Why I’m Not a Christian Zionist, Academically Speaking”

[Micah68]

God's Holy people?

Dead Palestinian babies and bombed mosques - IDF fashion 2009

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1072466.html

 

[Col3_11n12]

God's holy people, right here:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/babylonbeyond/2008/06/israel-gay-prid.html


Rev 11:8 Their bodies will lie in the street of the great city, which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified.

 

[Carey]

Big surprise Israeli army has a few bad apples what army or country
does'nt ??Israel authorities will punish these soldiers.

Israel also has Israelis like this one

Rabbi’s Son, shares Yeshua Daily with Israelis everywhere he goes

Aharon Zev Porat on Left Aharon Zev Porat on Right

Rabbi’s Son, shares Yeshua Daily with Israelis everywhere he goes
Update from Aharon (Zev) Porat
Five years after being raised in a religious home, I had a vision of Yeshua (Jesus) and I accepted him as my Messiah even though I knew I would be disowned from my family. Working in Evangelism is my calling and along with being a part of completing the Messianic Prophecy Bible. Here at Bibles for Israel we continue to share the Good News of Yeshua every day – so I just wanted to give you a peak into a typical day of my life.
I was born in Bnei Brak, the most religious city in Israel which is home to every Chassidic sect (Ultra-Orthodox sects which numbers around 50). My father was a rabbi, my grandfather was a rabbi, and it was expected that I would become a rabbi, however five years ago I had a vision of Yeshua and I accepted Him as Messiah! I was born again!
Yesterday was more or less like every day of my life now as I share the Good News with everyone.
In the morning I was at the market near my home in Tel Aviv, and as I was buying some bread a man in his early 40s said to me, “That is really fresh and good bread.”
I don't always know what I'm going to say to someone, however I pray every day that the Ruach (Holy Spirit) will guide me that day.
So this time after he said: “That is really fresh and good bread,” I responded:
“We can’t just live on bread alone.”
He didn’t understand what I was taking about, so he said, “Ok then, if you can’t live on bread alone, then you might want to get some cheese to add to the bread.”
I then took the opportunity and told him that God loves us and that we need His Word and His Ruach (Spirit) in our lives.
The man looked at the top of my head and asked that if I’m religious, why am I not wearing a Yarlmuke (Kippa) on my head.
I explained to him that I was raised very religious but today I have a close relationship with God and it’s not based on my works. He said that this was something that he had never heard before and we introduced ourselves .
His name is Mordechai, and I invited him over to my home later in the day. He said he prefers we meet in his home, so at 6 pm I went to his home to share with his family the love and truth of Yeshua through the Word of God.
We started to talk about God, but Mordechai did not have a Bible at his home, so I gave him one of my Tanakhs (Hebrew Old Testaments) and we looked up Scriptures about sacrifice and Daniel 9:20.

www.BiblesforIsrael.com

 

[Micah68]

......yet nothing about the innocent lives lost. Nothing like 'that is terrible', nothing...


Report: Netanyahu says 9/11 terror attacks good for Israel

By Haaretz Service and Reuters

The Israeli newspaper Ma'ariv on Wednesday reported that Likud leader Benjamin Netanyahu told an audience at Bar Ilan university that the September 11, 2001 terror attacks had been beneficial for Israel. (continued)

 

[Carey]

......yet nothing about the innocent lives lost. Nothing like 'that is terrible', nothing...


Report: Netanyahu says 9/11 terror attacks good for Israel

By Haaretz Service and Reuters

The Israeli newspaper Ma'ariv on Wednesday reported that Likud leader Benjamin Netanyahu told an audience at Bar Ilan university that the September 11, 2001 terror attacks had been beneficial for Israel. (continued)

Yes kidnapping and rocketing and mortaring innocents is terrible.

So when Israel is no longer attacked Israel will stop fighting back period.

