Why is God omnibenevolent?

Dorothy Mae

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Why is God anything? I think that is a flawed premise. He is I AM. Nothing created Him. He has no beginning. He just is. There is no reason why He is anything.
If He is not anything, then He does not exist. Being requires that there are descriptions of what that Being is that fit and what that Being is not. Having no beginning does not mean having no character.

The flaw in the question is that the author is not considerig the report of those who know said Being and to a man report that He is good, always good, loves good and requires moral goodness to some degree if one wants to walk with Him. If the author will not accept the testimony of those who know God (or knew Him in the Bible) then he/she is closing their eyes to the only source of real information. If that happens, then one can know nothing, ask all manner of questions that make no sense and never arrive at a knowledge of the truth. There are those who do the latter, ever "learning" but never coming to a knowledge of the truth. Not saying this is one, but they are out there.
 
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AACJ

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What's really bugging me is the world we live in, and how Graceless it is. Nobody - and if not nobody, than 99.999% of people - don't even come close to living like Christ, and as such, there's nobody to go to for help or leadership.
You have the Holy Spirit (your ever present Comforter if you receive Him), a living Christ Jesus (the Living Word of God, your Savior, Friend, and ever present help), and the Written Word (your daily companion, making you wise and more Christlike). How then can you say there is no one to turn to for leadership?
 
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Dorothy Mae

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You have the Holy Spirit (your ever present Comforter if you receive Him), a living Christ Jesus (the Living Word of God, your Savior, Friend, and ever present help), and the Written Word (your daily companion, making you wise and more Christlike). How then can you say there is no one to turn to for leadership?
There is tendency to name and claim matters that really should be experienced to be true. If the above were sufficient because of a legal claim on them, there would never be disagreements among believers.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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Based on the reasons that, people argue, philosophically and logically speaking, God exists, I have yet to find a compelling philosophical argument as to why God is pure good and not evil.

Couldn't it be possible that He created us for sadistic enjoyment, to watch people burn for eternity, and lie about the Love He has towards us? Why should we believe that He is all Love and not pure evil?
Lost Coin, something else occurred to me. You asked about a compelling PHILOSOPHICAL reason for God to be good. Philosophy cannot answer that point at all. It is like asking for a philosophical reason why bananas taste good. Or a philosophical reason why being loved is good. You are asking of philosophy something it cannot address.
 
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AACJ

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There is tendency to name and claim matters that really should be experienced to be true. If the above were sufficient because of a legal claim on them, there would never be disagreements among believers.
What?

Experience does not establish the truth of the truths I referenced. You believe the Comforter is not Comforter outside of an incident (experience) of comfort?

legal claim? You speaking of justification in Christ and its legal component?
 
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Sam81

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These questions are completely useless. The people God will destroy are those who make their own choices. Our focus is not on ourselves but on doing the will of God. If you delight yourself in Him then you know His commandments are in no way grevious. And if His Spirit live in you then you know His goodness.
 
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Thir7ySev3n

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Lost Coin, something else occurred to me. You asked about a compelling PHILOSOPHICAL reason for God to be good. Philosophy cannot answer that point at all. It is like asking for a philosophical reason why bananas taste good. Or a philosophical reason why being loved is good. You are asking of philosophy something it cannot address.

I don't think you understand what philosophy essentially is and that, while it has erroneous applications (which even the Bible does and so does not discredit its viability), it has great worth in subjection to Biblical truth. In fact, I was able to provide a comprehensive answer to this using the grand logical implications of Genesis 1:1. That is because logic, too, is a creation of God (or more specifically, a provision from His nature in our bearing His image), and philosophy is essentially the application of logic to understand abstract (or simply, non-concrete) truths surrounding concrete realities. Even your objection to philosophy was philosophical (an epistemological argument for what is knowable). If you don't enjoy that fact then it is more a semantical than substantial aversion to what philosophy is, since it will be impossible to engage in any thought without practicing philosophy. The only question is not whether or not you will engage in philosophy, but whether you will be good or poor at it.

As a side note and a little teasing fun, there is a philosophical inference for why bananas taste good and why being loved is good, and both actually rely on the same philosophical argument I presented earlier in this thread. Presented as a syllogism, this would look like:

1. God, as first cause, created all things (scriptural support: Genesis 1:1 et. al.)
2. God, being the creator of all things, created both the capacities for enjoyment and the objects of enjoyment (scriptural support: Genesis 2:9 et. al.)
3. The banana is an enjoyable thing which we have the capacity to enjoy
4. Therefore, bananas taste good because God created them to be enjoyed.
 
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dgiharris

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Based on the reasons that, people argue, philosophically and logically speaking, God exists, I have yet to find a compelling philosophical argument as to why God is pure good and not evil.

