Why I am doing this

[elwill]

If by peace you mean peace in the Islamic sense, that is submission to Sharia and Islam, then i choose War.

the problem is that you misconcept the shariah
shariah protect nonmuslims also

in shariah we put who commit kill crimes to death , if your laws make that also , so attack them because they excute some of shariah

in shariah we must cut off the hand of thiefs , if you going to make war with us for that , so you protect the crimers , you will be the bad one

anyway this is the way islam looks at
how many innocent people killed because rubber crimes ?
what about if they knew that just thier hands will be cut off , how many innocents shariah saved by this way

there are many crimers whom thier job is theft , if they knew that thier hands may be cut off , it will make them to think thousands of times before to commit it , can you imagine a society more peace than society under shariah from this side ? i don't think so

you look at the harsh of cutting off the hand of crimer , and ignore the innocents whom may be killed by these hands

 

[morningstar2651]

I only quote what I read from Islamic websites. If you can show me they are wrong then I stand corrected.

I can quote some pretty nasty stuff from Christian websites too (Jack Chick, Cutting Edge, jesus-is-savior). Websites aren't terribly reliable.

I tend to take the word of the Muslims here. They seem fairly knowledgeable about their own religion.

 

[anatolian]

And this uncleanness of non-muslims is not a core teaching.The Shi'is teach so, but sunnis differ.Probably the web sites you read are shi'i.

 

[Nadiine]

Yes, although I would like to argue that there's a difference between "respecting" and "embracing." Which the videos and teachings you mentioned are purportedly neither. I haven't seen these videos, hence the "purportedly."


A movie about someone achieving metaphysical prowess through ritualized combat. Good thing my irony meter goes to eleven.

Well first things first - if Lambert was a hotty, I'd of had more interest in Highlander lol (shallow I know, but hey... throw me a bone over here) heh

But ya I agree on the respect & embrace above - there's definitely a difference. But people are demanding acceptance today, they aren't satisfied with respect anymore imho.

I also don't respect another's "religion" or choices - I respect them as people.

 

[Nadiine]

you look at the harsh of cutting off the hand of crimer , and ignore the innocents whom may be killed by these hands

Aren't adulterers put to death too?

*turns wedding ring nervously*

 

[Secundulus]

I can quote some pretty nasty stuff from Christian websites too (Jack Chick, Cutting Edge, jesus-is-savior). Websites aren't terribly reliable.

I tend to take the word of the Muslims here. They seem fairly knowledgeable about their own religion.

You believe an anonymous web poster over the authoritative teaching of the Grand Ayatollah Sistani?

Let some Muslim come and tell me that Sistani is a liar.


84. The following ten things are essentially najis:

1. Urine
2. Faeces
3. sperm
4. Dead body
5. Blood
6. Dog
7. Pig
8. K a f i r
9. Alcoholic liquors
10. The sweat of an animal who persistently eats najasat.

107. An infidel i.e. a person who does not believe in Allah and His Oneness, is najis. Similarly, Ghulat who believe in any of the holy twelve Imams as God, or that they are incarnations of God, and Khawarij and Nawasib who express enmity towards th e holy Imams, are also najis. And similar is the case of those who deny Prophethood, or any of the necessary laws of Islam, like, namaz and fasting, which are believed by the Muslims as a part of Islam, and which they also know as such.
As regards the people of the Book (i.e. the Jews and the Christians) who do not accept the Prophethood of Prophet Muhammad bin Abdullah (Peace be upon him and his progeny), they are commonly considered najis, but it is not improbable that they are Pak. Ho wever, it is better to avoid them.
108. The entire body of a [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth], including his hair and nails, and all liquid substances of his body, are najis.
109. If the parents, paternal grandmother and paternal grandfather of a minor child are all [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth], that child is najis, except when he is intelligent enough, and professes Islam. When, even one person from his parents or grandparents is a Muslim, the child is Pak (The details will be explained in rule 217).

 

[elwill]

Aren't adulterers put to death too?

*turns wedding ring nervously*

yes , if anyone commit it during his marriage , the punishment will be a death .
but how far the possibility of this punishement may be executed ?
there must be four witnesses for this crime .

but what about if husband claimed that his wife commit it with another man or vice versa?

6 - And for those who launch a charge against their spouses, and have (in support) no evidence but their own, their solitary evidence (can be received) if they bear witness four times (with an oath) by God that they are solemnly telling the truth;
7 - And the fifth (oath) (should be) that they solemnly invoke the curse of God on themselves if they tell a lie.​

8- But it would avert the punishment from the wife, if she bears witness four times (with an oath) by God, that (her husband) is telling a lie
9 - And the fifth (oath) should be that she solemnly invokes the wrath of God on herself if (her accuser) is telling the truth.​

 

[Nadiine]

I tend to take the word of the Muslims here. They seem fairly knowledgeable about their own religion.