[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]Damascus-based Hamas leader Khaled Mashaal told an Australian paper in a report published on Friday.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]"The Israelis just don't learn. When they refuse to release Palestinians, it forces the Palestinians to resort to other means to gain their release - and inevitably this includes the capture of more Israeli soldiers," Mashaal said during an interview with the[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]When asked if he relates to the sentiment expressed by Hizbullah leader Hassan Nasrallah, who was quoted as saying that had he known the extent to which Israel would retaliate in 2006, he would never have ordered the kidnapping of IDF reservists Ehud Goldwasser and Eldad Regev[/FONT][/FONT]

BUT THIS SHOULD MAKE YOU HAPPY MICAH68

[FONT='Trebuchet MS',Verdana,Helvetica,sans-serif][FONT='Trebuchet MS', Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif][FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]America 'Moves Towards Abandonment of Israel'[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]

[FONT='Times New Roman',Times,serif][FONT='Times New Roman', Times, serif] [FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]An unnamed former highly-placed U.S.intelligence official has broken silence and says that America may soon be abandoning Israel in favor of the Arabs. "This is just the beginning", he said, "Israel could be about to lose the support of the United States."[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]The source made these remarks in an exclusive interview with Douglas J. Hagmann, the director of the Northeast Intelligence Network (NIN), which is comprised of veteran licensed professional investigators, analysts, military affairs specialists and researchers. The group has combined their resources to provide accurate and well-sourced information via their website.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]Hagmann appeared on Israel National Radio's Weekend Edition with host Tamar Yonah.[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]When questioned about the possible abandonment of Israel by America, Hagmann told Yonah, "The Obama administration is no friend to Israel, is no friend to the Jews in America and is no friend to democracy or freedom in America. ...Just by his very appointments, we can see him filling positions of power with people who are anti-Semitic, who want to see Israel essentially dissolved as a nation, if not by diplomacy, then certainly by war."[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman,Times,Serif][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, Serif]In his report, the unnamed intelligence source told Hagmann, "I have every reason to believe, based on what I've seen at my level of [security] clearance especially over the last several years, that Israel will soon be completely on their own... or worse." He explained this would happen "when our administration provides more support to Arab countries [with] financial and military aid, undercutting Israel's defense efforts all while pushing Israel to succumb to the pressure of unreasonable demands designed to end with their political annihilation as a nation."[/FONT][/FONT]

http://www.hearoisrael.org

[/FONT][/FONT]

 

[Micah68]

Two wrongs do not not make a right...

God sees all life as equal wanting none to parish!! God loves the Palestinian, the Jew, the Muslim, Hindu, atheist, etc. we are to do no less. Unfortunately there are those who refuse to see.

Israel's dirty secrets in Gaza

Army veterans reveal how they gunned down innocent Palestinian families and destroyed homes and farms
By Donald Macintyre in Jerusalem
Friday, 20 March 2009

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...rty-secrets-in-gaza-1649527.html?action=Popup
Palestinians' lives were seen as 'very, very less important than our soldiers'

• © More pictures

Israel was last night confronting a major challenge over the conduct of its 22-day military offensive in Gaza after testimonies by its own soldiers revealed that troops were allowed and, in some cases, even ordered to shoot unarmed Palestinian civilians.
The testimonies – the first of their kind to emerge from inside the military – are at marked variance with official claims that the military made strenuous efforts to avoid civilian casualties and tend to corroborate Palestinian accusations that troops used indiscriminate and disproportionate firepower in civilian areas during the operation. In one of the testimonies shedding harsh new light on what the soldiers say were the permissive rules of engagement for Operation Cast Lead, one soldier describes how an officer ordered the shooting of an elderly woman 100 metres from a house commandeered by troops.
Another soldier, describing how a mother and her children were shot dead by a sniper after they turned the wrong way out of a house, says the "atmosphere" among troops was that the lives of Palestinians were "very, very less important than the lives of our soldiers". (continued)

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

Simple pragmatism, if Israel does not serve America, America will drop it like a hot potato.. Israel was created by the British Zionists as a stronghold of western power in the mid-east.. to influence the flow of oil, first to Britain, then later to the US.

