Orthodox non-Egyptian

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    Yes, that is the problem. Too much Reza Aslan and other unbelievers with their hoary old denials of Christ's divinity in favor of a proto-hippie Jesus of their own making, not enough fathers of the Christian faith.
     
  11. JackRT

    JackRT Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have often wondered if the "Jesus Movement" of the Apostles would have survived at all were it not for Paul establishing the "Christ Movement" of the Gentiles.
     
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  12. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    Is not the teachings of and by Jesus the traditional Christianity? Or is it the teachings of those who rejoined the world of man that are the ones claiming the traditional title?

    Have not both existed in Christianity from the start? The article merely states that the tares seem to be taking over the field and that is logical in a world of man, as otherwise there would be no problem removing them, but God says no, let them grow.
     
    Last edited: May 14, 2020
  13. topher694

    topher694 Go Turtle!

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    The article contains a whole lot of finger pointing and very little substance to back it up. In my experience this sort of thing does happen, but it is far more rare than the author implies.
     
  14. timothyu

    timothyu Well-Known Member

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    There is not outright rebellion or division as compared to political issues, especially in the S of A, but there is two trains of thought or there wouldn't be two gospels. If Jesus is the Saviour and focal point shouldn't the spotlight be on Him and what He says? Or have the gentiles made it an exclusive club of their own?
     
  15. Grumman Tomcat

    Grumman Tomcat ✈The LORD is my Pilot ⚓ Staff Member Administrator CF Staff Trainer Supporter

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  16. Mollie1

    Mollie1 John 3:16 Staff Member Purple Team - Moderator Supporter Staff on LOA

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    Traditional Theology -- A forum dedicated to the respectful discussion of traditional, historic theology; liturgical practices, doctrines, dogmatics; Holy Scripture as found in the various canons of the Church; Church History; classic confessions of the faith, etc.​

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