Couldn't it be possible that He created us for sadistic enjoyment, to watch people burn for eternity, and lie about the Love He has towards us? Why should we believe that He is all Love and not pure evil?
I have to admit, there is a part of me that has been struggling with some form of this question my entire life, namely, if there is a God, why is there suffering? That is a different question, but there is some commonality with my question's origin to yours.

I did manage to answer my question which may provide "some" partial answer to yours.

In this universe, in order for something to be in existence it needs an opposite. There is no light without darkness, no heat without cold, no peace without war. And so, there can be no happiness without suffering. It is just the way the mathematics work out in this universe.

Now, your question is an interesting one, how do we know God is not pure evil? My initial response is that technically I don't think it matters. If God created the Universe, then you would/could define "good" as any action that is in agreement/harmony with God and "bad" as any action that is in disagreement/disharmony with God.

If we accept the premise that -- mortals that are not saved and do not adhere to the teachings of God will suffer for all eternity-- then the natural definition of "good" for this universe would be avoiding that fate and aligning with God regardless of the actions that enable that alignment. This logic leads to the conclusion that no matter what you do, as long as you do it for God, then said action is "good". Of course, this is the justification used for a lot of wars/etc that have happened in the past...

So basically, my initial argument is that based on the laws of this universe, the laws that God created, it is impossible for him to be evil regardless of what he does or mandates because his actions and 'will' result in a natural realignment of the entire universe.

So in a way, my argument is a bit of a cheat and wiggles away from the original intent of your thought exercise and question. :p
 
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usexpat97

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If He is not anything, then He does not exist. Being requires that there are descriptions of what that Being is that fit and what that Being is not. Having no beginning does not mean having no character.

Something got lost in translation here. The operative word is not the "is"; it's the "why".

God is. And God has many different names, and is many things. The flawed premise, however, is that there has to be a reason why. Just like saying everything has to have a beginning. Well, yes. But not God. He has no beginning. He has no reason for being, He needs no reason for having different qualities. It's frustrating to a believer looking for answers, but this time, there is none. There is no answer to be found. Which means any answer we "find", isn't.
 
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Thir7ySev3n

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Something got lost in translation here. The operative word is not the "is"; it's the "why".

God is. And God has many different names, and is many things. The flawed premise, however, is that there has to be a reason why. Just like saying everything has to have a beginning. Well, yes. But not God. He has no beginning. He has no reason for being, He needs no reason for having different qualities. It's frustrating to a believer looking for answers, but this time, there is none. There is no answer to be found. Which means any answer we "find", isn't.

This understanding of God's "isness" is actually helpful in resolving many of the questions relating to the hows as it is effective at dismissing the questions of the whys, when you understand how such a being must exist. This is because the how follows (though not necessarily simply) from the absence of any why in its respective attribute.

For an abbreviated example, why is God omnipresent? Because He is. But how is He omnipresent? Precisely because God is reality (i.e. all that is real) apart from His act of creation, there was nothing "outside" of God "spacially". And since God is Spirit (mind, though obviously in separate category from ours) anything He creates is inside of His mind since there is nowhere "outside" of His being to place it (as though God could create "a little to His left"). Anything inside of His mind is inside His "space" of presence and knowledge (simultaneous realities for God) and thus there is nothing real that can be unknown to Him and unsurrounded by Him.

God is incredibly and endlessly fascinating, in a way that truly makes worship songs and our comparatively trivial way of relating to Him much more beautiful. If you spend years thinking about the infinite nature of God and how incomprehensible (emphasis on not entirely unknowable) His manner of existing and relating make the simplicity of His Gospel and the simplicity of His relationship with man just as stunning and incomprehensibly wonderful as His nature. To think that He is all these things and so far removed by nature, and yet draws so near and takes most pleasure in things like the faith of a child.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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I don't think you understand what philosophy essentially is and that, while it has erroneous applications (which even the Bible does and so does not discredit its viability), it has great worth in subjection to Biblical truth. In fact, I was able to provide a comprehensive answer to this using the grand logical implications of Genesis 1:1. That is because logic, too, is a creation of God (or more specifically, a provision from His nature in our bearing His image), and philosophy is essentially the application of logic to understand abstract (or simply, non-concrete) truths surrounding concrete realities. Even your objection to philosophy was philosophical (an epistemological argument for what is knowable). If you don't enjoy that fact then it is more a semantical than substantial aversion to what philosophy is, since it will be impossible to engage in any thought without practicing philosophy. The only question is not whether or not you will engage in philosophy, but whether you will be good or poor at it.