 

[Micah68]

CIA report: Israel will fall in 20 years
Fri, 13 Mar 2009 14:44:41 GMT

International lawyer Franklin Lamb
A study conducted by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has cast doubt over Israel's survival beyond the next 20 years.

The CIA report predicts "an inexorable movement away from a two-state to a one-state solution, as the most viable model based on democratic principles of full equality that sheds the looming specter of colonial Apartheid while allowing for the return of the 1947/1948 and 1967 refugees. The latter being the precondition for sustainable peace in the region."

The study, which has been made available only to a certain number of individuals, further forecasts the return of all Palestinian refugees to the occupied territories, and the exodus of two million Israeli - who would move to the US in the next fifteen years.

"There is over 500,000 Israelis with American passports and more than 300,000 living in the area of just California," International lawyer Franklin Lamb said in an interview with Press TV on Friday, adding that those who do not have American or western passport, have already applied for them.

"So I think the handwriting at least among the public in Israel is on the wall...[which] suggests history will reject the colonial enterprise sooner or later," Lamb stressed.
(Continued)

 

[dad]

They were never in control of their land when the Messiah came the first time.

They only gained control of the whole land in 1967.

They were not promised heaven as in the new covenant and they were not promised a perfect situation in their land. But the land was promised and they have it with problems.

http://us.f500.mail.yahoo.com/ym/Sh...t=date&pos=0&view=a&head=b&box=Inbox#0_128715

The land was promised to who, that is the question. There has always been a remnant. Did all march into the promised land the first time? No!
Did all return to Jerusalem after the captivity? No!
The promises are not for anyone but those that obey. That truly love God.

Will all be raptured? No. Just the real saved believers. Will Israel have it's time again, after that? Yes. All the promises will be fulfilled for them, and they will rule on earth from Jerusalem. Christians will rule from New Jerusalem. He will fulfill His word to all. But one cannot say that the secular modern Israel state is the fulfillment. That is absurd. Do you think anyone will be able to bug them when God puts em under His wings!! No. Do you think that dessert of despair will be as it is now? No. He'll do it right, ansd all will know.

Proof: God woulld not empower a king to invade Israel, and defile the temple when He brings them back!!

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

A study conducted by the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has cast doubt over Israel's survival beyond the next 20 years.

Restore it to what it was when it was it's own country, with trans-Jordan and Egypt also, when we ran Palestine, before handing it over to be mismanaged by the israelis and americans.

 

[Micah68]

The promise to Abraham could not be annulled by the law, but had to await Christ for fulfillment. In other words, the promise to Abraham and his decendants were fulfilled in Christ.

God was NOT talking about a small piece of land, that was being promised or even given to a few forever and ever, but rather promised that all of humanity would be brought to him through Christ. Through Jesus the inheritance of peace and liberation has come! (We just need to live it) While Jews interpret their scriptures in light of the missing Messiah, we as Christians, in the presence of Christ, can not sanction or accept that the promise is about the physical land. The land is now irrelevant. The land where so much blood shed and tears have spilled .....and for what?

N.T. Wright "Jerusalem in the New Testement"

The Land, like the Torah, was a temporary stage in the long purpose of the God of Abraham. It was not a bad thing now done away with, but a good and necessary thing now fulfilled in Christ and the Spirit. It is as though, in fact, the Land were a great advance metaphor for the design of God that his people should eventually bring the whole world into submission to his healing reign. God's whole purpose now goes beyond Jerusalem and the Land to the whole World.

 

[hiscosmicgoldfish]

In other words, the promise to Abraham and his decendants were fulfilled in Christ.

I agree with that, but what about that verse that goes like 'i shall gather them from the lands which they were scattered'? is that literal in 1947, or metaphor for the drawing into the kingdom?