You believe an anonymous web poster over the authoritative teaching of the Grand Ayatollah Sistani?

*edit in*
-whether or not the poster had valid reason to disregard the teaching, this remains a key problem in religion today and creates a source of confusion.
This is a huge key to the problem going on today.
People are ignoring and bypassing the authoratative documents of a religion to accept what others say or believe about them instead.
Welcome to the world of relativity. [relative truth].

Religions are being hijacked and morphed into something else becuz people are randomly deciding what they like & dislike and just yanking out sections to make them into what they want them to be instead.
Religious buffet - pick & choose what you like & trash the rest.

I say this: either accept ALL OF THE RELIGION as it is defined by the authorities who created it, or go make up your own new one and call it something else - becuz it is NOT that religion the minute you've changed it.
(yes I know, that opens up the whole pandora's box as to interpretation & denoms. that spring up within the original orthodox religion - but for the sake of argument, lets just apply this to people who RADICALLY change the religion using the same God's name - and even decide that the authoratative documents can be altered or aren't reliable/true).

I find religious hijackers everywhere; stealing bits & pieces of religions & mashing them together to suit personal tastes (good or bad tastes).
This is what is causing confusion today as everybody grabs a piece & forms their own religious puzzle to make a different picture for themselves.

 

[elwill]

You believe an anonymous web poster over the authoritative teaching of the Grand Ayatollah Sistani?

Let some Muslim come and tell me that Sistani is a liar.



84. The following ten things are essentially najis:

1. Urine
2. Faeces
3. sperm
4. Dead body
5. Blood
6. Dog
7. Pig
8. K a f i r
9. Alcoholic liquors
10. The sweat of an animal who persistently eats najasat.

107. An infidel i.e. a person who does not believe in Allah and His Oneness, is najis. Similarly, Ghulat who believe in any of the holy twelve Imams as God, or that they are incarnations of God, and Khawarij and Nawasib who express enmity towards th e holy Imams, are also najis. And similar is the case of those who deny Prophethood, or any of the necessary laws of Islam, like, namaz and fasting, which are believed by the Muslims as a part of Islam, and which they also know as such.
As regards the people of the Book (i.e. the Jews and the Christians) who do not accept the Prophethood of Prophet Muhammad bin Abdullah (Peace be upon him and his progeny), they are commonly considered najis, but it is not improbable that they are Pak. Ho wever, it is better to avoid them.
108. The entire body of a [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth], including his hair and nails, and all liquid substances of his body, are najis.
109. If the parents, paternal grandmother and paternal grandfather of a minor child are all [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth], that child is najis, except when he is intelligent enough, and professes Islam. When, even one person from his parents or grandparents is a Muslim, the child is Pak (The details will be explained in rule 217).

this site is shiites not sunni muslims

 

[Secundulus]

this site is shiites not sunni muslims

Then post an authoritative Sunni site that states differently.

 

[Fuzzy]

Well first things first - if Lambert was a hotty, I'd of had more interest in Highlander lol

A Frenchman playing a Scotsman, and a Scotsman playing a Spaniard (who used to be Egyptian)

I also don't respect another's "religion" or choices - I respect them as people.

As an example, my Muslim neighbor wants to talk to me about something. Mowing her lawn while they're out of town, my tree needs pruning, whatever. She requests that we talk about it outside, so she's not in a "strange man's" house, as per her religious beliefs. As an aside, I'm easier for her to deal with (being married) than the 4 raucous bachelors who previously lived here. It's a simple thing for me to walk outside and talk to her, so I do, and we talk about whatever it is.

So am I respecting the person, or the religion, or both?

As a Wiccan, I've got an altar set up in my house. I don't expect other people to "embrace" it and light candles and burn incense. I think it's a reasonable expectation for people to "respect" it (especially since it's my house) and not kick it over, or not "rearrange it neatly" as happened to a friend in her dorm room when an RA was checking everyone's rooms for contraband.

 

[Nadiine]

A Frenchman playing a Scotsman, and a Scotsman playing a Spaniard (who used to be Egyptian)



As an example, my Muslim neighbor wants to talk to me about something. Mowing her lawn while they're out of town, my tree needs pruning, whatever. She requests that we talk about it outside, so she's not in a "strange man's" house, as per her religious beliefs. As an aside, I'm easier for her to deal with (being married) than the 4 raucous bachelors who previously lived here. It's a simple thing for me to walk outside and talk to her, so I do, and we talk about whatever it is.