As a side note and a little teasing fun, there is a philosophical inference for why bananas taste good and why being loved is good, and both actually rely on the same philosophical argument I presented earlier in this thread. Presented as a syllogism, this would look like:

1. God, as first cause, created all things (scriptural support: Genesis 1:1 et. al.)
2. God, being the creator of all things, created both the capacities for enjoyment and the objects of enjoyment (scriptural support: Genesis 2:9 et. al.)
3. The banana is an enjoyable thing which we have the capacity to enjoy
4. Therefore, bananas taste good because God created them to be enjoyed.
Not sure you understand philosophy and very sure you don’t understand my post.

let’s examine your presentation.
1. God is uncaused and therefore not a first cause.
2. Is correct but also a statement of faith, not logic or philosophy.
3. Done people do NOT enjoy bananas. That’s a fact.
4. There is no logical connection between this and the above ones.

None of these are logical nor statements of philosophy.
 
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Thir7ySev3n

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Not sure you understand philosophy and very sure you don’t understand my post.

let’s examine your presentation.
1. God is uncaused and therefore not a first cause.
2. Is correct but also a statement of faith, not logic or philosophy.
3. Done people do NOT enjoy bananas. That’s a fact.
4. There is no logical connection between this and the above ones.

None of these are logical nor statements of philosophy.

Hmmm...I advise never attempting to dismiss a person's knowledge on a subject when you are about to betray your own ignorance. Based on every one of your counter points, you demonstrate a lack of even an elementary understanding of philosophy, such as the definitions of epistemology and ontology, nevermind how to engage in it. Allow me to demonstrate indisputably:

1. Being the first cause by philosophical definition is to be uncaused; these are synonymous. That is philosophy 101 material, literally.

2. This is doubly flawed. First, even if it was a "faith" statement, it would fall under the logical category of an inductive argument (research the difference between inductive and deductive; both are logical forms of inference). Second, it is actually an ontological argument (for both the nature of bananas and human experience of that nature) from the presupposition of God's existence (for the sake of fluent argument) with teleological implications (regarding taste). 3 philosophical subjects were employed in this one inference process.

3. The ontology of bananas and human beings, as well as the teleology of taste do not rely upon a ubiquitous positive response to be true. That is a logical fallacy. Also note that the word capacity was employed to prevent the logical error you made.

4. The conclusion is actually deductive (in that it is not only probable but can not be false if the premises are true).

I urge you to learn a discipline before either addressing it's capabilities or attempting to engage in it yourself. That is also logical.
 
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aiki

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Based on the reasons that, people argue, philosophically and logically speaking, God exists, I have yet to find a compelling philosophical argument as to why God is pure good and not evil.

Couldn't it be possible that He created us for sadistic enjoyment, to watch people burn for eternity, and lie about the Love He has towards us? Why should we believe that He is all Love and not pure evil?

God is a maximally-perfect Being. This entails being perfectly, or maximally, good. If God, then, is not maximally-perfect, He cannot be God. To posit a God who is sadistic and evil is to posit what is incoherent/illogical (at least as far as the Christian conception of God is concerned). Doing so is akin to positing a square with no right angles in it, or a married bachelor. By definition, squares have right angles, bachelors aren't married, and God is perfectly good.
 
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Based on the reasons that, people argue, philosophically and logically speaking, God exists, I have yet to find a compelling philosophical argument as to why God is pure good and not evil.

Couldn't it be possible that He created us for sadistic enjoyment, to watch people burn for eternity, and lie about the Love He has towards us? Why should we believe that He is all Love and not pure evil?

God is love and love is God, there, you found a argument.
 
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Dorothy Mae

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Hmmm...I advise never attempting to dismiss a person's knowledge on a subject when you are about to betray your own ignorance.
You assume too much.
Based on every one of your counter points, you demonstrate a lack of even an elementary understanding of philosophy, such as the definitions of epistemology and ontology, nevermind how to engage in it. Allow me to demonstrate indisputably:
Untrue, but are dismissing my knowledge without basis.
1. Being the first cause by philosophical definition is to be uncaused; these are synonymous. That is philosophy 101 material, literally.
It’s the technical term used by those so educated, but not accurate in common meaning of the word “caused” which is important for the majority here who dud not take phil101. “First Caused” is inaccurate as applied to God.
2. This is doubly flawed. First, even if it was a "faith" statement, it would fall under the logical category of an inductive argument (research the difference between inductive and deductive; both are logical forms of inference). Second, it is actually an ontological argument (for both the nature of bananas and human experience of that nature) from the presupposition of God's existence (for the sake of fluent argument) with teleological implications (regarding taste). 3 philosophical subjects were employed in this one inference process.
Some people do not enjoy bananas so this whole line of reasoning fails when applied to real life.
3. The ontology of bananas and human beings, as well as the teleology of taste do not rely upon a ubiquitous positive response to be true. That is a logical fallacy. Also note that the word capacity was employed to prevent the logical error you made.
Capacity to enjoy at all does not mean all humans enjoy
bananas.
4. The conclusion is actually deductive (in that it is not only probable but can not be false if the premises are true).
But the truth is not all humans enjoy bananas.
I urge you to learn a discipline before either addressing it's capabilities or attempting to engage in it yourself. That is also logical.
I urge you to study the scientific method before relying on thinking detached from reality
 