 

[Micah68]

More like an ultra-literal interpretation; where scripture is seen as pre-written history and fulfilled in the interpreter’s generation. Never mind the requirements, stated in Eze 33, for returning to the land, and then adding the fact that the 'the land' was never intended to be a totally Jewish State. There is nothing Biblical about 1947 or 1967 for that matter.

This literalist hermeneutic can be traced back to the early 19th Century and can be found in writings of Hatley Frere, George Faber, Lewis Way and Edward Irving. Later on John Nelson Darby formalized this dispensation along with Scofield.

 

[Carey]

The land was promised to who, that is the question. There has always been a remnant. Did all march into the promised land the first time? No!
Did all return to Jerusalem after the captivity? No!
The promises are not for anyone but those that obey. That truly love God.

Will all be raptured? No. Just the real saved believers. Will Israel have it's time again, after that? Yes. All the promises will be fulfilled for them, and they will rule on earth from Jerusalem. Christians will rule from New Jerusalem. He will fulfill His word to all. But one cannot say that the secular modern Israel state is the fulfillment. That is absurd. Do you think anyone will be able to bug them when God puts em under His wings!! No. Do you think that dessert of despair will be as it is now? No. He'll do it right, ansd all will know.

Proof: God woulld not empower a king to invade Israel, and defile the temple when He brings them back!!

Yes God would allow the Temple Israel builds to be entered and defiled.

This will help them learn how real Yeshua is so when he comes they will accept him.

Many are already learning and turning to him in their land.

The Bible predicted the Decendents of Isaac would be return in part by airplane also....Isaiah 60 : 8 "Who are these that fly along like clouds, like doves to their nests? ( this is happening as we speak and has been going on for some time.)

Isaiah 60 : 4 "Lift up your eyes and look about you:
All assemble and come to you;
your sons come from afar, ( this has been happening since 1948 and
is still happening today not yet finished )
and your daughters are carried on the arm. ( this does not say the sons and daughters are going to be good or Godly )5 Then you will look and be radiant,
your heart will throb and swell with joy;
the wealth on the seas will be brought to you,
to you the riches of the nations will come.


10 “Foreigners will come to rebuild your towns,
and their kings will serve you.
For though I have destroyed you in my anger,
I will now have mercy on you through my grace. ( FULFILLED )

4 “Look and see, for everyone is coming home!
Your sons are coming from distant lands;
your little daughters will be carried home.
5 Your eyes will shine,
and your heart will thrill with joy,
for merchants from around the world will come to you ( ongoing fulfillment )


Rabbi’s Son, shares Yeshua Daily with Israelis everywhere he goes

Aharon Zev Porat on Left Aharon Zev Porat on Right

Rabbi’s Son, shares Yeshua Daily with Israelis everywhere he goes
Update from Aharon (Zev) Porat
Five years after being raised in a religious home, I had a vision of Yeshua (Jesus) and I accepted him as my Messiah even though I knew I would be disowned from my family. Working in Evangelism is my calling and along with being a part of completing the Messianic Prophecy Bible. Here at Bibles for Israel we continue to share the Good News of Yeshua every day – so I just wanted to give you a peak into a typical day of my life.
I was born in Bnei Brak, the most religious city in Israel which is home to every Chassidic sect (Ultra-Orthodox sects which numbers around 50). My father was a rabbi, my grandfather was a rabbi, and it was expected that I would become a rabbi, however five years ago I had a vision of Yeshua and I accepted Him as Messiah! I was born again!
Yesterday was more or less like every day of my life now as I share the Good News with everyone.
In the morning I was at the market near my home in Tel Aviv, and as I was buying some bread a man in his early 40s said to me, “That is really fresh and good bread.”
I don't always know what I'm going to say to someone, however I pray every day that the Ruach (Holy Spirit) will guide me that day.
So this time after he said: “That is really fresh and good bread,” I responded:
“We can’t just live on bread alone.”
He didn’t understand what I was taking about, so he said, “Ok then, if you can’t live on bread alone, then you might want to get some cheese to add to the bread.”
I then took the opportunity and told him that God loves us and that we need His Word and His Ruach (Spirit) in our lives.
The man looked at the top of my head and asked that if I’m religious, why am I not wearing a Yarlmuke (Kippa) on my head.
I explained to him that I was raised very religious but today I have a close relationship with God and it’s not based on my works. He said that this was something that he had never heard before and we introduced ourselves .
His name is Mordechai, and I invited him over to my home later in the day. He said he prefers we meet in his home, so at 6 pm I went to his home to share with his family the love and truth of Yeshua through the Word of God.
We started to talk about God, but Mordechai did not have a Bible at his home, so I gave him one of my Tanakhs (Hebrew Old Testaments) and we looked up Scriptures about sacrifice and Daniel 9:20.