So am I respecting the person, or the religion, or both?

As a Wiccan, I've got an altar set up in my house. I don't expect other people to "embrace" it and light candles and burn incense. I think it's a reasonable expectation for people to "respect" it (especially since it's my house) and not kick it over, or not "rearrange it neatly" as happened to a friend in her dorm room when an RA was checking everyone's rooms for contraband.

Well.... incense STINKS to high heaven lol I mite opt to talk to you outside instead too. sorry, I couldn't resist that one

But seriously -
No, I don't view that you're respecting her Religion by talking to her outside instead of inside... that's respecting HER becuz of all the crap that could cause her w/ other Muslims or her husband. (I'd also note that other women without any religion mite not feel comfy going into a house alone w/ another male - I mite not myself, it depends on the situation).

By not respecting the religion, I meant that I don't respect other religions in and of themselves. I don't embrace any of it. In the Christian worldview, those religions bring people to spiritual devestation; blocking them from Jesus Christ's grace, how can it be "respected" when it harms the eternal spirit and deprives them of a close relationship with God?

I don't "respect" other religions where I hold the casual, apathetic view of 'live and let live'; if that's your religion, great, I won't say anything against it. To hold that neutral attitude would be about equivalent to seeing a child wandering into a busy street.
However, I respect THEM as people who are allowed to make their spiritual choices; whatever they may be. I value that right and enjoy it myself.

That's the distinction as I view it.

 

[Ramona]

Like I said before. It is anti-dawa.

The dawa posted was full of half truths that misrepresent reality.

Wait, I think I missed something.

What have you been accused of doing in the first place?

 

[Futuwwa]

I only quote what I read from Islamic websites. If you can show me they are wrong then I stand corrected.

You know well enough that a single cleric, however accredited he might be, cannot be considered the spokesperson of Islam, let alone define Islam. Just stop with the BS and you might even regain the respect I once had for you.

 

[Secundulus]

You know well enough that a single cleric, however accredited he might be, cannot be considered the spokesperson of Islam, let alone define Islam. Just stop with the BS and you might even regain the respect I once had for you.

OK. I ask this in seriousness to cure my confusion.

Where do you go to find out what is Islam? Is it whatever the individual defines for himself? Is it each individual's interpretation of the Quran?

How can there be a worldwide Caliphate without a central authority to define Islam?

How can Sharia exist if everyone is free to define Islam for himself?

 

[Secundulus]

Wait, I think I missed something.

What have you been accused of doing in the first place?

I made an intemperate post that I probably shouldn't have made concerning another's invitation for Christians to embrace Islam.

 

[elwill]

Then post an authoritative Sunni site that states differently.

are you serious !
you claim that muslims sites said x about nonmulsims
my respond was , it isn't islamic it's shiits
so what is this silly question you want for me to do
if i told you i don't know sunni sites that state the differnet , is that mean that muslims responsibe for shiits beliefs !!!! , what a joke

 

[Ramona]

I made an intemperate post that I probably shouldn't have made concerning another's invitation for Christians to embrace Islam.

Yes, I saw that post. I think it requires an apology more than it requires justification, though. JMHO.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

You know well enough that a single cleric, however accredited he might be, cannot be considered the spokesperson of Islam, let alone define Islam. Just stop with the BS and you might even regain the respect I once had for you.

Salam. So ya'll don't believe in having a "Pope" like leader either huh?


Genesis 6:13 And Elohiym is saying to Noah "end of All Flesh he come before Me, that she is full the land wrong/violence from presences of them and behold Me! ruining them the land".

Luke 3:6 "And shall-be-seeing All Flesh the Salvation of the GOD/YHWH."

 

[Futuwwa]

OK. I ask this in seriousness to cure my confusion.

Where do you go to find out what is Islam? Is it whatever the individual defines for himself? Is it each individual's interpretation of the Quran?

Go find out what many clerics believe, rather than pick the one who suits your purposes best and generalize his teachings. Accept the fact that there are variants of Islam. Since you do not believe that any variant of Islam is the true religion, how can in your worldview any variant of Islam even conceptually be more authentic than any other?

How can there be a worldwide Caliphate without a central authority to define Islam?

How can Sharia exist if everyone is free to define Islam for himself?

Having a Caliphate would be a neat thing, but it is by no means necessary for the fullness of Islam. And besides, caliphs have never been considered to be infallible on matters of theology.

How would difference of opinions prevent sharia from existing? There is no universal code of sharia law, it is different in every jurisdiction. Neither does differences of opinion within the jurisdiction prevent the law from being applied equally to everyone. Do you agree ideologically with every law in your country? No, that's what I thought. Does that prevent the state from imposing those laws on you?