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Dorothy Mae

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LEt us look at that again...
I don't think you understand what philosophy essentially is and that, while it has erroneous applications (which even the Bible does and so does not discredit its viability), it has great worth in subjection to Biblical truth.
That you start out being insulting to me personally tells me that your argument is weak and you likely know it. So the best defence is a starting offense.
As a side note and a little teasing fun, there is a philosophical inference for why bananas taste good and why being loved is good, and both actually rely on the same philosophical argument I presented earlier in this thread. Presented as a syllogism, this would look like:

1. God, as first cause, created all things (scriptural support: Genesis 1:1 et. al.)
This says nothing worth saying and has no direct link the anything following. IT is true, of course, but no relation to anything else you say. God is, essentially.
2. God, being the creator of all things, created both the capacities for enjoyment and the objects of enjoyment (scriptural support: Genesis 2:9 et. al.)
Again true, but not connected to the previous or the following.
3. The banana is an enjoyable thing which we have the capacity to enjoy
Bananas are not enjoyable for everything so that is not a true statment as written. Bananas are not enjoyable to some people.
4. Therefore, bananas taste good because God created them to be enjoyed.
But many people say bananas do not taste good.
 
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SolomonVII

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Based on the reasons that, people argue, philosophically and logically speaking, God exists, I have yet to find a compelling philosophical argument as to why God is pure good and not evil.

Couldn't it be possible that He created us for sadistic enjoyment, to watch people burn for eternity, and lie about the Love He has towards us? Why should we believe that He is all Love and not pure evil?
Marquis de Sade concluded that God is evil like that.

Ultimately, we approach God through imagination. His nature transcends our own, and possibility of who God is approaches infinity. Who God may be is as broad and as deep and as expansive as the imagination that we conduit God into our lives with.

Theology in earlier ages was described as the Queen of the arts and sciences. The importance of developing the superior conduit to God, that which none exists who is greater in imagination or in reality, was understood to be the most compelling question for our human life. Reason went alongside of faith in determining the nature of God, not only in terms of who he may be, but in terms of what attributes he must have in order for us to reach our highest potential, according to our own human nature. Human nature is an anchor for our imagination after all. It is our nature and our body which grounds us to reality.

The possibility of the underlying nature of our world being ultimately evil is a very real one. Human cruelty, and suffering itself, are virtually infinite. They are central themes to all of conscious existence in our world.

Jesus suffered. He also showed us that there is something that is greater than suffering, and that is love. He chose suffering, not because he loved to suffer, but because he loved us, and he wanted to assure us that love is worth all the suffering that we have to go through in this life.
God, as philosophically defined as that which nothing greater exists in either imagination or reality, therefore can never really be discerned to be evil. Love is greater, both in imagination and in our own human nature, and therefore God is defined by his goodness, and not by the infinite suffering that is the mark of all conscious existence.
As real and as great as the evil of suffering really is-and it is assuredly real beyond our ability to transcend it-love is greater.
God is greater.
 
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Sin dominates me, and whenever I try to stop sinning, I'm left with a hole of emptiness and nothing to do, so I get back to sinning.

As funny as my profile picture is (it's Roman Catholic propaganda of the devil playing Martin Luther like a flute), it's kind of the state of my soul.
I am going to give you my version of how God works in the world . I Believe we can see it in the bible , but the Church establishment denied it in 553 AD.

It says in Genesis that the Heavens show the 'seasons ' ,and they do , not only as in spring , summer etc. on the earth , but they show the seasons of the TIMES we live through . If we look at history we see changes which affect all people to a lesser or greater degree ,eg we are passing the Age when Christ was at the foremost to describe the times ,we could say The Chrstian Age ,now we are in the beginning of a Scientific or aquarian age , Before Christ we were in an age of the Warrier ,and before that the age of the Bull, and so on ,so someone is organising the events on the earth in a certain order ,and I know it is how the Creator organises His Creation ,to evolve his creatures ,us . The animal while having a certain intelligence ,will never become like God , as He said we could .

You are now in a Season of testing and suffering , which will pass ,as all of us suffer from time to time , but we must be careful not to deny the Holy Spirit ,which is what you are doing by questioning God's inherent goodness . He who is incapable of evil . Instead , ask God to enlighten you, to encourage you, putting your faith in Him, even as you sin ,even as you are under terrible stress to deny HIM. That is keep asking ,keep reading the psalms , keep reading about His love ,and His patience etc.

In this way in time the Light will come on again ,but be careful not to deny Him
publicly as you will attract more darkness .
 
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