[URL="http://www.biblesforisrael.com/"]www.BiblesforIsrael.com[/URL]

 

[Micah68]

Why We Should be Concerned about Christian Zionism

http://www.ncccusa.org/pdfs/christianzionismbrochure.pdf

 

[Micah68]

Challenging Christian Zionism, Sabeel translates into 'the way'
http://www.sabeel.org/documents/cs32.pdf

 

[Micah68]

Israeli Occupation Puts Strain on Palestinian Christians
Israeli Occupation Puts Strain on Palestinian Christians - Standard Newswire

 

[bdolack]

Because this contradicts ...........


[FONT=&quot]❀ [/FONT]Reformed theologians (like myself) believe that something decisive happened in Christ. His covenant affected not simply the covenant of Moses – making a new and timeless form of salvation – but it also affected every Jewish covenant, including Abraham’s covenant. Christ fulfills the expectations of Jewish covenant life and renews the people of God rooted in the OT and Judaism. Thus Jesus is a new temple, the new Israel , there are 12 tribes/apostles, etc.


This.......

Matthew 5 : 17"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. 19Anyone who breaks one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."

So what did Jesus mean when he said "It is finished"?

 

[dad]

Yes God would allow the Temple Israel builds to be entered and defiled.

This will help them learn how real Yeshua is so when he comes they will accept him.

Many are already learning and turning to him in their land.

No, actually, He certainly would not. Under His protection, we are actually safe. No one is going to break through, and kill, or steal squat! The only reason they can now is because they are NOT under the shadow of the protection of the Almighty. He actually BRINGS the invaders down there!! If you call that protection, I have a bridge for you to buy.

The Bible predicted the Decendents of Isaac would be return in part by airplane also....Isaiah 60 : 8 "Who are these that fly along like clouds, like doves to their nests? ( this is happening as we speak and has been going on for some time.)

Nonsense. Just because some fly now in no way means that they cannot also fly later, when He actually does the thing!

Isaiah 60 : 4 "Lift up your eyes and look about you:
All assemble and come to you;
your sons come from afar, ( this has been happening since 1948 and
is still happening today not yet finished )
and your daughters are carried on the arm. ( this does not say the sons and daughters are going to be good or Godly )5 Then you will look and be radiant,
your heart will throb and swell with joy;
the wealth on the seas will be brought to you,
to you the riches of the nations will come.


10 “Foreigners will come to rebuild your towns,
and their kings will serve you.
For though I have destroyed you in my anger,
I will now have mercy on you through my grace. ( FULFILLED )

NO!!! His sons are sons, because they believe, not because they have some silly works. Them that believe..to THEM gave He power to become sons of God. The others are cast out. You really think that the hearts of all in Israel now throb and swell with joy!!! Ridiculous in the extreme. Not even remotely close.

4 “Look and see, for everyone is coming home!
Your sons are coming from distant lands;
your little daughters will be carried home.
5 Your eyes will shine,
and your heart will thrill with joy,
for merchants from around the world will come to you ( ongoing fulfillment )

Utter rubbish. The hearts of all in Israel simply do not thrill with joy!! Fear, greed, hate, adultery, sodomy, murder, etc..maybe Get serious. That is grasping at straws.